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Heavy Rain - Playing a Story
Posted by
Soulskill
on Wed Sep 03, 2008 11:01 PM
from the drops-of-realism dept.
from the drops-of-realism dept.
Edge Magazine is running a piece about Heavy Rain, a thriller by Quantic Dream that's been in development for a few years now. Edge spoke with David Cage, the game's writer and director, about using graphics technology not simply for breathtaking landscapes or realistic lighting, but to bring the characters to life and make them more believable. Cage walked the folks at Kotaku through a demo, and they provided details on how the controls will work. From Edge:
"'We worked very hard on motion capture, especially facial motion capture,' explains Cage. 'As you know, eyes are incredibly hard to do: the minute movements they constantly make mean you can tell whether something is human or not. We created a technology to motion-capture that from actors.' The shaders applied to the lead character's eyes and the skin that surrounds them also conspire to nudge Heavy Rain's characters closer to believability. The 'deadness' that so often afflicts such digital mannequins has been significantly chipped away, and we are presented with Madison, a character whose facial features, though attractive in an expectedly unnatural sort of way, also carry blemishes that succeed in breaking down her artificiality."
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Short summary; (Score:5, Informative)
PS3 only. Good quality visuals. It is a detective story/game.
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Re:Short summary; (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
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None the less, I speak the truth. Numbers are easily found.
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Look at the figures in the rest of the world. PS3 is outselling the Xbox now, and catching up on install base.
It's only really the US that's in love with the 360. Probably because in much of the rest of the world saying the name "Microsoft" leaves a bit of a bad taste in the mouth.
yes, MGS4 doubled PS3 sales for a short while. But even when they fell back they're higher than the 360 sales.
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Well imho people who don't play MGS4 are missing out. :)
I've been playing it at a friends place, I'm in Act 4 atm and I'm loving it
It truly is a work of art.
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Sure I'm biased because I've been playing the series since the first one on the MSX.
But I do think it's a work of art, great visuals, great story, so far very good gameplay.
And movies? I watch a lot of them in a lot of genres. Sometimes it's fantastic and sometimes it's just a stupid actionflick.
The movies I try to avoid are mostly those like Scary Movie and other parody movies like that, I quit watching Scary Movie after 10 minutes.
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Where did I say they're an invalid form of art? Did I or did I not specifically say "made to date?"
We're not talking about average films.
There's nothing artistic abo
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I regularly watch excellent films. Maybe you should watch something other than mainstream Hollywood productions.
Length != quality.
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Anyone who claims that quality films are few and far between and that there aren't any films with an excellent story is obviously not well versed in films. It's like saying that there aren't any games with good gameplay.
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"Check the sales figures. MGS4 was able to nearly double PS3 sales for a couple of weeks. Then they fell right back to their normal pathetic levels."
Which are higher than the Xbox360 level.
Sorry, but it's the truth.
Now sure, the 360 has a larger install base, but that's being eroded. And have you even tried playing PS3 games online? They work seamlessly, just like they do on the 360. This is not an area you can jump on any more. Plus it's free :)
"The PS3 is losing to the PSP of all things"
So is everything e
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If it's a quality game with innovative gameplay or great design, it's almost guaranteed to be a retail failure.
Some of my favourite games of all time fall into this category, e.g ICO and Psychonauts. Oh well, it just goes to show that game sales are not a reliable indication of game quality.
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Can you actually cite any of that?
You speak in generalities, that the U3 engine is "outdated" and "relies on normal maps" but are there actually any benchmarks that show the Cells can push a lot more similarly-processed polys than the 360's graphics?
I'd love to think that devs have thus far only unlocked a fraction of the possibilities lurking beneath the glossy plastic sitting in my entertainment cabinet, but from what I've seen, games thus far look pretty comparable between the two.
So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meeting (Score:5, Insightful)
All this realism stuff gets on my nerves. Sure it looks more realistic but is it actually a better game? Are the graphics on the Wii "realistic" hell no, they are basically cartoons but the games play well and I don't care about the graphics. So the eyes flicker around in this new game like the eyes of people in a meeting just waiting for it to finish, flicking to the clock, back to the notes and then gazing out of the window in a day-dream before flicking back into the room in case they are asked a question.
Realism isn't always the best way to convey the most emotion and impact, look at the finest paintings from the likes of Rembrandt, and its that impact that games companies should concentrate on rather than on yet another way to make a dull game look pretty.
So real you'll feel like you're in a chat room (Score:3, Funny)
"Realism isn't always the best way to convey the most emotion and impact"
Emoticons work much better.
Re:So real you'll feel like you're in a chat room (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
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:D
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The games industry is becoming more and more like Hollywood. They think pretty pictures, famous names & loud noise will make up for a lack of story.
Games were more playable on the 8-bit computers & consoles than on today's supercomputers/superconsoles. Yeah the graphics were shitty at times but you still got more immersed in the game than you do these days. Its hard to get too involved in an 'interactive movie' with a few decisions/actions.
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:5, Insightful)
It's not that games were somehow better back then, it's that you were younger and had more time to spend selecting and learning to play video games - and that you're comparing random games from today with your best memories of the best games of the past.
My best memories of, say, Deus Ex are much better than Crysis was... but I'm sure they're much better than Deus Ex actually was too.
Parent
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Far too many games have way too bland gameplay nowadays. Anyone having played assassins creed will know what I mean, although the story was quite intriguing. F.E.A.R. also suffered from shoot-the-same-guy-a-hundred-times-in-some-hallway-syndrome. Absolutely boring rubbish, although the paranormal events made it quite intriguing at the beginning. Half-life
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The Rose Tinting Effect of Memory. You remember the games/movies/albums you liked in those days, and tend to forget the rest. The signal to noise ratio has always been the same, you're just forgetting the noise. Also, your tastes and standards change over time. As a kid, Tron was orgasmic to me. Watching it now i could see more flaws and not be as entertained by this or that.
Wish i had mod points for ya.
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Really? Wolfenstein 3D immersed you more than Crysis? Yeah, ok...
What are these interactive movies that you're referring to? I haven't played an interactive movie since the mid-nineties when they were still being
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:5, Interesting)
Agreed.
However, looking at the development of art history, the masters first worked toward realism. Caravaggio with his tenebrism (dramatic shading, where 3D games begin to take off with better shading and lighting) really began to bring things to life. When they reached that pinnacle of realism, other forms began to emerge. I imagine gaming will do something similar as we become bored of perfectly realistic games, even if they are masterpieces of both art and game design.
Anybody else with a more extensive art background have any other comments on this?
Parent
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However, I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I love technology... I like to watch it advance before my eyes... and in no other place is that quite as startlingly evident than video games.
Of course, I can get hooked on a good video game with ok graphics (I LOVED Alpha-Ce
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Quote: "the obvious place to push the envelope is graphics"
The main problems in games is not graphics. Good 3D models and high resolution textures are common and realistic lighting is being pushed more and more.
The two main problems are lack of detail and lack of realistic physics. The lack of detail is evident in just about any game. I am not aware of any game for instance where dust is modeled as individual particles. Outside scenes are even worse. Roads are often textured rather than modeled meaning that
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Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:4, Interesting)
Agreed.
However, looking at the development of art history... I imagine gaming will do something similar as we become bored of perfectly realistic games, even if they are masterpieces of both art and game design.
Anybody else with a more extensive art background have any other comments on this?
Interesting thought, but not one that persuades me. Many games have already made a virtue of deliberately non-photo-realistic visuals. Molyneux [lionhead.com]' games, for example, have cartoonish visuals not because he doesn't have the graphic sophistication to go for near photo-real but because he chooses not to.
I think the visual aesthetic has a lot to do with the entire experience the director is trying to impart. I really love The Witcher [thewitcher.com] (my review here [jasmine.org.uk]) for its immersiveness, and part of that immersiveness is the beautiful visuals which are clearly aiming towards (although not, at least on my hardware, quite achieving it). You really can, in The Witcher, just stop and watch the moon rise and be blown away by the beauty of the scene.
Photorealism also suits stories which build on the 'film noir' genre, as it's clear that Heavy Rain does - but black-and-white might work better (it's noticeable that the palette in those Heavy Rain screenshots is pretty subdued).
However, in the game I'm trying to work on I want to end up with a 'charcoal and wash' visual - very little colour and not a lot of detail. I don't - yet - know how to do this - near photo real would be a lot easier and may be what I eventually end up with. But the reason for that choice is partly to make the game look distinctive, but it's also to comment on the culture of the people I'm trying to tell a story about.
Parent
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Realism isn't always the best way to convey the most emotion and impact, look at the finest paintings from the likes of Rembrandt, and its that impact that games companies should concentrate on rather than on yet another way to make a dull game look pretty.
The desire to turn an easy profit will win over the desire to make a better game for some companies after the first few companies start exploring a new area in visualisation methods.
Seen TF2? Awesome cartooning, quality abounds, its a whole new look for games of that type, and it works really well. Seen the new Battlefield? a cheap imitation, graphics wise which looks unpolished (Well, awful in comparison to TF2), but close enough to make people think it's breaking new ground too..
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TF2 was not the first shooter game to have that kind of visual style. XIII [mobygames.com] was released in 2003, and Killer7 [mobygames.com] in 2005. There are probably even earlier examples. TF2 also doesn't hold a candle to Eternal Sonata [mobygames.com].
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All this realism stuff gets on my nerves. Sure it looks more realistic but is it actually a better game?
Sometimes, yes.
I don't care about the graphics.
Yes, you do, you just don't realize it.
I've said it before, and probably better, but every part of the game affects gameplay, and can make a game better or worse. More realistic graphics can, in fact, make a game better.
Now, granted, Crysis was mostly about pretty pictures and who's got the bigger dic^Wvideo card. But that doesn't mean this particular game is going to be another Crysis.
Realism isn't always the best way to convey the most emotion and impact,
Not always, but sometimes.
Look at film. Certainly, there's a place for anime, and it often does a better job
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This is really just a myth. Crysis has very good gameplay, and the narrative is quite engrossing too. The large environments and foliage aren't just there for appearance, they actually affect the gameplay. Enemies can see you from far away, and you can hide in bushes and behind trees, and crawl through tall grass to remain unseen. There's al
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:2)
Normally I'd agree with you, however, from what I just read this is more like a book or a movie than a video game. And with that in mind context gameplay goes right out the window.
What helps make a book or movie more enjoyable is willful suspension of disbelief, and greater realism will help exactly that.
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Why don't you wait and see? Producing a compelling game is a fine art and it might suck for a multitude of reasons, but I fail to see why you pour hate on it because it strives for realism and a strong narrative.
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Just because graphics don't matter in Wii Tennis doesn't mean they don't matter in an adventure game. Advanced graphics can only be a good thing for adventure games. Sounds to me like you're just pretending to be some sort of pseudo-hardcore gamer by performing the same old routine about how graphics are the devil and we should all go back to Pong.
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"Are the graphics on the Wii "realistic" hell no, they are basically cartoons but the games play well and I don't care about the graphics."
Which games are these?
I have yet to find anything on the Wii I enjoy, other than the initial "Sports" game. The fact the graphics are primitive is a minor incovenience compared to how bad the game library seems to be.
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Craps? I'm sure the world is ready for that. We don't need another "Hot Toffee" scandal...
Am I the only one (Score:5, Funny)
Hard Rain? (Score:3, Funny)
Good lord, when I first saw the title of this thing I thought of that movie with Christian Slater from about ten years ago, "Hard Rain", and thought they were making a game out of it. It was at that point that I cried out in fear and pain, thrashing my keyboard into the wall and curling up in the corner, a whimpering smudge of a geek. "Make it stop...." was all I could be heard to say...
I'm a huge fan of Quantic Dream (Score:5, Informative)
Most of you won't remember, but Quantic Dream is the studio that brought us Omikron: The Nomad Soul. That game had a soundtrack with David Bowie on it.
They also brought us Fahrenheit/Indigo Prophecy.
I'm a fan of their immersive adventure style games. Hard Rain ought to be a knockout.
Adventure games are not dead (Score:2)
This is so cool. An article about an adventure game on /.. Adventure games are not dead, as everyone thinks. They're getting more and more mainstream.
Not more realistic than HL2 (Score:2)
Judging from the screenshots, the 3d characters are no more believable than Alyx from HL2. And that particular game is already 4 years old.
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Phantasmagoria? (Score:2)
Remember Phantasmagoria? Spent weeks finishing that one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantasmagoria_(computer_game) [wikipedia.org]
This seems to be doing the same thing better with much more realistic reactions and interface (of course Phantasmagoria had no choice as it used filmed section on 7 CDs) - and what is really noteworthy is that they are moving away from forcing the character down set pathways and decisions and allowing the player to choose their
Quantic Dream: All Sizzle, No Steak (Score:2)
All that work for nothing... (Score:3, Insightful)
All that work for nothing, because the game will be terrible. How can you tell? A focus on 'quick time' events. This type of game play is not even remotely fun. Please developers, stop using this aged and pointless game mechanic.
Re:Is it live or is it Memorex? (Score:5, Insightful)
I think you probably do need to say it. What's your point? That every attempt to improve facial features is doomed because of the uncanny valley? That this technology shows that the uncanny valley worries are unjustified? That this project has achieved a lot but still fails due to the uncanny valley? That despite suffering from the uncanny valley, this project nevertheless has achieved a remarkable level of empathy?
Parent
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Is that link for real? If so, I have to agree with you... it's complete crap. I don't think it's the least bit realistic, and the "virtual actor" (as you put it) looks and sounds stupid.
If I bought a game with lips synced that bad I'd only be able to play for about 2 minutes before I'd have to put a layer of opaque paint onto my monitor.
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Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7qGb8rF9AY [youtube.com]
Maybe I got the wrong impression, but the game sounds boring to me.
And the graphics don't look that realistic.