Online Consoles Marginalizing PC Gaming? 603
MattW writes "The gist of this AP/Miami Herald article seems to be that consoles going online will mutate the MMORPG space. Already, there is word that PC game development is withering, even though as a preferential PC gamer I see the best games ever. Is the console destined for superiority, or will the ubiquitous need and superior user input of the PC keep it as a viable game platform?"
Console vs. PC (Score:5, Interesting)
I suppose however that the console market may eventually become the place for the pre-eminent titles especially given the kind of hardware that will be going into the next generation systems (G5s in the next Xbox?) and that PC titles will become ports. Of course we did see this approach with Halo, but only because MS screwed it up for us by purchasing Bungie, thus delaying the launch of Halo for Mac/Win and killing it all together for Linux.
Old School (Score:5, Interesting)
Are there MMOGs that allow consoles AND PCs? (Score:4, Interesting)
I hope not ... (Score:2, Interesting)
IRC, ICQ, Voice Comms, email, website's, they all help the PC be a more complete package for gaming (see The CPL).
PC's rule in my book.
I think it will stand here (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Console vs. PC (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Console vs. PC (Score:5, Interesting)
However, I believe that we'll see many more games that work on the console and work incredibly well on the PC as well... kind of a "yes, the 'rabble' can play, too" in a way, although I have a feeling the consoles will be catered to more and more over time. After all, one must follow the money.
Still, I believe that as long as PC's are appreciably faster and featureful (and of course they will be- it takes more effort to stay ahead of the curve, and greater flexibility) all will be well.
My vision is that long-term OS game engines supporting multiple platforms including consoles will take over the world, and that those of us with PC's will be able to "run games" much like MUDS of the 90's and today but with rich 3d and eventually VR-like capabilities.
Who knows, with Maya et al, maybe that day will be sooner than I had thought. :)
Thats a very "simplified" approach (Score:1, Interesting)
Looks at UT2004 for example. How many keys do you regularly use there? No. Consoles simply aren't going that way. Unless you get a keyboard. And a hard drive. Oh wait, I've turned my console into a personal computer.
MMORPGS don't all charge either. Look at Neverwinter Nights.
The article is badly written, takes an over simplified approach and is obviously written by someone who has never played a game "online".
If other OSes gain popularity... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Old School (Score:3, Interesting)
I may be an old fart about this, but I think many of the slower more thoughtful strategy games are more fun than the twitchers. These games will always be on the PC side. I can see the migration where FPS's will tend toward the console.
I think you are right about the strategy games; the 'serious' gamers who play a lot of slower games don't usually buy consoles; and I'm not sure that there's a big incentive for the console developers to push into that market; except perhaps in Japan, where there seems to be a market for everything.
FPS's might and might not gravitate towards consoles; that will, however, only happen with better controls for the consoles - playing FPS's on anything other than a keyboard/mouse is an exercise in frustration and futility. Consoles will either need provide these, or come up with something better - if that's even possible ...
multiple factors (Score:5, Interesting)
I really hope not, but we've already seen posts about Deus Ex II having a crappy interface that parallels that required for a console.
I had an opportunity to play Metroid Prime recently, given all its hype. I was very impressed with the game from graphics to story, but I got too frustrated by the controls. I couldn't stop thinking how easy these things I was TRYING to do were on a keyboard/mouse combo, but were complicated on the console by trying to press three buttons at once while moving one or another stick. So I scrapped it for Tony Hawk, which is totally suited to a joystick/controller.
Please tell me that PC gaming will live forever
never heard? (Score:1, Interesting)
one word will do... Halo
Drives PC Hardware Sales (Score:3, Interesting)
I think if video game publishers ease off of the PC platform, we will see money from Nvidia, ATI, and Intel that will support cutting edge video gaming on the PC.
Re:Console vs. PC (Score:5, Interesting)
I think the thing is that there are quite a bit of games out there designed with the console controller in mind and they do a fine job making the controls work great. Then they port it to the PC and the game's annoying as hell to play without a gamepad. In that case I'd rather just stick to the console.
One thing no one ever mentions when the whole console vs. PC gaming debate comes up is whether or not you can actually get any gaming done on your PC. I know myself that I have a tendency to want to check my E-mail, oh and then there's a website I need to read, and I need to burn this CD, etc. until all of a sudden it's too late to do any gaming. If I go to the living room the PC's not there and I can actually forget about it and play games on my PS2 for hours on end. I actually game more since I bought the PS2 than I did before on my PC, even back when I was in college and had more free time. I really doubt I'm the only person out there who has found this to be true. Thanks to discovering this I'm pretty much just a console gamer, at least I'll actually play games and relax that way, and I'm on the PC at work all day anyway, not like I really miss being on it another 4-6 hours in the evening. :)
Of course it probably helps that I have never liked FPS games, and have found I prefer the cinematic-style RPGs on the consoles (like Xenosaga, with 22 hours or so of cinematics).
No Killer PC Apps Lately (Score:5, Interesting)
just wait till World of Warcraft and Doom 3 come out.
Consoles will win out (Score:3, Interesting)
PCs sold today come with either those crappy integrated graphics or advanced GPUs from ATi and nVidia. And even those with good graphics systems have would have a wide varieties of drivers installed, which means that some features are enabled and some are not.
Also, most PCs sold do not come with controllers and/or joysticks. And if the user buys such devices, there are numerous brands to consider.
There are also various sound cards, processors, etc., each with different features that gaming authors may or may not be able to take advantage of.
If you want to sell games for the PC, and you if you want to sell a lot of them, you're essentially forced to aim for the lowest common denominator. Only a handful of gaming publishers can sell high quality games without pandering to crappy computers.
And lets face it; there are essentially only two gaming engines for the PC, id's Quake and Epic's Unreal. When Carmack quits to devote himself fulltime to getting into space (which will happen after Doom3) that'll leave only one engine left. And let's face it, without Carmack, OpenGL will be dead on the PC too.
Re:Are there MMOGs that allow consoles AND PCs? (Score:5, Interesting)
No thanks. I would rather keep the console and PC platform seperate when it comes to online play. I pay for Xbox Live for three reasons.
1) It is extremely hard to cheat using the Xbox + Xbox Live system.
2) High speed connections are required (read: No shooting at a 56K players lagging all over the place)
3) Level playing field (everybody plays with the same graphic settings / options. HDTV being the exception)
If gaming networks mixed PC players with console players I would cancel Xbox Live because I can get the same service for free elsewhere. I'm pretty sure the majority of subscribers feel that way too.
Don't get me wrong. I don't think Live is "better" than plain internet multiplayer. I still play that way too. I just enjoy the clean sandbox benefits that Live brings to the table.
Re:Thank goodness for Microsoft, then... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Games: Topics Beat To Death (Score:5, Interesting)
For an example, take a look at Deus Ex and its sequel, Invisible War, which epitomises the sterotypes above. DX was originally written for the PC and had what often seemed huge levels, even if this was entirely down to effective design; the Hong Kong levels in particular were very impressive at this. There was quite sophisticated AI for the time and many situations could be handled a whole lot easier if you thought about what you were doing and didn't go in guns blazing.
Segue to DX:IW, designed from the ground up to accomodate the console market and much of the magic is gone. The levels are smaller; so much smaller that you seem to spend as much time loading levels as you do actually playing them because you have to move back and forth so much. As for the "universal" ammunition for projectile and energy weapons which smacks of "four control button consolitis"; puhleeze! No more rueing using your last sniper round on the minion to save time and now having to face his boss up close and personal with a melee weapon in DX:IW!
So, "Die"? No, almost certainly not, but getting hamstrung to the lowest common denominator of each aspect of the targetted platforms seems equally inevitable. All those PC game genres that take advantage of PC hardware, even trivial stuff such as having a proper keyboard, are really going to suffer if the trend continues...
It's ALL about the controls (Score:5, Interesting)
I know it was my first time playing a FPS with a game pad but I can't imagine actually prefering that input over a keyboard and mouse for a FPS. After that experience I am having second thoughts about getting a console, and thinking about just building a good PC gaming system instead.
Playing the Lord of the Rings game was a better experience with the game pad
But at the end of the day, I can easily get a game pad to work with a PC, if I prefer that input for some games, but AFAIK you can't use a mouse + keyboard with a console.
I agree with a poster above - it is all about what you play. With certain genres of games (FPS, RTS...) PC input is better.
How can anyone afford a gaming PC? (Score:4, Interesting)
I understand the modding scene is fantastic, but can anyone offer an insight into how PC games find a market worth developing for?
(*)I take it nethack doesn't count?
Re:Console vs. PC (Score:4, Interesting)
Um, so your problem is that you get distracted from your gaming productivity by things? My problem tends to be the reverse. I sit down by my computer intending to write that important essay or whatever thing I have been putting off, but somehow my mouse slips and I start (Baldur's Gate 2, UT2004, Halo, whatever).
"No! Bad computer! Oh what the hell, just a little bit then.... Ooops, is it midnight already?"
Re:Console vs. PC (Score:2, Interesting)
Even the newest Games on the consoles are "amazing" when compared to older console games, but to me... still mega-grainy looking.
"personalized" computers (Score:3, Interesting)
Keyboard and mouse control have already been mentioned. Let's take it a step further into oddball-land, with trackballs, spaceorbs, cyberman, joysticks, flight harnesses, USB peripherals, voice-activated microphone controls (UT2004)...
Then there's hardware modification. Modding a console voids your warranty and risks prosecution under the DMCA, or at the very least disqualifies you from online gameplay. This is compounded by the fact that to make consoles cost-effective, they need to have lowest-common-denominator performance profiles: the cheapest, minimal amount of RAM necessary to run anticipated games, the most cost-effective processor available when the entire line is published, basically minimal functionality beyond what the designers anticipate. A PC user can increase performance beyond the "specs" by loading up on RAM, high-performance video cards, hard disk space for more saved games, multiple-monitor output... basically, today's PCs have the capacity for levels of performance that even the "next generation" of consoles won't have when they're finally released. 3GHz processors with 1GB of RAM? With increasing bus speed and dedicated graphics processors, the kind of gameplay possible with PC hardware will doubtless exceed what any priced-to-sell console will do (keeping in mind that new consoles will probably go for $299-$399 and lose their vendors millions of dollars in the initial stages).
Of course, there's also software modification. 120GB hard drives mean that we can download Counter Strike and make Half Life into a whole new game. We can download Enemy Territory, Aliens for Doom, or Quake Rally, or any of thousands of mods which make our game into something wholly new. We can create, share, and seek out new third-pary maps, models, skins and rules for our FPSs, and gameplay experiences like Neverwinter Nights (as opposed to just MMORPGs) become possible. At the least, gameplay becomes more participatory and creative, and in many cases, game design careers are launched this way.
It's commonly noted that progress in technology is driven by two applications: porn and games. If consoles become the only venue for gaming, tech progress will face a glacial pace of innovation. While "the gameplay experience" hasn't been pushed on the PC recently thanks to gaming market stagnation into a few reasonably-successful genres, the capacity for PC gameplay innovation has always been vast; this can lead to new ideas in UI, in AI, in graphics quality and performance, sound, in modifiability (is that a word?).
The only real qualm people seem to have with the PC as a game platform is that games don't seem to sell too well. Well, some of them do. Others just don't seem to sell well enough to justify Hollywood-level production values. Ingenuity can come from smaller development studios too, and the nature of the PC and Internet allow these studios channels of distribution distinct from the Big Studio's dominance of shelf space in EBGames. Doom was an object lesson in this, but it doesn't end there. At least, hopefully it won't. Steam, for all its faults, is a bold new way to sell games; in an ideal world, Valve would open up Steam as a shareware distribution system, with new demos and for-purchase games showing up there from time to time.
Wow, I ranted.
PC gaming will be around as long as the PC (Score:3, Interesting)
Everyone will own the platform.
Some people may by an Xbox, some may buy a PS2 and some may buy a Gamecube. When future generations of consoles are released, there will be people who buy them as well.
But nearly everyone is going to have a PC (or a Mac) because they use it for other things as well. Not everyone will stay on the cutting edge of PC gaming, but they will continue to use the PC for years to come.
Re:Why I love my PS2 (Score:4, Interesting)
That's a bit of an exageration, altough a common one. In canada, the base PS2 (not the online pack) is 200$. For less than that price I can get a GeForceFX 5600 or a Radeon 9600 pro based card that will totally wipe the floor with the PS2 as far as frame rate/eye candy/resolution goes. Actually I can even get a TNT2 for 19$, and it might have a chance of beating the PS2 at the same resolution that the PS2 operates in.
Not that your point is invalid, a PS2 is the cheapest alternative. The quoted statement was just a bit much. The reasons the top PC card cost so much is that they're built to run games with WAY more details than PS2 games at 1600X1200 with 60+ frames per second.
Re:Console vs. PC (Score:5, Interesting)
even if the PS3 has a 9800pro with 256 MB memory, that doesn't change the fact that it has a very low maximum resolution.
I could buy an HDTV, but have you checked the prices of HDTVs lately? far far more expensive than the cheap monitor that comes with a dell.
also, I already have a computer, I can upgrade that computer when new tech comes out, I can browse slashdot, and do whatever I want on that computer. I cannot, however, upgrade a console, I just have to buy a new one, and I am limited to gaming.
I think i'll go with the PC.
Re:Old School (Score:3, Interesting)
The problem is that unless the superior input schemes (keyboard, mouse) actually come with every console sold, the game companies will design their games around the control instead. They don't want to artificially limit their market by only being able to sell to the few console gamers who purchase additional input devices to supplement the controllers that came with their system. So they will just design a game with a simplistic user interface instead.
Even if a major console manufacturer did include these things with their systems, I still don't believe it would be popular with the console gaming audience. These people don't want to deal with anything complicated and the keyboard and mouse makes them think of a computer. And, 3rd party console game developers would not develop for the keyboard and mouse either unless virtually all the popular consoles had it by default, since otherwise they would be limiting their ability to port the game to other consoles and increase sales.
All that said, I still think the keyboard and mouse are far superior for certain types of games than any console controller I've ever used. There are indeed fun console games that use a controller; I'm not denying that at all. I'm just saying that consoles encourage game developers to develop user interfaces with a very limited number of different controls and simplistic input methods. This can be a good thing in certain types of games, for sure. But other games suffer dramatically from it, especially in replay value. When I was really into Counter-Strike I typically had almost my whole keyboard bound to various actions so that I could memorize the locations and do things ultra-fast. Similarly, a lot of RTS games have a ton of keyboard shortcuts that can make the game a lot more enjoyable when you learn them. The keyboard shortcuts not only are more convenient but also introduce a steeper learning curve into the game that makes online matches much more competitive. It takes longer to learn the game so there is more variation in skill level online.
Re:Why I love my PS2 (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Console vs. PC (Score:3, Interesting)