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Documentary about Professional Gaming
Posted by
michael
on Sat Nov 22, 2003 11:36 PM
from the listen-to-the-bandwidth-meter-scream dept.
from the listen-to-the-bandwidth-meter-scream dept.
Simon Bysshe writes "My name is Simon Bysshe, I'm 22 & am currently studying film at the Bournemouth Arts Institute in the UK. For the last 3 months I've been working on a unique new freely downloadable film about the advent of professional gaming [there's also a BitTorrent mirror via GameTab]. The main purpose of the documentary 'Modern Day Gamer 2' is to ask whether we will ever see gaming become a mainstream spectator sport. The film features the UK based Four Kings Wolfenstein team as they compete at the Quakecon gaming event in Dallas Texas. The film also features interviews with John Romero, Sujoy Roy (iGamesUK), Paul 'Locki' Wedgwood (Splash Damage) & many other industry/gaming figures. This is the sequel to my original documentary which focused on the growth of gaming as a sociable hobby & received over 50,000 downloads worldwide. Running time: 17minutes 47seconds. Filesize : 157MB. Format: WMV."
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Documentary about Professional Gaming
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Format question ... (Score:3, Insightful)
(http://people.connexer.com/~roberto)
Running time: 17minutes 47seconds. Filesize : 157MB. Format: WMV.
How about a non-MS or non-proprietary format? Seriously, I am not trying to troll. As much as people gripe about how bad and inferior all MS formats are, I sure do see lots of WMA and WMV all over the place.
Well, there's an easy way to fix that. (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://inoshiro.com/)
Once that's done, head on over to the BitTorrent website [bitconjurer.org] and grab the software. Run a tracker and leave a seed open.
Then post it to Slashdot [slashdot.org] in a message where you can say, "look at me -- 20 minutes of work and a little CPU time, and I made an open format version of a movie that everyone can enjoy -- plus the video's encoded smaller because of the better codec!"
This will probably net you some great karma, in addition to making your initial format question moot. It's all a matter of effort and motivation
Re:vegans (Score:4, Funny)
(Last Journal: Tuesday May 03 2005, @09:38PM)
You misunderstand. Windows is not evil, just crappy. It's Microsoft that's evil.
watching games might not be so popular. (Score:4, Interesting)
(https://www.greenmountain.com/ | Last Journal: Tuesday November 18 2003, @05:07PM)
The reason specatator sports are so popular is that it takes a lot of years of effort and strenous training to be competetive at professional level. People enjoy these sports vicariously. That is not the case with gaming. Gaming is something people like to take active part in. That's the whole reason games are so popular. It would take lot of years of practise for someone to achieve a professional level 'worth watching' status in games and by then that game would be outdated.
Anyway, I will correct my opinions if there are wrong by watching the documentary. Thanks!
Re:watching games might not be so popular. (Score:5, Insightful)
"That is not the case with gaming."
You have GOT to be fucking kidding me. Try entering a high-profile competition in QuakeWorld, StarCraft or Quake 3 without having YEARS of experience in first-person shooters. You'll be running back to your mamma within minutes.
Re:watching games might not be so popular. (Score:5, Insightful)
This is exactly what they said to all of the state boarders and BMXers, and now look at the massive following that has become as a spectator sport. Kind of interesting though, gaming seems to be the chosen method of alternate entertainment by the professionals (Tony Hawk, et al) in that industry.
Re:watching games might not be so popular. (Score:4, Insightful)
(http://www.manu.com.au/)
Yes, but professional atheletes are not necessarily fit.
Darts. Bowls. Archery. Billiards. Skeet Shooting.
Not only are they spectator sports, they get international coverage. Some of them are even Olympic events. You do not need to be fit to be an athelete. Hand-eye coordination is good enough.
Professional gaming is not an oxymoron.
Re:watching games might not be so popular. (Score:4, Interesting)
(Last Journal: Saturday September 20 2003, @01:55PM)
Gaming is much more active than something like baseball from the spectating perspective -- In baseball someone throws a ball, someone else hits it, they run around a bit, repeat.
In CounterStrike, You have a sniper watching through the middle entrance trying to see any counterterrorists running to defend bombsite b, then telling his team which side to attack based on that, then you have the perfectly layed out teamwork involving very intense situations (last round of overtime, you're the only one alive vs 3 enemies and you only have a pistol, lose this round and you're out of the running)
CS and Chess also both have something going for it -- They're both games of strategy rather than steroids. No matter how good your twitch muscle is, if the other team can predict your every move and force you to make mistakes then you have no chance.
As for whoever said gamign doesnt take years to master -- Watch any playoff match. If you ever ended up playing against one of them, You'd get shot through every wall you try to run by, if you were lucky enough to make it past a corner you'd instantly have a bullet in your head.
Even of all of the pros theres a small amount that have a chance at winning, theres a good discussion going on in the forums at GotFrag? [gotfrag.com] about that right now.
Watching is much more enjoyable to from a technical standpoint -- Watching on TV is purely passive, watching a live match on HLTV lets you be the cameraman, watching whatever part you want, with the ability to go into an overview mode or watch first person and see exactly what someone else sees. Watching a pre-recorded match gives you all of that AND the ability to pause/rewind/fast forward (who needs TiVo?).
You can also learn from watching. Traditional sports have all been played so long it is very rare you'll see anything new, but with e-sports there is constantly a new change or two to throw things up, so now we have new crazes like 'the money game' (purposely losing a round after winning for X rounds in a row so that they stop getting so much money on each loss, but only after taking out 4 of their 5 teammates then have all of your team hide so that they have to buy a new gun and you dont.). Any team can take this new knowledge and apply it to their lower end matches (with varying degrees of success), but with most sports theres nothing to do but bet on a team and drink a lot of beer.
Re:watching games might not be so popular. (Score:4, Insightful)
people do watch counter-strike matches, but since most gamers know about computers well enough, we do in-game spectating as opposed to watching it on lower-res TVs. if there were a group that did *good* commentary, along with setting up good camera angles and having a bit longer wait time between rounds (for replays and such), then it might be more interesting in that way. gaming as a "sport" (like bowling or billards as a sport) is still in its beginning, so give it some time to see where it really goes.
I doubt that professional gaming... (Score:4, Interesting)
I tried to RTFA (Score:5, Funny)
Professional Gaming (Score:4, Informative)
(http://578.291.762.662/)
But seriously, with all that press coverage, and repetitive stress injuries, expect to see PG's form basic organizational structures, like unions, licensing boards, nickname boards!, and stuff, before developers/computer programmers ever develop just one of those.. sheesh!
Title Suggestion.... (Score:3, Interesting)
"Modern Day Gamers Go Gold"
MMORPG "PVP" and FPS tournaments (Score:5, Interesting)
(Last Journal: Sunday April 11 2004, @07:41PM)
I once saw about 200 people crowded around an arena watching a collection of gladiators fighting to the death for a cash prize. We were all placing bets and shouting at the combatants. Some people actually missed work to come witness the battles.
None of us were actually "there", at least not physically: it all transpired in the virtual world of "Ultima Online".
That was three years ago. I wonder how large the gatherings are now?
Great! (Score:2)
(http://rym.waglo.com/ | Last Journal: Monday May 10 2004, @12:11PM)
No (Score:2, Insightful)
But some may say..... (Score:4, Interesting)
(http://www.clickonstore.net/)
Having spectated at a few UK Lanparties, I can say that the 'players' are genuinely a mixed bunch and generally a very personable lot. (After all people can *hit* you if you misbehave on a lan).
The thing that makes major players so popular in many sports is marketing - in the UK we only have to look at David Beckham to know how true this is.
Having said that, Beckham is working for and living with a team in Spain.............go figure
The Real Reason for Spectators (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://slashdot.com/)
Now we have all been conditioned to answer because its entertaining to watch highly skilled professionals compete for the love of the game (stay with me), or something like that. But really, I would venture to guess that it has a lot to do with identity and community.
For example, if you watch sports, don't you sometimes or maybe even regularly mention events in the sports world to others who are interested (or maybe even not)? Do you ever consider yourself a fan, and attach it to your identity (like at a party you might say "yeah, I'm a such-and-such fan" or "I'm a big fan of sports X and Y")?
Likewise, how often do you watch events with other people? How often do you go with other people or meet them at an event? And don't you talk about it with certain groups of people? I am not a sports person, so please forgive me if you are a lone spectator. I am sure there are some.
This all revolves around what really drives masses to be spectators. I would venture to guess that their identity and the community (which are in some ways tied together for a lot people, maybe everyone) make them spectators. I would even go further to say that without these aspects, mass market spectator sports would not be quite so mass market. Sorry, I didn't watch the video - just some thoughts from a non-spectator.
Re:The Real Reason for Spectators (Score:4, Funny)
(http://singinst.org/)
Team A == Warrior Tribe A.
Team B == Warrior Tribe B.
Fans of Team A == Lesser Members of Tribe A.
Fans of Team B == Lesser Members of Tribe B.
Us. vs Them. Some like to live vicariously through "Us" or through "Them".
--
The Slashdot Gaming Timewarp Continues... (Score:4, Informative)
(http://www.dreamops.com/ | Last Journal: Sunday October 02 2005, @10:05AM)
Ahem, JAPAN.
Heck, we'll even throw S.Korea in there.
Gaming Book (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://gemsites.jcomserv.net/ | Last Journal: Tuesday January 11 2005, @08:09PM)
The number of wicked web links in there is enough for any gamer to drool over. I've been thinking of doing a Slashdot book review of it, too.
Interesting... (Score:1)
Direct Link to Torrent (Score:5, Informative)
(http://actsofvolition.com)
Sports are naturally boring to watch... (Score:2, Insightful)
However, I listen to the Team Sportscast Network when I'm bored, and also hang out in #tsn. I like it there because it's a community that PLAYS what they love, not just listen. People who know the game first hand; a relaxed community which knows the pros personally.
I find watching games more interesting than conventional sports because the game is always changing -- they aren't limited by real life physics and laws. The rules and gameplay are always evolving overtime.
Although rules change with videogames, i find game rules to be much more appealing. Sports that require referees take away from the game, along with judged sports. The computer counts and grades players in VGs, not some dude with a whistle. If anything, I find videogames to be a more relevant sport than games that rely on referees for fundamental parts of the game such as "foul balls", "penalties" and "strikes".
In the end though, I don't really want videogames to become mainstream sports -- it'll just end up controlled and abused like the rest of the sports. Don't get me wrong, I like tournaments, and I also want the very best players making enough for a living. What I don't look forward to is gamers becoming commercialized, overglorified, cocky jerks (it's partially there already) like other other sports "heros".
asinine reasoning (Score:4, Insightful)
do you listen to music? you could play instruments too.
watch movies? you could make your own with a digital camera's trivial film mode.
ever notice that people involved in sports tend to be avid fans of professional sports? ever notice budding musicians tend to listen to other, more accomplished musicians?
it's because they can't do what the pros can, at least not yet. they're able to command massive salaries because the audience is watching, and the audience wouldn't waste their time to watch bush leaguers.
My experiences... (Score:3, Informative)
I used to play Desert Combat [desertcombat.com] a lot a while back. I started playing with a clan (to get the whole 'teamplay' experience) who were involved in gaming league. [teamwarfare.com] During these games, there would be two spectators present, one on either team. These two specs would do a play by play of the game, both in contact with each other at the same time, and they would shoutcast [shoutcast.com] these matches to the masses. These broadcasts also had a slight time delay to avoid cheating by either team.
One of these shoutcast groups is Team Sports Network [tsncentral.com] you can listen to live games, or download past matches.
Just in case (Score:2, Informative)
(http://www.edalytical.com/)
If Slashdotter don't read the article (Score:2, Funny)
(http://www.gnasegarah.com/)
You think they would watch the movie :P
The infidel is using WMV!
I wouldn't pay to see people play (Score:1)
(Last Journal: Saturday September 13 2003, @01:42PM)
BitTorrent? (Score:1)
(http://singinst.org/)
I can't bring myself to use that illegal p2p stuff that the pedophile hackers use when I could be using a slow FTP or WWW link instead. Also, I don't like to change my old ways.
We should all do our part to support centralized distribution instead of distributed terrorist cell distribution.
Thanks!
--
Quick! Someone mirror... (Score:2)
goodness (Score:2)
(http://forums.boiledfrog.us/ | Last Journal: Friday February 21 2003, @01:08PM)
If you're studying film for fun, cool. Academic persuits for the sake of academia should be available to everyone that's interested so as to increase the knowledge of humanity. However, if you're planning a career in film, I strongly suggest you reconsider. Your production quality is horrible. Bad audio recording, bad cinematography, bad lighting, and a fairly poor presentation of the information (despite the actual information in this one being significantly better than the first).
Wheaton's show on G4? (Score:2)
(http://kulturkrieg.blogspot.com/ | Last Journal: Saturday February 10 2007, @10:13PM)
Problem: he so overshadowed the game to illuminate the fact that watching people play video games is damn boring. And he ended up leaving once it was revealed the damn thing was fixed (I assume to make it no longer boring).
Ever go over to someone's house and they're 'just playing games' and its all single player so you have to sit there... and watch...
It is cute to think that an intellectual game of reflex and strategy could become mainstream... but I doubt it. Try turning on the Poker World Championships some time. Some folks go crazy for it and it's the highest grossing competitive sport in the world. But it isn't raking in the TV contracts is it?
I dunno. With enough luck I can get a headshot with a AWP in Counterstrike: I'll never punt a 40 yard kick, run a 4 hour marathon, or ski for 30 km and shoot little black dots the size of nipples at 75m. I think a lot of competitive sport taps into something inate in us, some hunter-gatherer instinct. The physicality of it.
Watching someone stare at a monitor blankly, sipping from a Mountain Dew just doesn't do that for me.
Wait... (Score:1)
Live sports vs. Virtual Sports (Score:3, Insightful)
Most people don't give a sports match their full attention. They might raptly watch the replays, they might focus more the game when it gets tense, but most people are hanging out with their friends at the same time, or eating, or switching between ESPN and CBS.
The way that televised sports cope with the monotony of the wait for action is with commentary. They'll step out of the game to give stats, a retired professional will give his take on the rookie at bat or the down just completed. Most people don't want to watch players set up their bases, but they also don't much care to watch the football players line up time and time again. Most soccer fans don't pay nearly as much attention when the ball is in midfield as they do when the players are poised for a shot on goal.
Conclusion 1: Game spectating needs to be something you can do in a group before it will catch on.
Conclusion 2: There needs to be a mechanism to give commentary and instant replays to the viewers.
Conclusion 3: Game spectating has to be flexible. It has to be something that you can give part of your divided attention to, not the sole activity of a few hours on a Sunday afternoon.
Certainly there's some demand for it... (Score:1)
(http://bricks-game.de/)
Watching the finished product is one thing, but I don't think anybody would have wanted to watch my record it. I'd spend 2 hours working on a segment only to mess up in a different way each time and restart way too often.
Gaming spectating - not for the general public? (Score:1)
(http://www.johnwoodwark.com/toby/)
The reason gaming will take a long time to break into the mainstream consciousness as a 'sport' is the same reason any new traditional sport takes a while to get popular. The rules need to be explained to the audience. In a gaming context, the rules are really the control system used by the players - the set of choices they have at any moment and the amount of time they have to make those choices.
For Fightbox the controls are at the same time apparently simple, and obscured from the audience. The producers don't trust the audience with the rules. Unsurprisingly Fightbox is a ratings flop [guardian.co.uk]. The results seem essentially random, and the game just doesn't have enough depth. In particular, it is not a team game.
I think gaming on TV might work in a sports format if the rules are known. To put Counter-strike on TV would be quite easy because it is a fairly 'traditional' FPS game. It is also made up of quick rounds. The violence might be a problem, of course; this is a side issue.
But it would take a brave producer to take the step of actually displaying gaming as a sport; and an intelligent one to make it watchable. Although (NFL) football is complicated, NFL spectators are a sophisticated audience. They know what a pooch kick is, for example, and why you might want to use that play. The commentary generally reflects this sophistication. Similarly, gaming on TV needs a game which the audience can and will grasp, and it needs to be presented accordingly, in all its detail.
Yes, we will (Score:1)
(Last Journal: Sunday June 19 2005, @01:43PM)
We most certainly will. Some would find watching others play excrutiatingly boring and frustrating, rather like watching someone typing a chat in IRC. But I'm certain there will be some who'll find it equal to watching "live" sports. That fact happens to disgust me no end.
Believe me, this is not a troll. I just happen to think that far too many people are on a downward spiral away from living in reality, and prefering the safety of the artificial, and I don't see this getting any better any time soon.
So, yes, I can see something like ESPN-G, the Gaming Channel.
Pro Quake player (Score:2)
(http://www.animats.com)
Steven Levy covered this (Score:1)
(http://nymphs.org/)
There was one good quote in there, though: "You see this? This is my Robotron blister!"
the last thing we need (Score:1)
(http://www.tumyeto.com/)
Missing the point (Score:1)
(http://www.newpollution.net/)
Kasparov's match against X3D Fritz was well attended and not because people were tuning in for long, drawn out shots of Garry rubbing his temples. Professional gaming will be exciting because the focus will be on the game and seeing it--whatever game it may be--played better than the audience could ever hope to. The future will see better commentators, flashy presentation including Madden-like white pen sessions, strategy discussions with pros (the flyover of "Ice" in Modern Day Gamer 2 was a nice touch), and fast-paced action.
We also have to remember how widespread gaming has become and its move toward dominance in the sea of entertainment media. Even if the only people you could get to watch televised professional gaming were fellow players, that's one metric fuckton of an audience.
Professional Gamers have existed for a long time (Score:1)
(http://www.cjwatt.plus.com/)
Video is excellent (Score:1)
(Last Journal: Sunday November 23 2003, @04:16AM)
As far as professional gaming goes, it's already a reality in Korea, where there is Starcraft on TV and live events in which hundreds of fans are cheering their favorite players on. However, professional gaming has a long way to go before it is able to go mainstream: a game has to be created that is spectator friendly and has built in television functions such as HLTV in Half Life. Counter-Strike is the most popular FPS ever created, but at the professional level, it is sometimes downright boring to watch when players are camping, doing nothing for 2 minutes before they actually make a move and attack a bombsite. A game has to be created where there is constant action, and is watchable by the masses (ie, does not make the crowd nauseus like many first person shooters do), before it can be shown on TV.
I like the irony that (Score:1)
Spectator gaming: a model for interactive TV? (Score:2)
What I would want though, is the same quality of presentation that we now get with major TV sports events, plus the interactivity and participation that we get with online gaming.
I'd want:
- Quality live commentators, statistics and game state presentation... think Superbowl, Rugby World Cup, F1 GP
- A live director for - at least - each team, so if I want to watch blue team setting up their bases and traps I can do so without necessarily having to work the camera controls myself.
- The ability to still use the usual 3d online game 'spactator' controls at any time.
- I would need the participants to be representing my country or something else that I can relate to the real world, not just some clan.
If gaming server networks could somehow be set up with a "spectator" mode where data was simply pushed out and proxied so thousands could watch without the gamers suffering server lag, I think they could provide ideal platform to develop all the ideas necessary to make all that interactive television stuff that's been talked about so much and acted on so little, a reality.
I'd love to see it, I'd pay to see it. Game companies if you're listening, do it! (I'm available as a consultant and tester
There are far less interesting sports out there (Score:1)
(http://qntm.org/ | Last Journal: Saturday May 06 2006, @09:26AM)
In addition, many spectator sports appear to me to be *fantastically* boring compared to observing a good multiplayer deathmatch. Imagine the enthusiasm if we all had teams/players to support in addition.
A wise man once said... "If sweeping ice in front of a rock can become an Olympic sport, why not moving your thumbs in front of a television?"
Here's an idea (Score:2, Insightful)
(http://www.musicandstuff.net/ | Last Journal: Monday December 16 2002, @03:09PM)
I can see it now (Score:2)
(http://ellem.is-a-geek.org:5280/...html | Last Journal: Tuesday October 02, @10:35AM)
id Programmer: Can you see? Can you see? Look what they printed!
id PHB: I don't see anything!
id Programmer: Look! Look at it! The pixel at 320x540! Oh my God it looks like something from Daikatana!
id PHB: I think you're over reacting.
id Programmer: Sure for YOU it means nothing. Why does C|Net always do this? Why can't they just cover the game. WHY DO THEY TORMENT ME? Why can't they show the kid who camps all the time, huh? Why not him?
id PHB: I'm going to stand over there now.
id Programmer: Call them for me, make them pull the screen grab. They win I can't take it anymore.
[Pan to id PHB far away putting his back pack on and sticking his thumb out as a van passes him in the rain... fade to black]{cue sad music from The Incredible Hulk}
Gaming != "sport" && Gaming != "pro" (Score:2, Informative)
Gaming is *NOT* a sport!! Shit, you waste away hours leading to weeks of your life twitching only a few muscles for a digital score...sporty as a Gremlin next to a Porsche. The use of the term "professional" when speaking about a gamer is just sickening and demeaning to *REAL* professionals like the programmers who coded the game or the Network engineers at the ISP who maintain connections so the _game_ can be played. Tournaments are great, but lets put things in perspective. If you win a ribbon at your local or even state fair for your chili, do you think that gives you the right to start putting yourself on the same level as a real professional such as Emril Lagasse?
I love to spend a good 3 hours playing an online game, but in keeping touch with reality it's just a game. When I'm done thats it, I don't try to make it more than what it really is to compensate for a critical lacking in my life. Personally, I would not watch this sort of stuff online or in person with free admission, free food, and free beer. Strikes me kinda like watching golf...you have to be the right kind of person.
Professional gaming will not work for a while... (Score:1)
(http://www.electioneering.net/)
Already so. (Score:2)
The main barrier is that there is no salary. (Score:2)
(Last Journal: Tuesday March 09 2004, @01:55AM)
In addition, anyone can start a "clan" and compete. Not just anyone can start an NFL team and compete.
Until "clans" are organized like major pro sports teams, gamers that can be considered "professional" in the same sense that NFL players are won't exit. And the only way for that to happen is for Joe Sixpac to actually be a spectator who is willing to watch it. Pretty unlikely, since most people who are interested in watching Q3A and CS matches are people who also play the game regularly themselves.
The same goes for "pro" Magic players and "pros" of many other "non-spectator" activities.
Why oh why? (Score:2)
(http://slashdot.org/ | Last Journal: Tuesday January 22 2002, @05:54AM)
How many "are games art" articles have we seen here?
And no the new meme is "games are sport"!
What is next?
It's already happening in China (Score:1)
Re:Janitor dies after winning ass-stretching conte (Score:1)
(http://atmchicago.home.netcom.com/)
Highest tech indeed! (Score:1)
Romero (Score:2)
Isn't this.. (Score:1)
(http://www.andr0meda.com/ | Last Journal: Tuesday November 27, @08:27PM)
Games should be for fun. It is obvious that games are copied because people want that fun, thus ripping off the companies that make them. Are we now not taking it one step further, ripping the fun out of it as well?