From Hot Coffee To Warm Tea 129
I've been avoiding posting about it, but Joystiq has a completely and utterly sane discussion of the non-story that is the Bully boy on boy kissing 'scandal'. Despite the ravings of Jack Thompson, the homosexual behavior in Bully was seen by the ESRB and is not the first game to feature such content. From the article: "The ESRB would be insane if they were bullied into giving an 'M' (Mature 17+) rating to Bully, as this story continues to gain traction in the mainstream press ... It would also force the ginormous Electronic Arts into the mix to defend the 'T' rated Sims. We're willing to wager that Electronic Arts, which has a Human Rights Campaign corporate equality index score of 88 and had transsexual game designer Danielle Bunten Berry on staff, will put up a good fight if challenged. Rockstar played this brilliantly, they slid in a topic that is controversial, but perfectly defensible, and those that would attack 'Warm Tea,' won't have an easy time of it compared to 'Hot Coffee.'" SFGate put up a thoughtful opinion piece / review of Bully this past weekend. If you're not familiar with the game, it's a great way to fully understand how there's really nothing to worry about here.
classification (Score:5, Funny)
Hot Tea = male/male kissing
Oh, the brits aren't going to like this one...
True... (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
"I'm sorry, no thanks, they make me insecure about my sexuality."
"..."
Re: (Score:1)
Re:classification (Score:4, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
Bigotry (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
"Anyone who disagrees with me is a bigot".
That's pretty much the definition of irony :).
Bigotry -- bullshit (Score:2)
But, don't let that stop you fucking asshats replying to the OP.
Re: (Score:2)
According to dictionary.com, a "bigot" is "a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion". Finding homosexuality offensive is an opinion (or possibly belief, if the opinion is based on religion). Being intolerant of other people's opinions is bigotry. Therefore, the OP's statement is in itself bigotry.
That's the problem with being very tolerant of other people's values: how do you deal with people who are not tolerant ? Will
Re:Bigotry (Score:2)
There's a gap in your reasoning! How is calling someone a bigot an act of intolerance? I don't recall the OP stating any intolerance or animosity toward bigots. Heck, the fellow could be the president of Save the Bigots for all we know. Your assumption shows that you think that bigotry is bad. Therefore, you are yourself a bigot!
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
The OP did, however, show intolerance towards people who find homosexuality offensive. Therefore, the OP fits the definition of a bigot - he's being intolerant of an idea - the idea that homosexuality is offensive or wrong.
Unless, of course, one defines "bigotry" as opposing things I don't find wrong, in which case it quickly reduces down to "A
Re: (Score:2)
I'm going to draw up an analogy, since people *still* can't deal with homosexuality rationally.
Instead of homosexuality, how about race?
-Bully - a game developed by Rockstar that features black people.
-People complain about there being black people in the game.
OP: Anyone who finds it offensive(that the game features black people) should be considered a bigot.
You: No, you're a bigot.
Me: Bullshit. He was pointing out bigotry, doesn't make him a bigot.
You: Blah blah
Re: (Score:2)
This is
The slashtrolls will not work with you here- give us a bad car analogy we can pick apart for about 3 or 4 hundred comments.
This reminds me; Are you new here?
LOL!- I get your point, just had to point out the obvious.
Re: (Score:2)
Cartman: Shut up Jew.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
What if they're born fools?
-Eric
Re: (Score:2)
Then take 'em out back of the woodshed an' drown their unwanted asses.
That's what has got us in the mess we are in now- no way to "cull the herd" like used to happen in the world.
That's what society and civilization will get you- no ability to cull the herd, and the inferiors take over.
Damn, did I say that out loud?....Oh shit! here comes the MODS!!!! run fer yer lives!
Re: (Score:1)
The GP did not suggest that we be intolerant of bigots. It seems only fair that bigots wear any stigma attached to the label 'bigot'—they earned it and who are we to deprive them of their just desserts?
Re: (Score:1)
If Bigot is to mean:
Then I would say that both extreme sides would be called bigots. . .
as well as hypocrites. Let me explain:
A hypocrite is one who says one things but then do
Re: (Score:2)
Just plain wrong. You cannot possibly make a correlation about an entire group of people based on your personal beliefs. This is the same as saying all followers of Islam are terrorists. Simply not true. Period.
Same-sex relations leftist. . . . Says they believe in diversity, yet in practic
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
We do have WET, its pretty much every other station on TV. Being a white hetero male, I haven't run into any less rights than anyone else I know, minority or otherwise.
Or how about wanting Federal support for Homo
Re: (Score:1)
Please understand that a "moral stance" is a direct reference to one's personal beliefs in the morality of such actions, and not that of fear or contempt towards the idea of homosexuality or homosexual individuals.
If I hold that my belief in a God who considers such a lifestyle as an act that is not good, then it would be the morality of my convictions that would preclude me from such actions myself. This
Re:Bigotry (Score:4, Insightful)
I'm personally going to disagree with you mainly because I think the type of statement you're making undermines the freedom of speech (and religion) that western society is based on; it is the type of statement that prevents open (and honest) discussion on any subject and is just as damaging as "Anyone who rejects this videogame violence bill condones child abuse" or "If you oppose our participation in Afganistan you don't support our troops.".
Personally I don't find the content in the game offensive but saying that someone who does is a bigot is pretty extreme. Maybe my education was poor, but I was always lead to believe that biggotry had to do with someone being intolerant towards another group. Now Tolerance (inspite of some people's opinion) does not mean to embrace something, it means to put up with; if your parents said they would tolerate the person you choose to marry you'd probably get very angry.
I will try to make what I'm saying more clear
Suppose you started working in a cubical next to someone who came from the gym every morning and dried their work-out gear in the open; being that they only wash this gear on the weekend by wednesday it smells pretty funky and on friday it smells like a dead animal. Now if your boss told you to "tolerate" it does that mean that you have to stop being offended by the smell of the sweaty workout stuff?
In a similar fashion, someone who disagrees with (or is offended by) Homosexuality is not necessarily a bigot; it depends on how they act on it that would define whether they were a bigot or not.
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Taking a shit is a natural act too. That doesn't mean I wouldn't be offended if someone dropped trow and took a big dump right in front of me.
Some "natural acts" belong in a private setting, including tonsil hockey (be it between Adam and Eve or Adam and Steve).
-Eric
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
As for myself, I am quite tolerant of homosexuality. But I can nonetheless understand why others are not, and would not label someone a bigot for being uncomfortable seeing it thrown in their faces.
-Eric
Re: (Score:2)
Perhaps if a person doesn't like being called a bigot, they should work to get rid of the attitudes that make them one, rather than complaining about the label?
Re: (Score:2)
How so? They are free to express their offense at seeing computer-generated characters kiss. Others are free to call them bigots for saying that. That's all free speech. It's not like anybody is censoring them. In fact, it's usually that kind of person who wants things like this censored.
it is the type of statement that preve
Re: (Score:2)
It is somewhat interesting though, that this is coming out around the same time as US mid term elections.
Re: (Score:1)
Two people kissing is considered porn, now?
Re: (Score:2)
According to the FBIs Uniform Crime Reports, the rate of forcible rape has increased dramatically between 1970 and 2005.
Around 1970 the rate was ~20 per 100,000 inhabitants.
In the 2000's the rate was ~31 per 100,000 inhabitants.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
Heh (Score:2)
Politics (Score:2)
In general you could have infighting and loss of respect between these two groups and it should be in
Attack (Score:2)
Remarkably, it does seem to be the "left" that focuses on tearing down videogames ... which is just silly, if you think about it. Liberalism is supposed to emphasize being
Re: (Score:1)
'Hot Nougat' Squirrelsex mod (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:1)
Controversy (Score:2)
If I created and wanted to market a game, I would spend a few days programming and animating in something contraversal like this to use the current (and foolish) political climate for for advertisment.
So the only thing missing in a game in which you have to beat up kids is controversy... Hmm... Yeah, kissing ought to fill that gap!
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
Bioware beat them to it.. (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Before that, even... (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
Isn't Bully from Rockstar Vancouver and isn't Bioware based in Edmonton? I guess Canadians are leaders in the production of homosexual video game content!
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
If Jack Thompson wasn't such an asshat, Rockstar wouldn't be able to have something as simple as a boy-kisses-boy feature in the game to attract press attention.
Thompson (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I dunno, I guess it would depend how hot my cousin was...
Re: (Score:2)
You don't need a conspiracy theory to explain it. Jack Thompson is really only about promoting one thing: Himself. Being "that crazy idiot who hates profane hip-hop/violent video games" has kept his name in headlines for well over a decade now, when otherwise nobody would know or care anything about "that useless lawyer that never wins any cases". The fact that the target
Yeesh (Score:3, Insightful)
I bought the game last week. I haven't found the boy you can kiss. So far, though, my impression is that the 'controversy' here is laughable at best. When you target people options appear indicating what you can do with them. With some females, for example, you can profess your attraction to them and potentially woo them into smooching. My guess is that there's a boy floating around you can walk up and the heart icon will appear. Wee. Polish those pitchforks.
I have to be honest: I think it's more controversial that Bully is described as having 'gay sexual content that deserves a higher rating' than it is to have the option to kiss a boy in the game. Nice little double-standard there.
Re:Yeesh (Score:5, Funny)
Stop that, you'll go blind!
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
But really, it's just for the life-up, I swear!
Re: (Score:1)
Warm Tea...?! (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
No XBox/XBox360 (Score:2)
Oh well, not my loss...I just won't be buying it at all.
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Balance and equality (Score:2)
There's a "kiss" button combination, so if you stand in front of a girl and press it, you grab her and you kiss.
Now, what happens if you stand in front of a boy and press the same buttons?
It seems to me that if anything different happens, the developers have to explain why they're discriminating against homosexuality. The only fair and balanced thing to do is for the engine to treat boys and girls alike.
The only remaining quest
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Not exactly. You have 'positive' and 'negative' button pushes. With most guys, if you walk up and hit the positive one, he'll say "whassup?" and the dude'll either say something nice back or insult you. With the femmes, you'll say something like "You sure are pretty!", and if that works, you have the option to give them flowers. I haven't bumped into the gay student yet, but I imagine it wor
Ugh.. (Score:2)
I wonder which situation would actually make more of an impact on the typical Slashdotter. =p
virtual boy? (Score:2)
Nintendo's bringing back the virtual boy [wikipedia.org]? Is Nintendo actually making a VR helmet for Wii [wikipedia.org]?
Re: (Score:2)
Just kidding, I love you. HA! You don't know WHAT I said! Just leave. Don't worry, leave... this is all a dream.
This will cost Rockstar sales (Score:3, Insightful)
I'll give a non-homosexual example of where my digust for something made me regret a purchase. I watch a lot of movies in the theater. The movie Beloved had come out and I decided to go see it. There was one scene I was repulsed by. Oprah Winfrey urinating. God, I hope that was faked. It wasn't her sitting down and doing her business
So I don't like watching homosexuals kiss or watching Oprah pee. If a media product comes out which includes either, I will not purchase it.
Re: (Score:2)
I point you in the direction of the multitude of patches for Baldur's Gate 2 that remove the gender restrictions on the romance subplots, and laugh in your face. Then I point you in the direction of Fallout 2, in which absolutely everybody in the game seems to be bi (at least for my 17-year-old female with high charisma and the Sex Appeal perk, anyway). And laugh in your face again. And I, for one, am always game for more of that sort of thing.
Perha
Re: (Score:2)
If it was a game where homo-smooches were a major component, you might almost have a point. But this is o
Oh, please... (Score:2)
(Somewhat related: Jack Thompson also thinks that Sims 2 is a pedophile's dream-come-true, as well, since you can remove the pixel blur for children and even apply third-party skins with teh boobies! Somebody please think of the virtual children!!!)
Re: (Score:1)
My counter-suggestion, similarly based on wild conjecture, is that most people care much less than you do. For reference: well, anything popular that has homosexuality in it somewhere. Take your pick.
I think that the arena of armchair hypothes
Full disclosure (Score:2)
I'm not saying that Bully should be banned. But there should be full disclosure of homosexual content. This would allow gamers and parents buying games for their children to make a fully informed decision. Just as Gears of War should have a label stating "intense bloody violence" on it. I like games with brutal violence, but I understand that many people don't. If Mario suddenly ripped off Luigi's head and started raping the eye sockets, there are many people who would be unpleasantly surprised.
Re: (Score:2)
Being in the news (as in TFA) isn't full disclosure? Given how many idiot parents can't seem to read the ESRB labels, I'd say having this in the news will alert more people to the "objectionable" content than any label would.
...then the game would get a AO rating, and nobody would stock it. How many hetai games can you buy at your
Re: (Score:1)
Hmm, well "Spy Boy" did lead to the sequel "Spy Boy 2", but yeah, that was a rather limited audience...
Re: (Score:2)
Ohnoes! You can optionally kiss a boy! Now that I know I can offer flowers to a boy in the game, I simply can't resist, I'm somehow compelled by the homosexual agenda! I'm being forced get flowers, to track down a gay character, and offer the flowers to that character! Help, help, I'm being oppressed!
Meanwhile in reality, the gay kiss isn't "forced" on the player any more than the straight kissing also possible in the game is forced
Me too. (Score:2)
The same thing happened to me.
Here is a flower.
@}----
So, uh, do you want to go get some dinner?
Re: (Score:1)
You are almost certainly correct that this will cost the company some sales. Of course, with so many games allowing homosexual behaviour these days (e.g., all games with multi-player options that allow some freedom of avatar interaction and/or interactive chat amongst players), die-hard bigots have few games to choose from these days.
Even if you are correct that "very few people want homosexual content in their games", that number (and the number of extra customers that the company will gain through the in
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
This is about forcing something on the consumer that they don't want.
Rubbish. You, the player, are given the choice of kissing another boy in the game. If that offends you... don't!
Re: (Score:2)
Those guys tend to be repressed gays. They have a fascination with homosexuality, which is why they feel "disgusted." It's actually latent attraction.
After all, why would a heterosexual guy dislike homosexuality? It means there are more women to go around!
SimCopter (Score:2)
Long ago, SimCopter included an unplanned easter egg that featured semi-nude male NPCs running around kissing. The guy who included it in the game--it wasn't planned or discussed with the rest of the team, it seems--was fired supposedly for the unauthorized inclusion, not for its content. That, at least, is how I understood what happened.
Now, nobody r
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Never mind getting "caught" in the rotor - all characters have to wear reflective vests and helmets when near working helicopters.
Re: (Score:1)
Maybe it's an accidental include. (Score:2)
There's also nothing wrong with being a lazy programmer. (If you make games.)
So let's suppose you've got to create a sprite for your game. You like the girls better, so you code them first. There's nothing wrong with that. I can relate. You've then got to create a matching set of male characters.
Do you:
1. Create all the male characters from scratch?
2. Copy the female characters into the male directory, reuse a lot of the code like the gestures, dialog options, fri
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Got burnt? Yeah, they cried all the way to the bank! Those poor, maligned success stories....
Seriously, Jackass here is the best thing that ever happened to them. As long as he keeps up his "crusade", they get free press, and a reputation that will attract people purely for the controversy.
What's more, they've now made it a political issue by shifting the controversial content from s
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Jack Thompson, is that you?
No, we're not giving you a politically correct version!
Re: (Score:1)