The Pressures on the Next Nintendo Console 341
With the launch of Nintendo's next-gen offering a little more than two months away, the importance that Nintendo is placing on this console is finally becoming apparent. Dyed-in-the-wool Nintendo loyalists and haters alike have both come to the same conclusion: if Nintendo is to stay a force in the non-portable console market, this system has to succeed. Along those lines, WhatEntertainment offers an editorial entitled Failure is not an Option. It explores the reality that Nintendo's failure would have repercussions on the industry as a whole. "Most of all I'm worried what this might do to the industry if it's a failure. In a landscape already filled with the carcasses of those that dared to try something new, and publishers more afraid than ever to try something a little different, the high-profile failure of a system that tried to put innovation and fun before graphics could be the final nail in the coffin of creativity." Meanwhile, GameInformer has a piece entitled Will Wii be Dissapointed Again? Billy Berghammer says what he doesn't want to say: the Wii could be another flop for Nintendo. From that article: "The launch price is low enough (outside of the $60 for controller costs) to avoid damaging my wallet the same way the purchase of a Xbox 360 or PlayStation 3 will, and the possibilities and promises from Nintendo somehow still keep me hoping for a bright future. But for now, the future is made up of many of the same promises and hopes I had when the N64 and GameCube were announced. I just hope I don't end up being disappointed once again."
Zelda, Mario, Rinse, Repeat (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Zelda, Mario, Rinse, Repeat (Score:5, Insightful)
Indeed.
Plus the Nintendo war chest that dates back from the NES era (remember kids: nintendo has never EVER lost any money, even on hardware sales, even for a quarter, even during the worst of the GameCube era) is humongous, and the DS Lite prints money after all [uncyclopedia.org].
They can afford several more gamecube-level failures, especially since gamecube-level failures still nets them profits without even the need for first-party games.
Re:Zelda, Mario, Rinse, Repeat (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't think anyone in their right mind could justify saying Nintendo is going to be in trouble (as a company) if the Wii disappoints. However, it is likely that if it doesn't sell well, and people generally don't adopt it well, that Nintendo may start to be seen as "the" handheld company, and not the "video game" company it is currently. Does that make sense? I just think it's deeper than financial. Sony's not going to fail if the PS3 fails. But it's games division, SCE, will be rocky. But Nintendo, as stated, will make a profit on each unit, ensuring Nintendo isn't going anywhere soon.
But it may not be on people's radar unless they make Wii stick with gamers.
Re:Zelda, Mario, Rinse, Repeat (Score:4, Insightful)
Whatever happens in the west, even if the Wii utterly fails, Nintendo will always be a "true contender" on the japanese market (especially with the success of the DS, Nintendo has become omnipresent there).
Nintendo won't stop making consoles anytime soon, trust me on that one.
Re:Zelda, Mario, Rinse, Repeat (Score:5, Interesting)
Oblig. Sony complaints (Score:5, Interesting)
From the designs of their products, you can see that Sony has no interest whatsoever in making products that last beyond the warranty period. Their laptops have no latch securing the screen to the lapboard of the computer. When you put a Vaio in its sales floor box, with the hinge down, it literally falls open and cannot be closed. (I've even seen the new Blu-Ray equipped Vaios do this.) All the holding power that's supposed to keep the screen and the computer together when closed is in the hinge. Bad design.
Even better, Vaio laptops have the thinnest screen enclosures on the market. The enclosure has no ridge on the outer edge (like the ones you see on most other laptops, Apples and HPs to start) that redirects pressure to the outside of the enclosure and protects the screen. Instead, all the pressure goes directly on the screen. Maybe this is why all Vaios come back from repair with a note saying, "Your Vaio is designed for maximum durability. However, please refrain from putting pressure on the screen enclosure."
Sony cameras are probably worse. From their Handycams, that look and operate like relics from the late 90s but retail at futuristic prices, to their CyberShot cameras with touch screens on the back. One model has nothing but a power button and shutter on top and a touch screen covering the entire back of the camera, which controls everything else. It makes me wonder if Sony has an entire department dedicated to Putting Large LCDS on Things That Go In Pockets. Oh yes, and the batteries are proprietary, too.
Sony isn't doing too badly in audio equipment--their stuff seems to be on par with everyone elses. And their optical drives are decent but you wont see one in any non-Sony OEM machines. Not to mention their drives are more expensive.
For almost every technology thing you can name, Sony makes a souped-up, talked-up, marked-up version of their own. 99% of the time, it's just not worth the extra money.
Not selling at a loss != profit (Score:3, Interesting)
But Nintendo, as stated, will make a profit on each unit
This is a misconception. Just because the console isn't sold at a loss doesn't mean that Nintendo will "make a profit" on each unit.
Sure, each unit sold makes a positive contribution to the financials of the Wii project, but in order to determine whether Nintendo makes a profit on the console, you must factor in R&D, marketing, and a number of other support expenses. The amount of money that Nintendo brings in on each console (and accessories
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The HARDWARE costs nets them a profit, they still have R&D costs though.
Re:Zelda, Mario, Rinse, Repeat (Score:5, Insightful)
Right, right. So they have to do well enough to recoup their R&D cost. The reason why having a for-profit hardware console is important is that it means the very first sale of their console starts paying off that R&D cost. This is why they were able to make all their money back and them some despite the "failure" that was the Gamecube. If they had tried selling their console at a loss, like Microsoft, then they would most likely have ended up losing money overall, again like Microsoft.
Instead, they made money. And that was on what was possibly the least exciting most "me-too" Nintendo console ever.
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If you're going to say something is an urban legend, I'd at least expect a snopes link to support that.
But I'd believe the GC lost money overall and it was made up for with GB sales.
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But, of course, at this point we really have no idea how good this new controller is going to be for playing games. If it ends up being used for a couple of gimmicky features and otherwise a standard-style controller would suffice, then I'd say that $60 is far too much.
It looks as though the Wii is going to live or die based on how well the new controller works. If it turns out to be everything the hype is claiming, then you're right and nobody will mind paying for it. But otherwise, that price is going
Re:Zelda, Mario, Rinse, Repeat (Score:4, Insightful)
But I've played around with it, in house, and I'm absolutely convinced that once developers start getting creative with it, watch out.
There is a pattern emergin in many upcoming Wii games. I'm not sure if other people have noticed, but from a game design standpoint, a lot of games are focused on 'mini games'. Those familiar with the Warioware brand or the Monkey Ball brand I'm sure are aware of the term, but a startling number of games coming out for the Wii make minigames the core focus. And there is a reason. These games a comparitively low budget (development wise) exercises in order to find out what makes using the controller fun. I am pretty convinced that after the first round, or possibly second round, some game will come around that makes people smack their foreheads, going, "I never knew my favorite kind of game was more fun using this type of controller."
A lot of work has to be done on the developer side to filter input from the controller, and to tune how to interpret the results of the accelerometers and the pointing device SDKs. Once that initial round of solidifying up your in-house Wii input library happens, I'm pretty convinced we'll start to see games that make you wonder why dual analogue is the defacto standard. Everytime I've played one of the Wii projects at work under development, I've resolved that I'm not even going to risk it; the Wii is getting pre-ordered the day Futureshop starts accepting them.
Based on the surprise Splinter Cell announcement, and a few other late announcements, I think some game designers have realized that one analog and one pointer is better than two analogs.
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On the NES, SNES and N64 Mario and Zelda games where awesome, however that time is long long ago. MarioSunshine and Zelda WindWaker on the Gamecube disapointed for most part. So did NewSuperMarioBros on the DS. Sure, none of those games where horrbile, but they where far away from the legendary status that those fran
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There has only been one Zelda game and one Mario game since then. One game is not "long long ago".
Windwaker was good, though not quite up to the standard of the N64 games. I never played Mario Sunshine, so I can't comment on it as a follow up to Mario World (or was it called Mario 64, I forget?).
New SMB, however, was great fun! It's a retro-esque game, though, deliberately designed to be a succesor to the NES/
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If you think NSMB is nothing more than the original Mario Bros. games with prettier graphics, then the only conclusion I can draw is that you didn't play it for more than five minutes. The basic action might be old-school Mario run-and-jump, but the level designs, new powerups, and depth of gameplay (try getting all the star coins if you really want to prove your platformer chops) makes it great
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Yeah, I'm gonna have to echo a strong dissagreement with you on those. The only game that pretty much, universally, dissapointed was Super Mario Sunshine. New Super Mario Bros was a smash hit, much bigger than even expected, with gamers thoroughly satisfied and rivitted by it's attention to keeping true to the original series, while adding more modern features. Zelda - Wind Waker, is a staple, noone's going to call that anything close to a failour or dissapointment. Certainly, everyone had some issues with
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Still waiting for an all new Pixar rendered CGI Mickey Mouse motion picture... ;)
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Will it run Linux? (Score:2)
Imagine a game called Beowulf for it....
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Opinion of article.... (Score:5, Insightful)
"Nintendo reported that as of June 30, 2006 they have sold a total of 21.00 million Nintendo GameCube units worldwide."
"With 32.93 million Nintendo 64 units sold worldwide..."
They're not #1, but they are certainly a strong (read: profitable) second-place contender. I wonder what these flops are?
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Re:Opinion of article.... (Score:5, Informative)
Nintendo was actually 3rd place worldwide on the last generation... in unit sales (Microsoft shipped 24 million xbox)
Of course, Nintendo trounced MS in Japan and got a damn huge lot of profits out of the gamecube era (hint: you're nearly the only game publisher for a 20million user base. Ohhh look, every single release gets a million sales!) while Microsoft lost $2billion in the process. But on shipped units count, they lost.
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So, even though their home console sold the least, they were the clear winners of the last generation with regards to profit. And I agree with your statement about their lack of 3rd party support.
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How many XBox are actually sold out of that shipped number?
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Microsoft only reports shipped numbers, Nintendo only reports sold numbers. As of the release of the Xbox 360, Microsoft has stopped shipping original Xboxen. That shipped number will never increase. Nintendo, on the other hand, still ships the Gamecube, because the Wii has not shipped yet. They continual to outsell the original Xbox by 1000 to 1 in every region (and until March of this year, w
Re:Opinion of article.... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Read the complete article [gameinformer.com]. Billy Berghammer fairly clearly defines what he means as a flop: third-party developer support never really materialized.
If you read through the article, it's fairly clear that he's a Nintendo fanboi. His concerns are essentially that the Wii will fail to gain developer support, and essentially float by on only Nintendo games.
With the new control scheme, there's a very real risk that third-party developer support will never materialize and the Wii will suffer the GameCube's
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- No need for buying special cables.
- No need for buying a special TV.
- No need to share special TV with dad on Sunday afternoon (for there
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And any console shortage is temporary. 360s were so rare for a while it was laughable. Now my local walmart has them everywhere. The same will be true of the PS3. There will be a shorta
huh? (Score:2, Funny)
Says who? Oh, someone on the internet. So it MUST be true.
Bad style! [beep! beep!] (Score:2, Funny)
Alert, alert! They call it "THE Wii" when the Nintendo Wii style guide explicitly says to call it just plain "Wii". Deploy the style sentinel drones of doom!
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So the real news here is... (Score:4, Insightful)
Only time will tell, but it's very interesting that this all places quite a bit on Microsoft's side, as they are going to be regarded as the "established" player in the market, come Christmastime, and with a well timed and measured price cut, they could be looking at a very good situation over there...
I personally (and here's the fanboy side) hope the Wii does well. Even if it's not all we hoped, it's still someone trying to innovate in a market crowded with sequels, little improvements from generation to generation, and I hope they are rewarded for it. I think it will do much better than say, the Dreamcast. But, overall, it's going to be an interesting year from here on out to see where the consumer speaks with their wallets...
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Uh... what? So basically, losing $2b on each generation of your console and not being able to get any decent foothold in japan is "a stable place" now?
God, and there I thought that earning money meant you were in a stable position. The times, they are a-changing.
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If Wii doesn't sell well, and for argument's sake, neither does the PS3, who stands to benefit in the minds (and living rooms) of the world? Microsoft.
Again, that is not to say Nintendo won't make more money (because truthfully, Nintendo will hedge everything very well as they always have, with a great business-savvy, and be fine).
Just to
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Having to prove itself all over again is the position Nintendo's been in since the (relative) failure of the N64 and the successes of the PS and PS2.
For Nintendo, this generation is more of the same, they're the challenger and they want to get back to the SNES era.
My point is that Microsoft may look goo
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Microsoft is trying to build a brand with gamers for the express purpose of making a profit. They knew up front that xbox 1 was going to be a net loss in the end, but what they were buying was mind/market-share. That was true for xbox 1, but you can be sure that they're going to do everything they can with the 360 to
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Sure, Microsoft is going to try to make money. It isn't clear to me that they actually expect to make
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You make a sound case that if Wii & PS3 don't sell well then MS would have to win. Here is somethi
Re:So the real news here is... (Score:4, Insightful)
At least until they grow up, move out of their parents' home, get a job, get some responsibilities, get a wife and kids of their own. Then we'll see how much time they have left for Microsoft's hard-core gaming vs. Nintendo's pick-up-and-play casual nature...
The real winner for this generation is... (Score:5, Funny)
IBM: Alright, we seem to be falling a little behind on our high end chipsets, and we need to develop something new and spazzy. Hm... phone rings
Sony: Hey IBM! Were starting to develop a new console and were interested in developing a new chipset for it.
IBM: I know JUST what you need. You want the biggest baddest most powerful chip ever created. You want more power, speed, and flexibility than anything seen before. I'm telling you, 8 cores! Eight!
Sony: Power hm.... I don't..
IBM: cutting in This will be the fastest chip in the world! Your box will be more powerful than a supercomputer! How can you say no to that!
Sony: Hm... Ok were sold. We'll send our guys over to work out the details hangs up
IBM: Alright! That problem solved (idiots). Hm... Maybe Microsoft will be interested in something similar. Calls MicrosoftYo Bill!
Microsoft: Hey wazzup!
IBM: Well... I'm not supposed to tell you this but... let me let you in on a little secret about what Sony is up to...
A minute later
Microsoft: Hm... it sounds a little expensive, but we've gotta match them in power. Hm... maybe if we got our system out waay ahead of them.... How about we help develop an earlier version of your super processor, and we'll say that you really don't need a supercomputer to run games. That works. Alright deal.
IBM: Alright! I'll talk to ya later! Hangs up
IBM: I wonder what my pool would look like full of Benjamins. Man I can't believe those dupes agreed to bankroll our superchip. Now... it seems like our high end embedded processor could use a boost. Now what idiot will pay for the fastest and most energy efficient chip ever created.... Well now those guys at Nintendo might actually do it. Yea... They'll jump right on it, just as soon as they see the cost estimate for Sony and Microsoft... hehe.
IBM dials the phone
IBM: Yo Shiggy! Have I got a deal for you! I'm not really supposed to tell you this but... Sony and Microsoft are in the works to develop the most powerful chip ever created. Why don't you take a look at the materials here... emails Nintendo a set of documents. The cost estimates is very prominantly displayed throughout the documents
Nintendo: Hm... That's pretty impressive. But I don't think we can do that. It is awefully expensive....
IBM: That's no problem! In fact, I had something else in mind for you! Here let me send it over. This set of emails contains documentation on a chipset based on previous technology, but still very advanced. The word 'savings' can be seen repeatedly throughout the documentation
Nintendo: Wow! This is just what we wanted! Its perfect! Those fools at Sony will never know what hit them (hehe what a waste of money). Hangs up
IBM: Hehe... heh... dials on the phone Hey Bob and Sons construction? Yea hey! Yea the pool is awesome. In fact, that's why I called... No no, nothing's wrong with it, in fact... I want to expand it. Yea... Olimpic sized doable? Great.
Look at sales of the DS (Score:5, Insightful)
Plus, BECUASE the DS has become so popular, I think that people will be a lot more willing to give the Wii a chance.
Obviously only time can tell, but I think the DS's success is very important to the Wii...
Re:Look at sales of the DS (Score:4, Informative)
I also believe that DS sales are going to really help the adoption rate of the Wii. People didn't take the DS seriously at first, and now, they're flying off the shelves. I think that people are seeing that Nintendo is not just being innovative to be wierd (okay, not ALL the time, at least), but really trying to push what we consider regular gameplay to be.
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I agree with that, certainly. I do think that Nintendo Wi-Fi has boosted the DS significantly, and I find it alarming that we aren't going to see any online-capable titles on Wii until 2007. The 360 is all about Live, which is doing really well for MS, even though they're really using Live as a giant profit machine. You get your 360 and your headset and hook up the ethernet cable and you're good to go. Built-in WiFi on Wii is a good move - it keeps you down to just the power and A/V cables because of the wi
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EA certainly didn't expect it, only a month ago /. posted a story about EA complaining to Sony about the failure of the PSP (and probably their wasted development).
I don't think the size of the DS' success was as much of a suprise as the fact that they were able to find a new market for consoles (if only portables). I dont think Dr Kawashima's Brain Training, has been given enough recognition f
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Further, it's not whether or not Nintendo "needs" to sell the Wii at a profit. It's about whether they "can" sell the Wii at a profit. If, for example, Microsoft's production costs for the Xbox 360 wer
Same Arguments as DS had (Score:5, Insightful)
That doesn't guarantee success by any means. There's just a lot of positive angles that the author was ignoring.
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The Gameboy was competing against the Sega game-gear in the 90s, and despite the obvious superiority of the game gear (colour screen etc), the gameboy still sold much better.
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Hah, for a second there, I thought you were talking about the PSP...
Re:Same Arguments as DS had (Score:4, Insightful)
No, not really. Remember when the PSP was coming out how everyone was oo-ing and aah-ing the 'technologicaly impressive' PSP? I remember it well, mostly because I was one of the those posting replies to posts like yours, that stated Nintendo has had it and that those two screens, mic and touch screen were all gimics, especially when compared to the PSP which is 'more powerfull than the PS1'. Of course all I could say at the time was 'think of the possibilities!'. Now it's more or less a done deal and pretty much everyone accepts that the DS was a good idea. At least I haven't heard anyone call any of the DSs features a gimic in a while now.
The controller is more impressive than two screen, a touch screen and a mic if you ask me.
Backwards? I doubt it. It's specs might not look as impressive as it's rivals, but numbers aren't what define technology. For instance, from what I hear, it's power consumption is pretty minimal. This means very little heat and smaller compact device. In those respects it's light-years ahead of it's rivals.
As for price, in Japan it's half-price of it's only rival. 250,000 compared to 600,000. I'd call that an advantage.
In the rest of the world it's cheaper than the cut-down version of the Xbox and includes a game. That is also what I'd call a price advantage. Don't forget those are release prices, I suspect the difference will grow further into the cycle.
Yes, the other consoles are a bit big aren't they...
Looked at Nintendo's software sales recently? I'd say they've done pretty well for themselves. Considering they are one of histories most successful game makers ( and a lot of those games were post-snes), I say that thier catalog was worth quite a bit.
Re:Same Arguments as DS had (Score:5, Interesting)
My youngest is out at his friends, he has played them all, XBox 360, Xbox, PS2, Gamecube, and N64. For playability, he likes the N64 the best.
For the first time in my life, I am very tempted to put a game console under the chrismas tree. That would end up being a Wii as a family gift and a game for each of the kids.
I am sure many less tech savy folks than me will go, "Oh, I know my kid has their heart set on an XBox360, but at $400.00, I can get this $250.00 Nintendo system, buy some games for it, and still come out with an Xbox 360. I am sure the kids will like the Wii."
We'll know about abject failure pretty quickly (Score:4, Insightful)
Just wait for the reviews about two weeks after the Wii has been released to the reviewers, after the novelty has had time to wear off and there's a better sense of whether the games are actually fun, or if the controller is just a useless gimmick.
Right now, probably nobody really knows. The game devs and their testers are too close to the game to know whether it is any actual fun, and almost all of our reviewers have at most a few hours experience, all in the same day.
I think we'll only know it's an abject failure if the controller simply becomes tiresome, or hard to use, or to sum it up "no fun" with real use.
Otherwise, I'd expect the first Wii generation to look like the first DS generation, for the same basic reasons, and again for the same reasons, if you tried to determine the success of the DS based on that first generation you'd have been way off.
Anyhow, of all the times to be worrying about whether the Wii is going to fail, this is really the silliest, when we're this close to release. Just wait and see.
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The DS sold well at launch and was hard to find, even though there weren't that many great games available for it for a while. It was only months later, when better games started coming out, that the system really gained momentum. And then the DS lite made things even crazier.
The Wii might be a smash hit right out
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The word "abject" wasn't tossed in to my phrase "abject failure" to show my vocabulary; it's an essential part of my point. Dreamcast-failure takes months or years to show. Virtual-boy failure, another abject failure, takes days for the hype to go from stellar to hellish, once people actually get their hands on the system for real and the hype fades like morning mist in the
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Portables? Innovative games? Japan? (Score:2)
In the hardware department, Nintendo has been the king of portables for a long time. And Nintendo seems like it'll always have Japan... Microsoft is (and should be) trying hard to break into Japan, but Nintendo is still a very firm #2 there.
In the software department, Nintendo's first-party titles have routinely done very well.
Nintendo also has somewhat of a niche in coming up with interesting control schemes... maybe they'd have less flexibility with this if they ever left the hardware market. But
Doom and gloom (Score:4, Insightful)
Personally, I'm unconvinced. IMHO, the Gamecube failed due to two points. It was underpowered compared to the XBox and the PS2, but yet didn't have enough innovative features to really differentiate itself from the competition. And, secondly, there weren't all that many games for it. The N64, too, suffered from this.
With the Wii, Nintendo has already taken care of those points upfront. Not only are we going to have tons of classic games from older consoles, a lot of vendors have also already pledged support for the Wii.
And as for being underpowered, well, yes, the Wii isn't as powerful as the XBox360 and the PS3, but the sheer freshness of its gameplay and its innovative games should more than make up for it. Especially since the Wii is being marketed as the "console for everyone". If Nintendo's strategy works, a lot of people who wouldn't otherwise have bought a console will buy a Wii, and they won't care about sheer raw power. And neither will Nintendo fanboys.
So I don't see why the Wii should suffer from the same problems as the N64 and the Gamecube.
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Personally, I'm unconvinced. IMHO, the Gamecube failed due to two points.
Ummm, so selling slightly fewer units than the Xbox and making money is a failure, while shipping slightly more and losing money is a success? I find your inherent statement that the Gamecube was a failure a little unreal... and I've never owned one.
So I don't see why the Wii should suffer from the same problems as the N64 and the Gamecube.
I certainly hope it suffers from the same widespread adoption and profit problems. I'm a v
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The Gamecube might not have failed to make Nintendo money, but it did fail to capture the interest of third party companies. If the console is treated as if it doesn't even exist by some third parties than you can tell that something has to be wrong. And speak
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It's certainly not *my* inherent statement.
You wrote "the Gamecube failed because..." That certainly does include the inherent statement that the Gamecube did fail and you were the one who wrote it, whatever your intention.
I was merely going along with the tone of the article, which suggested that the N64 and the GC had failed because they were picked up by relatively few gamers.
I'm not sure just being agreeable is a valid justification. If you disagreed with that point in the article, you should hav
Re: PS2 was Weakest... (Score:5, Insightful)
Incorrect. The PS2 was the least powerful contender this time around (after the Dreamcast dropped out fo course) The only thing the GC didn't have hardware wise over the PS2 was disk capacity, since they went with mini DVDs, and not DVD9's. For a good comparison of capable graphics, play RE4 for each.
I don't understand the 'Graphics Arms Race' much as The PS2 was technically inferior to both the GC, and X-box yet the PS2 had the largest user base. The PS1 was inferior to the N64 (except for disk / cartrige capacity) yet the PS1 sold more. The DS is weaker than the PSP, yet is sells more. The Gameboy was weaker than all competitors, but crushed the competition.
Clearly 'power' =/= greater sales. There is more to it than that.
Failure (Score:5, Interesting)
I agree it would be a terrible thing for the industry if the console were to fail, but it would be OK with me.
I had an N64 and it was my favorite console of that generation by far. Some people say it "failed" because it didn't put The Big N back on top. I really enjoyed the thing, and I'm glad I bought it.
I have a 'Cube and many people say it failed (or is close). I've bought FAR more games for the 'cube than my XBox and PS2. It was a great little system. I don't regret buying it at all.
If the Wii fails, so what. I can afford to lose $250 on a console that that will only have a bunch of great games during it's life (Marios, Zeldas, Pikmins, Smash Brothers, etc.). That's OK with me. It will be sad, but I'll still love the games.
Let's not forget that even if Nintendo's grand experiment fails (the controller) everyone could always use the "classic" controller for the rest of the console's life-span (not unlike the NES Zapper was basically forgotten about). The Wiimote can still be used for fun with light-gun games (and is worth it for me for that fact alone).
The PS3 is $600. I'm not buying that until I'm dead sure there are tons of games I want for it. Even with the price drop that will have to happen by the time I buy it.
The 360 is $400. It's not as worrying as the PS3 but that's still a fair amount of money.
The Wii is $250, and worse case scenerio I can use it as a replacement 'Cube and have a few new fun games.
The Wii may "fail" because it doesn't take over the industry or ends up in 3rd place, but I bet I'll still love it anyway.
All that said, who do we think... objectivly... is the most likely to fail? The cheap one with the "gimmick", the expensive one that is more of the same, or the obscenely expensive one that currently seems like more of the same?
Lateral thinking (Score:2)
Failure? What Failure? (Score:2)
I thought that making money was how you win? In that case Nintendo has a winner with the GC.
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So does every Microsoft Windows release, however from a consumer point of view I still would call it a failure. In short I don't really consider it that important that the companie makes money, its of course a good thing when it does, since it means healthy business, but it might also mean that the consumer is getting ripped of.
With Gamecube its of course different, but I would consider that as a failure as well, since it simply didn't delivered what I had h
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Your license to judge the relative success of anything has been revoked.
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Someone always posts that. It's idiotic. You have buy a memory card ($40) or a hard drive($100), plus XBox Live ($50). That is $390 to $450 depending on which way you go for storage. That also doesn't include things like the wireless controller (which the Wii comes with) for comparison, or the price of games (the Wii comes with a game, the 360 doens't), etc.
You can not buy a usable XBox 360 for $300.
oh .. but we will have them! (Score:2)
There are so many people out there that love to buy the new Madden release or the latest Final Fantasy sequel that it's difficult to believe that Nintendo can change their mind or be a success without them.
Ummm
Madden is coming to the Wii. And in fact, will probably be the first (American) football game I buy since like '98. After reading that developer interview [ign.com] over at I
Oh noes, the sky is falling! (Score:2)
Yeah, if the Wii fails, who's going to make interesting games like Katamari Damacy and Shadow of the Colossus?
Oh, wait.
Rob
Re:Oh noes, the sky is falling! (Score:4, Funny)
Oh, wait.
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$60 unreasonable price for controller? (Score:5, Insightful)
Failure of Nintendo predicted for over a decade. (Score:3, Insightful)
Nintendo is still around making consoles after all this time. Maybe because they know how to make a profit without having to necessarily be the top-seller.
the controller has me worried (Score:2)
Re:the controller has me worried (Score:4, Interesting)
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well.. (Score:2)
If you want something to succeed, you need to be a part of it. It's a little bit of the chicken-and-the-egg, but if you really think about it, 3rd party support isn't going to happen unless there's a market. The market will come if people believe in this console, and believe me, I haven't been so excited about a gaming system since I got my TurboGrafx 16... I'm sure I'm not the only one.
Step
nintendo is more profitable (Score:2)
Question (Score:2)
Enormous pressure due to fanboi hype (Score:4, Insightful)
I want the Wii to succeed, but I don't like to be told by fanbois that it will (or "wii-ll") succeed, without them or myself even having tried out the console ourselves. I still have a lot of doubts, such as how sensitive the control will be, whether or not I'll get tired after a period of time, how long it takes me to adjust to, and more importantly, just how much "more fun" Wii games are, versus titles on other platforms.
I think it's healthy to be skeptical, but it seems like everyone brings up these valid points, a Nintendo fanboi shoots them down, saying that it's not going to be a problem, bashing all the other consoles, and claiming that Nintendo games have a monopoly on fun games. Puh-lease! This is starting a very dangerous precedent.
Don't get me wrong, I like what Nintendo is doing with the Wii, and I will get one this year. But you Nintendo fanbois need to back down a bit and let people have their doubts. Like or not, we're all going to get the real story once the dang thing ships.
single controller is a mistake (Score:4, Insightful)
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They leave the store having spent 250 + taxes, but...
They'll be back... and they'll bring more money! Yay!
Even if it dies, it will live on within our hearts (Score:2)
Whether or not the Wii succeeds is not the point in the long run; the Wii is going to have a massive impact on Gen 8 and beyond, regardless.
Because of this new interface and these "gimmicky" controls, people are going to realize that we've been using basically the same pad we have been since the NES, only with more buttons and joysticks. The Wiimote is an almost radical redesign of what gaming input is, and it's going to create one hell of a wave. We can already see the tide rising a
Wi + $60 = Wii (Score:4, Insightful)
As more and more details appeared, my excitement level dropped rapidly. I'm a jaded reviewer so my excitement level generally peaks at a 3 or 4, and the Wii had me at a 5 or a 6 which is pretty rare. Then to find the console will be $249 (and Nintendo then has the nerve to hype the fact that they are making profit on each Wii) and come with just one controller. Wi + $60 = Wii. Bringing the total to $310. Then for families and those who bought into the four player experience hype, we have $430.
The launch lineup isn't spectacular, and the control of Zelda and Red Steel have both been constant issues and received multiple redesigns *after* the games were well on their way to completion... not a good thing, especially when a 1st-party title can't get it right. In addition the sensor bar is small but still a drag.
Nintendo is resting way too much on the success of the DS and I think they may be in for a surprise. There haven't been any great DS releases in some time, with many of the top rated games being launch titles or pretty close to it. I think the Wii will sell out of its stock for Christmas and the next couple shipments but I think it will then taper off. Mario Galaxy doesn't do it for me personally and while it will help pick up sales down the road there isn't a whole lot on the radar still.
I still hope it does well because I think Sony and MS need to learn a bit of a lesson and bring gaming back around from a pure money-making venture into a *fun* and diverse money-making venture, instead of the next gangsta-simulator, racing, FPS now with 20% more polygons!!!!
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Microsoft did some big backpedaling before its launch too and they got beat down for it, Nintendo is not immune to it either. No matter how much you like a company, their product, or their decisions, they are not infallable. They can make mistakes and bad decisions. IMO they have here.
Anyone else think of War Games? (Score:4, Interesting)
Interesting game, professor. The only way to win is not to play.
Over Reacting (Score:4, Interesting)
No, Nintendo is nowhere near being in dire straits. What planet are you from!?
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Re:It costs a Wii bit too much (Score:5, Informative)
Actually, all we know about the Wii's GPU (code name Hollywood) and CPU (code name broadway) is that they're custom built processors manufactured using a 90nm SOI CMOS process; the process is the same process which was used on the PowePC 970 processors (the G5) which came in single and dual core configurations and ran between 1.5GHz and 2.5GHz. We have heard from ATI that the graphics demonstrated at E3 were just "The tip of the iceburg".
Recently, in an interview with UBIsoft about RedSteel, it was reported that UBIsoft did not recieve Wii hardware until 2 months before E3 and they did not have time to complete the artistic upgrades before the demo had to be ready for testing (most developers require 4-6 weeks of testing a demo prior to E3); this meant that the E3 demo was more representative of what was running on Gamecube hardware than what the Wii can do. Now, I'm not arguing that the Wii is a technological marvel but it is not incapable of adequate graphics ( http://media.wii.ign.com/media/821/821973/img_391
The one thing I will say about your "under 800MHz remark" is that I know for a fact that EBgames was publishing the fake IGN specs and received a nice visit from Nintendo's laywer; now they publish the same specs Nintendo does. Matt from IGN was either lying or believed a lie.
Re:It costs a Wii bit too much (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't know how you figure that out. Unlike the Xbox versus Xbox 360 you can directly compare the performance/power of the Wii against the Game Cube. The GC was only barely less powerful than the Xbox and certainly more powerful than the PS2. The Wii is pretty much a GC with 3x the clock speed on both CPU and graphics while being fully backwards compatible so it will be able to perfectly play GC games many of which are very good so there is a large library of available games to buy and be reissued.
No-one is going to argue that the raw compute power of the Wii is pretty far behind the 360 and PS3 but it really doesn't matter if none of the games really do much new. The 360 and PS3 are nothing but the evolution of the NES, nothing new, just more power. Nintendo defined the current controller structure and the Wii redefines it.
Judging by the number of people queuing up to pre-order the Wii this last weekend I think it is going to be very successful.
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So the 1.5 GHz Pentium 4 MP that was (said to be) about as powerful as the Pentum 4 3GHz was only 1.5 times as powerful as my Pentium 3 1GHz? What about the Pentium 4 Duo, since it runs at the same speeds that Pentium 4s ran at in 2002 it is no more powerful than that?
The fact is that modern CPU cores are getting 4 or 5 times the performance per cycle that they got on older
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