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Too Soon For A Columbine Videogame?
Posted by
Zonk
on Tue May 16, 2006 04:36 PM
from the touchy-subject dept.
from the touchy-subject dept.
neutralino writes "Rocky Mountain News has a story about a computer game based on the Columbine massacre. From the article: 'Called Super Columbine Massacre RPG, the game mixes cartoonish scenes with photographs of Harris and Klebold, pictures taken from newspapers and television stations and excerpts from their writings... [The game's creator] said he wanted to create something profoundly unique and confrontational that would promote a real dialogue on the subject of school shootings.'"
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On the Advent of Controversial Video Games 343 comments
eldavojohn writes "At some point in the history of video games, violence became uncomfortably real for censors and some parents. In addition to that, realistic use of narcotics has entered mainstream games. While gamers (of adult age) have by and large won the right to this entertainment, a large amount of games have arisen lately that challenge a different aspect of video games — inappropriate or sensitive topics. We've covered it before on Columbine to Fallujah, but I noticed through GamePolitics recently a large trend in severely controversial video games. Where do you stand on these titles?"
Read on for the rest of eldavojohn's thoughts.
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Are you kidding??? (Score:5, Informative)
First of all, someone is going to bring it up eventually, so I might as well be helpful and give everyone the link to the website that has the actual game...
http://www.columbinegame.com/ [columbinegame.com]
By the way, it appears that the game was designed using a program called "RPG Maker 2000" [chello.at]
Hopefully their website charges them for bandwidth, and once they get Slashdotted the server hosting bill will bankrupt the authors...
Secondly, I think that most people would feel some concern about copycats, and being that I haven't played the game myself, I don't know whether the perspective in the game glorifies the actions of Harris and Klebold. If it does, this can be pretty dangerous for some kids... Some of the comments in the news story tend to suggest that they are glorifying the murders. For example, the article stated that when someone is killed in the game, a dialogue box pops up stating "Another victory for the Trench Coat Mafia".
I would be against any effort to impose government censorship on this kind of thing, but the authors should have really thought about whether this was a good idea.
If you are going to download this game, you may want to do it soon. The article indicated that some of the content within the game may be in violation of a copyright.
Re:Are you kidding??? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Are you kidding??? (Score:4, Insightful)
WWII makes a good setting for a game for a number of reasons.
It fits a basic good v. bad story model, as it's hard for there to be much of a grey area when one side is shoving people into furnaces and gas chambers.
The combat was very mobile and the weapons are interesting--no boring trench warfare (I imagine a WWI game as playing more like Oregon Trail than an FPS; "Billy has trenchfoot!") and no fire-then-reload-for-a-minute (the ONLY reason a Revolutionary War FPS hasn't come out, and the community total conversion mods that have tried it were never very popular).
There's machinery like tanks and aircraft, but it's not fire-and-forget yet. You still have to see the enemy, dogfight, etc. Fast-paced and up-close action.
Luckily, the WWII setting also makes for some great experiences for the player. One can experience just a little bit of the horror of infantry combat in the mechanized age. It's hard to get across some of the horrors of other wars in the medium of the video game--again, trench warfare would be silly (It's the WWI choose-your-own-adventure game! *you are being shelled AGAIN. Do you a) wait it out or b) go 'over the top' and get mowed down by a machine gun?*), while much of the horror of wars like Vietnam weren't the *action*, but rather the way that day upon day of tension might play out after a close call that lasted maybe a minute.
I really do feel like a have a better handle on what that war was like after playing several WWII games. I'm NOT trying to compare it to the real thing at all, but I know that the first time I played the crossing-the-river scene in Call of Duty and "our side" (the Russians) called in a massive artillery strike less than 100 yards from where I was sitting, I was physically shaken afterwards. It's 1/2 of 1% of what the real thing is like, but it's more than you'd get anywhere else (outside of actual war, I mean). It gives a person a new respect for what a bunch of ordinary people went through over there, and what they accomplished in spite of it all.
Just expanding on what you said, not disagreeing--or at least, I don't think I am.
Parent
Re:Are you kidding??? (Score:4, Insightful)
Compared to WWII, all those other wars (plus Columbine and 2001/9/11 for that matter) were about as tragic as a guy stubbing his toe. No disrespect intended for the veterens of these events, but compared to 62 Million deaths from combat, bombing, starving, nuking and mass genocide, every other nasty event in the four thousand odd years of written history of violence seems like a jolly piece of fun.
Parent
Re:Are you kidding??? (Score:4, Insightful)
Should the game be banned?
No.
Should anybody buy it?
No.
Should every living person on the face of the earth tell the company that published this game that this is a bad idea!
Yes.
Freedom of speech means you can have the right to say anything and not go to jail.
It doesn't mean that every person on the planet doesn't have the right to hate your guts for saying it.
Parent
Re:Are you kidding??? (Score:4, Insightful)
No. Ignoring and going about our lives is the better solution.
What irks me about society is that it makes problems of non-problems.
Will "Columbine The Game" make anyone go out and do a copy cat? Only if they were going to go postal anyways.
These are one of those situations where making a fuss will just get it more attention.
Secondly, everyone just needs to get over it and get on with their lives. Digg had a story a week or two ago about one of the Columnbine victims who was paralyzed giving a subjective review of the game. That is an extreme thing that happened to him and logically reviewed the game without any sensitivity of his own plight.
From the interview [kotaku.com]:
That guy is stronger than any of us.
Parent
Hate: Definitely the Best Answer (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm intrigued by your response, because while you rightly support the free speech involved in this creation, you suggest we should hate people who express things we don't like.
I'm frankly shocked by the amount of outrage I'm reading in highly-moderated comments. This from a community that is usually quite happy to defend Grand Theft Auto or whatever game the media is attacking at the moment.
Is it because this game reflects real events? Does the fact of reflecting actual events somehow make this more or less real than a game of GTA? Because it seems to make it a lot more offensive to everyone.
And yet we have WW2 and Vietnam simulators out there. They're some of the hottest selling games on the market, in fact. Not a lot of outrage on that front. And when it comes to being evil in games, there seems to some interest [slashdot.org] in it. What a way to explore our humanity, eh?
Are we just trying to "think of the children?" We Slashdotters like to condemn people for using that line, too.
Personally I don't see how this game is any more or less offensive than any other violent video game--but much the way the holocaust or 9/11 hit sore spots for a lot of people, Columbine has become a bit of a sacred cow as well. Personally, I think the sooner our culture learns to let go of its sacred cows, the better. Because these sacred cows kill our perspective and inspire us to say and do things that are inconsistent with what are generally accepted as our principles.
Like, for instance, embracing hatred as a positive response to people who scarcely deserve our attention, let alone our hate.
Parent
The answer to both questions is the same. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:The answer to both questions is the same. (Score:5, Interesting)
Just because video games as an entertainment/art form are in their infancy doesn't mean they can't grow up and portray the same subjects that the more established arts do.
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Re:The answer to both questions is the same. (Score:5, Funny)
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Never is too soon. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Never is too soon. (Score:4, Funny)
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Re:Never is too soon. (Score:3, Insightful)
I smell BS (Score:5, Insightful)
I think what he wanted to do was generate some free promotion for himself, and he figured that school shootings would be a great way to get people to take a look at him. Instant noteriety.
Too soon? (Score:4, Insightful)
It's in the same boat as that "suicide bomber" flash game and the JFK game. The only thing that's interesting about any of these things is that the internet allows most anyone to create something and publish it. That's not a function of the games, but the ability for the creator to distribute. It's no different from someone's manifesto making it online, compared to the earlier method of sitting in a shoebox under the bed.
He also has no balls (Score:3, Insightful)
That's horseshit, and if that's what he claims, then he's got no sack.
Time to play the Devil's Advocate (Score:5, Insightful)
Since each and every one of the comments posted as of this moment is against the idea, I thought that someone should defend the author. At the moment, that someone is me.
First of all, please put aside the idea that there is such thing as a universal sense of taste that this guy is violating. There is no such thing. For example someone might tell you that a joke about rape is never funny, while George Carlin has a joke he provides as a counterexample that gets good laughs: "I'll prove to you that rape is funny. Picture porky pig raping elmer fudd. Why do you think they call him porky?"
By the same token, I remember laughing about the joke about NASA meaning "need another seven astronauts". I was a kid at the time, and I know that doesn't necessarily prove anything because kids lack refinement, but I guess what I'm saying is that refinement is not necessarily a virtue.
Human often deal with difficult situations with humor. Have you ever been in such dire straits (whether physically or emotionally) that it made you laugh, albeit hysterically? Laughter can be a coping mechanism. Of course, from the screen shots, it doesn't appear that they were shooting for humor (pardon the pun, or not. It was unintentional.
The claim is that this game was intended to provoke thought and dialogue. The screenshots seem to back that up, although my primary thought was wondering if the author really believed that access to guns was the problem, since if you believe that, you're a bozo. Any asshole can steal a gun, and there are other weapons available... But let's look at this story. Even without people playing the game, the very issue is causing serious dialogue. This comment is proof.
Is it acceptable to write a book or make a movie about the events of Columbine, discussing the ramifications? If so, then making a video game is every bit as legitimate. It's just another kind of artwork.
Those of you who are not bothered by books and movies about it existing, yet are still claiming that the video game is inappropriate, should go drive off a cliff with any progeny of yours in the vehicle at the same time. You'll do the rest of us a favor by helping to clean the gene pool.
Re:Time to play the Devil's Advocate (Score:4, Insightful)
How? If the game is presented in the same tone as the movie, which clearly seeks to give the viewer empathy for Mr. Kinte, then what's the difference? If anything, it should be a stronger example of negative conditioning because the acts relate more closely to the viewer (or in this case, player.)
Presentation is as material as content. While they do not glorify the events of Columbine, they do sensationalize them by using evocative and typically inaccurate adjectives, and by using dramatic music, lighting, and so forth. Anything put on video professionally is "punched up" to make it more interesting because video production is expensive.
The evening news is more about entertainment than it is about recounting the facts, regardless of what channel you're watching.
Video games are done from the perspective of the player's character and give their internal conflicts all the time. Hell, even Duke 3D has the main character talking to himself, giving you some idea of his [amazingly shallow] internal processes.
I don't know what makes you say this. Have you played the game? Maybe it's filled with insight into their lives. Well, actually I doubt that, but it's still possible... The right game would show us that. It would also show us how they became the way they are but it would be a bit tedious playing a game in which you are consistently abused by their parents, fellow students, and teachers, which is pretty much mandatory for kids to come out this way. Remember, raising kids is the job of the parents, this is definitely the fault of their parents :P
They are only superficially different. Sure, games are more interactive, but you are not completely passive when watching a movie, you're just not making decisions. Someday, of course, there may not be any non-interactive entertainment - would you rather watch a movie, or be in the movie? Once upon a time pictures didn't move...
The only difference between a video game and a movie is how real it can look (a movie will probably always be able to look better than a game, because you can prerender) and whether or not you're making decisions. Granted, that last is a significant difference, but not significant enough to change whether a video game is art or not (insofar as the concept is valid at all, video games are art) or whether it can address the same issues as a movie (which of course it can.)
Parent
See what a survivor says about the game. (Score:3, Interesting)
I don't think the idea behind the game was to trivialize the shootings, but to comment on them. In other words, it's not trying to be entertainment, it's trying to be art.
Assassin (Score:3, Interesting)
Hookers (Score:3, Insightful)
Columbine Survivor Talks About Columbine RPG (Score:4, Interesting)
" What did you think of it?
It probably sounds a bit odd for someone like me to say, but I appreciate the fact at least to some degree that something like this was made. I think that at least it gets people talikng about Columbine in a unique perspective, which is probably a good thing. But that being said there are a lot of things that are har to play or watch. And it seems to partially glamorize what happened. It shows a stark-contrast between fantasy and real life in an interesting way."
There is more of the interview at this site:
http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/feature/columbine-su
Reactionist (Score:4, Interesting)
Why on earth would I be interested in those? Because its fascinating in a very morbid way. Hell....I'm Jewish, almost lost relatives in 9/11, and went through many of the torturous highschool situations that the columbine kids did. I would never do any of these things, but I think games based on them can be an interesting way of exploring the emotions involved in the events....on BOTH sides.
Everybody knows how horrible it must have felt for the families of victims...but I have to say I'd be interested in getting into the heads of the people who actually committed these atrocities.
It reminds me of a class I took in highschool called Nazi Mind. The class was a psychology class looking not at the victims of WWII, but of the Nazis, and what could lead people to do the horrible things they did. BTW over half the class was Jewish. The first day we were asked what we thought of the Nazis and people gave their standard responses about how they were evil and they should die. Then at the last day they repeated the question and most people said they understood why some of them did what they did and that they themselves might do the same thing.
Yeah....this game might touch a lot of nerves and might cause some emotional stress for the families of victims, but I say more power to the creator for making people talk about this. Could the game be a bit more tasteful? Perhaps. But would we be discussing it as much then?
Its funny...for my final project in a history class I did a presentation on why kids need to learn to respect each other to prevent something like Columbine from happening. I made 3 people in the class cry and one had to leave she was so upset because of how sad my presentation was. At the end of the class we had a discussion and one of the "popular jocks" said he just didn't get why they did what they did...even after I had explained everything. His girlfriend called him a heartless loser and proceeded to explain how years of tormet can drive a person to do that sort of thing. Then basically every other person in the class chimed in. The guy, to his credit then realized the truth of it and apologized for his comment and talked a bit about why he had been one of the people in the past tormenting "geeks" etc. So in essence, he was "converted".
And of course for all of this I got brought down to the school psychologist because they were concerned about the report I gave...even though I had gotten approval on the topic before I had even started on it, had said nothing but positive things etc. Yeah, I hit the roof when that happened....
Re:Is it too soon for these games? (Score:3, Interesting)
If we're going to address painful issues
Too Soon (Score:4, Insightful)
For some reason, people have this idea that they have the right to never have their feelings hurt. Well fuck them. If being offended by stuff is the worst thing that ever happens to you, then you've lived a charmed life.
I swear, when a people are so spoiled and safe that they can get upset about a VIDEOGAME, it's time for war. Spending a few hours every night in a shelter waiting for the tanks to stop shelling your neighbourhood is just the kind of thing people need to remind of how enormously trivial a videogame is. Seeing your neighbours being taken away to deathcamps is good too. I suppose going to a deathcamp yourself might serve as a reminder, but you would never really get a chance to implement that knowledge...
To summarize: it's just a videogame. Whoopitty shit. Find something serious to care about, like the fact that the USA is adopting fascism, or that Europe has become a power-keg for racially/religiously/economically driven violence. Those things matter. Videogames based on what was possibly the smallest massacre in human history do not.
Parent