PlayStations of the Cross 267
theodp writes "Is there a place amid the witches, warlocks and diabolical monsters for Christian video games? The NY Times reports companies like Brethren Entertainment ('Entertaining for Eternity'), Digital Praise ('Glorifying God Through Interactive Media'), and N'Lightning believe that there is a market in faith-based video games. If the idea of Christian first-person shooters seems unlikely, so too did the idea of Christian pop music, which accounted for 7% of the total pop-music market and sold 43+ million albums last year."
FWIW (Score:4, Funny)
"PlayStations of the Cross" is also pretty clever -- a bit too clever for a Slashdot submitter. Let's see, did he just copy the NYT title...yup.
Re:FWIW (Score:4, Funny)
from the forgive-me-father-for-i-have-HADOKEN! dept.
(its even funnier than my suggestion of "from the stuff-that-antimatters dept" on a story relating to antimatter research)
Murder for Christ! (Score:2, Funny)
Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Crusades (Score:2, Offtopic)
This would have been a great improvement upon the actual crusades, where people were simply slaughtered out of hand without the chance to convert. One account of the sacing of Jeruselem in the first crusade states that at one place in the city the blood ran to the depth a mounted knight's stirrups.
Re:Crusades (Score:2, Offtopic)
Your game would have to have some witch burnings, and some bonus stages where no one fights back, and wiping them out is pretty easy. Pogrums for example: those jews in their synagogues are probably just doing witchcraft in there. Go in and kill them and the rabbi, and burn the place down,
Re:Crusades (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Crusades (Score:3, Interesting)
In fact, it was the Eastern half of the Church! It wasn't some splinter group, the Church had divided itself in half when Rome fell, and they both recognized each other. In fact, 9 years latter, Bishop of Constantinople was placed second to the Pope!
After the Pope learned of the first attack, when the man the Crusaders were paid to put on the throne was put there, the Po
Re:Crusades (Score:2, Informative)
Non religious (Score:5, Interesting)
In fact, I have turned my view 180 degrees. I used to think religious folks never stop whinning about gangsta/satanic industrial music and video games etc. Now I seriously think they deserve a chance to be marketed.
Re:Non religious (Score:3, Insightful)
It was almost like watching the South Park episode - Cartman was right, they will buy anything marketed at them. I hate to say it, but I think the market's too big, it allows mediocre music to be successful. (Insert RIAA joke here)
Re:Non religious (Score:2)
(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:5, Insightful)
I would be particularly interested in religion-based games that target a more mainstream audience, as most other popular games do. Let's face it, if you take Western religion as an example, the Bible is full of violent conflict that would be great for a game.
The problem as I see it, however, is in the approach taken in designing such a game. It is often a project taken on by a religious group, not a gaming group. In their eyes, the story needs to be exact, otherwise it goes against their religion. After all, you can't risk letting a child see David actually get KILLED by his enemies on the screen, that would be heresy in their minds.
Thus, the games tend to play out more like a movie than a game, which goes back to being geared more towards small children than mainstream gamers. They have to be able to risk that bit of what they call heresy if they want the game to be interesting. If you're going to play David and fight all your enemies, there needs to be an actual risk of losing if the game is to be at all enjoyable.
Re:(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:2, Funny)
You would just end up with games like "Christ Christ Revolution" and "Desert Walker Alpha 3: Tournament Edition".
Might convey the true Christian spirit, but having lame as hell games is NOT the best way to convert people.
Re:(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:3, Interesting)
You do have a good point, though. When one thinks "Christian game" one thinks of the life of Christ himself, who was entirely non-violent (I mostly see him as a teacher more than anything else) and inevitably had to meet a bloody demise here on Earth. (Yes, I believe in Christ and I believe in his victory and that it has simply yet to come to fruition here on Earth, but that again is another discussion entire
Re:(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:4, Informative)
You're mistaken (Score:2)
Re:(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:2)
Re:(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:3, Funny)
Totally, I can never get that "wine wine water wine water loaves wine wine fishes loaves loaves" combo in level 7.
Not about conversion (Score:4, Insightful)
These games are not about converting you to my religion, they are about giving me a passtime that doesn't violate all the principals of my religion.
My religion tells everyone not to watch (or own) a TV. There is nothing evil about a electron gun in a vacuum tube exciting a few phosphors (substitute your technology of choice). What is evil is what it is used for. Nothing is wrong with using a TV so you can take college classes from someone on a different continent. There is something wrong when you use TV to show sex, violence, and so on. (I picked two extremes, you have to decide where the dividing line is between them - if you even agree sex and violence is evil).
Video games are not evil of themselves. They can teach puzzle solving skills. A game of pac-man once a week has no value, but it isn't evil. (addiction to pac-man is evil, but that isn't the fault of the game itself) However most of the popular games go far beyond the line.
I'm not sure I agree that christian games are the solution to the problem. However the problem being solved isn't a reach out to non-Christians, it is a lack of things Christians can do.
Re:(Organized) Religion is always a cash-cow (Score:3, Insightful)
Oh, the possibilities (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Oh, the possibilities (Score:5, Informative)
Watch it very, very drunk.
Re:Oh, the possibilities (Score:2)
Re:Oh, the possibilities (Score:2)
God has been spoken of as King and Jesus as Lord since the very early days of Christianity. In medieval terms, this is understood of course to mean they are knights, and indeed there was a great deal of speculation among the heraldicly inclined as to the exact device Jesus would have borne upon his shield. So what does the Supereme Warrior do after the devil's minions have him strung up to die?
Go to Hell
Re:Oh, the possibilities (Score:2)
Syncretism (Score:4, Interesting)
As much as one might long to go ad fontes -- to the wellspring, Christianity as we know it in the West is irretrievably commingled with the violent, demon haunted world view of the northern tribes it filtered through. Certain elements of the ancient first and second century viewpoint can be recaptured, such as proximate parousia (the belief in the imminent Secnd Coming), but somehow they come out with more than a soupçon of Ragnarok in them.
So, we have the violent fantasy of divinely sanctioned holy war, in which, drawing the sword in the name of the Prince of Peace, indulging one's blood lust is not only sinless, but a positive good.
For most, Holy War is of course a metaphor. But where there is a metaphor, be certain that some will take it literally. Games are only games of course, except when they are indoctrination. That's difference between a Christian FPS and, say, GTA, which although it is disgusting in my opinion, is also harmless because it is meant to be, and is understood to be an absurd view of the world.
Re:Syncretism (Score:3, Interesting)
I don't know that the latin was totally necessary, but you do have a solid point. This is a big reason why most Christian games don't do well. Most either take the place of an action/fps type title where you're on the good side of a holy war (or literally a war between heaven and hell sometimes), or it's like a choose your own adventure stories, but with the world's most obvious "correct" choices. That's probably why the only really successful christian
Re:Syncretism (Score:2)
Well, of course, anything we write here is a simplification.
Speaking of syncretism, wasn't Kamthaka the Buddha's horse? Benedict XVI would like to have a word with you
He'll have to catch me first, which will be tough as I ride the noble Kamthaka into syncretic bliss.
Re:Syncretism (Score:2)
To me, that shows more a problem with the court than the game. I've personally put hundreds of hours into the first two GTA3 games (and intend on putting more into San Andreas when it comes out for the PC) and I have yet to attempt cutting through the local strip mall's pedestrian-only area so I can return a video 30 seconds quicker.
Re:Syncretism (Score:2)
Re:Syncretism (Score:2)
First Person Shooters? (Score:2, Insightful)
And wouldn't the goal, in a Christian game, be to do what Jesus would do?
So, yes, I would think any kind of shooter would be the antithesis of what Christ taught.
But I know few Christians that ever conside
Re:First Person Shooters? (Score:4, Interesting)
You know mostly lazy Christians.
Read the Old Testament for the more violent epics. Consider this for a video game:
You are recruited into the king's army. You fight battle after battle, each one more challenging than the last. Eventually, you have more political clout than the king himself because you're such a great war hero. The king then tries to kill you, but his own son betrays him and helps you flee. Actually, I forget what happened between the fleeing and the king's death (feel free to look it up, it should be in the books of Samuel), but eventually you return and are crowned king yourself. You fight more battles, further establish your kingdom. You raise your son to be a great leader after you. Etc. Etc.
If done well, such things could make for pretty good video games. And that's just one character in one religion (or one combined source of a couple religions).
Re:First Person Shooters? (Score:2)
On that tangent, I couldn't agree with you more. As a Christian I am personally offended both by the terrible things other Christians do in the name of our religion, as well as by the reactions of others who associate me with the "bad" Christians simply because we walk around with the same book in our hands, even though we interpret the book very VERY differently.
I am interested, though, in your mentioning of great dramatic situations without anyone resorting to violence
Re:First Person Shooters? (Score:2)
I could easily see a Christian-themed SimCity-type game, or Civilization-type game.
Then of course there are abstract games, like Q-Bert or Pac-Man, but I don't see how you'd fit a Christian theme in those.
Re:First Person Shooters? (Score:2)
Depends on context... (Score:2)
Remember one item, the term Christ-like is usually most attributed to people attempting to box in Christians. It is a term used to put Christians on the defensive.
Christ tells us to treat each other fairly. Christ taught us to love each other. However he is the final Judge and fair isn'
Lots of money to be made (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Lots of money to be made (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Lots of money to be made (Score:2)
But what's to stop a subversive "christian" game doing the same thing? Wouldn't that be an attractive method for the evil corrupters of good god-fearing Christians. Selling wholesome Christian games with a special surprise element.
Obviously, the only real solution is to write all the games that your children play yourself, and hope that you you
Re:Lots of money to be made (Score:2)
Even better is CrazyJim2, the troll who follows him around and writes sometimes hilarious posts.
Re:Lots of money to be made (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Lots of money to be made (Score:2)
(To get the joke, make sure you read CrazyJim1's posting history and shitty Geocities website.)
Re:Lots of money to be made (Score:2)
100 Philistine Foreskins (Score:2, Funny)
Get outside the box (Score:4, Interesting)
I am a Christian and I look forward to seeing high-quality Christian-themed games (even those including forms of violence), but to really create a new market that doesn't simply compete for shelf-space with other FPS titles, wouldn't a new gaming paradigm be a better opportunity?
For that matter, there are other game types that could be well suited to spreading the Word of God that don't require killing someone or something such as puzzle, adventure, strategy, simulation, etc.
I am not arguing that a Christian game should be void of violence, but these Christian game developers should not lock themselves into the mode of thinking that the only way to develop a hugely popular title is to compete directly with other hugely popular titles such as other FPS titles with gratuitous violence.
So violence is OK, but looking at things from other perspectives is not? Again I don't think these guys should make this assumption across the board. Let someone play the role of Satan; however, if this is a faith-based/Christian game that is to teach a certain message, then I would assume playing that role would provide the opportunity to teach the lesson of why playing that role is not as desirable as it initially seems.I don't think that's the idea (Score:2)
Christian game reviews (Score:3, Funny)
I can see it now..."You turn the corner" "You hear something" "You ask yourself, WWJD?"
Re:Christian game reviews (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Christian game reviews (Score:3, Funny)
You are in a maze of twisty little dogmas, all alike.
It is pitch black. You might get eaten by a heretic.
>WWJD
For hints consult your hint booklet.
Simpsons... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Simpsons... (Score:2, Funny)
Rodd and Todd - "Can we play now, Bart?"
Bart - "You are playing. We're a team!"
Rodd and Todd - "Yay!!!"
So... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:So... (Score:2)
I hope you don't also want to include the two men (angels, reportedly) who were in Lot's house while the townspeople outside demanded that they be let in to have sex with the men.
It could have a lot to do with the translation, but that's the general interpretation I've seen. Some tone it down by replacing "so we may have sex with them" with "so we may know them" but the carnal implications are definitely there.
Re:So... (Score:2)
Re:So... (Score:2)
fwiw (Score:2)
Haha, Ridiculous (Score:2)
How about... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:How about... (Score:3, Insightful)
I guess I personally don't know enough about those religions to even imagine such a game, with the exception of ancient Judaism of course. But if it's diversity you're after, go for it. I know several Sikh teens whose parents would probably love to replace their GTA titles with a game that promotes their traditions.
Re:How about... (Score:2)
Re:How about... (Score:3, Insightful)
I thought that many of the FF games had a buddhist/new age theology behind them? I didn't think that there was any shortage of Buddhist games. There are several puzzle games that are made specifically for main-line Buddhism as a relaxation aide -- 3 minutes of Googling should bring up 2 or 3 of these.
There certainly are a fair number of mixed-bag "pagan" games, combining ideals from wicca, witchcraft, buddhism, and other new age "roll your own" religion. Ultima and other m
Re:How about... (Score:2)
You've got Judaism confused with another religion (Score:2)
While Dua
Re:You've got Judaism confused with another religi (Score:2)
I'm not talking about just dualism -- that's present in many religions. I'm talking about the war between Heaven and Hell using Judeo/Christian vocabulary. I believe I also answered your question here [slashdot.org].
In Spawn, there is certainly a Hell. In Diablo and also in Doom. Though I see your point in games like Quake -- that seems to have the Satan-type character w
Re:You've got Judaism confused with another religi (Score:2)
So while the idea of supernatural forces with independent spirits are cool for RPG's - these are really Christian or pagan worldviews. Don't feel bad - a lot of writers like to throw Judeo-Christian around in popular writings, when they really mean Christian or Early Christian - it ends up confusing most
Re:You've got Judaism confused with another religi (Score:2)
Thanks.
Re:You've got Judaism confused with another religi (Score:2)
So what is Sheol all about then? Is it just a sort of "place of the dead" then? King David spoke often of his soul descending to Sheol as being a bad thing.
Re:You've got Judaism confused with another religi (Score:2)
It really boils down to this - Judaism, in contrast to almost every other major (or minor) religion out there - has a very weak concept of the afterlife. There really isn't a formal idea of what happens after death - and the ideas that are out there are fairly shallow - so even the concepts that resemble hell are very very simplistic - and lack the elaborate mythology that most religions have.
Re:You've got Judaism confused with another religi (Score:2)
Now there was also the place of burning -- Gehenna? But I think that's a Greek word, so while I'm sure it was familiar to Jews around Jesus' time (especially with the translation of the scriptures to the Masoretic Text), I guess you're saying that it might not have been mainline theology?
Thanks again! Cheers. :)
Re:You've got Judaism confused with another religi (Score:2)
Re:How about... (Score:2)
Yunno
I tried aiming this sort of argument at the fundamentalists who want to impose their religion as political go
Re:How about... (Score:2)
I spent a few minutes Googling, and here are some links showing the kinds of things I am thinking about:
Re:How about... (Score:2)
Manicheanism seems to be a dualistic religion that recognizes Judaistic vocabulary? From the article:
"The most striking principle of Manichee theology is its dualism. The universe is considered a battlefield for control between an evil material god, and a good spiritual god. Christians recognized the evil god in Satan but could not accept the idea that Satan had as much power as God. Christians held that Satan, unlike God, is a created being. The term Manichaeistic is ofte
Re:How about... (Score:2)
Hrm. Well I'd agree with you regarding the "[ongoing] war between heaven and hell", but the dialogue of Satan's struggle for the souls of men is as old as the book of Job (read the first part of this if you haven't already -- though I'm guessing you have).
And since Christianity has its roots in Judaism (I.E. Jesus was a pr
Re:How about... (Score:2)
Okay, I didn't mean to imply that that's what I thought the whole book of Job was about. You said that you didn't see the fight between Heaven and Hell a focused topic until 1000 AD or so, and that there wasn't a whole lot of basis for it in Judaic theology. I replied that most of the basis for these storylines is in the Old Testament, and was giving y
Re:How about... (Score:2)
Like this? [telegraph.co.uk]
Re:How about... (Score:2)
Re:How about... (Score:2)
*really* "evil" games >:)
Down with the Devil!
Doom, Quake... (Score:2)
That said, both Doom and Quake are flexible, so in lieu of reinventing the wheel, one can just put a new wheel in, as it were, and start playing around with imagery - that is to say, put in your own characters and equipment. Se
Re:Doom, Quake... (Score:2)
The original DOOM series. (Score:4, Funny)
Bork!
Good News (Score:2, Insightful)
I have only two words to say about this... (Score:2)
Kick Ass=Christian (Score:2, Insightful)
From a Bible standpoint everything that is really awesome glorifies God. As a future game developer (it probably takes a religious nut job to have enough hope to think that I can get into the games industry) I will focus on making the most kick ass, intelligent and fun games possible. Sticking a Christian sticker on something d
Simple answer (Score:2)
No. Why? Because unlike Christian music, Christian video games actually have to compete against stuff that's good.
Rob
Re:Simple answer (Score:2)
Remember: christian pop/rock is driven by parents who won't let their kids listen to anything else. Seriously.
Bribe a couple of televangelists to pitch it, and you're set. Hell, grandmas will buy it for christmas gifts.
Poor kids.
Chex Cereal had FPS, why not Christians ... (Score:2)
Re:Chex Cereal had FPS, why not Christians ... (Score:2)
Re:Chex Cereal had FPS, why not Christians ... (Score:2)
As a Chexite, I think it's about time Christians opened their arms to different cultures and religions.
Re:Chex Cereal had FPS, why not Christians ... (Score:2)
A worty one of the emulators. Highly entertaining for about 5 minutes.
Jesus Christ, super commando (Score:2)
http://jesus.evilx.com/ [evilx.com]
Its a shame it never actually got made.
Maybe it is time... (Score:2)
StepMania (Score:2)
You could try to leverage some of that Christian music into a video game. Grab StepMania [stepmania.com] and make some simfiles with music by ZOEgirl and other popular Christian artists.
I'm not the first to think of Dance Dance Resurrection [i12.com].
Matthew 10:32-36 (Score:2)
32 "Whoever acknowledges me before men, I will also acknowledge him before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in heaven.
34 "Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law.
36 "A man's enemies will be the members of his own househ
The Ultimate Market (Score:3, Funny)
Face it: The Religious Right is *the* ultimate market. I mean this both politically and comercially -- there is no easier market to sell to.
First off, the communications channels in organized religion are second to none. No other community of this size has such smoothly functioning internal communications regarding brand, product favorites and traction.
Secondly, they are *by definition* non-critical of all things "faith related". (The entire definition of "Faith" is belief without criticism). The Church discourages criticism and independent thought -- as it always has. Products which appeal to core beliefs benefit from swift, non-critical product acceptance.
Thirdly, religious institutions are increasingly commercial -- which means both distribution and marketing channels are increasingly bundled with traditional teaching, messaging and outreach programs.
Religious video games are a sure thing. Religious anything is a sure thing.
Re:As a Christian... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Wha-wha-wha? (Score:4, Interesting)
The big problem with the Christian subculture is that it is very ivory-toweristic. Meaning that when I was in youth group in high school, we were discouraged from listening to non-christian music, which means "not from a Christian label". Instead of training ourselves to discerns what's right and wrong in the world and actively engage it, we wall ourselves into our own world and make it sinful to engage with anything else.
That's just bad reasoning and you'll find it all over American Christianity, and it's a big reason I don't go to Christian bookstores anymore. I get this feeling that there are some people at the top making big bucks by building this subculture of isolationism and labeling all secular media as evil.
And honestly most Christian music sounds tripe and disingenuine to me. (not all, just most).
...So I've been listening to alot of U2 lately.