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Games Entertainment

XBox Tidbits 162

Posted by CmdrTaco from the think-i'll-play-starwars-starfighter-instead dept.
Kurt from Joystick101 sent in linkage to a report of a presentation on the XBox which shows things like the molding process, hardware layout, involved developers and more. idcmp sent in something a little stranger: its a letter allegedly from nintendo talking about an un-named company (obviously microsoft) and the affect they are having on the industry. No clue if its real, but it sure looks like it might be.
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XBox Tidbits

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  • All the screenshots I've seen look no better than current PC technology, which is essentially what the XBox *is*, with a slower CPU at that. I honestly don't see what the big deal about this thing is.

    - A.P.

    --
    * CmdrTaco is an idiot.

  • Frankly, I don't care if Microsoft is pure evil or how they promote their hardware in this particular case. I am sick and tired of having console hardware come out in Japan first and six to twelve months later in the US even though the US constitutes a significantly larger portion of the market.

    Yes they can charge more in Japan and yes they do recoup back some of their costs, but I doubt there aren't certain sections of the US (silicon valley, new york, LA, etc) which wouldn't pay the exact same amount if not more.

    One thing I can be assured of is that with Microsoft's existing manufacturing and distribution channels, that little Xbox will be sitting on the shelves at my local electronics store waiting for me when it launches.

    Of course this may seem wrong and evil, but I'm come on. I feel especially sorry for those in Europe who sometimes have to wait even longer.

    Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
  • The PS2 isn't disappointing because of poor game selection, it's been a retail disappointment because STILL, many months after its launch, you can hardly find them in the stores -- there has been slightly better availability in the last month, but you still pretty much never see them. They'd have sold more had they had more.
  • You know, It just makes me wonder why the xbox is drawing so much attention. From the pictures in the article...looks kind of like a compaq mini desktop system. What will this new game console provide that I don't already have on my pc that I'm using right now?

    Every game that comes out for it will be ported right over to the pc and windows, no wait time since the xbox uses directx. Its like buying a box exclusivly for playing games. I just don't see any point to buying a console for games that is not upgradable and will be way overpriced. If you have a computer the xbox is reduntant since my computer can do what it can and more. Not only that I can upgrade my computer as needed.

    I'll stick to playstation for a game console and my pc for the other games.
  • well, I've been holding off on getting a ps2 since I looked at the specs and realized it isn't actually finished yet. I figure around September it should be about ready. What I do like about it is that it also plays the ps1 games also. Unlike nintendo where you have to have each console on each level to play the games for that level..nes, snes, n64, cube...I can have one ps2 and play ps1 or ps2 games. Right now I haven't seen any good games for ps2, but its new and the good games haven't really been done on it yet. But if you concider that people who don't have a ps1 can have a ps2 and get the best of both worlds. Even though the ps2 has some flaws at least they have made some effort not to ignore their current customers by making a new box with no ability to play previous version games.

    From a marketing standpoint this also makes sense since there are allot of good games out for the ps1, so having a ps2 isn't that bad since your not limited to just ps2 games. The cube won't have a giant collection of n64 games to fall back on when its out.
  • Yes, but as computers get cheaper and cheaper, why buy a propriatary box when for a few hundred more you can have a real computer? Which can do more than play games?

  • you know, if the ps2 is so horrible, then why do they still sell out very quickly in just about every store that gets them? And since most stores in my area will not sell you just a ps2 (unless they have marked it up to $400) but you have to buy games and a service plan with it. And still they sell.

    As for great ps2 games...I'm sure they are in the works. Sony did some wierd things in their graphics chip desing and choice. So programmers need some time to learn to use it right.
  • you have a low UID and cloudy, inarticulate thinking. proves something. maybe about how you are an idiot? I dunno.


    Or maybe I'm an insane programmer diven over the edge by mass market beliving morons who believe anything mega corps tell them and the tv adds show them. Only a moron would by a computer in a box when they could have a upgradable computer in a bigger box.

    I'll bet you that every game that comes out for xbox not made by M$ will be out for the pc the same week. And half the games out for pc now will be changed over to xbox in no time. Its a mini computer that plays games thats it. Total waste of money.

    And if you don't like the way I think...tough.
  • ok, thats fine, they are not targeting me. Hmm, but lets see, how many people on /. are using something other than a computer to read and reply to this? Well for all of those that have a computer, a real one, well all you need is a hd partition with windows on it and a decent video card and preso you have an xbox. I'm sure some of the people here have computers that would put my computer to shame. DVD drives are cheap, even the good ones.

    If granny wants one thats fine, but why are all the people here that have everything the xbox will have so interested wasting money on one?
  • Final fantasy doesn't run on my computer, at least not for a while. There are quite a few games that run on ps1/ps2 that doesn't run on my computer. I do like some of the cool games squaresoft has made and will make. But would I buy a ps2 to do my web browsing? No. I think the difference is that sony, sega, and nintendo are game machines that are not directly transferable to my computer. If I were to make a directx game then not only would it work on pc's it would work on computers also.

    People buying a game console that isn't based on a pc system gets them for the games that will never be available on their pc without an emulator. This isn't so for xbox.
  • Anyone can see that Nintendo should be worried right about now.

    Yes, but nintendo has allot of the younger market with their younger kid oriented games. As long as they keep making those they will be fine. Just go to a store that has allot of games and look through the n64 section and the ps1 section. The n64 has allot of young kid games, the ps has more teen/adult oriented games.
  • If you don't like MS, just come out and say it, don't pussyfoot around the issue.

    ok...I don't like M$. But I am quite fond of windows 2000. Although not perfect it is massivly improved and almost stable.

    The PS2 and Xbox are identicle in terms of end result except the Xbox has a few more features

    I have to disagree here...ps2 and the nintendo cube would be identical but the xbox and my home computer are more in terms of the same thing. My whole point on the issue is that ps2 is a game concole that is harder to emulate, and the xbox will not even require emulation. Some brilliant hacker will have a program out to run the xbox version of games on a pc in no time. If I wanted to buy a propriatary box I'd probably buy a dell, or a gateway. If I really wanted to throw away my money I'd get a compaq or an hp computer. (I love hp hardware, but not thier computers) The xbox is just a small computer in a small plastic box that runs a version of windows. I have that, but mine also can run linux, or bsd, or os/2 (not that I would want to) or any other os that runs on a intel architecture.
  • Well, one thing would be that the projected price of the Xbox is less than the projected price of a GeForce3

    Yes, but what will the price of the GeForce3 be when the xbox actually does hit the stores? I have a voodoo3, and it cost me $85, and it does a good job for me. Its not top of the line, but in 6 month I can get the top of the line card today for 1/2 the price or less. And by the time the xbox does come out there will be video cards that will put it to shame. You can change the card in your computer..not the xbox.
  • you must live in a bad area, the local electronics boutique has about 25 ps2 games on the shelves. And if M$ waits too long to get the xbox out then the really good ps2 games will be out and the ps2 will be set in its market. Besides, sony makes more than the ps2, just like m$ makes something other than the xbox. So sony will not go away if the ps2 were to fail, which doesn't seem likely.
  • yep, I agree. Thats why I won't waste my money on one...will spend it on a better video card when I need one
  • I haven't seen a great game yet.

    Then you probably haven't checked out SSX from Electronic Arts. That game is incredible, and even the people who watch it being played get an adrenaline rush.

    Maybe you should look a little harder.
  • And you know why they aren't? Because they've already got a system out there to sell, and they don't want to kill sales of it! Microsoft has no such worry.

    I would disagree with you there. I think the rise of the latest generation of game consoles is one of the biggest factors killing the home PC market. And that translates into fewer sales of Windows.

    As a former PC game junkie, I just gave up on the whole thing after years of $1-2K PC upgrades, hundreds of dollars on new video cards, etc. I can spend $300 and get cutting edge stuff from a new console. And the games these days are damn good, and many are direct ports of PC games.

    Home PC sales are shriveling, and with them the PC game market. It seems to be dying a slow death with all the canceled titles and failing or converting PC game companies.

    Microsoft's entry into the console market is purely defensive, becaues people aren't buying new 1GHZ machines (and copies of Windows) to play PC games, and they sure don't need to upgrade for the newest versions of Quicken or Office.
  • The last I heard (read cared to read) about the Xbox it would include an NVidia chip and an AMD CPU. Looks like an "Intel Inside" sticker on the rightmost heatsink. Seems like the specs change a little bit too much.

    Also, what is a crappy Western Digital disk doing in there? Looks like a low-end PC with commodity parts. I have seen "micro" PC's before and they are nothing new.

    But then again, I will probably never buy a game console.
  • We will finally see some good games for the PlayStation 2 later this year.

    I know of a few that will definitely be PS2 killer app games:

    Final Fantasy X
    Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
    Virtual Fighter 4
    Grand Turismo 3
  • Maybe you should try reading it as a paragraph, rather than sentence by sentence... He said that the first 9 months of the year represent over 50% of SALES, not over 50% of the year as you imply there... He's saying 50% of their sales occure Jan-Sep and the other 50% Oct-Dec (the holiday season)...

  • Re:Nintendo's Letter (Score:4)

    by Kismet ( 13199 ) <pmccombs AT acm DOT org> on Saturday March 24, 2001 @08:54PM (#342579) Homepage
    When IBM was in trouble with the government for violation of anti-trust law, one of the remedies that was put in place was that no marketing could be done for products that did not exist.

    A common anti-competitive practice is to strangle a market by hyping up a "future" product. It's easy to make it look like a killer-product when it's still vapor. Unfortunately, when the time comes to release, it is delayed or shipped with fewer features than promised.

    In the meantime, everyone has stopped buying the real products in anticipation of the promise of things to come. And when they fail to deliver, nobody is forced to buy it, but the damage has already been done.

    There's a difference between promoting a product that is a month or two from hitting the market ,and promoting one that has a year or more left before anyone can get their hands on it. I think it's fine for Microsoft to allow rumors and speculation about their Xbox, and even advertise on their own turf. But they shouldn't be seeking disciples on Nintendo's turf until they have something to follow.
  • Having nintendo's alleged letter on fuckedcompany just seems so fitting.

  • You sadly seem to be missing my point.

    Someone, somewhere inside of nintendo, is going, "Hmm.. this could really fuck us."

    Besides, with good marketing people will be shit. And with poor marketing people wont buy the best of the best.

    Microsoft has already proven themselves to market well, time and time again.

  • And you don't think that whoever wrote that letter thought, "Oh boy, this could really fuck us?"

    Also, it was a double meaning to both companies -- as I think they are both on their way to fuckdom.

    Also, comparing Sega's impact to the impact Microsoft will make is not a valid comparison. Sega doesn't have a few billion to blow and a dominant market share in the computer industry.

  • [OT] Affect vs. Effect (Score:3)

    by image ( 13487 ) on Saturday March 24, 2001 @12:03PM (#342583) Homepage
    The normal usage of affect is in the verb form. From www.dict.org:

    Affect \Af*fect"\ ([a^]f*f[e^]kt"), v. t. [imp. & p. p. Affected; p. pr. & vb. n. Affecting.] [L. affectus, p. p. of afficere to affect by active agency; ad + facere to make: cf. F. affectere, L. affectare, freq. of afficere. See Fact.]
    1. To act upon; to produce an effect or change upon.

    As might affect the earth with cold heat. --Milton.

    The climate affected their health and spirits. --Macaulay.

    The less common noun forms of affect:

    Affect \Af*fect"\, n. [L. affectus.]
    Affection; inclination; passion; feeling; disposition. [Obs.] --Shak.

    Affect \Af*fect"\, n. (Psychotherapy)
    The emotional complex associated with an idea or mental state. In hysteria, the affect is sometimes entirely dissociated, sometimes transferred to another than the original idea.

    In comparison with the noun form of effect:

    Effect \Ef*fect"\, n. [L. effectus, fr. efficere, effectum, to effect; ex + facere to make: cf. F. effet, formerly also spelled effect. See Fact.]

    3. In general: That which is produced by an agent or cause; the event which follows immediately from an antecedent, called the cause; result; consequence; outcome; fruit; as, the effect of luxury.

    The effect is the unfailing index of the amount of
    the cause. --Whewell.

    Yes, go ahead and mod me down for being an off topic wanker.

  • All video game makers advertise ahead of time. Hell, Sony has already started whispering to the press about the PS3, and just because Nintendo isn't buying store space (And you know why they aren't? Because they've already got a system out there to sell, and they don't want to kill sales of it! Microsoft has no such worry) doesn't mean that they aren't making sure that the GameCube gets its own share of buzz. Your lame conspiracy theories weren't even good analogies.


    Cheers,

  • But like you just said, "Right now I haven't seen any good games for PS2." That was my point. If I had a PS1, the ability to play my old games is a very strong selling point. But if there are no good games yet, why not keep using my PS1 until PS2 does have some compelling games, drops their price due to the coming competition, irons out all those problems they've been having, or one of the two new systems looks sufficiently sweet that I move to one of them?

    (Glad to see some people were able to understand what I was trying to say despite the hideous grammar of my original post.)


    Cheers,

  • Hey, I'm not saying that they people who bought it are dummies and should repent for their sins or anything. But after all the hype about the PS2, don't you think the reaction to it has been pretty flat?

    I don't do too much gaming, and when I do, it's on my PC (I haven't owned a console since the original NES). I've got a kickass home theater system now, though, and I'd like to see how the new generation consoles make use of it. It doesn't matter a whole lot to me whether or not it's also available for the PC as long as it looks great and sounds great snd is fun. If the XBox/Nintendo don't come out with much interesting, I'll probably end up not getting any of them.


    Cheers,

  • Nearly everything about the PS2 has screams "failure." When you look at the system, what about it or what games for it make you so eager to have one now and at the current price? I haven't seen a great game yet. I've heard nothing but problems about his thing and have no problem whatsoever waiting until the XBox or Nintendo's entry is out there to have at least one of the new generation systems to compare it to.


    Cheers,

  • Although Nintendo makes a good point that it can't be wise to tell customers to not buy the stuff in stock because there's something better coming later, it's worth remembering that M$ has deep pockets. Don't think the M$ propaganda at the retailers showed up for free, M$ paid a lot of $$$ to get it there, although they can well afford it. Working at a video game company for a year introduced me to the strange concept that the games you see on a retailer's shelf arent there because the retailer thinks they will sell but because the distributor/publisher paid to get them there. It also costs $$$ to get your game mentioned in advertisements that the retailers publish. And retailers basically make just as much if not more $$$ selling ads, endcaps, and prominent placement on the shelves as they do from product sales. So when $$$ shows up with a big wad of cash, not only is it business as usual for the retailer, but they could still make money even though their sales might drop.
  • I always wonder why a group of grown-ups on higher-than-average salaries want to bitch about which console will be best, fastest, make them look hard with their mates etc. but really all these bits of hardware do the same thing! Dreamcasts, Playstations and N64s are all `silly money' now, even when you're paying in UK pounds like I am. I mean, you hardly need to lay out any cash at all for the system, and the games are all largely the same price. If there are more than a few games you're willing to splash out on for a particular console, why not just buy them all and bitch about which is the better game?

    Most of the discussion even a few months into a new console's life (this goes for the PS2 in spades) is centered around such-and-such a feature of a console not facilitating good games, or distribution problems, or publisher problems. The hardware is all pretty much without question really exciting and interesting across the board (multiple processors, exciting graphics chips etc., a real trip if you're only used to programming PCs) if you're genuinely interested in that, but that's pretty much by the by. They're all capable of giving exactly the same amount of fun, and fabulous, jaw-dropping games are increasingly not necessarily technical feats any more. So at the end of the day, it really, really doesn't matter what hardware is in these boxes-- all we're arguing about is the hype, surrounding them: unreleased consoles are great for this.
  • What I wonder is why people would buy an XBox rather than a PC, other than the fact that a gaming console is typically easier to use than a PC...

    I just can't wait to see the price M$ will want for one of those units.....

  • I don't think interest has been that flat - I still get a lot of interests from co-workers and others (I just recently had a cable internet connection installed, and every one of the five workers it took commented on the PS2!). I think the interest looks flatter compared to the pre-launch mania, but is still actually pretty high. I just read on IGN that the PS2 has shipped ten million units worldwide, 2.7M in the US alone. Granted that's not sell-through but I also have not seen a lot of units languishing on shelves for long. And I think there has DEFINATLEY been interest in games like Metal Gear Solid 2, Z.O.E. ships with a demo this month. That should help move a lot of systems.

    I have nothing against the XBox especially, I just like to point out some shortcomings that other people seem to overlook consistantly. I'll readily admit to PS2 shortcomings (like poor DVD player software and an architecture more difficult to devlop for) but as far as I can tell the XBox has problems as well. At the moment, they are just overshadowed by the graphics of the system (which do look impressive, though I'll be able to get better in a PC) and the fact that no-one can play one yet.

    I agree with you about wanting to see how the new consoles look hooked up to a good AV system - I was in a similar situation to yourself in that I had not had a console before the PS2 and just used my PC for games. But the PC with a good set of speakers and a large monitor is going to be more impressive than a TV to me (because of the improved resolution), so I'd rather play games there if I can. In fact I await anxiously a VGA adaptor for the PS2 so I can play on my PC setup.

    Still, I have to admit that watching games on a really huge screen is impressive even if the the resolution is not as good!

  • Actually, you could easily say the same thing about the XBox. What games are announced for it that look to be incredible? Munch's Odysee is the ONLY one that won't be out for the PC as well that has had really good reports.

    Why would I buy an XBox if I have a PC? Wouldn't it make a lot more sense to have a PS2 and a PC? That way I get the full spread of games. And those are most of the people that are going to be buying the first wave of consoles.

    There are also many other aspects of the PS2 that spell success. Consider that while Sony and the PS2 itself tend to be pretty proprietary in nature, the PS2 has actually more open connectivity than the XBox - standard USB and FireWire ports (so that games could easily support USB modems, mice, keyboards, and printers) while the XBox offers only proprientary USB ports (so anything you might want to use has to be made first instead of already being availiable).

    I have no regrets at all about owning a PS2, many of the games have been great and some of the ones coming out this month (like Z.O.E. and GT3) look to be amazing. Nothing about the XBox and games it might play seem at this point nearly as compelling as a PS2 that you can have right now!

  • Sure MS has the right to whatever kind of marketing they want. what nintendo is wisely pointing out is that the retailers are shooting themseleves in the foot by going along with this.

    The retailers probably don't give a flying f*ck, because they'll get more money for store-space advertizing deals than they will in terms of margin on the Nintendo consoles and cartridges.

    Besides, most people stopped buying N64's when the PS2 was pre-announced. :)

    Simon
  • People buy consoles for the games, not for the hardware. The CEO of Nintendo has all but made this his religion, and I tend to agree.

    -ben.c
  • The "9 months, which is more than 50% of the year," probably refers to sales volume. The last three months of the year likely represent the other 50% or so, due to holiday shopping.

    As for the spelling errors- you'd be surprised at how many director and VP level executives can barely craft an English sentence. At the company I work for, (a major tv/movie/web conglomerate) we have exactly ONE proofreader to intercept the veritable torrent of press releases and marketing communications the execs unleash onto an unsuspecting public. Stuff usually makes it out to the puiblic after a spellcheck, and nothing more.
  • Sure MS has the right to whatever kind of marketing they want. what nintendo is wisely pointing out is that the retailers are shooting themseleves in the foot by going along with this. Turning away your customers empty handed in the hope that they'll be back next year to buy another console is a stupid strategy.
    I suspect that the retailers are being well compensated by MS for the lost sales but that would be hard to prove.
  • Whatever ad revenue coming from MS will probably not counteract the fact that the customer just left the store empty handed. It's more then just the profit margin it's also psychological. Presumably the customer came in to buy something. Your job when the customer walks in is to sell them what they want, make them linger around to see if something else catches their eye, and sell them the other thing too. The stores make money by upselling or selling related products. Telling your customer that they should wait another year to spend their money is just plain stupid.
  • Man, I wonder if there will ever be a time where people get together with their consoles and tv sets to have a LAN party instead of lugging PC's.

    Yeah, lugging around a TV would be SO much easier than all that heavy computer gear.... =]
  • Looks like they're using a fairly standard WD IDE hard drive. 8 GB though...why 8 GB? Seems fairly small. I didn't think WD even made drives less than 10 GB anymore. It looks like this is something that wouldnt be too hard to "upgrade" on your own. Maybe change out that DVD player for a DVD-RAM at a later point? Since they're using fairly standard peripherals, swapping these things out should be a snap. I wonder if there's going to be an available SDRAM slot?

  • I see hte Xbox ships with a P3, any idea if they're still including the PSN number with that? Or if there's an disable feature in it's setup? Thanks!
  • So is Microsoft going with the traditional business model of selling the machine at a loss and making it up on the games? If not, exactly how the hell do they expect to compete? I dont care if there are more games for it (which there will be if you can use directX to code for it) I'm not going to pay PC prices for a console and then pay exorbidant prices for games too.
  • Man, I wonder if there will ever be a time where people get together with their consoles and tv sets to have a LAN party instead of lugging PC's.
  • well I'd suggest laptop lan parties but that is just so damn lame.
  • Plus the fact that Sony likes to fuck over their developers by not giving good specs. Nintendo gets hostile at anyone who wants to develop for their platform and Microsoft seems to be the good guy here claiming that development will be open to anyone who knows how to code for DirectX.

  • If you don't like the bias /. has, go someplace more to your taste.

    Because we all know the mainstream media is pure and unbiased, right?
    Cheers,

    Rick Kirkland
  • It is drawing attentioln for the same reason the PS2 did...and the Dreamcst before it...etc

    What the Xbox is starting and PS (3 Maybe??) will probably do, is make this an entertainment system. $300 for a dvd player and a gaming system. Thats not bad.

    And with add-ons now and probably standard later, you can surf the web do email etc. I know you are saying I have my computer that can do all that and more. But my grandmother would love it. It would be on her TV so it will be easy to read, 1 button to push and it is on, unobtrusive, and now she can watch DVD's.

    Point is, you are not the target for this.
  • What the hell? I just responded to another post by you where you said Why buy the XBox when you can have a computer that does more...and here you are talking about buying a PS2??

    A little consistancy would be nice :)
  • Obviously, you know your way around a computer, so why not just get emulators for all the various consoles? And I can't really think of any games that I would want to play that are only available on consoles.

    The PS2 and Xbox are identicle in terms of end result except the Xbox has a few more features (LOL and who would expect anything less from MS? :) )

    If you don't like MS, just come out and say it, don't pussyfoot around the issue.
  • Is real. I red about it somewhere else too. I think it is naive for Nintendo to think that putting posters and crap in the stores is going to hurt thier sales. The video gaming public is aware enough of the X-Box, and like most gamers, are intruiged about it.

    If I was in the market for a game system right now, it wouldn't be a N64. Rather, I'd wait to see what the X-Box and Game Cube can do. Then I would make my decision. Gamers are smart... putting a poster in a store is not going to sway them. They will make the choice based on what they feel to be the best after they evaluate the competition.

    It sounds to me like Nintendo is getting worried, but lets not turn this into a Microsoft bash.
  • I stopped taking sega seriously around Sega 32X and Sega CD- and I'm probably not alone in that.

    Just goes to prove one of my theories of console development: if upgrades are mandatory or even highly recommended for some games to be playable or enjoyable, then the console will fail.

    When I first heard reports of the 64DD for the N64, I said "Wow, guess Nintendo didn't learn from Sega's mistakes- they should cut their losses and start working on their next console" ; of course, all of my friends were looking at me crazy, as the 64 was seen, in their eyes, as the best console around.. but I knew that it would be a relative failure.

  • It is well known that the console makers are trying to position their next gen consoles as, in essence, the household "computer/internet" box. The makers such as Sony, Nintendo, et. all have come right out and stated exactly that.

    Actually, Nintendo has come right out and stated exactly that they do not want to be mistaken for a set-top appliance, and that is why they opted for the Gamecube name...
  • I'd only played NBA Live a couple times, but my brother and his friends, some of whom are both basketball AND console-gaming fiends, seemed to enjoy it thoroughly. Why's it suck?

    ***

    "ALL YOUR CODE ARE BELONG TO US!" -- Jim Allchin
  • I don't think the system is a failure yet... it's much too early to tell. However, there are a few great games out there that make the purchase of the PS2 worth it, at least to me. Madden 2001, SSX, and the EA Sports basketball and hockey titles (I forget the exact names). All good games.

    ***

    "ALL YOUR CODE ARE BELONG TO US!" -- Jim Allchin
  • You're not the target. They want those of us who had a ps1 and are sitting on the sidelines waiting for the survivor of the ps2/dreamcast/xbox/gamecube war
    --
    OliverWillis.Com [oliverwillis.com]
  • Sounds like Nintendo's been trying to spread some anti-MS FUD and they're running scared that they will be irrelevant.
    --
    OliverWillis.Com [oliverwillis.com]
  • What whining! The only way to beat MS at this game is to make AND ship something better with the same level of marketing. BE better and SHOUT about it. Can't afford to do that? Then go sniveling off into the corner.

    Even if the Nintendo article is a fake is does point out that the retail channels need to exist and they need pull-through support from the vendors AND the customers.

    Of course, this gets neglected by vendors like MS and Apple. Time and again the marketdroids keep forgetting that someone has to actual work in the retail store and SELL the damned stuff. It's not enough to just have a "good product" and expect the world to beat a path to your online store.

    But the computer industry keeps fucking this up, time after time after time. Yet it survives. Go figure.
  • What are you going to do with a 8Gb+ hard drive in a game console? Install Windows?


    ----------
  • While I know you are stating your opinion, and almost all of the games you mentioned are great, but I can't with good conscience, let you call NBA Live 2001 (EA Basketball) a good game. This game gives Rise of the Robots 2 a good running for worst game ever... well that might be a little harsh, I just think basketball has been done better (see NBA 2K1 for Dreamcast).
  • I agree with you. But if you want to see a great psx2 game, check out Onimusha Warlords [ign.com]

  • ign had an interview.... (Score:5)

    by geek_77 ( 81265 ) on Saturday March 24, 2001 @10:45AM (#342620)
    read this. explains everything (as much as they can)

    http://cube.ign.com/news/32525.html [ign.com]
  • The problem for Nintendo is that they don't want to make or deal with new technology.

    Even if this isn't a bona fide Nintendo memo, much of the rhetoric in the letter matches what Nintendo has done and said in the past. That is, at the very least, this is a really good satire. This company is much more evil than Microsoft and less subtle.

    On the hardware side, their agenda has been lock users into one platform (the nintendo one, of course!) with dated, decade old graphics systems, stone age media capabilities (they were willing to barricade their users into a quaint, expensive cartridge system to protect their bottom line from piracy) and declare everyone else (sony, sega and now MS) charlatans and looters. Instead of releasing new systems, they've chosen lame gimmick tactics like releasing Pokemon and clear color cases.

    I'm not sure exactly when either N64 or Gameboy was released, but it seems like the N64 is at least 5 years old, and the Gameboy is at least 10 years old. I don't know about the rest of you (and perhaps this is just a mental disorder plaguing the computer world), but it's really hard for me to use even a two or three year old machine without considering it to be a dinosaur. The idea that Nintendo expects to keep customers choosing their hardware over competitors' is completely insane.

    On the software side, they've been happy to beat every character they've had to death. There are very few new games or characters that come out of the Nintendo house. Most of the games recently released for the Nintendo platform are variation or sequels on previous sales successes (pikachu, mario, zelda). I can't think of too many game genres (sport, adventure, party, puzzle, etc) in which they haven't made a Mario or Pikachu version.

    In addition, they have had extremely poor licensing relations with third party development houses. Look at how many well established game companies were happy to flee Nintendo for Sony when the Playstation was released. Only a handful of game companies still regularly release games for the N64. Of those that do (like EA for instance), much of time it's only because it's an already released game that they can easily port from another platform like the PSX or PC. As a result, most of the non-Nintendo games for the N64 are available on other platforms.

    Even though Microsoft and Sony aren't the most benevolent corps in the world, I would strongly urge anyone who cares about game design and game technology to not buy Nintendo products. It should be woefully apparent that Nintendo retired anyone designing or engineering a long time ago.

    Also, consider picking up a Dreamcast. Sega is liquidating them right now, and available for it are a number of great, inexpensive games that have equal or better graphics and gameplay than any of the current PS2 games. For instance, Phantasy Star Online is a pretty solid multiplayer rpg (imagine a Diablo II that doesn't suck) and Samba de Amigo is easily the craziest party game I've ever played.
  • Well, one thing would be that the projected price of the Xbox is less than the projected price of a GeForce3. Add to that the fact that its a lovely little box that will almost certainly be hackable, and you've got a great recipe for something that geeks can play with. Chris
  • I don't understand what idiot moderator marked that as a Troll. He's making a very valid point. You might disagree with it but that doesn't make it a Troll. A troll is a post which intentionally lies in order to provoke a reaction. If I get my hands on the 13-year-old who moderated this one I would like to ground them for a week.
  • Because the X-Box is better than the rest.

    In terms of what? Specs? Well, agreed, some of the numbers are higher. Great. If that's all that counts for you, then have fun with your benchmark optimizer 'XBox'.

    What is more important for me is the less than impressive number of japanese developers. Yes, MS did list the Namco, Konami, Capcom... logos. But there is not much coming out by them. See this article [cnet.com] about Konami for example.

    As for me, the Dreamcast is the best console currently out.

  • That's the point I think the letter is trying to make. Nintendo want to come across as the guys (and girls) looking out for the retailers and the industry, and big bad 'Company X' are just storming in for the money...
  • Not so much 'anti-Microsoft', more so 'pro-Nintendo', maybe 'anti-Xbox'. No, I don't partiularly like Microsoft. Yes, I like Nintendo alot, and I think what they are saying in this letter is the truth. Unfortunatly, in taking Nintendo's letter as the truth I have to be anti-Microsoft this time.

    Sorry, I know anti-MS posts on Slashdot really hurt, and are really rare, but sometimes people need to see the truth, as horrible as it may be. I'm sorry that I caused so much pain on my Slashdot brothers and sisters by making a comment that goes against Microsoft, and I hope you can forgive me, I was just trying to do the right thing....

    :-P

  • Riding on only Pokemon? Do you think that whole 'iron fist on the handheld market' isn't bringing in profit (and no, the Game Boy is not a Pokemon only platform. The GBC has been a great 'flashback' console with SMBDelux, ZeldaDX and DKC, and the GBA is going to be THE flashback console (Yes! Return to the 16-bit days [and no, that isn't sarcasm, I love my SNES :) ]).

    Also, Nintendo have profited on the N64. Sure, hardware sales are lower then the PSX's, but software sales... Zelda was MASSIVE when it came out, and Nintendo has alot less piracy they have to 'compete' with.

    Sure, Pokemon has help, but Nintendo were hardly a poor company before it, and would have survived without the fad.

  • Also, comparing Sega's impact to the impact Microsoft will make is not a valid comparison. Sega doesn't have a few billion to blow and a dominant market share in the computer industry.

    Sega took Nintendo from a virtual monopoly with the NES to a 50/50 split with the GenesisMegaDrive/SuperNintendo. The pain from that will be much worse that anything Microsoft will dish out. Just because Sega didn't have a huge wallet and a PC operating system monopoly doesn't mean they didn't cause damange to Nintendo, infact, I doubt Microsoft will even inflict anything as harsh and what Sega did- break Nintendo's stranglehold.

    MS won't slash away 50% of Nintendo's userbase, that is definate. Microsoft is seriously gunning after Sony's userbase, both the consoles are going to be in direct competition with each other. Microsoft, if sucessful, will be Sony's replacement, just as they replaced Sega.

    Give Sega some credit, they changed the industry. Microsoft are just here with their 'PC-in-a-box' to leech from it now.

  • Fact - More limited space

    The GameCube optical disks are 1.5G each. Your beloved Dreamcast GD-ROMs are 1G each. Who has the space problem exactly. Yes, in the previous generation Nintendo had problems due to an expencive and small medium, however, now, 1.5G is not small, espically from a company that doesn't particularly like FMV. However, if a developer needs more space they can use more then one disk. Simple!

    I haven't actually seen a real advantage of Mini-DVDs over regular DVDs

    One of the advantages of the GCN's optical disks are, as you said, less piracy. It's not a mini-DVD, it's a proprietory format developed by Matushita(sp?), and, yes, will be difficult top copy. Do you think 3rd parties will be happy with Nintendo for making their console use a medium that cannot easily be pirated? Of course they will, less piracy is more profit to them. The PS1 was very much the pirates toy, and give it two years and the PS2 will be the same.

    And then, there is size. It's a GAME console. Smaller disks are easier to hold around, move around, and smaller to package. There has already been talk long-term of the NEXT Game Boy being theoretically able to use a format similer to the GNC disks due to their portible size. Size does matter :-)

    The whole fact that only a few games will come out for N64 this year, while games *continue* to come out for PS1

    Perhaps, but I don't LIKE any of the games on the PS1... at all. I love the 12 or so games I have on my N64. When I bought a CD-RW a few months back, my youngest sister (12 year old) actully half-jokingly said to me that I should buy a PS just to copy the games. Nice to see 12 year olds with that mentality... Anyway, like I said to her, what's the point on spending $100 on a console with no games we'd want, even if they were 'free'? She loves the N64, spends more time on it then me now (and she's not really into the Pokemon scene, I own no Pokemon games).

    Sure, alot of people like the hundreds of games on the PS, well, you can have them, I'm much happier with what Nintendo has to offer.

    I bought a Nintendo 64 the day it came out for close to $400 (with a game and controller)

    Same, and 2 months later when the price dropped $100 Nintendo Australia offered me a free game. I got a copy of Mario Kart 64 for free. That is a company that cares about their customer satisfaction!

    Today, I own a Dreamcast, which I love.

    And you're complaining about the software support of the Nintendo 64? At least is wasn't DOA. The DC was doomed from the beginning, the only people that don't agree with that were the people that wasted their money on them. You lost. Deal with it. No-one would have guessed that the N64 would outlive the DC, would they...

    Now I feel burned.

    Why, because they didn't make their console the #1 seller for you?

    and I'm selling my N64 and game collection on eBay.

    Oh well. I was happy with the two Zelda games, and the classic Super Mario 64 just to name a couple of games I have, and still have alot of fun with 4 player Goldeneye, Mario Kart, F-Zero X, Perfect Dark and more, but if that's what you'd like that's fine.

    Enjoy your future with the Dreamcast. If you like new console software you'll be buying a PS2, a GCN, or a Xbox within 12 months.

  • Japan first and six to twelve months later in the US even though the US constitutes a significantly larger portion of the market.

    #1: The Japanese market is bigger.
    #2: They are JAPANESE companies. How would you feel if some US company launched in Japan first?
    #3: 12 Months? What console was that?!

    Believe it or not, the US market isn't the most important to Nintendo, Sega and Sony just because you are in it. If you really want to stick up for the American way, for apple pie, fight off the east, then buy an Xbox, and prey it fares better then every other console out of the USA.

    I feel especially sorry for those in Europe who sometimes have to wait even longer.

    Yeah, I'm in Australia, and we have around the same release dates as Europe. Yes, it sucks. But I know a country of 19 million with a TV format different (*cough* superior *cough*) to the big two markets that I have to wait, and I also know they are in buiness to make money. Yes, it really sucks. But I guess I'm used to it now, and anyway, I can import if I REALLY want to. Just remember, some of us would love to get US release dates...

  • Nintendo's Letter (Score:5)

    by Xenex ( 97062 ) <xenex@noSPaM.opinionstick.com> on Saturday March 24, 2001 @11:17AM (#342631) Journal
    Yes, that Nintendo letter is legimate, but it says what it says with good reason.

    Microsoft currently have a 0% share of the video game console industry, and no product on offer at all, and will not until next year*. Yet, they are still sending out advertising aimed at consumers telling them not to buy products avalable NOW but to wait for their eventual product. What do you think the impact of this will be on stores that sell only video games? In displaying the Xbox advertising a retailer is trying to strangle their cashflow for the following 10 or more months. Obviously it would stop people buying products now, and of course that would be a bad thing for the industry.

    But do Microsoft care if that would be bad for the industry now. Hell no! Why not? Look at their current market share: 0%. Do you think Microsoft care if they make 20% less profit from a market share ok 0%. Of course not. 20% of nothing is still nothing. Microsoft are attempting to rape the industry now so things are good when they finally get in.

    Yes, Nintendo are somewhat biased, yes they have 2 consoles out trying to make profit at the moment. Yes Nintendo have a next generation console and a new handheld coming up that will be out before the Xbox. Yes it IS in Nintendo's interest for stores not to advertise the Xbox. But Nintendo are the old men of the industry, and they can also see that this will cause it serious damage if sales in consoles, not only theirs but the PS2, grind to a halt due to Microsoft FUD advertising. Nintendo don't want some new compnay just strangling the industry.

    Back in 1984 with the NES, Nintendo brought the video game market back from the death Atari had caused it, and turned home video games from a fad into an international multibillion dollar industry. Something tells me that they might have SOME idea about what they are talking about.

    Before you tell me that this is all bullshit, just ponder this: In the 'Linux Myths' Microsoft said that Linux did not have USB support at a time when their current business operating system was Windows NT 4.0 (also USBless), but said "Windows 2000 will have it, it'll be out soon". They wanted to stop people using Linux because of a product they had not shipped yet. Now they are doing the same to the video game industry.

    Also, have a look over at IGNcube here [ign.com] for an interview with Nintendo's vice president of marketing George Harrison all about this very letter. He states that Nintendo won't being in-store advertising of the GameCube until August- two months before it's release. Much better then a year.

    Microsoft Xbox: Bringing the blue screen to the living room. With a FREE copy of Photoshop for those post-game touch-up...

    -----

    * The Xbox will be delayed, the thing doesn't even have final dev kits out yet. People say that Nintendo's GameCube will delay even though 3rd parties have had final dev kits for months, but have blind faith in Microsoft shipping on time, a company well known for delays and FUD in the past ("Don't get a PS2 or GCN, look what will be out... eventually...").

    -----

  • Re:Suitable host. (Score:5)

    by Xenex ( 97062 ) <xenex@noSPaM.opinionstick.com> on Saturday March 24, 2001 @11:32AM (#342632) Journal
    Yeah, that huge handheld market they have and the profits there, and the money they make on first party games like Zelda on the N64 (the huge sales of that one game show that a console hardly needs to be #1 to make alot of profit for it's parent company) shows how fucked Nintendo are.

    Of course, profits and a huge bank balance aren't enough to be 'non-fucked' for you? How about the fact that Nintendo have shown that they can be pratically self-sufficiant, almost single-handedly supplying software to the N64 (well, the best of it at least). If all 3rd parties were to dump the GameCube tomorrow (which won't happen) the thing would be successful with Nintendo and the 2nd parties supporting it on their own.

    Nintendo are not fucked. Sega didn't fuck them. Sony haven't fucked them. Microsoft won't fuck them. Nintendo are the constant in the industry, it's Nintendo's competition that changes, let it be Atati, Sega, Sony and Microsoft. Microsoft are Sony's replacement this generation. Those 2 are competing for all the 3rd parties they MUST have to survive. Nintendo will keep making their games and bringing in the profit.

    Nintendo ain't going to be gone for a LONG time yet....

  • And what makes you think you can get it out. The last pic on the first link clearly shows the nVidia chip onboard..
  • I think this is the exact thing Sony did to Sega ... the announced the PS2 a year (or more?) in advance to "compete" with the dreamcast ... and I think it worked for awhile, but even most of the people waiting religiously for the ps2 bought a Dreamcast simply cuz it existed.

    Lesson to microsoft -- gotta get it out soon. If the gamecube comes out first all those console purchases will go to it instead.

  • If I were a shareholder of Microsoft and they just sat around doing nothing to promote their upcoming product (even one that's a few months from release), ...

    The XBox is not a few months from release. The slated release date is in the fall of this year, around October. That's 7 months. And the buzz is that it very well might slip and hit Christmas or, even, early next year. We're talking 7-12 months, not a few.

    ... someone just realized a bit late that they're being severely out-marketed.

    Marketing should be directed at consumers; making powerplays with distributors two-three quarters from launch is unacceptable. It's one thing to get the word out and get the hype machine started, and it's another to tell consumers to hold on to their cash in a market that suffered loss. I guarantee you that if people held onto their money for a year, PS2 and Nintendo both would start to feel it, and after so long a wait for consumers, if the XBox doesn't fulfill all of the hype? All that MS would have succeeded in doing is damaging the market.

  • Even though the XBOX will be backwards compatible with nothing when it is released there will be a much bigger selection of games to choose from compared to the selection when PS2 was released ...

    Let me translate this to English. You are saying, "Despite the fact that upon launch the PS2 had an entire library of games available from the PS1, the XBox, upon release, will have more games available for it." Great. Care to back that up with any facts? Has Microsoft shown a single playable demo, yet? Or a non-interactive demo? (That's an honest question, not rhetoric. Have they?) Are you really suggesting that the XBox will have more launch titles than the PS2 has games available? Or were you just throwing in the talk of PS1 games to confuse the reader? It's very difficult to determine what you meant because you apparently are being intentionally misleading in your statement. So a few questions:

    1. Do you mean the XBox will have more launch titles than the PS2 had launch titles (i.e., discounting the PS1 games, which you shouldn't have mentioned if this is really what you meant)? Do you have a list of launch titles that you know will be ready by the XBox launch in October (if it makes that date)?
    2. You are saying that the XBox will have more titles than the PS2 had at launch, and not that the PS2 library of games will not outnumber the XBox library at the time of the XBox launch, correct?

    Fact is, you have me stumped. Your first paragraph-sentence is so convoluted it appears you're trying to be misleading. Reading it strictly, you are saying, "The XBox will have more launch titles than the PS2 had." Which may or may not be true, but is exactly meanignless: the number and quality of the games available for both systems (well, all three systems) at that time will be what's important, not the number of games available for the XBox compared to the number of games the PS2 had months in advance.

  • This whole thing is about in-store advertising. If it hurts retailers then its their own fault!
  • Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • We have the intestinal tracts of herbivores? Give me a break.

    Do you know what an appendix is, Veggie nut? It's a vestigial organ, our version of something called a caecum, which you find in herbivores. If you ever dissected a herbivore, you'd know there's not the slightest possibility of mistaking a human appendix for a herbivore caecum. In herbivores, where the organ is still necessary, it's much larger. We don't need one now, because (say it along with me) we are not herbivores.

    And let's not even get into dentistry.

  • Anyone can see that Nintendo should be worried right about now. With the next gen consoles (Saturn, Playstation, N64) they lost a huge amount of groud, with Sony obviously trouncing the competition. They turned a 'geeky' past-time into something that was cool, and as a result Nintendo have got left behind with the kids games they are so often related to (Kirby, Mario, et al). With the X-Box having a big name like Microsoft behind it they are clearly scared that they are going to be finished off like Sega has been.

  • see hte Xbox ships with a P3, any idea if they're still including the PSN number with that?

    It'd be nice for copy control purposes. If too many copies of a game with the same serial number are being played online (such as in Internet multiplayer) on machines with different serial numbers, the game will randomly crash and throw up a PNG file of a BSOD. "Buy original unpirated software and it won't bluescreen on you."

  • For me, the killer app would be a Sony Playstation I emulator

    bleem! [bleem.com] is a PlayStation console emulator for Windows and Dreamcast.

    If it can do that, I'll consider it over a PS2...

    Compatible games look better on bleem! than on PS2.

    Until the X-Box can do that,

    The PC hardware used for PC bleem! is similar to the PC hardware used in Xbox. The Windows and Direct3D software that bleem! uses is similar to the Windows and Direct3D software that Xbox games use. Therefore, porting bleem! to Xbox should be a breeze.

  • What's so compelling about the XBox that someone wishing to buy a console would hangon rather than buy a PS2 right now?
  • Seems Sony hasn't learned its own lesson, from the rumors I've been hearing about developing for the PS2. That being as it is... I'm still rooting for Nintendo, myself. Sega should have won, but after the Saturn (remember that) I don't think anyone was taking them too seriously. My theory on Dreamcast is that Microsoft probably pulled an OS/2 maneuver on Sega -- floated a WinCE-based system as a trial balloon and then yanked the rug out from under them when the XBox was announced. The "note from Nintendo", real or not, raises some very valid points. Xbox is getting all this press, and we don't even know how it's going to be recieved by the users. But that's pretty typical marketing, I suppose. The fact is that I suspect Xbox is going to come up a little short -- expect a full Windows implementation on it where none is necessary would be my first bit of warning... /Brian
  • Thus, Conker's Bad Fur Day.

    They own the portable gaming market as far as the eye can see, though -- the Game Boy has never had a really serious competitor in the over ten years it's been on the market. Their fate is in their hands, though it doesn't help that they haven't seen fit to include DVD capability on the Gamecube. IMHO DVD capability on a game console is mostly a waste of effort, but there are places (dorm rooms are the first to come to mind) where it would be very useful indeed.

    /Brian
  • I think that feature was taken out of the P3 right about the time they ditched the Slot 1 packaging for it.

    /Brian
  • There was no reason it should have been. Nintendo made the mistake of sticking with cartridges, which has the theoretical upside (negated by patent issues, I believe) of making it possible to add hardware as well as play games but the downside of being a) proprietary and b) limited holding capacity by reason of semiconductor expense.

    The N64's also-ran status to me indicates the best reason possible for CD-based game machines: you can get more, more easily, on a $1 CD than you can on $20 worth of EPROMs.

    /Brian
  • Slightly ot...

    Has anyone yet seen the Pikachu special edition N64? A more blatant example of unnecessary corporate whoring I have never seen...

    See, the real fun part of all this is that the thing Nintendo could have done from the start is release a CD-player cartridge and crank up the Baby Indy that powers the thing. Of course, that would mean continuing to rely on SGI instead of IBM (the GameCube uses a PowerPC chip), which doesn't strike me as being good business sense...

    /Brian

  • The Nintendo letter is absolutely right, the Microsoft Xbox is too far out to be of great importance right now, but Microsoft still wants people to abstain from buying. This is one of their classic tricks. Sow a seed of doubt in people's minds so they don't buy from a competitor. They don't even have to release good product if this strategy succeeds! Some examples:

    Microsoft SMS. Versions 1.0 and 1.2 were absolute garbage and hideously behind schedule, but Microsoft kept harping on how fantastic Hermes AKA SMS was and to abstain from buying competing products from Intel, IBM and others. People played it safe and didn't buy from either of these two in favour of an unreleased product. Why make it good when you can prevent people from buying from the competition?

    NetPC. Larry Ellison had the computing world abuzz and Microsoft was worried. So together with Intel they announced NetPC -- a thin client PC. People decided to wait on the NC in favour of the NC. Microsoft could then safely kill the product and claim there was no market. Intel actually showed up at our company to demo the NetPC with a gray lunchbox with stickers on the inside printed like circuit boards!!! "This is what it will look like," they said! I was shocked!

    And finally a cross-platform operating system like Windows NT. Support a few different processor types long enough to save face, but restrict any good software for them and eventually pull support for all except Intel and Alpha (which they're contractually bound to support).

    XBox more of the same? How could you think otherwise...


    ---

  • Re:Nintendo's Letter (Score:5)

    by jayhawk88 ( 160512 ) <jayhawk88@gmail.com> on Saturday March 24, 2001 @12:05PM (#342659)
    OK, let's get some perspective, shall we?

    -Microsoft is making a console, currently scheduled for release end of this year/beginning of next, depending on who you read.
    -Microsoft wants to promote their upcoming console, as any manufacturer would.
    -The target market for console gamers are around the 14-25 year old range for the most part, an age group that, on average, can't afford to buy ever console released.

    It's in Microsoft's best interest to try and convince gamers to wait for their console. They have every right to try and promote this idea. It's Nintendo's responsibility to try and convince gamers otherwise: that the N64 is still a good purchase, or they should hold off for the Gamecube.

    You seem to think that Microsoft has some sort of responsibility to not advertise this way, that they shouldn't try and get gamers to wait for the good of the industry. Baloney. It's a free-freakin-market economy: survival of the fittest. And like you say, Nintendo's not exactly a fly-by-night company here; if anything, they have an advantage over Microsoft going in thanks to their character lineup.

    We all hate MS for what they did to the OS market, but I don't see the same thing happening here. Microsoft pushed Windows by tying it with another product everyone wanted: namely, computers. It's not the same in the console market. Sure, they can spend billions on hype, advertising, etc, but in the end, it comes down to what I as a gamer want: the Xbox, the Gamecube, or the PS2. My decision will be based on factors like which console has the best games, which has the best graphics, which has the coolest peripherals. In short, which is the better console.

    Of course, if MS starts giving away Xboxes with minivans or something, then you can worry ;)
  • Because the X-Box is better than the rest.

    A better question will be: What percentage of the rabid anti-MS crowd that still haunt Slashdot are going to stick to their principles and not buy or play a X-Box?

  • Sure, Pokemon has help, but Nintendo were hardly a poor company before it, and would have survived without the fad.

    I really don't so. Rather, I think without Pokemon they would've innovated a lot more and been pressured to push the GameCube out earlier.

    Besides, they are still making the same mistakes which burned them on the N64:

    - Claim - Cartridges will provide faster data access...
    - Fact - at the cost of much, much smaller media. And, cartridges are a pain in the ass to pirate, vs. CDs. Helps Nintendo's profits more than anything.

    - Claim - Mini-DVDs are the wave of the future from GameCube (or some such nonsense. I haven't actually seen a real advantage of Mini-DVDs over regular DVDs).
    - Fact - More limited space. Same anti-privacy features so Nintendo can breathe easy.

    One game success does not a console make. The whole fact that only a few games will come out for N64 this year, while games *continue* to come out for PS1, kind of shows the problem. I was a real fan of Nintendo. I bought a Nintendo 64 the day it came out for close to $400 (with a game and controller). Previously I had bought a SNES and Nintendo, never touching Genesis or Atari. Now I feel burned.

    Today, I own a Dreamcast, which I love. My little brother owns a Playstation One and Two, and I'm selling my N64 and game collection on eBay.

  • One thing I love about games consoles is the mentallity surounding them. Some people that own console X will defend it to the death. Why? I have a braun toaster, if my neighbor came round and told me his brand X toaster kicked the hell out of my braun I'd think he was more than a little bit sad.

    It's marketing and some of you people fall for it so heavily. They're bits of electronics that display colors on a TV but a lot of people treat them like they are a religion. What really worries me is young people being life long fans of multi-billion mega corps.

  • Gamers are smart... putting a poster in a store is not going to sway them. They will make the choice based on what they feel to be the best after they evaluate the competition.

    Many gamers are young. Young enough to not posess or be allowed to spend $300 without parental input. And unfortunately, parents are going to be swayed easier than informed gamers... If an uninformed parent sees a poster that says wait for the X-Box and they don't see one for the Game Cube (and they don't read the hot gaming sites on the web and spend time speculating like hard-core gamers do), then I think some will be swayed by the MS posters.

    So maybe gamers won't be swayed, but the ones holding the cash will be.

  • Um, Nintendo isn't denying that Microsoft has a right to try to do this, they're questioning whether it's in the retailers' best interests to let them do it...

    Yup, you're completely correct.

    One thing I've noticed is that unless a person explicitly says that, the assumption is easy to make that they're attacking Microsoft. When I re-read Xenex's post it was only then that I noticed that even he might not have been 'attacking' Microsoft, but that even I had simply assumed it.

  • It is well known that the console makers are trying to position their next gen consoles as, in essence, the household "computer/internet" box. The makers such as Sony, Nintendo, et. all have come right out and stated exactly that. Does it surprize anyone that Microsoft has developed a strategy to fight this? This is not a new market that Microsoft is entering, but rather it's, at least with the newer consoles, an extension of the battle for the home PC market. By stalling purchases now and introducing an extremely powerful gaming platform soon Microsoft is doing a great job keeping the developers and users in "PC land". I don't fault them whatsoever for it, and I hope it's massively successful.

    It is so intriguing when companies like Nintendo and Sony are seen as underdogs or the "good guys" in cases like this. Are you people all on crack or something?

    Of course Nintendo is upset about MS stalling new purchases in lieu of the X-Box. Nintendo has a product on the shelves, an ancient product with games that are seriously overpriced, that they are rolling in the dough with and of course they don't like Microsoft threatening it. Good for them. However they are not holding a moral high ground here : This is cut-throat busienss.

  • Either 1) Nintendo's VP of marketing is hopelessly unschooled in English grammar or 2) this is a hoax. The punctuation is worse that the average /. post. If this is all the better Nintendo can do in communicating with its retailers, they are already doomed.

  • Microsoft vs. Nintendo...the world hasn't seen an evil-versus-evil matchup like this since Stalin vs. the Little Corporal.

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