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Columbine RPG Kickout Has Repercussions

Posted by Zonk on Tue Jan 09, 2007 02:46 PM
from the feel-the-burn dept.
Entertainment Games
As a direct result of the removal of the Columbine RPG from the Slamdance game competition, two games (so far) have pulled out of the judging process. The Forge has extensive commentary on the first pullout (the game Braid), as well as the removal of fl0w from the competition. From the article: "Regardless of the artistic merit, the facts as I understand them are that Slamdance had actively courted the creator of SCM RPG! to enter it into the festival, which then judged it to be a finalist before bending over for the corporations and shredding their credibility by removing it from the competition. Imagine Dominoes Pizza deciding it objected to the theme of Brokeback Mountain and told the Academy Awards to remove it. Imagine them doing it after it was already a finalist."
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story

Related Stories

[+] Columbine Game Kicked From Slamdance Festival 209 comments
Imaria writes "A Kotaku post has the news that Super Columbine Massacre RPG! has been kicked out of the Slamdance Gamemaker Festival. After reaching the finals, the organizers were forced to remove the game from the running to appease mounting external pressure. According to the post, this is the first time in the Slamdance Festival's 13 year history that they have removed either a game or film due to criticism. From the article: '[Game creator] Ledonne said that he bears no ill will toward the festival, but that the decision to pull the game does raise concerns about freedom of speech and video game development. "I don't want to paint them as the villain in this," he said. "I don't think the real issue is a couple of guys at Slamdance who decided to reject my game, it's the larger pressures placed on them."'"
[+] Slamdance Festival Loses More Entrants 62 comments
In yet more displays of solidarity with the creator of Super Columbine Massacre RPG, additional Slamdance finalists have withdrawn. The incredibly creative Toblo, as well as the titles Once Upon a Time and Everyday Shooter have taken themselves out of consideration in protest of the Columbine game's removal from the competition. Only eight of the original 14 finalists are still in the competition, with several of those having gotten together to write a letter of protest to the contest's organizers. Danny Leddonne, creator of the Columbine title, has spoken with Ars Technica and Next Gen in recent days, and touches on both his controversial title and the hoopla that now surrounds it. Update: 01/10 20:21 GMT by Z : It doesn't end. Slamdance has now lost a sponsor over this.
[+] Columbine RPG - How Real Is Too Real? 118 comments
westlake writes "Washington Post columnist Mike Musgrove offers a rare and balanced view from the mainstream press of the Slamdance Competition and Super Columbine Massacre RPG. Surprised by the effective use of flashbacks and the authentic dialogue of the Columbine game, he goes on to say: 'But when it came time to start creating mayhem in the school's halls, I couldn't bring myself to push the buttons to continue. Odd, I suppose, because I have killed thousands of video game characters over the years. And though the game's chunky graphics are primitive...no game has ever made me feel nearly as queasy. I didn't want to be responsible for the real-world violence that happened that day, even in a game.' Ledonne figures that games will either grow into a medium in which it is acceptable to confront and challenge an audience with titles like his, or will devolve into a stagnant, failed format."
[+] What We Owe the Columbine RPG 66 comments
Gamaustra's Soapbox this week touches on the lessons learned from Slamgate and the Super Columbine Massacre RPG!. Author Patrick Dugan explores the ways in which SCMRPG challenged the media and gamers alike to think about what the medium of games is all about. Covered by everyone from Newsweek to Game Informer, it opened the eyes of non-gamers to the possibilities of the format and forced gamers to rethink their assumptions. "Game Informer's benchmark of game-specialized print journalism may very well inspire other major publications to follow suit with their own coverage, and in the capacity of Game Informer's readership, paints a symbol of solidarity. The twelve year old kid who thinks Gears of War is the best thing going can take a look at these graphics, popular before his birth, and get a sense that his beloved past-time is part of something greater, something he can defend to non-gamers as being inherently valuable." This issue is also explored in the final part of N'Gai Croal's interview with Jamil Moledina, which we talked about last week.
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  • good for them (Score:5, Insightful)

    by spykemail (983593) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @02:52PM (#17526948) Homepage
    Good for them. When you give in to pressure from big business to censor you lose all of your credibility.

    • Re:good for them (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Rob T Firefly (844560) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @03:11PM (#17527340) Homepage Journal
      Indeed. I wish I had a game in the competition so I could withdraw it now, and I'd like to go on record as being newly motivated to check out any games by people with enough integerity to stand by their fellow designer and stick to their beliefs even though it means losing a shot at this particular brass ring. That action earns my respect far more than any "I won at Slamdance!" blurb could.

    • Re:good for them (Score:5, Informative)

      by abandonment (739466) <mike...wuetherick@@@gmail...com> on Tuesday January 09 2007, @04:21PM (#17529100) Homepage
      Looks like 3 more have dropped out as well:

      http://braid-game.com/news/?p=21 [braid-game.com]

      5 games in total have quit in disgust. Good on em indeed!

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Shads (4567)
      More power to em. Hopefully, the entire competition drops out until they either let Columbine compete or till another year. I may think the game is tasteless, but it has as much business being there as any other offensive piece of artwork. When you start discriminating on which art goes too far because of corporate sponsors, you're no longer being subjective and judging on artistic value you're being a corporate shill... there is no sense of integrity in the competition, its just who is willing to make a

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by westlake (615356)
      Good for them. When you give in to pressure from big business to censor you lose all of your credibility.

      It depends on your target audience. If your goal to introduce independent gaming to the general public then maybe Columbine: The RPG is not where you want to begin.

      It is easy to lose credibility with the Geek.

      The eternal sophomore. To whom everything is black and white, all or nothing, 1 or 0.

      Much harder to win the respect and trust of those whose primary interests and values are rooted outside his

  • I know most people think that SCMRPG is in horrible taste, I disagre (I view it as documentry/commentary on a horrible event in video game form). Flow standing up against this is good of them in my mind.

    I don't think that the SlamDance guys are bad for caving to the preasure (they do need corporate backers), however seeing a company that is gettign LOTS of recognition standing up against something like this still makes me happy.

    as a note, if you havn't played around with Cloud (their other game) I deffinat
    • I don't think that the SlamDance guys are bad for caving to the preasure (they do need corporate backers)

      Slamdance invited SCRPG to participate in its event, voted it to be worthy of status as a finalist, and then kicked them out. That's irresponsible. Why pretend to host an objective contest when votes are for sale to the highest-paying sponsor?

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Thansal (999464)
        If you don't cave to sponsors, you don't exist. I know it sucks, and I really hate that it is true, however something is better then nothing in my mind, and we do need more outlets for indy devs to get some recognition.

        My hope is that because they caved and this flare-up is now happening we will see something come of it. Either SlamDance will lose all of their credibility (very possible), or they will rally and specificly state rules reguarding removal of contestants (guidlines that have to be followed, a

        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by iamhassi (659463)
          "If you don't cave to sponsors, you don't exist."

          But there needs to be some kind of limit. What if McDonald's was a sponsor and complained because a game about the Burger King was a finalist and Burger King wasn't a sponsor? Who really deciding which games win, the sponsors or the judges?

          The judges should have told the sponsor that complained that the judges decide which games win, not the sponsors. Of course the sponsors will complain, that's what they're suppose to do, of course they're going to
          • Yes, the limit is howmuch they can do with out financial backing. Yup, it sucks, however this is the real world.

            Mabey they will be able to become a not forprofit organization that survives on donations, or they will find backers that have more open views. That would be awsome, no need to wory about your backers pulling out and you can then actualy show off everything you want. However for now they HAVE to listen to the people giving them money or they don't exist.

            On a second note:
            Again, SCMRPG does have

            • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

              by Al Dimond (792444)
              Yes, the limit is howmuch they can do with out financial backing. Yup, it sucks, however this is the real world. What the latest action shows, however, is that they have legitimate pressure from both sides. They need corporate money to be what they want to be, but without the support of the community and developers they won't have an audience and thus won't be worth sponsoring anyway. The community voice checks the corporate voice, and tells Slamdance that they'll have to take a harder line with the spon

            • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

              by jlarocco (851450)

              I also hope they seak new financhial backing and dump the one(s) that threatened to walk. However I still can't really say that they are BAD people, they were in a hard situation (Stand up, take the bullet, and die. Or run away to live and fight another day).

              They chose wrong. I'm not a big gamer, so I had never even heard of this contest before. But right now, the only thing I know about the event is that it's controlled by corporate sponsors. In other words, it's pointless. Who wins? Who loses? W

  • Speaking of Brokeback Mountain (Score:5, Funny)

    by AssCork (769414) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @02:53PM (#17526968)
    When the hell is that game coming out?

  • This is typical political correctness (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Rosco P. Coltrane (209368) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @02:57PM (#17527062)
    Of course, any game based on something as horrific as the Columbine shooting is at best bad taste, at worst shameless exploitation of the event to get in the press, and people should rightfully be angry, and the game should be pulled out.

    But for some reason I fail to understand, there are dozens of games glorifying WW2 combats, or simulating the Iraq war. Millions have died during WW2, and hundred of thousands died in Iraq and continue to do so. Yet nobody finds reasons to be upset when you incarnate a G.I. killing German soldiers in a game. It's all perfectly normal to them.

    My grandfather died in WW2, I never knew him. He was fighting for the "good guys" (the allies), but that didn't prevent my dad from crying often when he thought about him. War simulation games make me just as angry as this stupid Columbine RPG, and people who get their pants in a knot over the Columbine game then go play the virtual soldier ten minutes later make me sick, because they're biased, politically correct idiots with short memories...
    • And what of "America's Army" - an army recruitment game with no restrictions on who may play? The purpose of America's Army is to guide the player through basic training, siphon him into a regiment and specialty, give him a weapon and ship him out to hot zones. The game is as realistic as possible to best portray army tactics and day-to-day life. For all the games critics like Jack Thompson have dubbed "murder simulators", isn't America's Army the most literal definition? Where's the outrage from American taxpayers who fund continued development and distribution of this "game"?

      • Re:This is typical political correctness (Score:5, Funny)

        by deinol (210478) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @03:53PM (#17528432) Homepage
        dubbed "murder simulators", isn't America's Army the most literal definition?

        Killing cops is bad, killing terrorists and nazi's is good! Don't you get it?

        Why do you hate America?
      • Where's the outrage from American taxpayers who fund continued development and distribution of this "game"?

        Well as an American taxpayer I have to say I thought the game kicked ass. Glad to see my money go towards benefiting me directly for once.
    • Blame Hollywood. It all started with them. They made war movies glorifying the violence in the wars. Video games just put the control in the hands of the viewer.

      WWII was also a horrific event. Do you think that movies based upon it, such as Saving Private Ryan are shameless exploitations of the event? Should they all have been pulled? Should all the war games ever made be pulled? All games in which any person harms another person?

      If this 'game' (It's more of a documentary) were non-interactive, this
      • WWII was also a horrific event. Do you think that movies based upon it, such as Saving Private Ryan are shameless exploitations of the event? Should they all have been pulled? Should all the war games ever made be pulled? All games in which any person harms another person?

        No. I think all these games and movies have a right to exist, including the Columbine game, or even an Al Quaeda simulator if there was such a game. They have the right to exist because if they don't, then at some point or another, some ot
        • "Just try to make a game where you incarnate a German SS going on a shooting spree, and you'll quickly draw the ire of the entire nation."

          I think I did this in Castle Wolfenstein.

          Quite a few games have put the player in the role of a German in various WWII conflicts.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by drinkypoo (153816)

      Of course, any game based on something as horrific as the Columbine shooting is at best bad taste, at worst shameless exploitation of the event to get in the press, and people should rightfully be angry, and the game should be pulled out.

      I'm not sure what you're saying here. I rather suspect that you aren't either. Your sentence implies that the creation of the game is exploitation of the event. The game was developed in advance of the event and the creators of the event specifically sought its inclusio

    • I can understand where you're coming from, but I have to agree on several points.

      Making any form of art depicting or relating to a horrific event should in no way instantly disqualify it from competition, recognition, or thoughtful contemplation.

      For example, Guernica. Picasso painted a well-regarded masterpiece artfully depicting the utter horror and waste that was the bombing of a peaceful, remote town. We could potentially throw this work of art away because of its "exploitation" of a tragedy, or examine

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by a.d.trick (894813)

      But for some reason I fail to understand, there are dozens of games glorifying WW2 combats, or simulating the Iraq war. Millions have died during WW2, and hundred of thousands died in Iraq and continue to do so. Yet nobody finds reasons to be upset when you incarnate a G.I. killing German soldiers in a game. It's all perfectly normal to them.

      The primary reason I hate (real) war as much as I do is from my experience in video games about war

      I do not think that all war games are good and health, but as a who

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by gstoddart (321705)

      But for some reason I fail to understand, there are dozens of games glorifying WW2 combats, or simulating the Iraq war. Millions have died during WW2, and hundred of thousands died in Iraq and continue to do so. Yet nobody finds reasons to be upset when you incarnate a G.I. killing German soldiers in a game.

      Because, gloryfying WW2 in films and TV established the precedent. Collectively, WW2 has become part of both American and world psyche and mythology. GI Joe is a recognizeable concept (and I don't mean

    • Re:This is typical political correctness (Score:5, Funny)

      by soft_guy (534437) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @05:09PM (#17530182)
      Of course, any game based on something as horrific as the Columbine shooting is at best bad taste, at worst shameless exploitation of the event to get in the press, and people should rightfully be angry, and the game should be pulled out.

      But for some reason I fail to understand, there are dozens of games glorifying PacMan, or simulating large scale eating of dots. Millions have died from binge eating, and hundred of thousands died from obesity and continue to do so. Yet nobody finds reasons to be upset when you incarnate a mindless yellow eating machine in a game. It's all perfectly normal to them.

      My grandfather died from eating thousands of marshmallows; I never knew him. He was fighting for the "good guys" (fluffy-puff marshmallows), but that didn't prevent my dad from crying often when he thought about him. Eating simulation games make me just as angry as this stupid Columbine RPG, and people who get their pants in a knot over the Columbine game then go play the virtual bulimic ten minutes later make me sick, because they're biased, politically correct idiots with short memories...

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Psychochild (64124)
      Of course, any game based on something as horrific as the Columbine shooting is at best bad taste, at worst shameless exploitation of the event to get in the press, and people should rightfully be angry, and the game should be pulled out.

      Amen! And, while we're throwing things on the bonfire, let's not stop with just one silly game!

      I think we should abhor Goya's Tres De Mayo [wikipedia.org]. It's simply exploitative of Napoleon's attacks in Spain. This painting is simply blood and gun porn obviously intended to appeal

      • Re:This is typical political correctness (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Rosco P. Coltrane (209368) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @03:11PM (#17527348)
        In the case of war, the argument can be made that it is morally correct to try and overthrow Nazi's.

        That's where you're wrong. War is morally wrong, period. That doesn't mean we shouldn't have gone to war against the Nazis, what I'm trying to point out is that exploiting the human misery that WW2 in a game 60 years later is no more acceptable that exploiting a bunch of kids getting machine-gunned in a school recently. Probably less so: WW2 is a world-wide stain on humanity, whereas Columbine is, despite all its horror, a local event.

        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          by radarjd (931774)
          War is morally wrong, period. That doesn't mean we shouldn't have gone to war against the Nazis,

          Out of curiosity, does that mean you believe that a morally wrong action was still the correct action to take?

          • Out of curiosity, does that mean you believe that a morally wrong action was still the correct action to take?

            Yes, a morally wrong action may be the correct action to take if you're forced to do it to prevent something morally worse. In the case of WW2, it was morally wrong to go to war, but morally worse to let the Germans invade Europe. In that respect, the Allies were "less wrong" than the Axis, which makes none of it okay of course, but sometimes you're cornered and you have to take choices.

            When you're
            • going to war should be considered an international crime. and as such punished by... Come on you hypocrite, say it!

            • Re:This is typical political correctness (Score:5, Insightful)

              by aicrules (819392) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @03:44PM (#17528184)
              You obviously have no idea what morally even means. It would be morally wrong to not have gone to war to stop the Nazi destruction of Europe. It was not morally wrong to have gone to war in that case. Morality is not based on only one piece of information. It is based on all known information.

              Well, okay, morality ends up actually being completely subjective to whatever person is deciding whether a particular thing is morally right or wrong for themselves. But you stated war was "morally wrong, period" as if it were a fact and not an opinion. It would have only been morally wrong to go to war to save Europe and ourselves if there was a way to stop the Nazis otherwise that would have guaranteed less bloodshed on both sides. There were certainly acts committed by both sides during the war that would be considered morally wrong by anybody, but the overall act of going to war was morally right.
              • I think there are two reasonable definitions of morally wrong: One is "any action other than the best moral action for some moral system", the other is specific to the moral system, but I'll take utilitarianism as an easy example: "Any action that has a negative net value to society is morally wrong."

                I can accept that war is always morally wrong by the latter standard, and it's not an unreasonably definition. Clearly, war can rise to the former standard, although it is more complicated than most people real

                  • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

                    by Jerf (17166)
                    Actually, it is an unreasonable definition, because it basically says (for some circumstances), "everything you do is morally wrong."
                    Yup, that's where the definition leads. Definitions do things like that.

                    Remember, definitions don't actually have any power. As long as they are reasonably consistent and everybody agrees with them, you can communicate with them. You can still discuss what is least wrong with such a definition.
              • Thank you for the translation. For some reason all I got out of the parent post was "I'm 12 years old" over and over again.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by drinkypoo (153816)

          War is morally wrong, period. That doesn't mean we shouldn't have gone to war against the Nazis

          That's precisely what you just said. The meaning of "morally wrong" here must use the following definition of moral: "Conforming to standards of what is right or just in behavior; virtuous: a moral life." Note the conforming to standards bit. There is no universal morality. There is only what has been defined by society.

          Of course, I disagree with you. War is not necessarily morally wrong - if you're the def

  • Here's my two cents... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Captain Sarcastic (109765) * on Tuesday January 09 2007, @04:03PM (#17528666)
    First off, I'm not angry or upset about Columbine Massacre. If I find something to be tasteless / offensive / not my cup of "Hot Coffee" <grin>, then I just don't buy it. Seems simple enough to me, so I'm not interested in "how can you judge it without playing it" arguments.

    However, I see the organizers of Slamdance as trying to have their cake and eat it, too. They courted the makers of the Columbine RPG primarily for shock value... and the publicity. Then they found out that some of their sponsors objected, and planned to do their objecting with their sponsorship of Slamdance, and decided to remove the game from the competition, meanwhile loudly blaming "outside pressures" for "muzzling" games.

    And that is what bugs me about Slamdance. If they were willing to seem edgy with their inclusion of Columbine Massacre, then they could have accepted the consequences of their sponsorships getting yanked. But they didn't, so they shouldn't.

  • It doesn't stop at 2... (Score:3, Informative)

    by loraksus (171574) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @04:09PM (#17528802) Homepage
    Everyday Shooter [everydayshooter.com], Toblo [csnation.net] and Once Upon a Time [wakinggames.com] have also pulled out.

    This leaves the number of finalists at 8. leaving only ~60% of the original...

  • violence depictions based on real-world events need a certain buffer to be forgiven. war/battle sims, movies and lots of other artistic content constantly invade/avoid such a buffer. 9/11 was "off-limits" until the softest, most congratulatory touches began - or hack comments about ethnicities, etc.

    The buffer is time, or social distance, or satire versus sympathy (Borat movie comes to mind), etc.

    These days, you can re-enact or view depictions the scenes from some major historical moments -

  • MORE pullouts! Slamdance may collapse entirely! (Score:5, Informative)

    by Alsee (515537) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @04:22PM (#17529116) Homepage
    Slamdance originally announced 14 finalists. [slamdance.com] They are currently down to 8 participating finalists. [slamdance.com]

    Super Columbine was ejected.
    Braid [ironrealms.com] has pulled out.
    Flow [thatgamecompany.com] has pulled out.
    Toblo [csnation.net] has pulled out.
    Once Upon A Time [wakinggames.com] has pulled out.
    Everyday Shooter [everydayshooter.com] has pulled out.

    With nearly half of the finalists already gone, just a few more pullouts could cause a complete collapse of Slamdance this year.

    -

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      I for one am going to send all these developers nice thank-you emails for doing the right thing. Also I'm going to check out their games.
  • I can totally tell that none of you have played this game and you're totally bashing on it. You're doing exactly what the media does with games like Grand Theft Auto, etc. This game glorifies nothing about Columbine, but gives insight into what happened that day. Also, the game costs nothing, you can go ahead an download it for free. http://www.columbinegame.com/download.htm [columbinegame.com] Just my 2 cents, stop hating without being educated about what you're criticizing.

    • Re:This is not censorship. (Score:4, Informative)

      by kfg (145172) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @03:48PM (#17528314)
      Why is it improper for them to have decided they don't want that RPG included in their competition.

      Because, as already noted, they invited it and then declared it among the elite of the entrants before throwing it out?

      KFG

    • Re:This is not censorship. (Score:5, Informative)

      by illegalcortex (1007791) on Tuesday January 09 2007, @04:20PM (#17529056)
      People like to throw around the term censorship, but it's really only censorship if the government is involved.
      censor:
      "to examine in order to suppress or delete anything considered objectionable"
      http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary [m-w.com]

      censoring:
      "1 a : the institution, system, or practice of censoring"
      http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Diction ary&va=censorship [m-w.com]

      Censorship can refer to goverment censorship, but doesn't have to. Anyone who has any power (including companies, contest judges, etc.) can censor.

      As Carlin says "Try to pay attention to the language we've all agreed on."

    • It would be like Domino's pizza objecting to a movie that glorified the two kids who went on a rampage at that school.

      Have you played the Columbine RPG? I have, and it doesn't glorify them at all. If anything it's an attempt to help you to understand them, but it doesn't really succeed at that, except perhaps by asserting that to the two shooters, the massacre held the same unreality as a video game does to us.

      What if I decide to make a game where the player is a rapist? The player earns experience by go

    • Give it 20 more years and the general public will feel just a bit more detached to accept this game, or something to its liking, anyway.

      shooting unarmed kids in a school. "god mode" in gaming terms. you could like the shooter of the Amish girls introduce rape and torture into the game. until the sniper from the SWAT team puts a bullet through your head.

      thanks, but no thanks.

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