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WTO Awards Caribbean Country Right to Ignore US Copyright
Posted by
Zonk
on Thu Dec 27, 2007 01:25 PM
from the virtual-pirate-league-arrr dept.
from the virtual-pirate-league-arrr dept.
The WTO's recent ruling on Antigua's complaint against the US over the banning of online gambling resulted in a payment to the island nation much less than they asked for. It appears, though, that this payment was just part of the WTO's compensation package for Antigua/Barbuda. Via Kotaku, the Hollywood Reporter notes that the Caribbean country can now freely ignore US copyright laws - legally. This dispensation is apparently limited to some $21 million a year. "The WTO often takes decisions awarding trade compensation in cases where one nation's policies are found to break its rules. But this is only the second time the compensation lets one country violate intellectual property laws. In this case, Antigua will -- in theory -- be allowed to distribute copies of American DVDs, CDs and games and software with impunity. 'That has only been done once before and is, I believe, a very potent weapon,' Antigua's lawyer Mark Mendel said. 'I hope that the United States government will now see the wisdom in reaching some accommodation with Antigua over this dispute.'"
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Politics: WTO Rules on Internet Gambling Case 171 comments
doggod writes "The Associated Press reports today that the WTO has finally ruled on Antigua's complaint against the US over online gambling. The complaints stems from what Antigua sees as unfair trade practices relating to the US passage last year of a law that forbids banks from handling money to and from online casinos. The amount they awarded is significantly less than Antigua asked for. If you download a copyrighted song from a server in Antigua, will that be an ironclad defense that will make you invulnerable to future attacks from the RIAA?"
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yea,, (Score:4, Insightful)
Pfft... 21 Million? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Pfft... 21 Million? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Pfft... 21 Million? (Score:4, Insightful)
I think this will go the way of the wind with trade sanctions and embargoes before it is over. I think we could also expect their Internet connections and communications lines to be hit with a torpedo of some sorts.
But that wouldn't matter anyways, WIPO and the WTO are separate organizations and constructs. Under WIPO treaties, other countries would be banned/prohibited from accepting the pirated property. Well, that is if they want to trade with other countries that expect WIPO agreements to be held up. It may well be that this ruling is only applicable to residents of Antigua. They can steal the Copyrighted material only to sell it to their residents.
Re:yea,, December 27th, a day which will go DOWN (Score:5, Funny)
ANTIGUITY
Re:yea,, (Score:4, Insightful)
Mod me flamebait without understanding the post if you want, but what I've said is factually true (although fantastically worded). I spun it so to make the spin obvious.
No, I don't think those organizations I named qualify as terrorists. I do think spin is a funny thing to those who understand it and dangerous to those who do not.
Spin is what the people in charge of "leaked" tidbits of information want to use to keep people in control. Don't be sheep, people. Search for factual information and make your own decisions. If you're not getting factual information, then your government and press don't really believe in a free, participatory society. You need true facts to participate properly in your government.
It is interesting, though, that commercial goals are not mentioned in that definition. I guess someone somewhere prefers old-fashioned crime family style organized crime for profit be kept as a separate matter.
A whole new market (Score:4, Insightful)
A victory for internet users worldwide (Score:3, Insightful)
Not Really ... read carefully. (Score:4, Interesting)
So they get to "violate" $21M USD worth of IP, then they are infringing. So 21 million MP3's (if iTunes is considered fair market value). Apple claims 2.5 million downloads per week, so presuming everyone from iTunes now downloaded from Antigua at the same rate, they'd be done in 8.4 weeks. Anything past that would be punishable IP infringement.
But again, those numbers are all suspect, what is the real dollar amount of IP? The point being, though, this isn't a free flowing well, it is finite and capped each year. So enjoy it for a few weeks, Antigua. Christmas in January.
Re:A victory for internet users worldwide (Score:5, Insightful)
Still this strikes me as an odd penalty. If I go and rob a bank, do you put my children in jail? Yes, I would be upset at that, and it would be a deterrent for me, but at the same time, the children did nothing wrong - you should be jailing me.
They are punishing the US by allowing people to take the works of it's authors, actors, software developers, etc. without compensating them. Yes it punishes the government, but it punishes people completely unrelated to the action even further.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:A victory for internet users worldwide (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Hah. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
What the US should be "reined in" on, is to respect the treaties signed, or start loosing the privileges you got from them, and respect the resolutions, even if they are not favourable to them, when they use the resolutions of the same organizations to
Internal or export? (Score:4, Interesting)
Time for allofmp3.com.ag (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Time for allofmp3.com.ag (Score:5, Funny)
abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:3, Interesting)
Since when did "free trade" translate into an abandonment of sovereignty in favor of having an unelected global organization dictate national policy? If the people of the United States (or any country) want to ban online gambling then what business of the WTO is it? At least when the WTO steps in over protective tariffs that makes SOME sense. If a product is completely outlawed though, how the hell is a free trade issue?
Can the Netherlands file a WTO complaint because some of their products (cannabis coffee shops) illegal in the United States? Can the United States file a complaint because some of our exports (pornography) are illegal in Saudi Arabia? Where the hell does it end?
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Informative)
You haven't been following this issue. Countries can prohibit trade on moral ground under the WTO. They just can't treat the domestic businesses differently than the foreign ones, which the US does explicitly.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Yeah we do that all the time. But on this one specific issue I fail to see the problem -- is there something that treats American horse-racing betting sites different then ones from overseas?
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Informative)
Yes, if you use less specific terms. Change "horse-racing betting" to "gambling" and re-ask the question.
Apparently, WTO sees the US government's uber-specific microlegislation, where it permits some kinds of gambling and not others, as an absurd joke that is obviously derived from special interests (i.e. private industry's desire to use government power to put money into their own pockets) rather than any sort of principles. In other words, they saw it the same way that we, the citizens of US, do.
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:4, Informative)
So where's the difference between domestic and foreign?
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:4, Insightful)
So because the "majority" of horse racing gambling is in the states that makes it a protective tariff to outlaw ALL forms of online poker
YepRe:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Nobody made you join the WTO either. Nobody made you agree to the definition of categories of industry. If you'd had the foresight to separate horse racing from online gambling as separate categories this would not be a problem. But these are the rules you agreed to and know you have to play by them if you want to keep playing.
And you DO want to keep playing because the WTO is the force that's preventing Canada from creating a nationalized daycare system. (would prevent american companies from competing in the daycare industry), is forcing Canada to sync copyprotection laws for America's RIAA/Hollywood interests, is preventing Canada from selling subsidized electricity to its own residents because FreeTrade/WTO rules force us to export electricy at the same rates we use it internally, despite that a lot of the energy infrastructure was built by the taxpayer.
And that's just Canada... the US is wielding the WTA/FreeTrade agreements around the globe for its benefit. It benefits far more from them than it loses. For every Antigua there are 30 Canada's. Antigua is just interesting because they've scored a symbolic blow to the US, and in a very public high profile way.
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
This is more like saying "
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Informative)
The ruling was that
your wheat which you are going to use privately on your own farm impacts the state market.
your state trades wheat with other states.
So your all your private wheat are belong to us.
Once that was ruled, if they could argue something would have even a secondary affect on interstate commerce, they could regulate it.
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:abandonment of sovereignty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Okay, it's like this. The only way you get to ban gambling is if you believe that gambling is morally a bad thing, or if you believe that gambling could damage public order. By allowing some types of gambling, you agree that gambling is not morally a bad thing, and that it is not a danger to order either. Hence, you can't ban gambling, in any form.
Unless, of course, you'd like to argue that betting on horse races is moral while gambling in general is immoral, or that the latter would somehow cause order to break down. However, I don't think any sane person would accept that. I wouldn't.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Catch you later... (Score:5, Funny)
As I sit looking out my window across a lovely but frigid blanket of white to the filthy, freezing slush on the street and notice a pedestrian being blown off the sidewalk by an icy, knife-edged wind, I think of setting up a nice little pirate factory to legally crank out stuff that will drive the RIAA to frothing, incoherent rage on one of the nicer Caribbean islands.
And a drink. A drink with an umbrella in it. Could life be better?
Time to use those airmiles (Score:3, Funny)
This has been in the works for some time. (Score:5, Interesting)
Before Bush came into office the US had never lost a single case at the WTO. Now he has lost at least two. The last one I remember was against Europe with regard to an import tax on steel. Here is a link or two:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3291537.stm [bbc.co.uk]
http://themanufacturer.com/us/detail.html?contents_id=1726 [themanufacturer.com]
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/politics/article77803.ece [independent.co.uk]
In that case the US backed down fairly quickly as the tariffs Europe was going to impose were all designed to damage the economy in places Bush needed to get re-elected. One example given was taxing Florida oranges heavily and making them far more expensive than those from elsewhere. This is what every last tariff was designed to do. The European Union chose products where the same item could be obtained elsewhere for a competitive price (but not after a 30% tax hike was imposed on the US produce).
In this case turning Antigua into a file sharing haven will be an annoyance, but probably not as dire as what Europe was aiming for. This is especially true when you look at the amounts involved. In this case 21 million dollars per year is fairly small compared to the 2.2 billion that the last dispute could have cost had the US not backed down.
Re:This has been in the works for some time. (Score:5, Informative)
Here is some more information on this http://benmuse.typepad.com/ben_muse/2007/09/how-is-the-us-d.html [typepad.com]
or the source (warning PDF) from the US gov't rather then a random blog:
http://www.ustr.gov/assets/Trade_Agreements/Monitoring_Enforcement/Dispute_Settlement/WTO/asset_upload_file811_5696.pdf [ustr.gov].
I didn't realize that number was so high, but as a Canadian I could think of a couple of cases that didn't go so well for you guys (not that you haven't taken it to us as well).
Ignore the GPL too? (Score:5, Insightful)
Not that I'm trying to be a Troll, just a random thought that crossed my mind as interesting.
Pirates of the Caribbean (Score:4, Funny)
Re:I bet the Mafiaa Won't Like That (Score:5, Insightful)
What this really represents is a message to the US: the WTO is not afraid to use IP laws to penalize us if we try and bully other countries. The member states of the WTO are not happy that the US can basically run free, so they just wanted to remind us that there is a system in place that can overrule America's policies. I personally view that as a good thing, since the US keeps using its position as the single most powerful nation in the world to push various agendas on other nations.
Re:I bet the Mafiaa Won't Like That (Score:4, Insightful)
Uh, no.
Dear Servicemember:
We realize that you were due to retire in 2008. However, as we're now fighting EVERYONE, your enlistment has been extended...
...to 2108. Thanks for serving, and have a friendly-fire-free day!
Love, Uncle Sam
Seriously, folks... While I'm as proud as any military brat concerning the amount of rear the US armed forces has the capability to kick, we are NOT at the point where we can take on the world.
Rephrased: How many 12-year-olds could you take on? [mcsweeneys.net]
Re:wha?! (Score:5, Funny)
Also, "holy shit" is redundant because right now in every office in Hollywood, overpaid cocaine soaked executives are making that very same exclamation.
Well, not all of them will be saying "holy shit." Some will simply be saying "shit", referring to what they just did in their pants.
-mcgrew
PS- everyone should now go out and sell all their Sony stock. Not because this will make the price of Sony stock drop, just because Sony is evil and this is as good an excuse as any.
Re:wha?! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:wha?! (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
"Now - $21 million may seem like a considerable award. However, according the the RIAA's calculations, this only covers the single "Just a Lil Bit" by artist 50 Cent."
Since the award is to Antigua, and the profits of the award are to compensate Antigua,