Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments
Search

News for nerds, stuff that matters

Slashdot Log In

Log In

Create Account  |  Retrieve Password

Lara Croft As The Final Girl

Posted by Zonk on Tue Apr 25, 2006 04:40 PM
from the psychology-of-teenage-boys dept.
Entertainment Games
Clive Thompson, over at Wired, takes a look at the appeal of playing as Lara Croft ... and doesn't focus on her physical assets. From the article: "The Final Girl theory emerged in 1985, when Carol Clover -- a medievalist and feminist film critic -- was dared by a friend to see The Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Back then, most feminist theorists loathed slasher films, and regarded them as classic examples of male misogyny. It wasn't hard to figure out why: Thousands of young men were trooping into theaters to cheer wildly as masked psychos hacked apart screaming young women. That really didn't look good. But as Clover sat in the theaters, she noticed something curious. Sure, the young men would laugh and cheer as the villain hunted down his female prey. But eventually the movie would whittle down the victims to one last terrified woman -- the Final Girl, as Clover called her. Suddenly, the young men in the audience would switch their allegiance -- and begin cheering just as madly for the Final Girl as she attacked and killed the psycho."
+ -
story

Related Stories

[+] Lara Croft's Big Comeback 96 comments
Next Generation has a piece talking to Eidos marketing chief Bob Lindsey about the restoration of Lara Croft's good name. From the article: "Lindsey says the negative associations surrounding Lara will be swept away with a single decent iteration, arguing that Lara, far from being a one-decade wonder, has legs. 'Eidos has learned in spades that just because we make it, does not means they will come,' he says. 'Users are very discerning about what is a good experience and what is not. If you create a big franchise like Tomb Raider, one that has sold more than 30 million units globally, you can't afford to burn it with something that does not deliver.'"
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.

Lara Croft As The Final Girl 50 Comments More /

 Full
 Abbreviated
 Hidden
More
Loading... please wait.
  • Brinke Stevens -- my nomination for favorite Final Girl.

  • May the best X win! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by MarkusQ (450076) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @04:50PM (#15200575) Journal

    The summary at least misses the point. The audience didn't "switch their allegiances"; in each conflict, they were cheering for the better (generally smarter) of the combatants. That's why those films seldom just have people being killed. Instead:

    1. We meet a character
    2. We get to see how stupid they are (or greedy, or two faced, or whatever)
    3. We get to see what happens to them for it

    Then, at the end, we get to see someone who didn't exhibit these character flaws win.

    It has little or nothing to do with sexism, and everything to do with cheering for people with survival traits.

    --MarkusQ

    • Re:May the best X win! (Score:5, Insightful)

      by shmlco (594907) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @05:17PM (#15200799) Homepage
      "It has little or nothing to do with sexism, and everything to do with cheering for people with survival traits."

      Survival traits? Sorry, not even that. And I could, for example, make a pretty good case for greed BEING a survial trait for you and yours.

      No, such films are nothing more than grown up versions of the boogyman stories parents would tell their children, all about what happens to little kids who do bad things.

      • I could, for example, make a pretty good case for greed BEING a survival trait for you and yours.

        Greed (trying to acquire more resources than you could reasonably need) may have been a survival trait before we became so social. Now, it's anti-survival, but the urge is still there (which is probably the strongest argument for it once being pro-survival). In the kludgefest that is evolution, it hasn't been eliminated, but patched over with various greed-limiting mechanisms.

        The question is, are we applyi

        • I think everyone is reading way too much into these crappy films. Lets try a simpler explanation. Ever heard of the Roman colleseium? How about people like to watch violence. They will cheer for the violence itself.

          I don't think the audience members really care who it is thats being hacked to bits... is it the bad boy or the naughty girl. Whatever, its somebody being hacked up. Its sensational, it stirs up all sorts of things, I think people often identify with the killer at first because well, the alternat
    • 1. We meet a character
      2. We get to see how stupid they are
      3. We get to see what happens to them for it


      OH, so THAT's why the girls in "The Descent" were so stupid!
      "Oh, no, I didn't bring the maps, because, guess what, this is a WHOLE NEW CAVE! So the rangers will be looking for us elsewhere while we're dying here trapped! Aren't I great? :D"

    • But cheering for the last remaining female is also a survival trait. :) I know when I'm with girls in "hostile" environments, I feel a very strong urge (instinct I'm presuming since it happens without choice or forethought) to protect them. Makes sense if we do that, on a more subconscious level of course, in video games where you're helping, guiding, and making decisions about a womans well being that's standing there in third person in front of you. If she wasn't in third person, then there would be nothi

      • I know when I'm with girls in "hostile" environments, I feel a very strong urge (instinct I'm presuming since it happens without choice or forethought) to protect them.

        Tonight on slashdot: nature vs. nurture.

        Sure, it would be useful to the species if the [typically bigger and stronger] males defended females instinctually. However, it's not necessary for that to be the mechanism. It could as easily be a universal societal influence. We are inundated with messages instructing us to behave in a certa

  • True Neutral? (Score:4, Funny)

    by DeadCatX2 (950953) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @04:50PM (#15200577) Journal
    So does this mean the young men in question would be True Neutral?

  • This is why (Score:5, Insightful)

    by cultrhetor (961872) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @04:52PM (#15200591) Journal

    You know, I have an MA in Literary and Rhetorical theory, and this kind of crap is why I left Literary study for Rhetoric and Digital Media when I went for the old Ph.D. The worst part is, I can probably cite most of the papers and books that this woman read, without even finding her references. It gets predictable. Want an alternate reading/viewing? Lara Croft is a modern female version of the "American Adam" archetype, as laid out by R.W.B. Lewis in 1955 in a book by the same name. She's "an individual standing alone, self-reliant and self-propelling, ready to confront whatever [awaits her] with the aid of [her] own unique and inherent resources" (p.5).

    The point - and I do have one - is simple: the beauty of cultural criticism is that everyone can debate it endlessly, and everyone who's got the right sources can be right! Yay!

    • By "this woman," whom do you mean? Carol Clover?
    • She's "an individual standing alone, self-reliant and self-propelling, ready to confront whatever [awaits her] with the aid of [her] own unique and inherent resources"

      Wow. I *am* the male Lara Croft! :-)

      But without the guns.

      And without the boobs. Or the good looks. Or the legs. Or the mansion, money and international intrigue. Or the cool butler.

      But other than that, I *am* the male Lara Croft!

    • the beauty of cultural criticism is that everyone can debate it endlessly, and everyone who's got the right sources can be right! Yay!

      No no no, the BEAUTY of it is that everyone can debate it endlessly and PRETEND that it's not about huge tits, when it's clearly the case that it is. That, my friend, is the beauty of cultural criticism.
      • But created for an American audience - Henry James used British characters frequently; but he was American, writing to an American audience, and the female protagonist in The Turn of the Screw is classified as an "American Adam" - but she's a British governess... SEE?!?! Everyone can be right! [FULL DISCLOSURE: I wrote my thesis on the evolving American Adam, so this is a touchy area for me. I don't mean to grouse.]

  • Kill Bill (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Peter Cooper (660482) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @04:52PM (#15200597) Journal
    I don't really know about Lara Croft, but I'd say I felt this for Beatrix Kiddo in Kill Bill. I was like, whoa.. I really want this chick to kick ass!

  • Cheering? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by hackwrench (573697) <hackwrench@hotmail.com> on Tuesday April 25 2006, @04:53PM (#15200605) Homepage Journal
    What I don't get is the mention of cheering when the bad guy killed the dumb girl. Didn't they cheer just as loudly when the bad guy killed the idiot boy? For me it was about getting rid of the stupid idiots no matter what their gender and then putting the agent of destruction away once the job was done.

  • I call shenannigans on this... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Vokkyt (739289) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @04:53PM (#15200610)
    This article just did not have any convincing arguments regarding Lara Croft as a positive thing for female role model. If the intent behind Lara was anything besides selling a game with a sexy icon, then there would be no need for the misproportionate breasts, the sexual innuendos, and the skimpy outfits. If the theory of the "Final Girl" is true, would it not work with any mildly appealing women? Well, the answer to that is even revealed in his article, and that is no; the anonymous gamer, anonymous being indicative of the reliablity of his source, even says that he feels like he's protecting Lara; He's protecting Lara. As much as I dislike the Tomb Raider games, I know enough about them to know that anyone who thinks they are "protecting" Lara is disillusioned and just as misonganistic as any man from the 40's. Lara is not a person who needs protecting; the games make that clear.

    Lara is indeed a girl that every boy wants to be with, but not in a plutonic way; they want to control her, and have her be the object of their sexual fantasies.

    • Lara is indeed a girl that every boy wants to be with, but not in a plutonic way; they want to control her

      Lord knows I tried, but the camera angles are just so shitty. Seriously, I'm like "I know there's bats out there, but the camera is trapped behind some plants and all I can see is green shit, wtf mate?" ps: you mean 'platonic,' d00d. At least, I'm pretty sure you do: http://www.answers.com/plutonic&r=67 [answers.com]

        • Something from or of the Roman God of the Underworld
        • Something made on the planet Pluto
        • Something made of Plutonium
        • Any Walt Disney movie involving dogs


        I guess that, by the second of these alternative definitions, there may well be NASA astronauts who would want Lara Croft plutonically.

    • I played Tomb Raider in the 1996 and found it to be a groundbreaking game. The lead character's gender and appearance were minor details to me. I've played through several sequels (none of which lived up to the possibilities the franchise promised), and I honestly didn't notice sexual innuendo, paternalism, etc.

      I experienced negative reactions to the Lara Croft character only from non-gamers looking at the cover artwork (esp. from my ex-wife). My instinct tells me that many of the criticisms are bas
    • The article is an example of what happens when people who have know business thinking decide to become writers
    • I have problems with the article as well. But consider that some video games do have less sexy female leads - Beyond Good and Evil, for one. That was a great game and it was just as fun plying her as it was Lara Croft.

      I don't think in either case I am playing because I want to "be" with either one. Instead I enjoy "being" them - powerful, smart beings kicking ass when needed. I mean do all the people playing Doom also want to "be" with the marine?
    • I don't pretend to understand all this literary big-word stuff... what I do know is that a female character doesn't have to be hot to kick some ass. Case in point: Metroid. Samus Aran was the classic video-game heroin (who always reminded me a lot of Ripley in Alien). We all cheered for Samus, even though, at first, we didn't know she was a chick because of the suit. But after we found out, we cheered even more. Because deep down, what guy doesn't like to get the crap kicked out of him by a girl?

  • What are they cheering for? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by lawpoop (604919) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @05:07PM (#15200718) Homepage Journal
    "Thousands of young men were trooping into theaters to cheer wildly as masked psychos hacked apart screaming young women... Suddenly, the young men in the audience would switch their allegiance -- and begin cheering just as madly for the Final Girl as she attacked and killed the psycho."

    Maybe the men weren't cheering for the psycho or the woman, but for the violence itself .

  • Buffy Anybody? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by monopole (44023) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @05:11PM (#15200753)
    Buffy the Vampire Slayer was originally devised by Joss Whedon (who has a degree in feminist film studies) as the reversal of the girl and the monster enter the alley and only the monster exits. In contrast, with buffy she and the monster enter the alley and only Buffy exits. The first girl is the final girl, without the misogyny.
    This is a much closer analogue to Laura Croft, or other fictional kickass ladies like the Major in Ghost in the Shell.
  • Hmmm the last girl who finally defeats the monster. Isn't this called "survival of the fittest"?

    However, I really don't think of Lara as the "Final Girl". She's just a tough girl, period, if not a sex symbol. C'mon, we all know she was famous for her gravity-defying measures, but later was slimmed down to appeal more to the feminine public. I much less identify with her.

    Now allow me to compare to another famous treasure hunter.

    Indiana Jones

    Family: A devout religious man (Junior?)
    Studies: Ph. D. in Archeology
    Job: Archeology teacher in Barnett College, NY ("X never ever marks the spot")
    Reasons for treasure collecting: "It belongs in a museum!"
    Favorite Gadgets: His leather whip and a Fedora with a very high sentimental value (belonged to the man who stole the Cross of Coronado).
    Sex appeal: "And my mother's ears, but the rest belongs to you."
    Most used quotes: "I hate Snakes!", and "Don't call me Junior!"

    Lara Croft

    Family: Extremely Rich family (can you compete with the Countess of Abbingdon?)
    Studies: At home
    Job: What job?
    Reasons for treasure collecting: Add to her dad's collection, and, once in a while, save the world
    Favorite Gadgets: Dual 9 mm Pistols
    Sex appeal: Boing, boing, boing!
    Most used quotes: ?

    I'll take Indiana Jones, thank you.
  • I thought it was the Dangerous Chick With Weapons theory (i.e., Resident Evil, Blade Trinity, Aeon Flux, and Ultra Violet). Surprisingly, that was the one thing that didn't happen in the Silent Hill movie. The main chick lost her weapon (a butcher knife) before she could use it on anything, and the cop chick ran out of bullets before she was rendered unconscious. The ending was a bit peculiar since you do have a Final Girl but evil still won out in the end.
  • Wait, wait, wait. There's a whole theory based on an audience cheering for the person they expect to see win?

    I'm shocked. No, no, not shocked that the audience sided with the obvious soon-to-be victor. That's predictable. I'm shocked that anyone places stock in a theory that suggests that the winner's traits matter in whether the audience sided with that character.
  • Hey guys....

    UKism here but football is exactly the same. For anyone from the U.S. you might as well stop reading right now as i doubt this will make any sense.

    "Does anyone know any manchester United supporters from Manchester?"

    The fact is people will support whom ever ends up being glorious. In most of these films the girls are against impossible odds, so the men support the "evil henchman/manic killer/giant monster of death" and why?

    Well lets get really "medievil"..... Cave men... they are fighting right?

  • She's the one for me. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Progman3K (515744) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @07:13PM (#15201493)
    The valkyrie at my side is shouting and laughing with the pure hate for blood-thirsty joy of the slaughter

    And so am I

    The fire, baby. It'll burn us both

    There's no place in this world for our kind of fire

    My warrior woman. My valkyrie

    You'll always be mine. Always. And never

  • Counter interpretation (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Gulthek (12570) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @07:28PM (#15201569) Homepage Journal
    [All information here shared by my wife with her English masters degree. Any and all misinformation introduced by my transcription of her description of the theory.]

    Actually Lara Croft doesn't really fit with the final girl theory. In Carol's definition you can't start with the *final* girl. She goes through a metamorphosis and becomes more masculine as she survives more of the horror.

    Interesting points about the final girl theory:

    The theory is flawed (all failings acknowledged by Carol Clover, she doesn't assert that this theory is anything grand or definite) in that it assumes that only adolescent males enjoy horror movies. The theory is completely broken if you agree that any women enjoy horror movies.

    The theory itself says that the adolescent boys can identify with the final girl without themselves feeling threatened by the killer (who is hunting women), but who demonstrates the traits of a stereotypical adolescent male masculine fantasy (surviving against all odds, strong, capable, etc.). The theory is that this is a way for young men to indirectly experience homo-erotic fantasies. The women are characteristically running from phallic, penetrating objects such as knives and other stabbing weapons. Yet the final girl is also an erotic object herself. She usually has an asexual name (like Sam) and carries a phallic object like a torch, stick, etc.

    Yes, the world of literary theory is stranger than you know. o_O

  • Suddenly, the young men in the audience would switch their allegiance -- and begin cheering just as madly for the Final Girl as she attacked and killed the psycho.

    Dude, spoiler alert!

  • Angelina Jolie turned the genre around (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Animats (122034) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @11:00PM (#15202391) Homepage
    We have Angelina Jolie to thank for turning the video game movie genre around. Almost all the video game movies before "Tomb Raider" were horrible duds. ("Super Mario Brothers" was actually funny, but that's as good as it got. Few people could sit through all of "Wing Commander".) After "Tomb Raider", most video game movies were successful. It's as big a milestone in film as the first Batman movie, which demonstrated that you can make a good drama out of a comic book.

    It speaks well of Jolie as an actress that she was able to bring off the role without it being a joke.

    • "stopped reading?" you must be new here

    • Re:"Medievalist and Feminist Film Critic" (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      And you call yourself a geek. What a looser. "Medievalist" means she likes to go the RenFaire, "Feminist" means she has higher standards then to waste time on a self important fool like you, and "Film Critic" means she likes to go to the movies. Except for the fact that she views you as a cockroach, she would be a great date for a geek.

      I think this relates to the article about a lack of new computer science students: an unacknowledged reason is that geeks don't reproduce very often.

    • Re:"Medievalist and Feminist Film Critic" (Score:4, Insightful)

      by LordKazan (558383) on Tuesday April 25 2006, @05:53PM (#15201022) Homepage Journal
      You are the only one, and your ignorance and misogyny is showing. Grow up, women are equals, stop associating the extremists of a group as being the extire group.

      All groups extremists drag that groups name through the mud - misogynistic punks just like to forget that

      Christian extremists drag the name of Christianity through the mud
      Muslim extremists drag the name of Islam through the mud
      Environmentalism extremists drag the name of Environmentalism through the mud
      Animal Rights extremists drag the name of Animal Rights through the mud
      Extremist feminists drag the name of Feminism through the mud

      do I really need to go on or are you going to wise up and learn that the fundamental tenents of feminism are: equality of the sexes, the right to choose their roles for both sexes, respect between the sexes.

      These extremists vary from that. There are whacko feminists who think all sex is rape, while I know several feminists who think porn awesome*: i'm marrying one of them and the other is going the PRODUCE porn. There are whacko feminists who really are "man haters" but they are not the majority by a long shot.

      So GROW UP and stop trying to pretend that the minority is the majority: feminism is about equality - not all these things that Rush Limbaugh falsely attributes to it because of some it's more extreme members.

      *except like.. snuff porn, and bukakke

      (PS: I'm a guy and a *gasp* feminist because I believe in the equality of the sexes!)
      • It's possible you're being a little harsh on GP. It could be that he finds as much weird or objectionable about being a "medievalist" as a misogynist might be regarding a "feminist." He could even have just been trying to be silly.

        I wonder, though, what compelled you (and others) to respond so vigorously to what amounted to a "throwaway" post that really didn't say anything. My speculation would be that you're one of those "extremists," at least in the sense that your post seems like an overreaction...
        • I'm not "one of those extremists" for one: i have a dick. Second I believe in the basic tenants of feminism only: equality of the sexes, choice of roles, respect between the sexes - but none of the nonsense some of the more vociferous and less intelligent feminists try to claim are feminism: such as the hatred of pornography. My fiancee is the same - she is infact getting a double degree: Women's Studies and Political Science. There is a wide range of different ideas amongst the few.

          My very angry reactio
            • Oh i'll admit he's catching some heat that other people deserve more :D I'm also working late since several of the marketing people think their code changes have god-given priority over something I've needed to get finished coding by thursday but they keep interrupting.

      • So GROW UP and stop trying to pretend that the minority is the majority: feminism is about equality - not all these things that Rush Limbaugh falsely attributes to it because of some it's more extreme members.

        There are several problems with feminism. One of them is the name. The name doesn't say "equality", it's all about women. Another one is the baggage. There've been so many radical feminists that have been embraced by the movement that there's an instant stigma attached to being a "feminist".

        Personally, I don't instantly shut down when I encounter someone describing themselves as a feminist, but I have to admit that I'm slightly less likely to pay attention, because of all the ridiculous shit that's carried the feminist banner. I'm a humanist, or maybe an equalist?, and I do believe that all people should be considered equal until they prove that they aren't.

        • One of them is the name. The name doesn't say "equality", it's all about women.

          I fully agree with that statement and have said smiliar in the past.

          Another one is the baggage. There've been so many radical feminists that have been embraced by the movement that there's an instant stigma attached to being a "feminist".

          Yes there is baggage, I wouldn't really say "embraced" so much as though - it's just a movement that is very tolerant of variances in opinion and very much "take what you want from what the perso
        • Feminism is one front in the fight against stupor and self-centerdness.

          People are deeply self-centered, often don't understand others, or even themselves, and don't reflect upon the meaning of their actions. Society has been owned and run by men, and women have been second class citizens. When you're self-centered you just don't know and don't think about how your actions, such as running society, affects others, such as women. It's every little thing from public restrooms to drug trials, not always obviou
        • You need to learn to read, and i have read feminist literature: I, like any intelligent person, ignore the extremists

          "Women who challenge patriarchal structuers, whether compulsory pregnancy, harassment on the job, or nuclear war, will be made to pay." (Barstow, Witchcraze: A New History of the European Witch)... and this crap attempts to pass itself as academic history.

          Let me restructure this sentance in a language you will understand

          if ($person->isWoman() && $person->challenges(array("patria
      • Either she studies the history of the middle ages [wikipedia.org] (a.k.a. the Dark Age before the Lord Of The Rings came out) and/or she dresses up in medieval clothing or battle gear. I noticed that these kind of women are a lot tougher and won't hesitate to use a sword to cut off your most significant part if provoked
      • I'm a fan of "Feminist" anything

        See my post here and learn what feminism actually is [slashdot.org] before you continue to sound like a troglodyte
          • Oh grow up - you've presented no evidence that the majority of feminist literature IS extremist either - so STFU your snarky little punk.

            for a list of feminist literature you would have to talk to my fiancee who is finishing off her double degree in women's studies and political science.
            • Actually, the task for somebody upholding moderate feminism as the defining strain of the movement has to deal with the problem of sympathizers. Sure, you may not personally geld men or go around screaming that all sex is rape but if you accept such extremism, if you don't clean your own house, you provide tacit support to those who do, providing them support and cover to espouse their hard-line views.

              This is a problem that is not unique to feminism. All political and social movements are vulnerable to the

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective owners. Comments are owned by the Poster. The Rest © 1997-2009 Geeknet, Inc.