PlayStation 3 HDD to Ship With Linux

timtwobuck writes "Gamespot.com is reporting that Ken Kutaragi, president of Sony Computer Entertainment, has disclosed in an interview that PlayStation 3 will natively run Linux. In fact, it will come bundled with it, if you purchase the HDD peripheral." From the article: "But while Linux would require a hard drive to run on, Kutaragi told Impress PC Watch, 'We're not going to equip [the PS3 with] a HDD by default, because no matter how much [capacity] we put in it, it won't be enough.' It was unclear whether he was referring to the previously known fact that the PS3 would not have an internal hard drive or whether he was indicating that the device would not come with the external 2.5-inch detachable HDD outlined in the specs revealed at E3."

Not suprising.

This is not suprising. Of course they wouldn't ship it with Windows, they don't want to fund their direct competitor!

Re:Not suprising.

The money is made with the hardware (in PS3 case), not directly with the software...

And unless they buy a copy from india (1$), I don't think they will change the price of the PS3 just to include Windows.

Re:Not suprising.

Yes, but they wouldn't even buy it from India. They wouldn't even put it in if they got it for free, simply because Microsoft = XBox = competitor.

Re:Not suprising.

What are you talking about? This is very surprising. It doesn't have to come with a PC OS at all. Listen to this quote: "It will become completely open if we equip it with Linux, and programmers will be able to do anything with it." This is a total about-face from the normal attitude console makers have, which is "we control the hardware, we control the software, and you can't do anything we don't like with it or we'll sue you."

Of course, no matter what exact words are coming out of Kutaragi's mouth, I'm sure what he *really* means is closer to the second statement. But it's interesting that they are trying to position the PS3 as a real computer, not just a game console. If they really do equip it with Linux and provide dev tools, they won't be able to control the resulting flood of hacks, emulators, media center applications, indie games, and the like.

Re:Not suprising.

You mean they won't be able to contol the desire for everyone to have this machine, instead of buying their competitors product? They won't have to worry about people poking around their bios and reverse engineering it, because there would only be one reason to do that? They won't be able to handle the heaps of praise placed upon them from the open source community?

Damn, this looks like a bad move on their part.

Re:Not suprising.

What you say is true and may even seem obvious, but for a bigwig at Sony to see it that way? That's not only surprising, but outright bizarre.

Re:Open source?

No. WINE is not an emulator, Cell is not an x86 chip.

Re:Open source?

Well you could not run JUST Wine. You would need Wine with a cpu emulator or a JIT compiler.
The other issue will be the tool chain. Can you get a compiler for the Cell? Most emulators do not do a lot of FP so the Cells will probably not be used much for the lower end emulators.
The compiler/tool chain is going to be critical. GCC for what I have seen is not very good at vectors. For a lot of Cell development a compiler the can generate vector code will be extermly useful if not vital. Maybe Intel and or IBM could help out GCC in that area?

Re:Linux bluetoooth support ?

Stable but wonky interface, in my experience. You have to manually poke it to get it to attach to a
new device, and at least on my belkin parts you have to manually switch crypto off and then back on.
Oh, and anybody in the world can listen in on your keypress events, but that's not a Linux thing,
that's an auto-selected 4 numeral PIN thing ;)

Not listening to anything re HDD

After the whole fiasco that Sony had with the NA release of HDD (delaying it by years, promising it would do things it never did, then abandoning it completely with the PS2 redesign after being on market less than a year), I'm not beliving anything Sony says about PS3, HDD specs or otherwise, until it is physically at the store available for purchase.

Personally, I think it would be a mistake that they not include an HDD with the console, but considering the rumoured cost of the PS3, it is probably doubtful that it will include one at launch.

Re:Opening the door for game pirates?

On the serious side, this is probably what sony wants to avoid. A lot of people were devoted to hacking the current consoles to run linux on them - and incidentally opened it up for piracy along the way. If it runs linux from day 1 there will be less people working to crack it. Won't hurt the big piracy orgs, but could stop a few of the smaller ones.

Any more middle-aged geeks out there...

...fancy buying a PS3 and joining my "Emacs Exterminators" online editing clan?

We're gonna *TAKE DOWN* those vi fanboys!

Won't be enough?

'We're not going to equip [the PS3 with] a HDD by default, because no matter how much [capacity] we put in it, it won't be enough.'

Nonesense. Never came close to filling up the 8gig on my Xbox, but every game I've played has made use of the HD because they KNOW it will be there.

Of course, since the HD is optional with the PS3, devs will have to assume that it will not be there to reach a wider installed base. PS3 has just made developing for their system more difficult by releasing two products - ones with HDs and ones without.

Even just a small 4gig drive might have been helpful and inexpensive.

Re:Won't be enough?

We're not going to equip [the PS3 with] a HDD by default, because no matter how much [capacity] we put in it, it won't be enough.

I think what he really meant to say was:

We're not going to equip [the PS3 with] a HDD by default, because no matter how much [money we make on the PS3] it won't be enough [when we can make a bit more by milking extra money out of customers for a HDD]

Re:Won't be enough?

Wrong. You're basing that off really old rumors that turned out not to be true. Microsoft is shipping all XBOX 360s with a 20 Gig HD, included in the box. It's removable to be upgradable and portable so you can take your data/saves/music with you to use on other XBOX 360s though.

Good strategy

It's a good marketing play. It just shifted my preference toward PS3 and away from Xbox360. The ability to use Linux on a system with some rather exotic symmetrical processors, and play all previous PS titles. Right now, all Xbox 360 has going for it is the promise of Halo 3.

obligitory....

...yes, but does it run windows?

;P

Windows or Mac on PS3!

Other PC Operating Systems can run too, such as Windows and Tiger (Max OS X 10.4), if the publishers want [them] to do so. That happening seems so far-fetched to me that its very mention undermines the believability of anything else said in the article. That said, it is good to hear Sony will continue to support linux on PlayStation.

ps3 as pc?

This announcement makes me wonder if Sony is positioning ps3 as a general purpose pc replacement. If the HDD includes not only the kernel but a windowing environment(KDE, gnome, etc...), I could see more than a few people using ps3 as thier primary web/email/office box. Assuming that it has keyboard/mouse support, the ps3 has more than enough power to handle normal pc usage.

Re:PS2 Linux

PS2 Linux was a disaster. First, it was ludicrously expensive - considering you were paying for a free OS. Then there was the whole fiasco about suitable displays - you could only play games on a TV, but only use Linux on a monitor (and one with a "Sync on green" facility too). And finally, they crippled access to all the interesting bits of the system too for good measure.

If that was their idea of opening up the system, then I don't hold out much hope for Linux on PS3.

Huh?

Can anyone understand what this guy is saying? It seems like everything he says he says the opposite like 2 seconds later!

"We're not going to equip [the PS3 with] an HDD by default."

"So in order to declare that the PS3 is a computer, I think we'll have [the PS3's HDD] preinstalled with Linux as a bonus."

Basically he wants to have PS3 seen as a computer not just a game machine. OK, fine. He says to do this it will need as OS (Linux) to be installed on the HDD. OK, fine. But PS3 won't ship with a HDD. OK, .. but...I thought...WTF!

Optional Hard Drive?

Terrible move by Sony. Developers ignored the PS2 hard drive because the installed base was so low, and I'm sure PS3 will be the same way.

MythTV

If this is true, and they write some reasonable accelerated X drivers, they've more or less sold me on the PS3. Why?

One reason: MythTV frontend. It's hard to justify spending $350 on a console. Spending $350-$400 on a console that replaces a $250-$300 mini-ITX box... that's much easier to justify. You gotta figure that MythTV will be ported pretty fast to it, if the video and audio drivers are reasonable. I also rather like the idea of using MythGame to emulate other systems - really makes for an all-in-one entertainment system.

X-BOX 360 was definitely a competitor for my cash and home media network, but I just can't bring myself to deal with MCE. For all its benefits (easy setup, well-supported), it has niggling annoyances (lack of friendly open formats, multiple tuner issues, proprietary extenders).

-Erwos

This guy doesn't appear to know shit...

KK: Linux is legacy, but it will be a start.
Legacy? Riiight. No Linux fanboy here, but I know bullshit when I see it.

In the case of the Cell, operation systems are applications.
Wah?

The kernel will be running on the Cell, and multiple OSes will be running on top of that as applications.
Bah?

Of course, the PS3 can run Linux. If Linux can run, so can Lindows.
Comparing kernels to distros here. Despite the fact that the latter is built upon the former.

Other PC Operating Systems can run too, such as Windows and Tiger (Max OS X 10.4), if the publishers want [them] to do so.
But the odds of Microsoft or Apple doing so are zero. So why say it?

I'm sure the guys clever. But he's not technical in the slightest.

The built in games?

Does this mean that the default games for the PS3 will include Tux Racer, and Penguin Hunt?

Re:Spelling please?: Kutaragi

The fun-packed grammar and spelling nazi show can be followed by the Useless Japanese Trivia show:

Ken Kutaragi -- in Japanese, v'½--Ç-Ø OE', is one of those lucky fellows with a four-character surname. You can go for years among Japanese people and never meet such a person; it's like having a European-language surname that starts with "X". There are even web sites devoted to listing up all the 4+ character surnames.

And that was Useless Japanese Name Trivia for today!

Re:Spelling please?: Kutaragi

I call your bluff -- ' v'½--Ç-Ø OE',' isn't a name at all! In other news, Slashdot (perhaps unsurprisingly) isn't very multilingual.

However, I did once know a Japanese lady whose family name was 'kyuuraku' as in 'long-lasting pleasure'.

I think it's one of those names awarded to artists and craftsmen way back when... they're getting pretty rare now.

There's a list of 4-character names here:
http://www.ipc.shizuoka.ac.jp/~jjksiro/4moji.html [shizuoka.ac.jp] ...but it doesn't have Katuragi, so there must be more.

Re:But...

Just the other day I was ship-watching at a really noisy location with my foul-mouthed friend in the Navy and I said "HEY, YOU *$&%, IS THAT A DESTROYER?" and he yelled back "NO, CARRIER! *#&$!"

i'm so ashamed to have done that...