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Movies Stars Seek More Control Over Videogames 66

Posted by simoniker from the zombies-ate-ben-affleck dept.
stoolpigeon writes "MSNBC has an article about major actors and their relationship to videogames, saying: 'The trickle of A-list talent appearing in games has turned into a torrent of late and beyond publicity, the trend has triggered changes in game development. Stars now work with game producers on story and character development as agents and lawyers try to figure out how an actor can maintain his 'image,' in an interactive environment.'"
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Movies Stars Seek More Control Over Videogames More

Movies Stars Seek More Control Over Videogames

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  • Proactive rather then reactive (Score:3, Interesting)

    by servicepack158 ( 678320 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @08:08AM (#8338244) Homepage
    This can't be a bad thing :)

  • Could be a slippery slope (Score:5, Interesting)

    by darkmayo ( 251580 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @08:15AM (#8338271)
    but considering most games that had featured real actors have been flakey movie spinoffs I don't think we have too much to worry about, if its a movie based game then what the character would do and whatnot probably has already been established. Other than a few exceptions (like onimusha 3 that has Jean Reno and the likeness of a dead Japanese) I don't think most celebrities will make the plunge into videogames especially if the developers aren't willing to shell out the bucks to have some a-list actors name on the project... tho it would be a dark day if all the production costs went to paying for celebs.....

    anyways back to playing Street Fighter the Movie.. :P

  • Great. (Score:5, Funny)

    by Dolemite_the_Wiz ( 618862 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @08:22AM (#8338295) Journal
    If this is going to be the new trend then it's just a matter of time before the Gigli of Video games is put on the market. ::hurl::

    Dolemite
    __________________

    • Re:Great. (Score:5, Funny)

      by *weasel ( 174362 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @09:26AM (#8338580)
      it isn't as if a lack of J.Lo and B.Flek meshes have stopped games of that quality/hype level from being made anyway.

      Daikatana anyone?

      • Re:Great. (Score:3, Funny)

        by fuzzybunny ( 112938 )
        Giglikatana. 'Nuf said.

        Maybe, and we can hope, two negatives would end up as a positive and we'd have a killer game.

        "You are a mafia assassin using your great big butt to hunt down beasties through time" or something.

  • Why do people like famous actors? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by 0x0d0a ( 568518 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @08:41AM (#8338368) Journal
    I've always wondered why people like movies with famous actors at all *anyway*.

    Sure, they can generally act well, but there are a lot of good actors out in the world.

    And the down side of having a famous actor is significant. You are constantly having the fact that the actor is the *actor* thrown in your face. It's much harder to achieve the illusion of the actor being the character in the movie. Sure, for some movies it doesn't matter. When you go watch an Arnold Schwarzenegger or Jackie Chan movie, you aren't going to see the character -- you're going because you want to see Schwarzenegger or Chan doing more of their trademark things. You aren't going to fall into the false reality of the movie, because, well, you're watching *Jackie Chan*!

    For most movies, I *much* prefer when I don't know the actor -- maybe there's a really extensive makeup job done, or the actor is much older or younger than in any other movies that I've seen him in, or I just plain haven't seen the actor before. It means that I'm watching the *character*, not the *actor*.

    I am interested to see what happens when good CG (starting somewhere around Gollum in LoTR) becomes more pervasive and it's not as readily apparent who is acting as what character.

  • Hmmm... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Bluesman ( 104513 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @08:44AM (#8338380) Homepage
    "as agents and lawyers try to figure out how an actor can maintain his 'image,' in an interactive environment."

    Simple. Make sure the character makes idiotic virtual public statements once in a while and gets divorced at least once during the course of the game.
    • Don't forget that the virtual actor also has to have a virtual home pr0n released and sold without their virtual permission. Sheesh! And to think that Pamela and Paris had issues. Imagine what Lara must think of Nude Raider!

  • Bahahahah! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Ender Ryan ( 79406 ) <TOKYO minus city> on Friday February 20, 2004 @09:12AM (#8338504) Journal
    I say, let them eat cake!

    Seriously, the gaming industry doesn't need Hollywood asshats to fuck up more games than are already fucked up by movie-licensing and the like. The best games have absolutely no Hollywood contributed components.

    I'm not against famous actors lending their voices to games, quite the contrary, but they should stop at that, IMHO.

    OTOH, a lot of games have such horrible writing that they make Hollywood look good, heh.

    • Medal of Honor and Call of duty. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by SmallFurryCreature ( 593017 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @09:52AM (#8338756) Journal
      Don't tell me that these games (the good bits meaning the none dungeon crawling bits) weren't inspired by "Saving private ryan" and "Band of brothers".

      At least it is not the old interactive movie crap.

      And script writing for games is very very hard. In movies the audience is passive. In games the audience is supposed to be in some kind of control.

      I hate the movie script of Max Payne. I am in a warehouse killing bad guys left and right without any worries about police procedure. Then I hear a couple of thugs holding someone hostage. So what happens? Control is taken away and ME does something really really stupid and gets the hostage killed. BAD writing. It could work in a movie but in a game I AM MAX PAYNE and I am not an idiot.

      OFP Resistance has the main character constantly whining about how he hates wars and really doesn't want to fight. Yes nice speech. Except I am supposed to be the character and I bought a war game. Spare the pacifism and lets go shoot someone. (when are we getting a war game in wich units can surrender? (and that ain't hex-based))

      This has been true for all games with a story. How to make sure the personality of the player and the character in the game match. Dramatic plot twist like the dead of a character are the proven elements in a movie but hard to do in a game apparently. All somehow seem determined to make it integrate with the players action. Wing commander, you kill all the baddies in a second yet still your wingmate buys the farm. Doesn't matter how good or bad you are, it is scripted and she dies. BAD

      The better way? Make it happen outside the PERCEIVED area of control of the player. You and her go on different patrols. You hear her patrol being ambushed and change course to intercept. As you come closer you hear more messages until you are close and the patrol is wiped out. Far less frustating I think, a really good script writer could improve it of course.

      System Shock worked well for me since all the plot happened before you arrived on the scene. So people fighting and dying is totally outside your control yet you still can have the plot of finding out about a desperate struggle. But all the deaths are outside your characters control.

      • One game that did a pretty good job of keeping a script while giving the player more control was Deus Ex, although I would have appreciated the central plot choice offering two very different paths. For those who have played it, the airplane bit with Anna and other guy. It would have rocked to have been able to make either choicen and play a whole different plotline. Another old one was Alien Legacy, an old Sierra game, where you were colonizing a new solar system. The plot was similar to System Shock,
      • The better way? Make it happen outside the PERCEIVED area of control of the player. You and her go on different patrols. You hear her patrol being ambushed and change course to intercept. As you come closer you hear more messages until you are close and the patrol is wiped out. Far less frustating I think, a really good script writer could improve it of course.

        That is a somewhat better way, but still lacks. It is still scripted, and the player can not do anything about it.

        Although I have not played it, I
      • The original Deus Ex handled this pretty well for the most part. Sure, it was heavily scripted, and when it came to the crunch you weren't actually allowed to choose not to leave UNATCO, but you still got a fair amount of control over which characters died when, if they even died at all (was it actually necessary to kill anyone apart from Navarre? I'm pretty sure she's the only person you can't let live).

        BTW, don't forget the characters who are still alive when you begin System Shock. You can't have for
        • Diego is still alive when you meet him... sorta.

          I really like the emails coming in. Or Shodan's messages coming right after the "click... blaaaaaaaam!"

          I need to play that game again.. or at least load up the sountrack again. Only got the "Glory to the many" song in my head..
      • The better way? Make it happen outside the PERCEIVED area of control of the player. You and her go on different patrols. You hear her patrol being ambushed and change course to intercept. As you come closer you hear more messages until you are close and the patrol is wiped out. Far less frustating I think, a really good script writer could improve it of course.

        Actually in Wing Commander Prophecy (PC version, haven't played the GBA remake), they do something you describe. In one mission, your taking off fr

      • Excellent post.

        I knew I wasn't going to buy MP2 after the hostage thing in the demo.

        HalfLife, on the other hand, seemed to rarely break you out of interactivity. In the parts I have played up to, dialog and plot are all progressed in the engine, rather than cutscenes. This may change later in the game, I don't know.

        In ST:Elite Force I experimented with going berserk in the armory and just zapping everyone in sight. I can't remember exactly, but a security crew came in and blasted me or they exposed the c

  • Poor decision making (Score:4, Interesting)

    by mwheeler01 ( 625017 ) <`matthew.l.wheeler' `at' `gmail.com'> on Friday February 20, 2004 @09:30AM (#8338608)
    <rant>Considering the poor quality of some of the appearances and likenesses in some video games, I've often wondered what makes movie stars still want to participate. If it was the money offered by the game companies, a desperate attempt to resurrect a carreer (as is undoubtedly the case with Mark Hammil in the Wing Commander role), or just trying to make a poorly executed connection with an audience they don't normally reach. If I were a movie star I'd at least want to see an alpha of the game or let my son/nephew/random kid off the street play it before throwing my weight behind it. Regardless of the situation I can only see things getting better because they certainly couldn't get much worse than a couple of years ago.</rant>

    • Re:Poor decision making (Score:3, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      ...as is undoubtedly the case with Mark Hammil in the Wing Commander role...

      I would have to disagree with this statement. While he is known for those movies he did 30 odd years ago, for the last ten years Mark Hammil has been a professional voice actor lending his talent to a huge number [tvtome.com] of animated shows. Just from listening to his definitive Joker in Batman the Animated Series you can tell he is one of the best voice actors around.

      • I agree that he does a great job voice acting, his joker voice is really good (especially in Mask of the Phantasm) but I still think he was trying to recapture some of his former glory.

    • Re:Poor decision making (Score:1, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      a desperate attempt to resurrect a carreer (as is undoubtedly the case with Mark Hammil in the Wing Commander role)

      What was John Rhys-Davies' excuse, then? I know he was at least famous enough that I was surprised when I saw his name in the opening credits of WC3. And of course there's Todd "Maniac" Marshall, played by Tom "Biff" Wilson, which I mention only because I get a kick out of it. The point is that the cast of that game was not entirely made up of unknowns and hasbeens. That doesn't mean the

  • Slackers... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Metal_Demon ( 694989 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @09:31AM (#8338617)
    The trickle of A-list talent appearing in games has turned into a torrent of late and beyond publicity

    Whats up with the editors? A torrent without a link?

  • Thank goodness! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by SandSpider ( 60727 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @09:39AM (#8338671) Homepage Journal
    There's another class of people who don't understand interactive storytelling ready to add the cacophony of "This is the way we want it done, oh and it better work as a game."

    Just when developers finally start to get the hang of the movie translation, and just a producers learn how to deal with marketing and management and publishers and every idiot who thinks that they know how to make a game, and it's pretty much the same thing as writing their high-school english essays but easier, since it's a game, and how hard can that be, there's a brand new class of people who come along. Not only that, a brand new class of really pushy people. Oh, hooray.

    On a slightly less sarcastic note, yes, there have been many, many bad video games featuring actors, and some of those very good actors, and perhaps this will help out. At least to have someone say, "Wow, these lines are really cheesy. Who wrote this, the programmers?" (Cause, you know, sometimes programmers like to help out on the dialogue, too.) But I can't help but feel impending doom for at least 5 years of this actor/agent-as-game-designer thing starts gaining momentum.

    =Brian
    • Cause, you know, sometimes programmers like to help out on the dialogue, too

      "Ok, dude, get this: then right as the player's ship has been slowed by the tractor beam, the bad guy goes 'All your base are belong to us!' Wouldn't that be f@#$ing awesome? Man, script writing is easy!"

  • Unnecessary and unwanted (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 20, 2004 @09:53AM (#8338761)
    Not only are celebrity VG actors unnecessary (games don't regularly make use of full-motion video, even for cut scenes anymore), they're unwanted. Just as with feature-length animation, the main thing recognizable celebrity voices add to video games is distraction from the content.

    Games are not a passive medium, anyway. The player character is the "actor" in a game, and its "star". Shifting that focus to celebrities because they are whiny starry-eyed bitches with no conception of their actual utility in the real world just makes games unappealing.
    • Games are not a passive medium, anyway. The player character is the "actor" in a game, and its "star". Shifting that focus to celebrities because they are whiny starry-eyed bitches with no conception of their actual utility in the real world just makes games unappealing.

      I wouldn't want to have a celebrity doing the voice for what should be my character. I agree with you -- that would be very annoying. However, it wouldn't be so bad if you had some kind of guide, whose voice was done by a famous actor.

  • Say good-bye to modding, hello IP enforcement... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Gyler St. James ( 637482 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @10:08AM (#8338869)
    Draconian enforcement, that is. Has anyone thought about the ramifactions this will have to how "open" games will be? Here's a choice quote from the article: "The fact that a player has the ability to control the character presents issues,".

    It's already been announced by EA that there will be no PC version of the upcoming "Everything or Nothing" Bond game. I wonder why? "What would happen to an actor's career, for example, if it was discovered that a player could have use his or her character to perform violent or sordid acts and then post screenshots on the Internet?"

    Although I love the idea of game developers getting more access to Hollywood, the possiblities for abuse of the medium will be incredibly high...all too easy even. What will happen when people try to crack the console-only versions of the games and post working hacks on hacked Xboxes, GameCubes and PS2s? Can anyone smell DMCA waving all over that? Don't be surprised when the first $100+ million game is developed, with 90% being agent, lawyer, producers, etc. fees. This is not entirely good news for the gaming industry as a whole, especially after the new FBI seal they got.

    There will be a war on consumers and it's already gearing up.

  • Yeah, most games based on movies tend to suck. The Hollywoodization (wee, I made up a word!) of games probably isn't a good thing.

    On the other hand, actors can sometimes add to a game. English voice acting in games is usually horrible, but when done by real actors, it's usually pretty good. Even without the voice acting, it's interesting to see people you already know playing video game characters. Was I the only one who liked Mark Hammil in the Wing Commander series?

  • The First Game To Come Out (Score:5, Funny)

    by hambonewilkins ( 739531 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @11:15AM (#8339416)
    Supposedly, the cast of TV's Friends has teamed with Maxis for complete image control of the new "Sims: Friends", which takes the level of not having real friends one step further.

    Said series creator Wil Wright: "It's a perfect combination. People play the Sims to pretend like they have a real life and a job. People watch the TV show 'Friends' to pretend like they have a real group of close-knit friends. We're creating a real synergy here."

    Geeks are disappointed with the decision, hoping for either a "Buffy" or "Farscape" version of the popular sim-game. Due to a lack of demand from the general public for either, geeks will likely hack the game to create it themselves.
    -Gamespot

    • I know a couple of people who have turned down interacting with real people and instead stayed home to play the Sims.

      I can't wait till they have a game that simulates watching TV. You get to see your character sit on the couch and watch TV. I bet it would be a smash hit.

  • Article Text (Score:4, Informative)

    by ksiddique ( 749168 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @11:37AM (#8339627) Homepage
    I couldn't load this in Firefox for some reason so here's the text from IE

    --

    Electronic Arts
    "Oh James!" Pierce Brosnan and Mya in 'Everything or Nothing'
    By Tom Loftus
    Columnist
    MSNBC
    Updated: 1:17 p.m. ET Feb. 19, 2004You know the love affair between Hollywood and video games is in full bloom when Judi Dench appears in a game. Yes, that Judi Dench, noted Shakespearean actress, Dame of the British Empire, Oscar winner and now star of Electronic Arts's upcoming James Bond title, "Everything or Nothing."

    advertisement

    The trickle of A-list talent appearing in games has turned into a torrent of late and beyond publicity, the trend has triggered changes in game development. Stars now work with game producers on story and character development as agents and lawyers try to figure out how an actor can maintain his "image," in an interactive environment.

    When Electronic Arts decided to create a new James Bond game, among its first actions was to make an offer to Pierce Brosnan, the actor who has played 007 for the last four years.

    The offer was unusual: There was no film to support the game's release. The script, the soundtrack, the girls ... everything would be digital.

    Producer Joel Wade remembers Brosnan's reaction. "Pierce thought it would be odd if someone else played him," he said.

    Such an exchange was nearly impossible just a few years ago. A 40-plus-year-old A-list actor pondering whether or not to appear in a game? Heck, even Roger Moore would have been loathe to actively participate in what was once the perceived domain of momma's boys.

    "Traditionally, Hollywood signed away rights without any expertise or any idea of the plot lines," said industry analyst P.J. McNealy.

    Several factors helped change Hollywood's mind. Technology advanced exponentially, making it possible to accurately recreate the voice, looks and movements of real people. Another factor was the Sony PlayStation 2. Or to be more exact, 60 million PS2s, GameCubes and Xboxes sold in the United States alone.

    As games became synonymous with mass entertainment, Hollywood got it. The movie executives who chanted "cross-branding" and "synergy" at power lunches got it. Game developers got it. Even the actors got it. Soon Electronic Arts was convincing not only Brosnan, but Bond regulars John Cleese ('Q') and Judi Dench ('M') as well as William Dafoe, Heidi Klum and Mya to join "Everything or Nothing."

    And the sound of "ka-ching" rumbled down the California coastal range from Silicon Valley to the Hollywood Hills.

    From co-stars to co-creators
    It's not only about the money. As more and more stars realize the impact a game appearance can have on their careers, they are starting to contribute to the creative process.

    Sony Computer Entertainment America Inc.
    Jet Li in "Rise to Honor"

    While developing Sony's upcoming martial arts game "Rise to Honor," producer Jim Wallace hit a potential roadblock. The storyboard called for a scene where the protagonist Kit Yuen, a Hong Kong gangland tough, would have to battle an evil nurse.

    That was a problem. Yuen was voice-acted by action star Jet Li who, in his films, was known to reject any scene that called for him to fight women.

    "I called Jet up and said 'hey, is this cool?'" Wallace said. "And he said, oh yeah, that it would work."

    Such double-checking isn't unusual in films; actors, depending on their leverage, regularly have a say. But in the comparatively cloistered world of game development, such level of involvement is new.

    And with increasing frequency, game publishers are learning to listen.

    For "Rise to Honor," Li not only vetted scenes with Wallace, but brought along his longtime collaborator Corey Yuen, who worked with Sony on the fighting system -- the underlying combat technology -- so that it dovetailed with Li's signature moves.

    The middlemen
    "It's very important that the closer the game developers are

  • No involvement (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Robmonster ( 158873 ) <slashdot.journal2.store@neverbox.com> on Friday February 20, 2004 @11:57AM (#8339837) Journal
    In my opinion 'Stars' shoulkd have no involvement with the plot of a game, or character development. The game should be written, and then the 'talent' found to fit the role.

    Leave the game design to those who design games well, and leave the acting to those who act well.

    Whats next? Game developers telling movie producers to include a car chase in their movie, as they have already written a great driving section for the spin-off game?

  • The L[i|ee]s and Appropriate Use (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Discoflamingo13 ( 90009 ) on Friday February 20, 2004 @12:24PM (#8340097) Homepage Journal

    My experience with BtVS: Chaos Bleeds has cemented my belief that franchise video games can be made or broken by the presence of the actors originally involved - but what about when the actor is, themself, a franchise in their own right?

    In my experience, rabid gamers/Hong Kong action buffs are quick to point out that virtually every fighting game based in the "real world" already has Bruce Lee and Jet Li in it. If you don't believe me - DoA and Tekken. The characters' names and looks are different enough to not force a lawsuit, but seriously - what the hell? I would much rather Jet Li was transparently involved in the creation of a character that is using his image than that he stood back and did nothing.

  • Lets have actors playing parts in some first person shooter. Ben hunts down jlo with a railgun or something.
  • Games companies nowadays scan movie actor/actresses faces, I don't know what's to complain about... they look almost identical to real life.

    Back in the 8 bit days when every movie star was just a square block... that's when they should be bitching. Not now.
  • I understand Val Kilmer is still pissed off about this [klov.com].

    Said he wasn't even asked.
  • Well maybe *I* don't want then to be in games since royalties to them will redice profits to devs, or worse, increase costs to me.

    I think we need to start a new type of game we can play with our 'movie star games': Put the celebrity in compromising positions! Make them commit crimes agaisnt humanity! Post the pics/vids on the net!

    Seriously, we don't need or want stars in our games. Perhaps they could serve some use as voice actors, perhaps they won't (David duschovny was shit in XIII). No need to stuff it

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