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Rockstar Announces GTA San Andreas 522

Posted by simoniker
from the xbox-owners-crying-into-cereal-bowl dept.
Tickenest writes "According to a Yahoo-reprinted press-release, Rockstar Games has officially announced Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas, the latest in the GTA series. The press release continues: 'Developed by world-class designers Rockstar North, Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas will be available exclusively for the PlayStation(R)2 computer entertainment system and is expected to be in stores in North America on October 19, 2004 and in Europe on October 22, 2004.'" This confirms earlier rumors of (initial?) PS2 exclusivity and possible name for this much-awaited game.
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Rockstar Announces GTA San Andreas

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  • by sweeney37 (325921) * <mikesweeney@gmai[ ]om ['l.c' in gap]> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:30PM (#8430672) Homepage Journal
    Is this is going to be something new or just the GTA engine with some minimal improvements and a new locale? My guess is that it's the later, from what I remember GTA 4 was supposed to be an all-together new game.

    Mike
    • by MaxQuordlepleen (236397) <el_duggio@hotmail.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:33PM (#8430705) Homepage

      If you download your free copy of GTA 1 from the Rockstar web site ( here [rockstargames.com] ) , you'll find that "Liberty City", "Vice City" and "San Andreas" are the names of the three playable cities from that game.

    • by dave420 (699308) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:37PM (#8430773)
      You're talking as if GTA4 was a bad game... it's clearly one of their most successful games ever, and the series has one of the largest followings around.

      I think we'd be lucky if it was the GTA engine with minimal improvements in a new locale :) we'd be guaranteed a great game.

      • It's not that 'Vice City' wasn't a good game, in fact it's a great game. But even though it was a great game it was a re-hash, it was basically exactly like GTA 3 with some bells and whistles. It was fun but nothing as mind blowing as GTA 3 was.

        Your right even with minimal improvements it would still would be a great game, but to be perfectly honest it wouldn't really feel like a new game.

        Mike
      • by gughunter (188183) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:08PM (#8431236) Homepage
        I think Vice City was, in Rockstar taxonomy, a continuation of the "GTA3 line." I believe the idea was that GTA4 would be "revolutionary" instead of "evolutionary," and probably not available until the next generation of consoles arrives.
    • by drunkentiger (556459) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:47PM (#8430913)
      My guess is that it's the later, from what I remember GTA 4 was supposed to be an all-together new game.

      Yes, rumors are that the real sequel to GTA3 (e.g. not just an "expansion pack" like vice city/san andreas) will be developed for next-gen consoles (xbox2, ps3). Always remember to take your grain of salt.
    • by zero-one (79216) <jonwpayneNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:48PM (#8430933) Homepage
      "The same GTA engine [...] with a new locale" isn't necessarily a bad thing. Both the games based on the GTA 3 engine have been very playable.

      If they have got a game engine that does what they need, there is no need to re-write it for every version. Not many film reviews say "same old camera, different plot".

      I was going to suggest that maybe game engines have evolved to the point where most of the effort of making a game can go into the content rather than the technology. Then I thought about all the LucasArts games based on similar SCUMM engines.

      Perhaps the rule of thumb is that games need to have a certain amount of "newness" but it doesn't really matter if it comes from the technology or the content.
      • by PainKilleR-CE (597083) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:59PM (#8431095)
        "The same GTA engine [...] with a new locale" isn't necessarily a bad thing. Both the games based on the GTA 3 engine have been very playable.

        If they have got a game engine that does what they need, there is no need to re-write it for every version.


        Additionally, it's not like the hardware got any better in the time from the start of the work on GTA3 to the present. Incremental additions, even minor, to the existing engine are far more effective on a fixed platform than they ever would be on a variable platform like the PC. At the same time, they have an existing engine that has counterparts on the PC and XBox, all of which probably use a lot of common content (though the artwork on the PC and XBox games is obviously superior to the PS2 version, the PS2 art could be generated from the PC art if they made this game with future ports in mind). They can always add the incremental improvements into the engine's ports and then polish the ports according to the platform's capabilities (ie the PC version could increase quite a bit more than either the PS2 or XBox versions), but all of that is a matter of adding workload to what is essentially supposed to be the same game.

        If this were a strictly PC-based series, I'd expect much more improvement between titles, but in the case of a series in which 3 titles are released on the same platform, with absolutely no change in the platform's capabilities in the interim, there's not much point to rewriting the engine. They certainly added to it technically in GTA:VC, giving the game motion blur, better graphics, and interior areas. None of these things are really the items most people mention when they talk about the changes in Vice City, but in reality they were probably the biggest challenges they faced, technically, in building the game (of course, I don't know whether 2-wheeled vehicles were an engine limitation or not, and it's quite possible that was among the most technically challenging portions of the game's development).
    • by fafaforza (248976) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:58PM (#8431080)
      I think they should license the engine from the "Driver" series and incorporate it into the game, or write an updated engine similar to that one. Cars in GTA felt too much like cardboard cutouts. With a better engine, GTA would be utopia.
    • by mrselfdestrukt (149193) <nollie_A7_firstcounsel_com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:17PM (#8431369) Homepage Journal
      Who cares! GTA VC was not much better than GTA3. Engine still basically the same. Textures changed, different cars and ability to fly helicopters, ride bikes etc. But therein lies the beauty. It's about the storyline, the different feel. Yes, it was a major bonus to have a bit more freedom and that's what I think they will probably improve in GTA: SanAn but I still enjoy playing GTA3 every now and then even though I clocked both.Small differences and a different timeline and improvement in the AI will make this one even better although probably not much different visually from the others. I've been a GTA fan from the first one and the only one that dissapointed me was GTA2. I for one cannot wait to get my hands on this one!
    • by fenix down (206580) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:49PM (#8431930)
      I just want some goddamn multiplayer already. I don't even care if it's online, I just want to be able to sit in the back of the damn pickup truck with the rocket launcher while somebody drives me around.
  • Too bad... (Score:5, Troll)

    by dfj225 (587560) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:31PM (#8430682) Homepage Journal
    I was looking forward to the xbox edition.
  • Awesome! (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:32PM (#8430691)
    I want to be in an earthquake doing 160 along the fault line! Sweet!

    =P Seriously it would be awesome to have an earthquake in a game, I don't think any other GTA-style game has done something like that (i.e. disaster scenarios).

  • exclusivity (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Neophytus (642863) * on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:32PM (#8430693)
    Is this console exclusivity or won't it be reaching the PC at all. They've been vauge in the past and having just released 3 & 4 for the xbox I expect that cash will speak the loudest words.
    • Re:exclusivity (Score:5, Informative)

      by PainKilleR-CE (597083) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:39PM (#8430795)
      Is this console exclusivity or won't it be reaching the PC at all.

      If any previous game with PS2 exclusivity (including Rockstar's games) is any indicator, this announcement has no impact on any possible PC release. That being said, it's doubtful it will be released for the PC for a while.

      They've been vauge in the past and having just released 3 & 4 for the xbox I expect that cash will speak the loudest words

      Just a note, GTA:Vice City isn't GTA4, and neither is San Andreas. VC and SA are simply continuations of GTA3 (given that Liberty City, Vice City, and San Andreas are the playable areas in GTA, and that Rockstar was very explicit about this before and during the launch of Vice City). GTA4 has been hovering around for quite some time, but it doesn't really appear that they've done much on that, given the amount of work they've put into the GTA3 titles.
    • Re:exclusivity (Score:4, Redundant)

      by nharmon (97591) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:40PM (#8430818) Homepage
      GTA: Vice City was released "exclusively for the console", although we see now that it is on PC.

      You will not see GTA:SA for the PC until probably early 2006.

      I'm glad to see they aren't waiting for the next Playstation, which means the PS2 I bought in order to play Vice City will also work with San Andreas!

      I, for one, welcome our new GTA overlords.
  • by ackthpt (218170) * on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:32PM (#8430701) Homepage Journal
    San Andreas? Where'd they get that name? How about Grand Theft Bicycle: Vatican
  • by jeblucas (560748) <{jeblucas} {at} {gmail.com}> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:34PM (#8430713) Homepage Journal
    That's the real key. GTA:Vice City locked up a lot of the decent 80's tunes. Is this one going for a Starsky & Hutch 70's groove, or a 90's grungy/glam sound?

    Oh yeah, I hope the game is fun too.

    • by Quill (238781) <martin@NOsPAm.simaltech.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:41PM (#8430823) Homepage
      I have to say, the 80's setting + the real music (which was the only way to make the setting convincing) in Vice City is what made the game for me. The press like to look at GTA as a stupid, ultra-violent shooter - but it's one of the most well put together and balanced game I've played. The production standards at Rockstar are through the roof.

      • by ivan256 (17499) * on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:15PM (#8431346)
        The production standards at Rockstar are through the roof.

        You're talking about the same company that published "Midnight Club" and "Oni"; two of the buggiest and most incomplete PS2 games ever. They bought DMA design after the GTA3 engine was complete, which is probably why the GTA titles are high quality. With their other titles, they have a bit of a history of pushing things out before they are ready.
        • by daddy norcal (734037) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:45PM (#8431860) Homepage
          To those complaining that Rockstar lacks production polish, citing games that came out 3 years ago like 'Oni' (see Bungie for that one)Let's just have a little history lesson, shall we?

          Manhunt - Excellent twist on the stealth genre, great game play, killer sounds. Hollywood stars rounding out the voice casts. "..the most important game in the last 5 years..." -The Chicago Tribune

          Max Payne 2 - Love it or hate it, this game on Xbox/PC is gorgeous. The textures and level designs are top notch. Story is on par with most movies being churned out by any major hollywood studio. Artistic storyboards, full mo-capped character models, and again, excellent voice acting round out this game. Several PC GOTY and Action GOTY nods.

          GTA:VC - Dozens of authentic tracks from the time perioud. Amazing radio stations and voice acting. Full hollywood cast. Beautiful cut scenes. Immersive, large locale. Game of the year almost everwhere, including an Academy of Interactive Arts and Sciences award.

          Midnight Club 2 - 9.1 out of 10 IGN. 91 out of 100 Gamerankings. Killer music, awesome graphics and killer gameplay including online component. Set a new standard for environment freedom in a racing game.

          What makes Rockstar great is not just their awesome games, but their attention to production and detail which blur the lines between games and other traditional forms of entertainment, such as movies. I have a feeling GTA:San Andreas will be no different.
  • Tools needed (Score:5, Interesting)

    by IamGarageGuy 2 (687655) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:34PM (#8430714) Journal
    Do they make tools for building your own world yet? It would be fun to cruise around your hometown a la Doom.
    • Renderware platform. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by kyz (225372) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:57PM (#8431064) Homepage
      The game is mostly a huge bunch of data on top of Renderware Platform. The difficulting in creating the game is the huge amount of artwork required. Unlike a racing game or DOOM, you need to fill an entire city where every building needs all four sides and the roof defined, plus needs a multitude of models so it looks good both close up and at a distance.
  • San Andreas (Score:5, Funny)

    by SabrStryk (323739) <sabrstryk@caroli ... r.com minus city> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:34PM (#8430718)
    San Andreas sounds rather based on L.A....

    "You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy in all the galaxy...."

    I.E., a perfect setting!
    • by product byproduct (628318) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:42PM (#8430839)
      That would be:

      Grand Theft Speeder: Mos Esley
    • Re:San Andreas (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Belgand (14099) <[moc.ssertroftenalp] [ta] [dnagleb]> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:53PM (#8431019) Homepage
      Personally I'm hoping for more of a San Francisco setting myself. Maybe it's just been far too many cop shows, Bullit, Dirty Harry, etc. but San Francisco just seems more right to me. Not to mention the kind of insane stunts you could get on those hills as well as having a great deal more character to it.

      L.A. ... well, I don't really see a lot that you could easily do with it to make it seem as fun of a setting. Not to mention the fact that Rockstar seems very much into doing pastiches of film/tv (i.e. Vice City largely being Miami Vice thrown in with Scarface) there's a lot more ground to work with.

      As for the time... well, the 70s could be cool and replicate the same sort of retro-vibe they've been going for, but personally I'd like to see them try their hands at something even older. I mean, how about a late 40s, early 50s noirish L.A.-based setting that draws on Chinatown and L.A. Confidential. Music would be radically different, but on the other hand so would the cars, clothes, weapons... everything would be a lot less derivative. Plus, I really can't remember the last time I saw something of this sort done from the criminal's perspective. It would be an interesting approach to things.
      • Re:San Andreas (Score:4, Interesting)

        by gughunter (188183) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:20PM (#8431396) Homepage
        > Personally I'm hoping for more of a San Francisco setting myself.

        From what I remember of GTA 1, there was a big red Golden-Gate-like bridge, so that may be what they have in mind. Also the "San" shared by "San Francisco" and "San Andreas" could be a clue.

        > As for the time... well, the 70s could be cool and replicate the same sort of retro-vibe they've been going for, but personally I'd like to see them try their hands at something even older. I mean, how about a late 40s, early 50s noirish L.A.-based setting that draws on Chinatown and L.A. Confidential.

        Good idea, but there's one problem: no stats list item that reads "Least favorite gang: Hippies".

        I guess "beatniks" could work, though...
  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:35PM (#8430743)
    instead of having a generic ambulance mode, we'll have it transformed into a mode where you chase after gang fights and save the hatians lives after being injured by the evil cubans.

    then in grand theft auto: los vegas, you'll deliver hatian hookers to cubans and vice versa to promote love between them and settle the gripes of the previous game by the cuban community.
  • Console vs. PC (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Quill (238781) <martin@NOsPAm.simaltech.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:37PM (#8430772) Homepage
    No screenshots? Aw man...

    GTA is fabulous in that in manages to blur the distinction between genres, something that many have tried but few have succeeded.

    It's interesting, because I've always loved RPGs, but never been a fan of shooters or racing games. I would never call GTA an RPG, but I would call it a shooter/racing game - but I love it!

    The weirdest thing for me is that it's actually making me appreciate consoles. I've been a PC game snob, and my first GTA was Vice City on the PC. I was convinced that superior graphics + smaller load time was better, but having just bought a PS2 with GTA 3 + Vice City, I'm starting to understand that some games are just *made* to be played on consoles.
    • Re:Console vs. PC (Score:5, Interesting)

      by phriedom (561200) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:55PM (#8432022)
      I wouldn't call Vice City an RPG either, but it does have some RPG elements in that you do build up your character. When you complete all the firetruck missions he becomes fireproof, when you complete the ambulance missions, he can run without getting tired, etc. I'm just sayin' you're right, it really blurs the genre lines.

      But I still think the GTA3 games are better on the PC. My solution was to get an adapter to plug my old dual shock PS1 controller into my USB port. I used the sticks to drive and the mouse to shoot and it seemed like I got the best of both worlds without paying for an entire console.

      The other giant advantage that the PC version gives you is that you can modify it. When I got tired of driving normal cars and dealing with traffic, I downloaded a car stat editor and made one of the unique vehicles (so I wouldn't run into someone else driving one) max speed, max accel, 40000 weight, 4wd, .000000001 damage, max braking, and I made the center-of-gravity about a foot below the ground level so it would always roll back on its wheels like a weeble-wobble. I also lowered it a bit so that when I hit other cars they would pop up into the air. That led to a mini-game of how far can you make the other cars go in the air, hours of fun.
  • by newdamage (753043) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:38PM (#8430783) Homepage Journal
    1. Umm, swimming, a little bit, please?
    2. More indoor environments.
    3. More flying (helicopters were hands down the best improvement to the vehicles in GTA: VC).
    4. The property buying in GTA:VC was a good first step, but it can be expanded so much further.
    5. NPC drivers, accomplices, bodyguards for hire, etc, etc.

    And while I know everybody is clamoring for better graphics, am I the only one that thinks the current engine from GTA:VC got the job done? I'll take gameplay over graphics any day.
    • by Quill (238781) <martin@NOsPAm.simaltech.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:47PM (#8430908) Homepage
      Swimming?

      What kind of crap is that? Everyone knows that in the real world when you plow your car into the water, you should just sit in it until it sinks to the bottom of the ocean. You'll just wake up in front of the hospital in a few hours.

      Now, if you'll excuse me I have to pop this adrenaline pill and jump on the roof of my house. I think someone left a shotgun there.

      Now, to reply seriously, the #1 feature for me in VC was the property buying. I too would like to see it expanded. I would also like to see more use for money in the game - you always finish with millions of dollars you never need.
    • One more request; I always like biking around in GTA:VC. Police bikes (maybe just take the PCJ 600 and add a siren and flashing light) would be cool.
    • by British (51765) <british1500@gmail.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:52PM (#8430994) Homepage Journal
      I would like to see more dynamics with the pedestrians. There's o so much they can do with the virtual city they have.

      how about..

      1. People getting in and out of cars? We only saw this to a limited extent(cops getting out of cars, carjackigns, etc). How about taxis that pickup/drop off people at random?

      2. Different behaviors for different kind of peds? Some would be cowardly, some would be valiant, and some would be just downright crazy, all gang members aside.

      3. yes, more indoor locations.

      4. I haven't gotten to it yet, but looks like a lot of people got frustrated with "The Driver" mission. I got stuck several times of Death Row, but eventually figured out a plan: take the chopper to get to the junkyard, and fly him to the hospital. If you fly westward a bit, Diaz's Comet car-driving thugs get stuck(since they take a linear route) in the entry area to the junkyard.

      Either way, I'll be buying it the minute it's availble.
      • the driver (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Nf1nk (443791) <nf1nk@noSPam.yahoo.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:57PM (#8431065) Homepage
        I find the most fun way to do this mission is to fight my way to the trash truck and then the goons in the comets just bounce off you. much more satisfying than the helo method (unless you use the apache, but that is another post)
      • (Very minor spoilers below)

        Death Row is made easier if you take the Trashmaster that's in the middle of the junkyard (although one time it wasn't there). Like Nf1nk said, the other cars just bounce right off. The helicopter is another option, although not by any means necessary.

        I think The Driver isn't all that challenging... if you're a pretty good driver. Stay as close to Hilary as you can, and eventually he'll make a mistake. There's no secret, you just need to have a good feel for the physics of t
    • by Nf1nk (443791) <nf1nk@noSPam.yahoo.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:02PM (#8431153) Homepage
      adding on
      1.I would like semi tractor trailers that can jack knife in an accident
      2. Multi player.
      3. bring back the semi open ended mission structure of GTA 1, where you don't have to keep repeating the same mission over and over again if you can't quite pull it off.
      4. more and bigger explosions (think tanker trucks, gas stations)
      5. make the properties interact with each other (ie a mission that opens in one property only after you have purchased another
    • by Albanach (527650) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:05PM (#8431200) Homepage
      What about 6. Network play on the PS2.

      I lost many evenings with network play on GTA2 on the PC.

  • by Ty_Webb (729466) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:42PM (#8430832)
    Sony has the rights to the franchise, so they grant themselves a period of time where it is only available on their platform (the PS2). After that, if they choose to, they allow other platforms to pick it up. That's why it took so long for PC & Xbox versions of GTA3 to come out, etc.
  • Exclusive? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by samsmithnz (702471) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:43PM (#8430851) Homepage
    It will probably be as exclusive as the last games... meaning they aren't ready to release the PC version yet, but maybe next year...
  • by OmniVector (569062) <see [ ]homepage ['my ' in gap]> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:45PM (#8430889) Homepage
    developer #1: i have an idea
    developer #2: what?
    developer #1: you know how no one had ever really heard of GTA 1 and 2, but 3 was a great success right?
    developer #2: of course
    developer #1: well, lets take the already written game engine and capitalize off it's success by making the same game over and over with different cities!
    developer #2: brilliant!
    developer #1: brilliant!
    • by Malicious (567158) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:04PM (#8431181)
      Have you ever heard of Halflife?
      Blue Shift?
      Opposing Force?
      Team Fortress Classic?
      Counter Strike?
      Day of Defeat?

      This is called a successful business model, and personally if the engine isn't broken, why fix it?
      • by Belgand (14099) <[moc.ssertroftenalp] [ta] [dnagleb]> on Monday March 01, 2004 @03:40PM (#8432613) Homepage
        Except that that's not entirely accurate. Half-Life was the only thing even approaching an original game in there. Opposing Force was the expansion pack and so was Blue Shift.

        Team Fortress Classic is something that TFS had been working on for a while before Half Life ever came out (TF2 was originally going to be a Quake 2 mod, then development shifted to making it a mod for Half Life and eventually Robin Walker and the rest of TFS got hired by Valve). Essentially it's still a community mod that just got a little bigger.

        Counter-Strike and Day of Defeat are both mods as well. Valve just decided to box them up and try to make some cash off of them.

        If you wanted to get this right you're thinking of Gunman Chronicles. The pretty damned terrible TC that ended up getting backed and released by Valve as a stand-alone game. Otherwise you really only have one game there.
  • Wow! Can't wait. (Score:3, Informative)

    by Trashman (3003) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:47PM (#8430918)
    In case are wondering about the city

    Libery City = New York City (Modern Day)
    Vice City = Miami (1986-87 there or about)
    San Andreas = (I Imagine that is Los Angeles, but when?)
  • No PC version? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Control-Z (321144) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:47PM (#8430921)

    Weren't GTA3 and VC big sellers on the PC? Until the consoles get some equilavent of "mouselook", I have zero interest in playing games like GTA on a console.

    • Re:No PC version? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by SoupGuru (723634)
      Each time I play a shooter on a console, I get to a point where I have to aim at something, and then I shut it off. Sure, a controller is awesome for sports games but when it comes to shooting things, nothing beats a mouse and keyboard.
      • by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 01, 2004 @03:34PM (#8432543)
        but when it comes to shooting things, nothing beats a mouse and keyboard.

        That's what I thought, until I was invited on this hunting trip. Boy did I feel stupid lugging my Logitech Cordless desktop around in the woods.
  • by enrico_suave (179651) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:48PM (#8430935) Homepage
    GTA San Andreas gives new meaning to the term "shake down"

    e

  • by stratjakt (596332) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:48PM (#8430944) Journal
    Resident Evil: Codename Veronica was a dreamcast excluive... Code Veronica X came out for PS2 later, the X makes it a whollllle new game.. Now resident evil is a gamecube "exclusive"..

    GTA3 & Vice City were PS2 "exclusives", until the PC versions, and later XBox versions came out.

    The Final Fantasy series is PS2 "exclusive", nevermind that Crystal Chronicles thing.

    It may be exclusive on PS2 for awhile, but I have no doubt a PC version, at least, will surface some time next year.

    The only real exclusives are from the console makers themselves, Nintendo's franchise players, etc..

    It just doesnt make sense for third party developers to lock themselves into one platform in such a fragmented market.
  • by Featureless (599963) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:51PM (#8430989) Journal
    Many of you will remember the brouhaha over GTA3: Vice City and the phrase "Kill all the Hatians."

    It was a big stink - bigger than any of the stuff you thought would be worse (you can kill police, or anyone for that matter, in the game) that ended in Rockstar actually changing the game - they now only push a "patched" version to stores AFAIK.

    I was wondering why we don't demand an apology from Francis Ford Coppola about the Godfather movies (to which the GTA series is often, for obvious reasons, compared). After all, there's a line in one about black people being animals "who have no souls."

    Then again, that was said by a character, not by the screenwriter.

    Isn't it interesting that sometimes we're capable of knowing the difference, and other times we're not?

    People apparently love these "gotcha" stories. They have no relation to the facts, and are frightening in their ignorance about the basic issues. I mean, distinguishing between something a character is saying and something the game/movie's makers are saying is a pretty basic feat of human intelligence. Of course the context is everything - the context of the line in the game is a gang war (and "the hatains" are one of the gangs in the game). But when it's time to worry about how many people are watching your news program rather than the competitions, a scare story, a little race baiting, even when the facts aren't exactly straight, can slip through.

    Especially when it's a video game.

    Where are the defenders of all Hatians now? Probably advocating Edward Norton be locked up for being a Nazi (since he played one in American History X).

    Apparently we still hold games to a different standard than movies, even when these games are obviously made for adults, and are rated accordingly. If the game were a movie you'd be laughed out of the room for talking about it like that.

    And the amazing thing is that Rockstar has caved to this kind of idiocy.

    So what's the point of all this?

    If Rockstar feels they have to edit everything in their products to fly this far under the stupid-radar, then they will essentially be neutering their product - which succeeds in a large part on the basis of its funny, irreverent, transgressive "creative" (i.e. game design and story, which are, in this as in many cases, inextricable).

    I'm wondering how San Andreas will stack up - if they still have their spine after the "Hatian Incident." If they PC'd and PG-13'd the series, I predict an adverse response from the audience, and at the "box office."
  • by dark-br (473115) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:53PM (#8431011) Homepage
    My buddy has a 3 year old. During the time his wife was away, my buddy would play GTA: Vice City, and his son would watch. The son thought it was cool when daddy "beat the shit" of of other guys with the bats. Well, Mom came home to see her son, and saw her son going to town on his favourite teddy bear with a kid-sized hockey stick. He said to his mom that it was because daddy did this "on tv". (And yes, the son would say daddy "beat the shit" out of somebody on tv.)

    Whether you decide to play these games is up to you, but I believe we do have to be careful with our kids. We need to make them understand the difference between reality and fantasy, and if they can't tell the difference right now, then that's a lesson for later.

    I believe it's called parenting.
  • ID Software (Score:3, Funny)

    by Embedded Geek (532893) on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:56PM (#8431058) Homepage
    Rockstar/Id merger and Quake jokes in 3, 2, 1...
  • the website (Score:5, Informative)

    by zr-rifle (677585) <zedr@nOSpAM.zedr.com> on Monday March 01, 2004 @01:59PM (#8431087) Homepage
    is over here: http://www.rockstargames.com/sanandreas/
  • Non-PC games (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Egekrusher2K (610429) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:03PM (#8431162) Homepage
    Why is it that so many titles are released exclusively for consoles, and never released for the PC? Do the game companies NOT realize that the most hardcore, high spending gamers use the PC as their primary gaming platform? Granted, there are a lot (A LOT) of PC titles that don't do so hot. But that is because the genious creative minds behing all the great console hits aren't creating them. PC exclusive games are usually buggy as hell upon release, with poor game play and even more poor acting. If we could get some of these top developers to start releasing their console exclusive hits on PC, I think they would notice that we, as PC gamers, are just starved for good content. Our market SUCKS.
  • by stateofmind (756903) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:13PM (#8431320)
    Parenting Group officially releases "Lawsuit 2: We're back"

    Developed by world-class lawyers and parents that want to blame everyone else for their children problems, will be exclusively targeted at GTA: San Andreas. The lawsuit is expected to be released in North America on October 20, 2004.

    Josh
  • Official Site (Score:4, Informative)

    by RadicalBender (734280) on Monday March 01, 2004 @02:41PM (#8431805) Homepage

    An official site is up (but no content yet):

    http://www.rockstargames.com/sanandreas/ [rockstargames.com]

    One thing worthy of note: the script in the logo for the words "San Andreas" is in that faux-English "newspaper-title" font that is popular among Latinos who put it on the back of their pickup trucks (often along with a decal of the virgin Mary - I don't get it either) and what not. Dunno if that means anything...

  • by HarveyBirdman (627248) on Monday March 01, 2004 @03:13PM (#8432246) Journal
    Nuts.

    I heard it was going to be GTA: Spira. You'd play as Paine after she goes insane from snorting tainted megalixer crystals. They said you'd be able to jack chocobos, do jobs for the LeBlanc syndicate and pick up lesbian hooker nuns in Bevelle.

    And Spider Jerusalem from Transmetropolitan was going to be a playable character with a +7 bowel disruptor.

    Or maybe I just dreamed it all.

    Oh well.

  • by automaticlarynx (747144) on Monday March 01, 2004 @04:12PM (#8432985) Homepage
    Is it too early to sue them yet for warping my impressionable, young child's mind, or do I need to wait until the game is actually released?

Faith may be defined briefly as an illogical belief in the occurence of the improbable. - H. L. Mencken

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