Taking Bully Seriously?

simoniker writes "There's been plenty of controversy about Rockstar's PS2 title Bully, but does it actually have anything to teach players? Ian Bogost looks into whether the game actually has a social message, explaining: 'Taking Bully seriously means acknowledging that the game has something to say about the world, not just that the world has something to say about it. It means assessing how effectively the game tackles the topic of bullying and how meaningful its claims about it are.' His conclusion? 'Sweeping away all the dust that Bully left in the wake of its release, it's hard to defend the game, not because it might be a pubic nuisance or a danger to kids, but because it could have been so much more of a scathing critique of high school social politics than it turned out to be.'"

Scathing Critique?

[denebian devil (944045)]

I don't know about the rest of you, but when I play a video game, I don't want a "scathing critique of high school social politics," or anything else for that matter. I want something that entertains and engages me. Whatever happened to fun for fun's sake?!?

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[Rachel Lucid (964267)]

Who grinds on WoW because it's fun? We do it because we don't want to do REAL work!

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[OakDragon (885217)]

Agreed. How about a game where I scream "NERDS!" and kick them in the shins? Now that's lawsuit bait!

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[KiahZero (610862)]

It's the gaming equivalent of literary criticism. In other words, the author is analyzing this as art. "Fun for fun's sake" isn't sufficient to make a truly artistic game, just like it's not enough to turn your typical trashy romance novel into a work of art.

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[geekster (87252)]

I don't have a single preference for playing games. I'm all for playing a game "for fun's sake". But at the same time I don't mind playing a game, or more likely, watching a movie with some social critique. To sum it up, it's not all or nothing. I'm getting kinda tired of his attitude.

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[geekster (87252)]

"this attitude" sorry. Nothing personal.

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[aafiske (243836)]

South Park, the Simpsons, etc. are entertaining to watch and make meaningful social commentary. Why does saying 'you know, sometimes extra levels of meaning can make a thing more enjoyable' encounter such resistance?

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[MobileTatsu-NJG (946591)]

"I don't know about the rest of you, but when I play a video game, I don't want a "scathing critique of high school social politics," or anything else for that matter. I want something that entertains and engages me. Whatever happened to fun for fun's sake?!?"

Do you watch South Park?

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[MrHanky (141717)]

Ah, Slashdot at its finest: +5, insightful for a comment that basically states that it only wants mindless entertainment.

Meanwhile, back in the real world, we have games being attacked by idiot lawyers, and some people trying to defend the games on the basis of freedom of speech. I'd rather take the social criticism angle than the "But you honor, beating up kids in school entertains and engages me! Whatever happened to fun for fun's sake?!?" defense. And further, girl, this article is probably not about you

public?

[spectral (158121)]

hehe he said pubic.

Yes it could be a social commentary.

[kinglink (195330)]

Even as a game we can have an interesting social commentary in it. But in the end, games are about having fun, and Rockstar isn't known for their social commentary, they are known for open world game play.

I do agree Rockstar can use better writers, their characters aren't exactly inspired (unless inspired means "We just used Tony Montana and gave him a little Ray Liotta acting") So them trying to give a social commentary would be like monkeys acting out shakespeare. You won't get the point, but it could

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[kinglink (195330)]

My point is he's asking the WRONG company to do it. MGS has commentary on many topics since the begining, You can read in social commentary on many games even if it's not there. But just like we have something deep in some games doesn't mean we can't have an action game, and bully never looked like it was going to be anything like what they are advocating.

Rockstar is the wrong company to start this type of game because as it is most regulators arn't going to take them serious even if they try to be, they

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[aafiske (243836)]

Yeah, because the sarcastic, humorous, and vulgar South Park never attempts to make biting social commentary or anything. It'd be stupid if it tried.

Er...

I'm looking forward to playing it...

[meringuoid (568297)]

... not because I expect a fully realized system of high-school popularity politics, but because I want to play Skool Daze 2006 in glorious 3D. So far as I've heard the setting is very much a Beano Annual kind of thing. Elements of Winker Watson, elements of the Bash Street Kids. All done with a GTA engine. Sounds fantastic.

Pubic nuisance?

[JFMulder (59706)]

not because it might be a pubic nuisance or a danger to kids

Does the game come with a STD or what?

Concentration Camp Tycoon

[Supurcell (834022)]

I want someone to make a Concentration Camp game where you play the Nazis and see if it causes a ruckes near as big as a game about schoolyard bullies.

Match the cards and solve the rebus

[tepples (727027)]

I want someone to make a Concentration Camp game where you play the Nazis

And if you can match the cards and solve the rebus [wikipedia.org] before the Jews, you get to go through with the Fuehrer's final solution, right?

It may have nothing to say, but

[grapeape (137008)]

It may have nothing to say, but its still every picked on geeks dream come true. I can imagine many a young geek will be taking out his frustration with this. If I had this option when I was kid it would have avoided many poundings as I tried and often failed to stick up for myself.

What's the big deal?

[Thumper_SVX (239525)]

I mean, seriously. I remember playing this game years ago! [wikipedia.org]

Has this one just become a big deal because the Spectrum couldn't handle full motion 3D graphics? Bully seems to be just a logical evolution of Skool Daze, a game that's over 20 years old now but was great in its time (and I played it recently on a Spectrum emulator and enjoyed the hell out of it, still!). Hell, it even had the "homosexual content" thing down where you could kiss guys, so even that's nothing new.

Having said that, I'm actually looking forward to picking this one up and playing it. I have always enjoyed Rockstar's games and I see no reason I won't enjoy this, too. I doubt it's going to turn me into a bully because (a) I'm not at school; I'm in my 30's and (b) Grand Theft Auto didn't turn me into a carjacking gun-toting villain except maybe for a few hours every few days when I got time to play it! If you seriously can't separate fact from fiction enough to play a game like Bully, then you probably shouldn't go to the movies, or watch TV... or hell read a book!

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[meringuoid (568297)]

I am sick to the back teeth of Animal Crossing: Wild World.

It's getting old for me too. I mean, how many times can you WOW, TURNIP PRICE IS LIKE 478 BELLS! WOOT! BIGGER HOUSE HERE I COME!...

Erm, as I was saying... how many times can you go digging for HOLY CRAP COOL I'VE FINISHED MY STEGOSAURUS!

No, sorry, what was it... Ah yes. I'm sick to death of that evil bloody kitsune Crazy Redd and his forged artwork. Surely there should be another way of obtaining material for the museum's gallery. That's why I

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[KermodeBear (738243)]

And Firefox's inbuilt spellchecker doesn't know 'kitsune'. Silly thing.

That is silly. It also does not know kermode. Kermode bears are awesome. At least a right click'll add 'ya. (o:

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[WilliamSChips (793741)]

Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.

DO NOT BLAS-PHEME!

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[KiahZero (610862)]

[i]Bullying happens. People messing with other people happens[/i]

Life's not fair, so I can hurt people however I want, right?

[i]Rockstar's job in developing Bully was to make an entertaining game, not to push some progressive agenda[/i]

Who said they were under an obligation to do so? The author of the article certainly didn't.

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[KiahZero (610862)]

I regularly post on two boards that use BBCode and one board that uses HTML (this one). If you look at my post history, you'll note that sometimes I use the appropriate tags, and sometimes I don't. In fact, in one thread (Will the U.S. Lose Control of the Internet?), I managed to use both methods... thankfully, it wasn't so bad that I went with both in the same post. What this really means is that I need to remember to use Preview rather than just submitting straight off.

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[DeadChobi (740395)]

Wait a minute, how is Bogost trying to advocate the destruction of an art form? What he's trying to say is that Bully could have been much more had they taken it seriously instead of making it like their usual fare. There's no "OMG! Hate! Burn it!" message there, and it's depressing that you saw that.