UT3 Won't Feature Cross Play Capability

Next Generation is reporting on comments from Epic's Mark Rein, who participated in an IRC chat with some members of the Unreal community recently. In the chat, Rein revealed that Unreal Tournament 3 will not feature the ability for PS3 and PC players to compete on the same servers. Said Rein, "We looked at how this would impact our ability to respond quickly to things happening at internet speed on the PC side of the equation and realized that this would not be in the best interests of our very loyal PC userbase because we would constantly be holding on to updates to wait until they passed cert on the console platform. Our PC fanbase is of ultimate importance to us. They are our bread and butter. We can't let them down or compromise their experience in any way to accommodate cross platform play."

What?!?

So, does this mean that they don't "have a lengthy certification process" for PC patches? What is the real problem anyway? If they need feature and update parity between PC and console versions, then just keep doing what they already do: don't let systems with different versions play each other, but if users (Xbox360, PS3 and PC) have the same version, then let them play! Also, they plan [linux-gamers.net] a linux client version. Will linux users not be able to play against PC users either?

The proposed brick wall between the different platform users would make this a pointless purchase for me because I would want to play against some friends that use consoles. I wonder if this would also mixed prevent lan play?

Re:What?!?

PC patches don't require Sony's blessing-- that's the deal with it.

Re:What?!?

OK, I've been following the UT3 development as closely as I can since UT 2004 came out. Now Let me summarize what I've read/heard/watched on several interviews and blogs (with Epic Employees.)

• Cross platform play is dropped for above stated reason. It works fine in the development lab but Sony must "bless" the patch before release and for the PC once it passes Epics testing it's good.
• 360 is delayed because of limitations of XBOX Live. On PC and PS3 custom maps can be downloaded from the host server. 360 only allows downloads from Live download servers, so it needs Microsoft's "blessing"
• Dedicated servers for PS3 will run on any standard PC, so you can host the server on a PC for your friends to play on even if you're PS3 is off. (this should also be true for 360, but was not commented on)
• The requirements for PC and PS3 dedicated servers has not increased much since UT2Kx, but the map textures and meshes have more detail so more RAM is recommended
• PS3 version of UT3 will support Keyboard and mouse. (I've not heard about 360 version support)
• I repeat. Cross platform play works in the dev lab so It's due to patch certifications that they are not allowing it.

That said, Epic has a history of listening to the community, raise a stink on the forums and they may add it in a patch. Also If you post about the different version restrictions, it's similar to UT2Kx where if I'm running a certain version server, and you have a different client we can't connect, so It is a valid idea.

If microsoft Live servers weren't so restricted all 3 platforms would launch at the same time. If you're a console gamer and want to make maps, then you will need to buy the PC version as well as your console version. IIRC you will be able to browse UT3 download sites for maps to directly on the PS3, but I may be wrong on that part.

Re:What?!?

I thought it was more widely known that the PS3 version will support keyboard and mouse [ign.com] play. One of the reasons I finally bought a console for gaming.

Re:What?!?

I think you'll be surprised. There's a generation of kids out there who pull off headshots every time using just the analog stick on high sensitivity. And analog sticks beat WASD for movement every time. Obviously some kind of hybrid controller is the answer (and there is one for the PS3, though the name escapes me)

Well, the problem is also

That console owners wouldn't have much fun getting owned by people that are playing with kb/mouse - so it also makes sense.

On the other hand, :(

Re:Well, the problem is also

See, I was hoping for some epic battles between the Halo-obsessed frat-boy types on consoles vs. the diehard PC gamer types with the kb/mouse. I would be among the PC crowd bringing down some fire and brimstone upon the console twits.

It was going to be like a flamewar, only with guns.

Damn you, Epic! Damn you! (shakes fist)

Good

Honestly, it's not fun to play against mouse users with a controller. I prefer controller FPS's, since aiming is more of a challenge and I feel strategy comes into play more than point-click.

Controller

Also worth thinking about is that responsiveness with a mouse keyboard is far greater than with a game pad. This would give anyone using a PC a definite advantage over console players.

I seem to remember hearing that when they ported Halo to the PC they had to take out a delay the enemies had in firing so it would be more challenging.

Console vs PC = bad idea for developers

The first time a group of fairly talented console players meet up with a group of fairly talented PC players in a first-person shooter, the limitations of a console controller versus the flexibility of a mouse are going to become painfully obvious.

When I played Halo on an Xbox (not a lengthy play session, admittedly), it felt like I was playing wearing mittens.

There's something to be said about having your mouse set almost fast enough for the cursor to register your pulse - because in an FPS, being able to do a quick 360 in midair in a fraction of a second is the difference between getting a kill and being a kill.

This could lead players to assume that the PC is the platform to be on, much to the detriment of console game sales and rentals.

I don't have a use for consoles - I dislike the limitations and the controllers have been horrendous since the days of the Atari 2600 and don't care much for the kind of games that consoles do better than PCs, so while I admit I might be short-changing the console side a little, that's my take.

Well...

Well, that and the fact that PC gamers would either utterly OWN console players, or they'd have to add in such an aggressive and compensatory aim-assist in the consoles that the PC players would refuse to play.

Of course, the tinfoil hatter in me speculates that the console MAKERS wouldn't have much incentive to support/encourage a product that would illustrate to their players how really crippled they are by the control systems....but that's just nuts, right?

No, no, I'm SURE it's just about them supporting their loyal fanbase and not wanting to wait for console-certification. Sure it is.

Let's not forget...

...that PS3 UT3 players are not limited to the SIXAXIS controller [kotaku.com]. So there will still be keyboard-over-controller domination.

Try to keep up, people

All the "well you wouldn't want them to compete anyways, because keyboard 0wnz controller" posters would do well to remember that keyboard/mouse support has already been confirmed for the PS3 version of UT3.

EPIC is making the right call on this...

You're all absolutely correct about mouse versus joystick for aiming and turning.

The other point to consider is that the entire Unreal series has been heavily modded by the PC gaming community...I recall nude skins and even black skins (invisible in the dark, except for the sniper bullets that fly off you), Simpsons mods, Mario Brothers mods, The Matrix mods, Aliens mods, etc.

Imagine the Republican uproar in Congress (e.g. Lieberman, McCain, et tu Clinton?) or the Florida courts (Jack Thompson) about little Johnny seeing a nude girl jumping around and shooting him while playing on his console...I say screw that. Keep the kiddies with their consoles locked in the original games and make them pay for mods using the Microsoft pay-for-download model...who cares if those clowns don't get community-based mods? EPIC is going to give us the PC version we want, with no filters or limitations, the way they always have.

Hmmmm

What Epic actually said is they're going to get the 2 code bases stable first, solve any cheating issues then work on it.

Already knew this

It was plain to see when Mark Rein gave this interview it wasn't going to be put in: http://www.joystiq.com/2007/08/03/joystiq-interviews-unreal-tournament-3s-mark-rein/ [joystiq.com] Me and a couple of friends had a chat with him literally right after he did this interview at devcon judging by that pic, he got about 10 feet before we pounced on him lol. Very friendly guy, we just walked up to him and he chatted with us for a bit despite just having done that interview and probably already answering all the dumb questions we asked him 3 minutes previous. I think his exact words were "whats the fucking point?" when someone mentioned cross platform play. The guy's right, there is basically no benefit for either group of users (xbox, pc or ps3) in being able to play the others. Why do I care if the guy I just shot / who just shot me was playing on an xbox or ps3? The pc version runs a little quicker game speed wise, ie players run / rockets fly a bit faster, and you're either going to have to slow down or speed up the game on one platform to sync with the others. Doesn't sound like a great idea to me. Lots of effort to get it working, for basically no real benefit for the end user.

The PS3 version is second grade anyway...

The PS3 version will be worse than the PC version anyway, and won't include all the maps:

http://www.jolt.co.uk/index.php?articleid=9625 [jolt.co.uk]

Epic's Mark Rein has now said maps have had to be cut from the PlayStation 3 version because the next-gen system can't handle them.

Speaking to IGN, Rein commented that the maps not in the PS3 release didn't sit well on the console "because the system didn't have the resources to produce a smooth gameplay experience."

The PS3 omgpowerhouse looks less and less powerful...

Cheats

This is a good thing for the console gamers because it means they won't have to be victims of the various cheats and hacks that the PC gamers inevitably find and exploit.

Thank god!

At first I read this as 'UT3 Won't Feature Cosplay'.

If only we could have been so lucky.

3?

UT, UT 2003, UT 2004, UT 3?? what happened there?

gears or war?

Gears of War uses the UT3 engine, or at least is based on an earlier revision.

Will GoW not have cross platform when it's released to PC? I've always suspected it wouldn't.
I have GoW for 360, and I have a lot of friends with PC's that refuse to pay for an expensive
console that I'd like to play with.

I was planning on getting UT3 for PC anyway since it's supposed to support Linux and I have a
box that's up to the task, and playing an FPS with a control pad is painful to me. (GoW seems
to have been designed with a pad in mind, so while aiming isn't as precise, I think overall
I prefer it with a pad).

Thats a shame

...because all us mouse/keyboard users would completely dominate anyone using a console controller.

This is bull@#?!

Damn, I was SO looking forward to pwning some console jockeys, too.

Fafherd and the dominator

> "We looked at how this would impact our ability to respond quickly to things happening
> at internet speed on the PC side of the equation and realized that this would not be
> in the best interests of our very loyal PC userbase because we would constantly be
> holding on to updates to wait until they passed cert on the console platform. Our PC
> fanbase is of ultimate importance to us. They are our bread and butter. We can't let
> them down or compromise their experience in any way to accommodate cross platform play."

"Also, mousers destroy controller users, and we don't want our much larger console market userbase to feel like chimpanzees."

Re:No big deal

i've heard there's a multiplayer tower-defense flash game in the making somewhere, guess this could maybe used on a console as well? ;)

Re:No big deal

The Xbox360/MS Vista game they're calling Shadowrun centers around PC and console deathmath-type game types. From what I understand, Microsoft did a large amount of testing and balancing. They did a pretty good job at it. I saw a lot of 4 on 4 matches going on at PAX with computers on one side and 360s on the other.

I still cringe at it being called Shadowrun, though. I'll have to accept that FASA's dead one of these days.

Re:No big deal

Unified online?

Final Fantasy XI