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Exploring The 360's Crashing and Heat 114

Posted by Zonk from the pirates-of-the-carribean-don't-eat-the-tourists dept.
GameDailyBiz has a piece up looking into the crashing and overheating problems that have plagued the Xbox 360 since the system launched. A new crashing problem seems to be associated with the most recent update to the Xbox Live software, while german forum-goers think they may have identified the overheating issue. From the article: "The way it's installed now by MS the GPU chip makes contact with the protection foil instead of the heat transfer pad. This can of course cause cooling issues for the graphics chip as for optimal cooling performance there should just be a thin layer of thermal pad between the GPU chip and heatsink."
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Exploring The 360's Crashing and Heat More

Exploring The 360's Crashing and Heat

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  • That's not a glitch! (Score:5, Funny)

    by cbiltcliffe ( 186293 ) on Friday March 10, 2006 @06:53PM (#14895316) Homepage Journal
    It's a feature. It stops you from playing for so long at a stretch that you risk developing carpel tunnel, thereby preventing you from suing Microsoft over health problems.

  • Sad day indeed (Score:4, Insightful)

    by suspected ( 907639 ) on Friday March 10, 2006 @06:57PM (#14895353)
    One of the main advantages of a console games over PC games is simplicity and compatibility. About 10 years ago, installing a computer game wasn't as simple as it is today, and you were never sure if it would run on your computer. Today such concerns are minor, but consoles still hold a considerable market share even though they are nothing more but computers that are geared for video game.

    Having said that, it's really disheartening to hear that Microsoft has over-looked the key advantage of consoles and screwed it up. I certainly hope that the xbox360 sales stay low, if for no other reason than to send a message to prospective console entrepreneurs: don't screw your consumer base by releasing expensive, under-tested products!

    • Re:Sad day indeed (Score:3, Insightful)

      by E-Rock ( 84950 )
      Sales stay low? Low as in they sell every single unit they get on the shelves?

      Also, I'm not sure how 'wide spread' this problem is as no one I know with a 360 has ever had it happend and no-one I see complaining about it on-line has either. It's always a friend of a friend, or I hear that...

      • Re:Sad day indeed (Score:1, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward
        > Low as in they sell every single unit they get on the shelves?

        Wow, 360 owners are still trying to get people to believe that BS???

        That is so sad...

        Of course you don't mean in Japan where they don't look like they will ever sell their initial shipment.

        Europe looks to be doing quite bad with multiple people in one console forum a couple days ago offering to upload pictures of large numbers of 360s sitting unsold in stores over there when someone tried to claim the 360 was sold out over there.

        And the US,

        • Re:Sad day indeed (Score:5, Informative)

          by Donjo ( 797935 ) on Friday March 10, 2006 @07:40PM (#14895630) Homepage Journal
          I just purchased my 360 not long ago and I had to search long and hard for it. I wanted to get a premium package but they were nowhere to be found in retail stores and I was finally able to find an EB that had a single core system left. I know a lot of people that never had problems, yet I know quite a few people that had problems with their PS2 release consoles and the DVD drive that came with it. Every launch console has problems and people who are against the console tend to hype it.

        • Re:Sad day indeed (Score:5, Insightful)

          by wolrahnaes ( 632574 ) <seanNO@SPAMseanharlow.info> on Friday March 10, 2006 @07:43PM (#14895653) Homepage Journal
          Sold out does mean as recently as 2 weeks ago, one local Best Buy got a shipment of 6, and 15 minutes later I was walking out with the last one in hand. Every other store in town was out of stock.

          This isn't a small town either, Toledo is either the 4th or 5th largest city in Ohio (not sure if we're ahead of Akron).

          There were only 2 core packages anywhere too, so even those pieces of crap are selling.
        • Of course you don't mean in Japan where they don't look like they will ever sell their initial shipment.

          Looks like those will be sold at a discount in other markets. You can get them in Australia already, and some Australian online stores ship to the US, so anyone in the US who's desperate might want to look there.
          http://www.mp4store.com.au/category37/product386/ p roduct_info.html [mp4store.com.au]

      • Okay, my best friend who lives in Duluth, MN owns a 360 that has overheating problems. His old X-Box sat in a relatively well ventilated spot on the shelf and didn't have any problems. The 360 sits in the same spot and, being a bit smaller, has better ventilation. The P/S sat behind the set up. Whenever he played DOA or CoD 2 the game would freeze up and the console would shut down. I have witnessed it.

        The solution was to put a few nails in the wall and hang the P/S about a foot off the ground and half

    • Re:Sad day indeed (Score:3, Insightful)

      by JL-b8 ( 862188 )
      I have to say that every time the 360 comes into the limelight I smell the fanboyism all over the place. If it isn't the PC gamers than its the sony or nintendo freaks and everyone slings a nice thick wad of mud on the other guy while thinking they're preference is so high and mighty. I've owned all 3 systems and I've gone through my share of crap with all of them. I've yet to cross that road with my 360. But I know they're imperfect machines designed by imperfect humans and assembled by more imperfect peop
      • I think most of the trolling is a single user. The AC trolls are all similar, lack real arguments and there's usually just one troll reply per post. It's one guy who wants to convince everyone that everything bad in the world is MS's fault and that Sony and Nintendo are perfect and the PS3 is the second coming.
    • They sold out all the Xbox 360s they made, so if sales are slow it is because they haven't manufactured enough... but I agree with you, the whole benifit of consoles is that you don't have to deal with all the crap setup and compatibility issues that you do on a PC.
      • They have not manufactured enough because they have had to reduce manufacture rates whilst the overheating problem is designed out of the system. Overheating is really bad news for tech equipment as it kills the life of the equipment.

        Console owners are going to be pretty pissed should the units start dying not long after the 90 day warranty expires. The whole concept is just so stupid, shave a few cents, so losses are reduced, annoy huge numbers of customers with failing units, who have to replace them wi

    • PC games are easy to install nowadays? Since when? Some of the major titles like Half-Life 2 and Battlefield 2 had issues at launch, sometimes game-crashing. To be honest, I really don't understand why games need to be installed on acomputer: if I have a fast enough DVD drive, things should load off the bloody DVD, no? I've seen games do it before (Tomb Raider comes to mind), I don't understand why most games don't do it, especially since most games require you to have the disc in to play anyway.
      • DVD read speed at 12x, max (in order, from beginning to end, no random seeks): 15.85MB/s
        Hard disk read speed (average sustained large chunks ~64KB+): 58.7MB/s

        Do you have any questions now? The answer is very simple: hard drives are far faster.
        • Consoles can handle it though. The 360 is loading high res textures comparable to ones found on PC games, and some games even manage not to have loading screens in between levels.
          • That's like telling people that horse-and-buggy do the trick fine.

            If you've got this blazing-fast hard disk there, why not use it?

            Also, if the 360 is at all like the original Xbox, running from hard disk will be much, much faster on that platform as well.

            Be glad they make use of it on PC.
        • Errr you realise games run from RAM not the hard disk. That the difference between harddisk and DVD is about 3x while the difference between harddisk and RAM is about 1,000,000x. I mean your talking like the parent is making some kind of dumb suggestion but the only difference running off harddrive makes is loading times.

          Loading times that actually manage to be longer on PC than console because the developers often either over look it or are too lazy to sort them out. I.e. PC games often load slower than co
          • All Xbox 360 games run from RAM; you can't assume a system will have a HDD (remember, there are "core" systems out there). Because PC game makers have a more expansive platform to work with they frequently will cache things to disc, and as the parent notes, be "sloppy." I don't know how much you can bag on them for it (ok, actually I do, since I work with a lot of console engineers, and the answer there is "an unlimited amount"), because obviously they have a lot of other things to deal with, such as making
          • Load times on the PC are usually a bit longer (well, compared to the Gamecube, the PS2 is just as bad) but less frequent. Some games take one load and that's it, you're playing for hours. PC games can stuff a lot more content between load pauses and when a console game gets ported to the PC in many cases the load times are so short you don't even notice them.
      • I don't know about yours but my DVD drive is fucking loud when it spins. The HD makes almost no sound. I prefer having a game on HD (and without CD check) over having it on DVD and having to dig out the disc every time I want to run it.

    • Re:Sad day indeed (Score:4, Funny)

      by cgenman ( 325138 ) on Saturday March 11, 2006 @12:06AM (#14896649) Homepage
      About 10 years ago, installing a computer game wasn't as simple as it is today, and you were never sure if it would run on your computer... it's really disheartening to hear that Microsoft has over-looked the key advantage of consoles and screwed it up.

      "There's an old story about the person who wished his computer were as easy to use as his telephone. That wish has come true, since I no longer know how to use my telephone. "

      -- Bjarne Stroustrup

    • "PC games is simplicity and compatibility. About 10 years ago, installing a computer game wasn't as simple as it is today, and you were never sure if it would run on your computer."

      Don't worry, PC game manufacturers are working hard to bring back the good old days when you didn't know whether a game would install and work. Consoles have always been superior in this regard; just put the game in and play.

  • Holy crap these people are morons (Score:5, Informative)

    by pythas ( 75383 ) on Friday March 10, 2006 @07:16PM (#14895495)
    The foil IS PART OF the heat transfer material. Intel uses it on the pentium 4s, I've seen it on Dell servers as well.

    Just another case of idiots on the internet pulling out the "jump to conclusions" mat.
    • I like the part where there's this worry that the foil will somehow block the heat transfer. Right. If you believe that, wrap your hand in tinfoil and stick it in a fire.
      • I suppose it is part of the consequence of people being able to screw together a few parts and calling themselves "computer builders". Sometimes they are people that understand what they are doing, and other times they are just idiots thinking they understand thermal engineering.
      • Foil does do a good job at blocking radiative transfer.

      • Re:Holy crap these people are morons (Score:5, Informative)

        by MicktheMech ( 697533 ) on Friday March 10, 2006 @11:35PM (#14896518) Homepage
        I like the part where there's this worry that the foil will somehow block the heat transfer. Right. If you believe that, wrap your hand in tinfoil and stick it in a fire.

        1. Your example is primarily covective/radiation, where the heat transfer in question is primarily through conduction. It isn't a very good analogy.
        2. The issue isn't the conductivity of the foil, it's the contact surface. When you have imperfect contact it works like an additional resistance. If you measure the temperatures of the two surfaces you'll see something like a disconinuity between the two. Thermal paste conforms to each of the surfaces, reducing the effect of the contact resistance. Remember, convection is generally negligible for small characteristic lengths. Radiation is also a small factor when you're looking at the temperatures inside of a computer.
    • Heh, I always thought you were supposed to peel that foil off! :)

      I'm not an expert but I would have expected the foil would be less efficient at transferring heat than the pad underneath it. I thought the point of thermal compounds was to be slighly fluid so that it can squeeze into the small imperfections on the surface of the CPU to create a closer bond? If the foil is there then doesn't that mean it's just the same as if the CPU was in direct contact with the heat sink?

  • until now ... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Frag-A-Muffin ( 5490 ) on Friday March 10, 2006 @07:44PM (#14895659)
    consoles have been such a stable platform. A consistent target for developers with usually not many surprises.

    Thanks Microsoft! For bringing in the troubles of the Wintel world into the console world! Updates to fix a system that clearly wasn't ready. That's what I want from a console, incomplete, work in progress! w00T! :)

  • new user notes (Score:5, Interesting)

    by morcheeba ( 260908 ) * on Friday March 10, 2006 @07:59PM (#14895738) Journal
    I just got my xbox360 sunday, and I've had no heat problems, but there are tons of problems with the UI. Oh, where do I start?

    • Downloads are fux0red. You can only download one at a time, and while that's happening you can't do anything else. There is no time display, only a percentage display. Not only is the percentage display grossly wrong, if you don't touch the box (because you can't do anything else), the screensaver kicks in and shows you the menu underneath -- totally useless. Downloads instantly start at 5% done. Abort and restart it, and it'll automatically be 50% done. Abort and restart it again and it'll be 100% done and quit downloading.
    • Once you get a download, the default action is to re-download it. Which, if you accept this, it'll delete (without warning) and start again. The default action should be "go to my download". No, actually, the default action should be "play my download", but they don't have that -- you have to go through 2 more menus to actually play it.
    • The box constantly logs me in and out - some things need me in, some out.
    • Menu items are inconsistent. Even on the same menu, some items are highlighted by brightening the center, others are highlighted by brightening the edges.
    • When you quit a game, the OS doesn't know if you've saved the game or not. So, it'll always warn you that you are about to lose data, even if you haven't started a game. A little communication between the OS and games, please!
    • The unit is really loud. Much louder than my PC or my microwave.
    • The only auto-power off option is "never" or "6 hours". I'd like it to power off after downloading my games -- I hope 6 hours is enough -- and preferably ASAP because the fans are really loud.
    • There is no headphones jack. I use it with my monitor, which supports HDTV but not audio.
    • There are some things you do that apparently require it to reboot (it doesn't tell you), which autostarts the game. Frustrating if you say "do xxx" and it starts the game instead of going to the menu you were previously at.


    The controller is genius. It feels solid and comfortable, the radio works well.
    Graphics have been a letdown compared to my PC.
    The software is amazingly half-baked considering they've had 4 months after the release date to fix it.
    • what I hate is not having the ability to boot to menu, ala the DS.

    • Re:new user notes (Score:4, Insightful)

      by DeadScreenSky ( 666442 ) on Saturday March 11, 2006 @02:10AM (#14896959)
      Most of your problems just sound like new user issues, honestly.

      Downloads are fux0red. You can only download one at a time, and while that's happening you can't do anything else. There is no time display, only a percentage display. Not only is the percentage display grossly wrong, if you don't touch the box (because you can't do anything else), the screensaver kicks in and shows you the menu underneath -- totally useless. Downloads instantly start at 5% done. Abort and restart it, and it'll automatically be 50% done. Abort and restart it again and it'll be 100% done and quit downloading.
      Limiting downloads is actually a feature, sort of. The X360 isn't a PC. Games expect to get complete hardware performance every time they run (technically 5% or so of one of the cores is devoted to the GUI, but you understand what I mean). Yeah, I guess you could still want to listen to music or something while you download a demo, but the interface isn't really designed for multitasking like that. That's a good call, it's already fairly complicated enough for a gaming system. Like I said, it's a console, not a PC.

      You want the screensaver to cut in. Some HDTVs are very susceptible to burn-in. The controller turns off too, to save power. I guess that could be mildly annoying to some people, but I don't think you are expected to just sit there and watch the download.

      The 50% resume issue is a little bizarre, but it's not really much of a problem IMO. I've never had that fake 100% issue before, and I've resumed and stopped downloads all of the time.

      The box constantly logs me in and out - some things need me in, some out.
      Like your problem with unexpected reboots, this sounds like an issue with software updates for a new system. I'm not sure I consider it a problem myself, but you won't really have to worry about it now.

      Menu items are inconsistent. Even on the same menu, some items are highlighted by brightening the center, others are highlighted by brightening the edges.
      Where does this specifically occur? I've never noticed this.

      When you quit a game, the OS doesn't know if you've saved the game or not. So, it'll always warn you that you are about to lose data, even if you haven't started a game. A little communication between the OS and games, please!
      This is more of an issue with shoddy games that don't autosave, generally lazy multiplatform releases. It's not a problem with the consoles. Games like DOA4 will never make this complaint. It just autosaves in the background when you unlock or accomplish something new. This kind of thing was pretty standard even on the better Xbox1 games.

      The unit is really loud. Much louder than my PC or my microwave.
      It is very loud. This is probably my biggest complaint with the console. That said, my PS2 is roughly the same volume, maybe even louder. So is my new videocard. I understand why they don't allow this, but it's too bad you couldn't upgrade the fans to something higher-end and quieter like I have with my PC's CPU.

      Graphics have been a letdown compared to my PC.
      Wow, seriously? What PC games am I missing exactly? I've had the completely opposite experience. I haven't seen anything on the PC that looks as good as PGR3, DOA4, Kameo, GRAW, Full Auto, and occasionally PD0. This is the first videocard upgrade I've really been disappointed with, and it's solely because nothing has come close to the X360 I've had for months.

      And I'm a big fan of the controller too. One of these days I have to pick up the wired version for my PC. It's just so damn comfortable.

      • Re:new user notes (Score:3, Interesting)

        by cgenman ( 325138 )
        Limiting downloads is actually a feature, sort of. The X360 isn't a PC. Games expect to get complete hardware performance every time they run (technically 5% or so of one of the cores is devoted to the GUI, but you understand what I mean).

        Yes, but you should at least be able to navigate the dashboard, start other downloads, chat with friends, etc. Downloading itself isn't a particularly processor intensive task, and it shouldn't be too difficult for the system to put up a "download in progress... game is

        • Re:new user notes (Score:4, Interesting)

          by DeadScreenSky ( 666442 ) on Saturday March 11, 2006 @06:54AM (#14897537)
          Yes, but you should at least be able to navigate the dashboard, start other downloads, chat with friends, etc. Downloading itself isn't a particularly processor intensive task, and it shouldn't be too difficult for the system to put up a "download in progress... game is paused" message for anyone who tries to enter or resume a game.

          I expect we'll see this improve as MS releases more dashboard updates.

          I didn't think about chatting with friends. That's a good point. I guess I just only download demos when I'm not using the console, so it's never seemed like a big deal to me.

          This rather bothers me as well. I'd much rather be logged in or not depending upon how I feel, rather than what the internal state of the box wants.

          You can log out anytime you want (or just make yourself look like you're logged out). The only reason the system forces you to log out is when it is a necessity (generally for software updates).

          Lots of games on the PS2 autosave, just as lots of Xbox games didn't. There seems to be a lot of developers around who haven't quite understood that it isn't save and autosave anymore, it is save and manual save.

          DOA can get away with autosaving without warnings because there really isn't any moment-to-moment progress to be lost. However, in an RPG every resource you consume or action you take could count as progress, and as such unless you're going to hit the memory card every second or two, you need to warn the player.

          This is really only a problem for the X360 because that's the only console that has the concept of "quitting" a game. You don't quit anything on the PS2, you just turn the machine off.

          I didn't mean to imply that only the Xbox1 did autosaves, though it was pretty rare on the PS2 and Gamecube. It definitely is a developer education issue.

          Autosaves in an RPG are more of a gameplay design issue than anything. Of course since the X360 doesn't have any yet that can't be what the grandparent post was complaining about. But it's pretty ridiculous that games like Burnout Revenge and Amped 3 pop up big "now saving" messages that stop the game in its tracks every time you accomplish anything. DOA4 saves in the background after every battle and it doesn't slow the game down at all. That's clearly not a console issue, it's a developer issue.

          And really, that summarizes all of the growing pains the X360 is experiencing. It took a very simple thing, a console, and expanded it out in new directions. Some of those are painful and confusing. Some aren't.

          Well put.
          • I'd just like to point out that pretty much every game I have for the Gamecube (between 15 and 20, can't be bothered to count them) autosaves at relevant points. Admittedly most of these are games actually by Nintendo.

      • Re:new user notes (Score:1, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward
        It is very loud. This is probably my biggest complaint with the console. That said, my PS2 is roughly the same volume, maybe even louder.

        WTF? The PS2 isn't even half as loud as the 360. If yours is even louder it's got a serious problem.

        I haven't seen anything on the PC that looks as good as PGR3, DOA4, Kameo, GRAW, Full Auto, and occasionally PD0.

        FEAR, AOE3, Quake 4, B&W 2, X3 Reunion, TRD3, Half-life 2 LC just to name a few.
        As for the 360 games you mentioned, PGR3, Kameo, PD0 are jaggy-filled nightma

      • What do you mean by "new user issues"? You mean "things people will eventually learn to work around"? Come on, most of these are just usability issues, they could be fixed in software, and they should have been caught in a rew usability testing iterations.

        Your parent poster obviously didn't figure out what was going on with respect to, say, auto-log-off. That's not his problem, it's Microsoft's problem for not making it clear.

        Sure, eventually he'll learn, but why should he have to?

        • What do you mean by "new user issues"? You mean "things people will eventually learn to work around"? Come on, most of these are just usability issues, they could be fixed in software, and they should have been caught in a rew usability testing iterations.

          Your parent poster obviously didn't figure out what was going on with respect to, say, auto-log-off. That's not his problem, it's Microsoft's problem for not making it clear.

          Sure, eventually he'll learn, but why should he have to?

          Complex things sometimes t

  • Several people I know have gotten their 360s that I know. The major issue that I have seen is the insuffecient grey matter heap size issue. You know, PEBKAC.

    Three friends and a brother all have had the heat issue. They kept their consoles in nice av cabinets, one with a glass front. No air flow. A-B user interaction error. We had this problem with high performance gaming PCs and enclosed areas. Local user issue.

    • Re:User Headspace Error (Score:5, Insightful)

      by rafemonkey ( 152890 ) <rafemonkey@@@yahoo...com> on Friday March 10, 2006 @09:49PM (#14896189)
      This is the same mistake Microsoft made. They, like you, assume that the 360 is a computer, and people will treat it as such. But the reality is that a game console is not supposed to be a computer. It's a piece of AV hardware, and it ought to work like it, since that's how people are going to treat it. Think of it like a VCR, it needs to be able to go in the cabinet under the TV and still work.
      • I have a Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8000 DVR. Timewarner rents these to us.

        It has a fan, runs excessively hot and I was told not to put it in my AV cabinet because it would over heat...

        Doesn't work like it used to anymore...you can't just assume that because it's not a computer that you can lock it in a space with no moving air.
      • "This is the same mistake Microsoft made. They, like you, assume that the 360 is a computer, and people will treat it as such. But the reality is that a game console is not supposed to be a computer. It's a piece of AV hardware, and it ought to work like it, since that's how people are going to treat it. Think of it like a VCR, it needs to be able to go in the cabinet under the TV and still work."

        If that's the case, all three companies are going to be in serious trouble this generation. You've got Microsof
        • I agree that all of the next gen consoles are computers and really need to be treated as such. But the problem is that they are being marketed as game consoles, and every game console back to dawn of time (or the late 1970s) has been a peice of AV hardware. Companies go out of their way to market them as such, to avoid losing potential consumers who have no interest in computers, or even find them scary. That the next gen consoles really are computers doesn't change the way consumers percive them. This can
        • And you have Nintendo, which should be fine in the heat department but pretty much will require internet connectivity for the main feature of the system, emulated games (not everyone has the luxury of an internet connection in their living room).

          Thankfully they sell a Nintendo branded USB wifi dongle for just this type of situation.
          • Except they haven't totally verified that the USB dongle will work with Revolution. For that matter, suppose the user has 56K? This is bad enough trying to play Mario Kart on DS -- imagine downloading N64 games on it.

            A lot of people lambast the 360 (and it's predecessor) for requiring broadband. I have a feeling Nintendo is going to require the same thing, and not everyone has broadband yet. Especially considering they're marketing a low-priced system to people without HDTVs (lower-class families), it's
            • Except they haven't totally verified that the USB dongle will work with Revolution. For that matter, suppose the user has 56K? This is bad enough trying to play Mario Kart on DS -- imagine downloading N64 games on it.

              Suppose the user is blind! Imagine playing Mario Golf with no eyes!

              Give me a break.

              • You're telling me the dongle is an option. I'm telling you it's not. Logistically, it makes no sense to have a service which'll essentially be downloading ROMS run through anything less than broadband. Since the dongle can be connected to anything, it's a problem.

                I don't know if you've tried playing Mario Kart with the dongle connected to anything less than broadband, but it's painful. Even with broadband there are a lot of fits and starts. Now take that experience and amplify it now that you're downlo
            • A house without HDTV is "lower class"? give me a break.

              And where is this "you're pretty much going to need broadband to get a reasonable gaming experience out of the box." coming from? And how is that not true for every console of the next generation?
              • "A house without HDTV is "lower class"? give me a break."

                One could easily argue that anyone who purchases the cheapest of the 3 systems with games from 20 years ago is lower-class. I mean, a person with a decent amount of money would buy the better systems (or perhaps all 3). They could get the same results out of an emulator. *shrug* But Nintendo has always kind of bowed to the lowest common denominator -- that's why they're in the position they're in now.
                • Except your comment wasnt about the future Nintendo system, it was about HDTV's.

                      And one COULD argue that someone is "lower-class" based on something as superficial as a console choice. But the person making that argument would be idiot and/or a troll.
                  • "And one COULD argue that someone is "lower-class" based on something as superficial as a console choice. But the person making that argument would be idiot and/or a troll."

                    Sure thing "MentosPimp". Your opinions are just as valid as mine. *rolls eyes*
                    • I welcome you to point out an opinion of mine that is as off-base
                      as you denigrating an entire group of people based on the electronics they own.

                      About 90% (maybe less, but certainly not lower than 80%) of America does not have an HDTV. According to you they are "lower class" That may be an opinion, but I believe your average person would see that as a baseless insult.

                      But you are free to point out that silly usernames on a Website have
                      some bearing on the content you are posting. I'm sure it will be as insi
      • You're getting warmer, but you still aren't quite on the money yet. A video game console isn't a piece of AV equipment; it's a toy. As such, it should be able to deal with running on top of a pile of clothes in a kid's room, on the floor, on a stack of pizza boxes, stacked on top of other gaming hardware, pretty much anywhere. It also needs to be able to withstand being kicked, having the wires pull out suddenly, being gnawed on by pets, etc. No matter how much shiny plastic we may cover it in, we canno

      • Really high end AV equipment overheats all of the time. Add in Windows Media Center and DVRs (why do you think that the tivo has temp sensor) which are both heat sensitive. A good highend amp can fry an egg. I have an audiophile friend that proved it. As our kit gets more complex, we will need to worry about heat, internet connection, emi, and a plethora of issues. Welcome to the information age. I have a 360, Tivo, VCR (because my wife is a ludite), HD Digital Cable Box, A wireless router (needed a switch

  • 360 -- which 360? (Score:5, Funny)

    by shrinkwrap ( 160744 ) on Friday March 10, 2006 @09:43PM (#14896163)
    I guess I'm getting old. When I saw the title, I immediately thought, "Who is still using IBM 360s?"
    • I remember for quite a while after the PS2 launch, the first thing that always popped into my head when someone said "PS2" was the old IBM computers with the same name*.

      *Yes, I know they were called PS/2, not PS2. But I have always heard them pronounced the same way.

  • Thermal Pad? (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    What thermal pad are they talking about? Those pads are for Electrical Insulation! They also are more resistant to heat transfer making them bad. You only use them when you need to electrically isolate the component from the heatsink. IE multiple transistors with active tabs on a shared heatsink. For a processor like that you want the chip as close to the heatsink as possible for best heat conductivity. Heatsink grease is only used to fill in any air spaces (nothing is completly flat) between the chip and t
  • Has anyone I mean ANYONE anywhere. Got _actual_ figures of how many X-Box360's have gone wrong. Anyone, anyone at all?

    Doesnt seem like it.

    Last MS said no more are going wrong than any other launch. I dont really believe them but the alternative is /. and these quite frankly biassed and rubbish articles that make it seem like every other 360 is blowing up. My friends have about 5 between them non has ever crashed or had any problems at all so this doesnt seem to believable either.

    Everyone who hasnt seems to
    • Well, this is anecdotal, but we own 9 xbox360's and have 3 more customers that bring in their own to play on our network. (We own a network game center.) So our systems are also on 12+ hours per day and are under very high use.

      So, out of our personal experience with 12 separate systems - 9 Premiums and 3 Cores - we have had one unit fail. It developed the 3 Red LED flashing issue, we called the very next morning. Microsoft had the shipping box to us the following business day, and 4 business days later,
    • Well I found a Premium 360 finally, and have had mild trouble from the beginning.

      No red LEDs but instead I get random lockups. Most notably Kameo locks up (indeed it managed to corrupt my saved game losing me hours of play), magazine disks have locked up too. The most concerning though is that I've had lockups on watching DVDs, I managed to get through two episodes of the Simpsons before it froze. [It's funny when the game locks up during a point where the controller is vibrating - the vibrat^H^H^H^H^H^H
  • I have had no problems with crashing scratching of discs etc. I have had mine since December 2005 and no crashes It is in a relitivly warm room sitting verticly.My friend who also has one has had no crashes either.

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