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U.S. Army to d00dz - We're Coming for You 183
Thanks to cdagobah for mentioning a post up on the America's Army game site. Executive Producer Phil DeLuca posts a message updating the community on a recent anti-hacking campaign they've initiated, and has a clear message for would-be wrongdoers. From the post: "Allow me to speak directly to the bad guys for a moment: When you get banned, know that we know and have records showing you were doing something that's a violation of terms of service, breaks your EULA, and also happens to be against the law. We know who you are, and can track down where you play from. We have incontrovertible proof you did something illegal. The Army is angry, and we're coming for you. "
YEA!! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:YEA!! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:YEA!! (Score:5, Funny)
Chris: Dad, I tried to go to school today, but some guy said I couldn't.
Peter: Oh ya? Him and what army?
Chris: The US Army!
* US Army points all guns at Peter's house *
Peter: (Shocked) Oh thats a good army.
Re:YEA!! (Score:2)
Give me a fucking break... (Score:5, Funny)
The Army is angry, and we're coming for you.
Nice to see that the Army is doing something useful. I wouldn't want any of these teenagers walking around the streets.
First they break the EULA, next they're killing babies. Gotta stop this evil when it starts!
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:2)
It's pretty plain to me...if you want to cheat, don't play AA. Go cheat on Counterstrike like everyone else does you little wienies....
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:2)
You know, I wouldn't necessarily hassle them. First I'd see if they'd be any good in my new Cyber-Warfare unit..
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:2)
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:4, Funny)
Gorilla (about midnight): "Look, old chum, I've already told you at least a dozen times that I don't happen to HAVE a Magic: The Gathering deck. I prefer chess. Now, bugger off like a good chap and let me read my Milton."
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:2)
That's a good one; Hmm... If the Gorilla's ACTUALLY an intellectual, he'll be intrigued; if it turns out he's a poseur, he'll be angry that you found him out and throw you around like a suitcase in a Samsonite commercial.
Either way, you won't be bored!
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:2)
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:2)
The Army must be
Re:Give me a fucking break... (Score:3, Interesting)
If the Army tried to 'come after' people for cheating, they'd catch hell from all over the place for not doing their job.
The Army isn't exactly supposed to be operating against US citizens.
Its About Time (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Its About Time (Score:1)
Since when... (Score:2)
Since when is it illegal to use a wall-hack or aimbot? ;)
Seriously, does anyone know the details?
Re:Since when... (Score:5, Interesting)
That said, if they then ban you and you continue to play under a fake account or something similar, you are now illegally accessing a computer system, and that you will do time for (probably more than a rapist does on average too).
Re:Since when... (Score:2)
Lastly - don't forget - these guys have REAL guns...real BIG guns!
Re:Since when... (Score:2)
America, **** yeah (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:America, **** yeah (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:America, **** yeah (Score:2)
Re:America, **** yeah (Score:2)
I don't get it... (Score:5, Insightful)
I've never played this game, and know little about it...but if I'm understanding this correctly, some people used some cheats in a video game, and a developer is insinuating criminal repercussions? Is it safe to assume that there were no real monetary losses?
Yeah. I'll believe that the federal government will actually prosecute when pigs fly.
Inmate 1: What are you in for?
Inmate 2: First degree murder, but I'll be out in 4 more years. What about you?
Inmate 1: I cheated in a video game, which was technically misusing US Army property. I'll be in here for a long time.
Inmate 2: Daaaaaaaaaaamn.
Re:I don't get it... (Score:2)
Re:Or, this could be handy... (Score:2, Redundant)
Sgt: "Kid, I want you to go and sit down on that bench that says Group W .... NOW kid!!"
NAR: And I, I walked over to the, to the bench there, and there is, Group W's where they put you if you may not be moral enough to join the army after committing your special crime, and there was all kinds of mean nasty ugly looking people on the bench there. Mother rapers. Father stabbers. Father rapers! Father rapers sitting right there on the bench ne
Re:Or, this could be handy... (Score:2)
You left off the ending! (Score:2)
Re:I don't get it... (Score:2)
Please direct your attention too... (Score:2)
(3) With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. However, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead.
http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1925.html [faqs.org]
Priorities people (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Priorities people (Score:2)
Maybe they should focus on... oh I dont know... Osama Bin Laden?
Focus on another fitcional character in yet another game ;) No problems.
They don't know the "extend" of what we know (Score:3, Funny)
Re:They don't know the "extend" of what we know (Score:2)
Re:They don't know the "extend" of what we know (Score:2)
but... (Score:2, Funny)
You can get anything you want (Score:5, Funny)
And I, I walked over to the, to the bench there, and there is, Group W's where they put you if you may not be moral enough to join the army after committing your special crime, and there was all kinds of mean nasty ugly looking people on the bench there. Mother rapers. Father stabbers. Father rapers! Father rapers sitting right there on the bench next to me! And they was mean and nasty and ugly and horrible crime-type guys sitting on the bench next to me. And the meanest, ugliest, nastiest one, the meanest father raper of them all, was coming over to me and he was mean 'n' ugly 'n' nasty 'n' horrible and all kind of things and he sat down next to me and said, "Kid, whad'ya get?" I said, "I didn't get nothing, I just got a temp ban from the official servers." He said, "What were you arrested for, kid?" And I said, "Wallhacking." And they all moved away from me on the bench there, and the hairy eyeball and all kinds of mean nasty things, till I said, "And creating a nuisance." And they all came back, shook my hand, and we had a great time on the bench, talkin about crime, mother stabbing, father raping, all kinds of groovy things that we was talking about on the bench.
Re:You can get anything you want (Score:1)
Wow...
The 60s really haven't died...
Re:You can get anything you want (Score:2)
Re:You can get anything you want (Score:2)
Keep it up.
*Ahem* Mr. DeLuca, (Score:2)
Now I'm scared (Score:4, Interesting)
Everything else breaches separation of powers and / or is plain illegal. Like the RIAA paying retired police offers to play Gestapo. Or the army saying "The Army is angry, and we're coming for you".
Rather than threatening its own people, I'd prefer the army focusing on defense, and on respecting the law themselves. As a suggestion, they could start in Abu Ghraib or Guantanamo.
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
...
I'd prefer the army
Hmm - didn't do the maths on this one did we? They are the US Army, and as you infer, they do not respect the law. I beleive it's been more than adequately demonstrated over the last few years that they are well and truly Above The Law.
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
*HEADSHOT*
*HEADSHOT*
*HEADSHOT*
*HEADSHOT*
k3w1^d00d: LOLZ J00 SUXXOR!!!!1111eleven
Player1: Bot.
k3w1^d00d: LOLLLLLLLLOLOLZZZZZ WH4T3V3R L4M3R
[CPS]janxor: I'm getting the admin
ColMustd: Screw that I'm calling the army!
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
However, the military MUST not come after me in this case, because this case is about disregarding license agreements or the like, and I hope it's still illegal for someone to send the army because of this.
But then again, this army has been sent further away for even more dubious reasons...
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
However, the could well use Army resources to develop their case against you. If you interfere with the Army in a tortious or criminal manner, why wouldn't they? In a case like this, where it's not a major security threat, they might not bother law enforcement until they've got all the ducks in a row and the perp ripe for picking
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
Yes, special rules apply to the military, but the wording of this makes it clear that this regards internal matters. It doesn't say "in connection with," it say "arising in." That means the 5th amendment does not apply if and only if the situation involves members of the land/naval forces or militia forces when in actual service in a time of war or public danger.
I have n
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
But all this means is that when the Army comes after you, it's not going to be extra-legal (air-to-surface missle) nor will the matter be ajudicated in a military court.
There's nothing preventing the Army from taking this to civilian court. And what's worse, because the alleged illegal acts are taking place on military computers, it's a severe criminal matter.
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
That clause outlines the test for whether or not someone can be held without a Grand Jury indictment, nothing more, nothing less. It has nothing to do with which type of court any proceedings are brought in. The amendment as a whole isn't even considered in courts martial, because the only things considered are those contained in the UCMJ.
It does not prevent the Army (or other military branch) from bringing (or participating in) civil, criminal, or court marti
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
Re:Now I'm scared (Score:2)
Call the marines (Score:5, Funny)
wake up and smell the coffe, war is not about obeying rules. It's about winnning.
The US army is going to use lawyers because it cannot police it's own servers. I do so look forward to you explaining that to the press.
Given that once again the US Army cannot deal with problems in a rational, pragmnatic and effective manner I suggest you always do what the army does in this situation. Call for the marines.
This might be a good thing... (Score:5, Funny)
yeah, geez! (Score:3, Funny)
Speaking of proof (Score:3, Funny)
Raise your hand if you've heard that one before [slashdot.org].
Wow Somebody tell this guy the war is over (sorta) (Score:5, Interesting)
Throughout the article this guy keeps saying "bad guys" like he was fighting for something tangible and sacred. Get some perspective man, you're booting cheaters from a game server, not saving babies in 'Nam.
How about: Tampering with software and servers owned or used by the Army is cyber crime.
Oooooh, oh no! I'm not fully clear on what people are doing that's got General McNads' panties in a bunch, but I'm assuming it's a bit more annoying than just using a wall hack, perhaps people are trying to crash servers and the like, but that happens to every game/website/store on the web! But because it's happened to the army's game, now they're really serious and pissed. Hello, US Gub'ment, this is the sort of "cybercrime" that goes on daily and is ignored or completely fumbled by current law bodies. Now you know what Joe Developer has to deal with daily when he wakes up and his web-store has been hacked to shit. Did you care then? Nope, but apparently now that it's personal it matters. The guy writing this sounds almost surprised by the affront of the "bad guys": 'How dare they hack us! I mean we're the army for crissake!'
And the bit at the end saying "We're coming for you." Honestly, I think this guy actually believes someone's going to have their house stormed and shot up. At best they'll be sending a lawyer, there will be due process in court, and life will continue as usual. Someone, please, get this over-inflated self-important bastard away from his keyboard and someplace where his gung-ho attitude might actually affect change at the scale he hallucinates. It's a friggin game.
"My god Er, I can't believe we are standing in the presence of THE Moon Master!"
Re:Wow Somebody tell this guy the war is over (sor (Score:2)
And here I was thinking it was an attempt to recruit kids into the army.
Re:Wow Somebody tell this guy the war is over (sor (Score:2)
they are all a sorry bunch of losers. wanna be army boys who wouldn't cut it in the real world.
Reading that dev's post shows that he has the same mindset they all do and although he's just trying to scare the kids into not cheating, I think a lot will believe they're going to have their doors bashed in during some fucking dawn raid.
bad guys. heh. tosser.
The awful truth.... (Score:2)
A Better Response might have been... (Score:5, Insightful)
"Thanks for exposing a hole in
-our- security.
We'll work hard to plug that hole
so that others won't be able to
crawl through it, in future."
I'm reminded of the Hacker Challenges
of other security conscious web sites.
Dear army. (Score:3, Funny)
I have been playing Enemy territory for some time and have noticed a lot of cheaters ,aimbots and wallhacks.
It has come to my attention that you have undertaken the role of punkbuster, only with rifles and live ammo.
Could you please um, 'solve' the problem on the Enemy terrirory servers please?
Maybe send these people to obligatory service in Iraq or something?
Thank you.
Finally! (Score:3, Interesting)
Sure, non-gamers say "but its just a game", but (to draw another analogy) imagine if every social sports game you played had streakers, people doped up on horse steroids, and people that just walked up to you and started screaming abuse. It would quickly become annoying.
Of course, in the real world, doing that sort of thing quickly has repercussions (ie, someone smacks your bitch ass up) but online, its a real pain in the ass (especially in a free game with no real mechanism to ban users - like Steam, but that's another kettle of fish) to stop these users from ruining the online experience of others.
Personally, the thought of Delta Force guys kicking in some random hackers door at 3am and throwing in a couple of flashbangs makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside. Hell, they could record it on video and put it on the America's Army website and people would PAY MONEY to see it.
Re:Finally! (Score:2)
The point is that acting like an anti-social, disruptive, obnoxious jackass in real life has consequences. Its why there aren't many streakers in football/cricket matches - sure, there's a few, but the ones that do it get dealt with so harshly and usually so quickly (ie, their "bitch ass" is "smacked up") that it makes doing it not worthwhile, unless you're a serial idiot.
I Guess... (Score:2)
Re:I Guess... (Score:3, Interesting)
Well, I know that the company making the armor plates was only running at about two-thirds of capacity but nobody from the government bothered to check with them to see if they could supply more product sooner until after that GI put Rumsfeld on the spot. And I'm pretty sure that the soldier wasn't forced by the reporter to say anyt
Obvious (Score:2)
Hah, so it isn't a cyber crime to mess with other's computers if they're not owned or operated by the army? Thanks for stating the obvious, Capt. Obbvious.
Brought to you by Lt. Redundant.
Strange Similarity (Score:1)
Re:Strange Similarity (Score:1)
How an Americas Army player thinks of this (Score:4, Interesting)
The primary hacks are: full auto 203s. Imagine a grenade launcher, add unlimited ammo, and a firing rate of 700 RPM. Imagine maps where there is almost nowhere that cannot be hit. It becomes impossible to deal with. This can also be applied to rocket launchers, sniper rifles, just about any gun in the game can benefit from full auto. Then there are the speed hacks which allow players to run to the objs in about 4 seconds, the obj hacks, where players can take the obj without even being near it, or maybe the respawn hacks, where even if you kill the hacker, he comes right back from the dead. And don't forget a hack that adjusts for the game-physics and run speed, so literally there is no safe thing to do. And don't forget the standard set of aim-bots no fog hacks, etc. All there, and in more numbers than most games, and even more than CS. Almost every server had a blatant hacker on them at anytime, and most had a couple of covert hackers.
Then there is the problem with the server company having a monopoly on honor servers.(honor is a number displayed by your screen that is a rough indicator of skill, but only kinda) The servers crashed non-stop, the support tickets went unanswered, and generally SCI was a pain in the ass. It went so far as there were Freedom of Information Act requests put on the Army and SCI's contract. There was no response. It took SCI repeated requests to allows us access to PB screenshots, which take a picture of whatever your screen is, and them send them off to the server. But this was hacked too, allowing the hacker to send any image he wants, so on many PBSS it was a picture of tub girl. CVAR checks didn't work because after every crash(usually 3-4 times a day) it resets all server scripts. Every AA player who has played since 1.9 remembers the good 'ole days of HomeLan and admins, who were utterly ruthless.
Recently Speakeasy's gamefire division has been allowed to rent honor servers, but they currenty don't have PB enabled, so no-one plays on them anyway. But this just started the 10th, so we will need to wait and see.
There have also been numerous bugs including the "critical error" or "General Protection Faults". In 2.0-2.2 a critical errors would happen non-stop meaning that no AA session lasted for much more than an hour.
And for people who have been bashing Phil Deluca or [Dev]Skippy, recently a large number of hackers were banned, and that caused a notable improvement in the quality of gaming. Under his control, they also released 2.2.1 which has cut down on the critical errors. Things under skippy are looking up, so I really wouldn't be suprised if you see on CNN in a couple of weeks that "the Army has sued several internet sites for hosting hacks for the Army's free recruiting tool video game, Americas Army".
We've been through hell, but for some reason AA just has me coming back for more. Some of the 1.9 era maps are brilliantly done(Bridge SE is possibly one of the best maps ever in an online video game) AA is also the only game to have realistic long range combat. Not just twitch shootin, but tactics will almost always win in AA. Don't bash AA if you havn't been in the community for a long time.
If what Skippy says happens, we are going to be a very happy bunch of gamers.
Re:How an Americas Army player thinks of this (Score:2)
It's not that hard to keep track of ammo server side, as well as checking for the other things you mentioned. Of course make it completely hack-proof is impossible, but the things you mentioned are hardly impossible to defend against.
Re:Steam seems to handle (Score:2, Insightful)
Where do you get that from? My point was that you can't trust the client of a network game. You can't trust a web browser either, but you don't have to - it's not the server's business how someone chooses to display their web pages, and what one person does generally has no effect on what other people can do. But it has a huge effect if your game client is displaying translucent walls or teleporting you around the map.
Wow, the arrogance of it all. (Score:4, Insightful)
Wow, this guy has some balls to be comparing a bit of video game hacking to pearl harbor.
That could hurt (Score:3, Funny)
What's the big deal? (Score:1)
Just ask that cheater... (Score:2)
America's Army is not a game. (Score:3, Interesting)
Come on guys (Score:2)
Seriously. You guys sound like you think there are active soldiers who aren't overseas.
On the other hand, he really shouldn't be saying what he
and yet their FAQ says... (Score:3, Informative)
Player and Army Privacy
"Finally privacy is a big concern for us. Players register under a userid and gameplay information cannot be traced to an individual's real identity."
Obviously, anything online can track all sorts of information about a user (duh), I guess I just find it funny they offer the warm and fuzzy privacy gurantees on one page, and then threaten(?) "naughty" users elsewhere on the site, after they get a mad-on.
Deluca Has a History of this sort of thing (Score:4, Informative)
The problem was further aggravated by the political nature of the game. As accusations against the "Volunteer Police" Grew they had to defend themselves. Back and Forth it went, the simple message that having people who had invested years into their various team being refs was a very bad idea, never got the respect it deserve
I don't play Americas Army but for Phills sake and the games sake, I hope he has payed help this time and some effective means to actually identify the hackers and deal with them. The last time he had none of these and it was a disaster.
Ok .lets get things straight (Score:2)
Re:Ok .lets get things straight (Score:2)
Waste of American taxes and military resources (Score:4, Interesting)
Spoken like someone who isn't paying enough taxes to care how his government spends his money.
Really now, do you want military-sized, wasteful, beurocratic budgets to spend time tracking down people who cheat in a video game?
Re:Waste of American taxes and military resources (Score:2, Flamebait)
Sure, why not. Better this than...oh, I don't know...invade a country that was zero threat to us? OH that's right, NOW we're changing history to say we went in to "help the Iraqi people"...instead of the real reason (yes, I have a memory), which is because Saddam was messing around with the weapons inspectors and being a jerk...which of course gave us the "in" we were lookin
Re:Waste of American taxes and military resources (Score:2)
Might as well (Score:2)
Did we (American taxpayers) want a military-based, largely unnecessary computer game to be developed without us even being asked? For the most part, no we didn't want money being spend on America's Army. But since its already done, we might as well continue to support and work with it instead of just dropping it, bitching about the lost money and not getting anything productive
Re:Waste of American taxes and military resources (Score:2, Interesting)
In such an environment, you need to secure the code, or the game is worthless for any of these applications.
Naturally, shipping the aimbot crowd to one of the world's favorite war zones is an ideal solution. Didn't you read the part of the E
Re:Waste of American taxes and military resources (Score:2)
Re:I hope they do! (Score:5, Interesting)
the line between a 'hack' and a non hack on a online game is very slim anyhow.
is turning up the contrast a hack? or using 1920*1400 resolution and a maginifying glass on the centre for insta sniping? or using a lightgun to pinpoint the mouse to the enemy, friend sitting next to you with the gun(a little work and it's doable, you just run around and your frind picks up enemies).
is buying a better mouse a hack?
is having a crappy internet connection a hack?
or is it hack if you're just _really_, _really_ good? you hear that being called a hack all the time.
these problems can only be combated with novel game element design really... of course, you'd have none of these problems if you played seriously face to face on the same table.
or just didn't give a rats ass if someone shot you.
but this "we're coming for you!!!" is a bit extreme crap, especially coming from the fucking army(especially hacks being outside of usa probably, too).
Re:I hope they do! (Score:2)
But anyway, you KNOW what the hacks are. The aimbots and the wall hacks...don't throw out those "buying a better mouse" statements. I mean, come on..
Re:I hope they do! (Score:2)
is buggy graphics drivers a hack? sure it is then.
i was just making a point about subtle hacks that can be used to boost playing performance without touching the whole software. with the lightgun(or touchscreen at it's place) technique you could get results that would not be far from an aimbot with some randomizing in it. in fact, i'd say that it would be pretty damn hard to distinguish the two at the other end - yet one of them is a hack and one is just enhanced input device.
surely
Re:I hope they do! (Score:2)
Until your friend shoots you in the back.
Re:I hope they do! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Good (Score:2)
Re:Good (Score:2)
Ahhh, so it *does* emulate the Army very well, then!