Revisionist History in Age of Empires

The fact that Microsoft Game Studios picked and chose from the past in order to make Age of Empires fun is understandable. While recognizing that, the Wonderland Blog brings up the (dubiously laudable but) important role Age of Empires has in educating young people. Alice asks if such a game, helpful to the teaching of the young, should futz with the past the way it does. The Guardian Blog follows up on her commentary by discussing the game and the issue in the context of Serious Games. From the article: "With the snowballing of interest in Serious Games and governmental support for the development of games in the classroom, should this be an issue that is seriously debated in development houses?"

Historical Accuracy

[XxtraLarGe]

The only time they should take these things into consideration is if the title is being developed as an Educational/"Edutainment" program. Otherwise, gameplay should trump fact. Everybody knows that the Great Pyramid didn't actually give the Egyptians a free granary in each of their cities, right?

For the love of all things holy

[SiliconJesus]

Its a game people.

G A M E

Say it with me now. Its for the purpose of having FUN, not learning. If I wanted to learn I'd crack open a book and read or something. If I want to kill off Native Americans the old fashoned way with a musket, then I play a game.

Jesus effing christ on a stick. Get your blue state heads out of your collective asses and HAVE FUN instead of insisting that everyone tries to conform to your concept of "HOW THINGS SHOULD BE."

Didn't this happen?

[KDR_11k]

I mean, didn't Cortez use some tribe to assist them defeat the Azteks? So since the concept of using natives to further your goals existed in reality, why not have it available in a game without restrictions? The economic system in the AoE titles isn't close to realistic either but I see nobody complain that it teaches children gold grows on the surface or something.

AOE3 more accurate than the reviewer's view of his

[jbs0902]

The reviewer's problem seems that AoE3 doesn't go along with the revisionist history supported by the reviewers.

From TFA
'The crux is that the Native Americans in AoE III "are not so much a peoples to be exploited and killed off with pox-infected blankets as they are partners in your war against the other countries," according to Kotaku.'

So, the reviewer has the racist view that Native Americans are weak social incompetents whose only purpose is to be exploited and killed. To the reviewr's Native Americans are not fully realized human being (capable of both selfishness and charity, both good and evil) but instead the reviers complains that they are not seen only as victims.

When in reality (not the reviewer's politically correct fantasy) the Indians were a number of unallied and often mutually antagonist tribes/countries that frequently allied with the Europeans. For example, the Anti-Aztec Indians that allied with the Spanish in order to topple their Aztec masters. These Indians did this, not solely for the Spaniards benefit (although the Spanish did benefit) but because these Indians hated their Aztec rulers.

Another example, would be the French and English Indian allies during the French-Indian War. Once again various Indian tribes and mercenaries sided with either the French or English in the hopes of increasing their (the Indians) wellbeing and domination over an opposing Indian tribe.

Did the Europeans do bad things to the Indians? Yes, both as individual settlers and as organized acts of imperialism. But they also acted in a way roughly (it is hard to tell without the game being published yet) in accordance with AOE3's portrayal. The Europeans took the Indians on as allies when needed or convenient.

It is revisionist to re-write the history of the Native Americans to exclude their acts of savagery and genocide, leaving them only as objects of pity, too incompetent to fend for themselves or produce noble achievements. This revisionism which denies the Native Americans their true history and their ability & potential to share in the both the horrors and grandeurs of basic human nature is racist.

The review's problem seems to be that AOE3 does not exclude the self-interested actions in favour of the reviewer's political point of view. The reviewer's view of history is more revisionist than AOE3s.

Re:Historical Accuracy

[jessecurry]

If there were some sort of certification that games could receive showing that they had historical accuracy I think that it might be a way to increase sales.
If I were purchasing a game for my child and could choose between Warcraft or Age of Empires and saw that Age of Empires contained historically accurate content, then I would probably go with AoE. Now, if AoE had horrible game play then I would have to choose Warcraft being that the game's primary purpose is entertainment, but when choosing between two titles that are supposedly equal the one that would educate as well as entertain would win out.

Re:Incidentally...

[Momoru]

Also once the Aztecs were conquered in Mexico, they occasionally joined forces with the Spanish and helped fight other native tribes in the present day southwest US. I think it's funny how revisionists have ALREADY rewritten history to make it appear that all Native American tribes were simply sitting around smoking peace pipes before the evil europeans came in and slaughtered them. A large amount of Native tribes fought each other in wars for centuries, and when the first Explorers set foot in present day Florida, Louisiana, New Mexico, and Mexico, they were greeted with hostilities. It just so happened that the Europeans had better weapons and superior numbers in most cases.

Re:Historical Accuracy

[fm6]

You're right, the obligation of game designers is to good play, not historical accuracy. But game players have an obligation to understand that it's just a game, and they shouldn't rely on it for historical education. Unfortunately, lots of gamers are less critical than that. Such as Orson Scott Card, who claims to have achieved great historical insight from playing Civilization, the game that invented the discovery-cascade model used in Age of Empires and Rise of Nations. Which is one reason I no longer bother with his books.

My favorite "discovery" is the Existentialism upgrade in Rise of Nations, which rather than changing anybody sense of self, just causes a nation's economic and military efficiency to go up slightly. One wonders what Sartre [wikipedia.org] would make of that!

Re:Historical Accuracy

[Mike Hawk]

The key to Civ3 is picking the Babylonians and going for world domination by building religious buldings and wonders and taking over cities by spreading your culture mixed with smaller local skirmishes to crush dissenters as necessary. But thats just the game though. Nothing like real life at all.

You win some, you lose some

[IorDMUX]

Though it would be quite nice to see an Age of Empires campaign that accurately represented some period in history, no army in history has ever been as successful as the play is required to be in these games.

I don't think the user would be as appreciative if you were required to lose an average third of the scenarios to keep things historically accurate.

"Objective: Hold off the Spanish assault for three grudging hours until you run out or resources and are ownzed."

Re:Historical Accuracy

[Anonymous Coward]

You no longer bother with Orson Scott Card because of his views on... Civilization? It's not like he's a history writer. You must not have read his anti-homosexual essays.

Lies?

[Stargoat]

This is revisionist history. Revisionist history has been necessary in some cases, but let's not pretend like smallpox in blankets was everywhere, or even anything but a single isolated incident.

Instead, think about how the British allied with the Sikhs against the French. Or the French with the Hurons against the British Colonists (French and Indian War). Or Nelson attacking the French with help from local native Central Americans. Or Cortes taking advantage of the cruelty of the Aztecs to create a series of alliances with the local natives. Or the British allying with the Egyptians and using Indian troops against Muslim holymen in the Sudan. Or T.E. Lawrence with the Bedouin fighting the Turks.

No, that has been the pattern of history. Despite what modern day opponents of Colonial History may say, the West has historically used ambitious natives in their money making schemes. Africans enslaved Africans, not Europeans. Chinese sold Opium to Chinese, not the British. Indians fought against the Afghans under British leadership.

Quite frankly, this sort of history as being presented in the article is erroneous to the point of being deliberate. Is there an agenda here, or is this just some deluded fool?

Re:Historical Accuracy

[dr.badass]

Unfortunately, lots of gamers are less critical than that. Such as Orson Scott Card, who claims to have achieved great historical insight from playing Civilization

There is a difference between insight and knowledge.

It's entirely possible to learn some general ideas about the growth and development and fall of civilizations by playing a game. You may not get very deep insights, but you're not likely to get those in school, either, and we require kids to play that game.

I don't know exactly what he's claimed, but I know that I learned more from Civilization II's built-in Civopedia, which had tons of historical information, than I did in history class. More importantly, CivII got me much more interested in history than any class.