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XBox (Games)

Xbox 360 - What You Get For Your Money 108

Posted by Zonk
from the you-can't-always-get-what-you-want dept.
1up.com has a news post throwing together information from various sources, and revealing some release details about the Xbox 360. Scans of marketing flyers finally make clear the differences in the two skus. From the article: "There's ... a handy chart comparing the Core system to the standard system. The accessories are perhaps the most interesting, with specs and suggested retail prices listed. The wired controller is compatible with Windows XP, and the hard drive comes with some pre-loaded data, including an HD puzzle game. Of course, everything in the brochure is subject to change without notice, so check back for more confirmation as we get closer to the launch date." More commentary is available from Chris Morris's always excellent Game Over column. A transcript of the J. Allard chat is available at Major-Nelson.com.
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Xbox 360 - What You Get For Your Money

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  • Good setup (Score:1, Redundant)

    by Kawahee (901497)
    It's a good setup, and the hardware is coming cheap(er) than what I expected, thanks to Microsoft subsidising it. Anyone know how much they'll be losing per xbox?
  • by Exitar (809068) on Monday August 22, 2005 @04:08AM (#13370292)
    Do you mean hard disk defragmentation?
  • the hard drive (Score:5, Informative)

    by fixmyship (802069) on Monday August 22, 2005 @04:18AM (#13370311)
    Seems like you have to get the hard drive to play "top-selling" original xbox titles.

    "Xbox 360 Hard Drive (20 gb) ... * Store multiple game saves and play top-selling original Xbox games. ... Why Buy: Expand your Xbox 360 content with downloadable content, rip music and play an array of original Xbox games."
    • Of course -- "backwards compatible with select xbox games" = "downloads ported executable for a few titles"
      • Nope, completely wrong.

        The reason for that is that the Xbox didn't abstract the storage device, so all the games are written as if there's always a hard drive there - so there has to be one to play them.
        • No. Actually you're completely wrong. (well you could also be right about old xbox games expecting a harddrive. I don't know for sure. It just depends)

          "(Microsoft has) implemented compatibility purely through emulation (at the CPU level). It looks like emulation profiles for each game are going to be stored on the hard drive, and I imagine that a certain number will ship with the system. They already have the infrastructure to distribute more profiles via Live, and more and more can be made available online
          • Unless that nVidia deal kept them from having to do all that, that is. I would still expect them to have to do some work on the executable to get it working but I could be wrong.
          • From the J Allard interview that was just posted here on Slashdot:

            J Allard (Expert): Another one from mail: What about backward compatibility in the core system?

            J Allard (Expert): because we didn't abstract storage in the first generation xbox back compat will require a hard drive. the good news is that the core system owners can upgrade if they deside to update at a later date.


            • Sure. I didn't deny that, but that doesn't prove or disprove the fact that the games might still require new executables in order to be backwards compatible.

              Although I had forgot about their deal with nVidea (replied to my orig. comment about it) but I still haven't seen any quotes from microsoft saying they are not going to need new executables. I HAVE seen quotes from microsoft saying they will need new executables. Until I see otherwise I'll just assume the harddrive is going to come packed with updated
              • I've seen emails to Xbox lists here at Microsoft where some of the devs have said that they will not have new executables, but be doing standard emu. Suprising they would be giving contradictory messages... are you sure you've seen a quote directly from someone at MS about them doing so, or were they articles that claimed it minus quotes?
    • Re:the hard drive (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Seumas (6865) *
      And at something like $100 for a 20gb drive... WHAT A DEAL!

      I mean, that's only $5/gb compared to those expensive deals you get on hard drives today that are about 44cents/gb!
    • Re:the hard drive (Score:4, Informative)

      by Fred Or Alive (738779) on Monday August 22, 2005 @05:55AM (#13370522)
      Probably not suprising for Xbox games, even if it's just a strait emulator running the games (ie: no game specific patches / executables), Xbox 1 games assume that they will have a hard disk, and they use it for caches etc.
    • The brochures all confirm that a hard-drive is needed for backwards compatibility

      Unless I've missed something (which is certainly quite possible), there has been no talk of how to move your saved games/preferences/etc from the old Xbox to the X360. Sure, the X360 will have a drive so the old games will run, but unless you can move all the info over from one machine to the other, who is going to bother?

      Oh, that's right -- "Backwards Compatibility" is only for NEW purchases of Xbox games so they'll pl

      • If an adapter can be made for legacy PS* memory cards, an adapter can be made for Xbox 1 memory cards. You'll just need to do the extra step of copying the save from the Xbox HD to the memory card beforehand.

        (If it comes as a surprise that the Xbox 1 can use memory cards, that's only because they're a very rare sight because the hard disk is so much better that nobody needs them.)
      • Put them on a memory card, dingus. What are you, a retard? Or are you just going WAAAAY the hell out of your way to bash Microsoft?
        • "Dingus"? Please. I have both PS2 and Xbox and enjoy playing both of them.

          The whole idea behind the XBox's hard drive was so you didn't have to buy a memory card in order to save games. There was no way to avoid buying a memory card if you wanted to enjoy PS1/PS2 games.

          That being the case, you're saying that I should go out and purchase an Xbox memory card for the sole purpose of transfering games to my "backwards compatible" X360 console?

          Doesn't make sense - not after Sony let the PS2 read PS1 mem

          • That being the case, you're saying that I should go out and purchase an Xbox memory card for the sole purpose of transfering games to my "backwards compatible" X360 console?

            I'll apologize for him. We're sorry. I guess you don't have any friends, otherwise you could have thought of mooching off of them, or having them all pitch together so that you all could share the memory card to transfer all of your saves over.

            Has anyone thought of just networking the XBoxes, and transfering saves that way?

            • you all could share the memory card to transfer all of your saves over

              Already said that in my original post where I mention that a one-time use peripheral would not be the best purchase to make. But thanks for playing.

              Has anyone thought of just networking the XBoxes, and transfering saves that way?

              Whatever it takes -- it certainly wouldn't be unheard of (yes, all of you with modded XBoxes; I see you waving your hands wildly in the air).

              For example, XBox Music Mixer had software that allowed you to

  • ...that 1up always makes out that it is the first with everything. One question...why bother getting scans of the brochure, when they could just refer to Microsoft's official press release that stated all of these facts last week?

    What next? "RIDGE RACER TYPE 4 COMING TO PSONE!"
    • They didnt make out they were first with it - the first line of their news post links back to the site that did post them first - http://www.planetxbox360.com/ [planetxbox360.com]
    • by badasscat (563442)
      One question...why bother getting scans of the brochure, when they could just refer to Microsoft's official press release that stated all of these facts last week?

      I love it - last week we had people saying "why is this news? We all knew about this months ago!" and now we have people saying "why is this news? MS just released this info last week!"

      Ok, I guess since all of you guys know the future two to three years in advance, the whole rest of the web may as well just close up shop. You could open up a ni
  • by astroblaster (600838) on Monday August 22, 2005 @04:39AM (#13370354)
    "I'm not trying to push you into the high cost option ... I'm saying the lower cost option doesn't exist." Link [penny-arcade.com]
  • when I get sucked in by hype. When my Xbox popped-its-clogs on Christmas Eve last year (boy was I angry). I prommised myself that I was an adult now and that I didn't need a games console. So confident was I that I sold all my games and accessories.

    I can actually feel my Maestro card burning in my pocket at the moment. I'm going to take a cold shower.
  • I'll wait (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Dr.Opveter (806649) on Monday August 22, 2005 @05:43AM (#13370502)
    Value for money?
    I'll probably pick up a Xbox or Playstation 2 this year. Hopefully the second hand market will get flooded with consoles from avid gamers trying to get the latest stuff.
  • 500+ dollars? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    So to get a new xbox with wireless controllers and that plays old games is going to cost over 500 dollars? Over 600 dollars by the time a game or two is added in!

    WTF is MS smoking? There are a couple of games that looked interesting, but I am sure as hell not going to blow that much cash unless the games look phenomenal - and so far the 360 stuff looks somewhere between crap and meh. Even the latest PGR3 news is talking about the game having frame rate problems. And that was supposed to be the big release t
    • Huh? The hard drive/wireless bundle is $400, not $500.

      Expect similar pricing for the PS3. Believe it or not, Sony doesn't have any magic technology to make hard drives any cheaper to manufacture.
    • Unless that's canadian dollars, calm down, the system costs 400$ for the "full" package. Well, okay, that's still overly expensive but at least less than the 500 you listed. It's 520 with two games, add another 30 for the extended warranty you'll be forced to buy the system with if you wwant it near launch. But realistically, are there even two games out of the launch lineup you want?
      • You aren't adding in the cost of a second wireless controller, which is expensive.

        So take your $550 total price, and add in another $50 for the extra controller. Strangely, that equals $600. If you want the stupid play and charge cable, the total is greater than $600, which is the price you were disputing.
        • Second controller? That can wait. Unless you buy some multiplayer-only game.
          • I guess if you're comfortable shelling out that kind of cash to play all your new games alone, that would be okay.

            I've always bought two controllers. I think it's kind of lame they don't include two by default with any of the systems.
    • I don't get the complaints on console prices. Okay, it's going to be $400. That's a lot of money.

      But at the same time, that $400 will be just enough to buy a new model graphics card for a PC. Then you still need a mobo, RAM, sound card, case, power supply, keyboard, mouse, etc.

      True, PCs can do other things. But most of those other things can be done on a $150 used PC you pick up out of the classified ads.

      As far as gaming goes, consoles are usually a great value.

  • Now this is just rediculous. One of the comparison columns (one reading :Good experience/Best experience" or something similar)reads

    Good Experience: Faceplate
    Best Experience: Multiple faceplates

    Seriously who is going to waste money on more than one plastic faceplate for these things? I can see maybe one to match the room, but several?

    I think whoever in marketing over there came up with the face plate thing is getting a little desperate.
    • Seriously who is going to waste money on more than one plastic faceplate for these things?

      Question: Do you actually know any 13 year olds?

      Trust me, those things will sell like hot cakes.
  • I wish they'd put a nice RGB SCART cable in the UK systems, instead people without fancy new TVs that take YUV / HDTV are stuck with yukky composite again (well, it's better than RF), unless they buy an extra cable. Wow, that's going to be great to show off the extra power of the 360 on older TVs (which usually take RGB SCART, but not YUV). Although I suppose the YUV cable is good for the rich gits with really new TVs, and Microsoft's HDTV message.

    Then again, they are offering a VGA cable, that is going to
    • I hate to say it, but SCART is pretty much dead, for two reasons:
      1) it can't carry digital signals
      2) it can't carry surround sound signals
      SCART was an interesting all-in-one design that was great in its day, but it wasn't adequately future-proofed, and it never made any impression in markets outside of Europe. See this page [wikipedia.org] for more info. Welcome to the digital future, I hope a new TV is in your budget! Seriously though, they're going to all the trouble of enforcing HD content, they want to encourage
  • Business-related FYI (Score:3, Interesting)

    by BlackCobra43 (596714) on Monday August 22, 2005 @09:19AM (#13371380)
    The XBOX360 will only be assigned two different SKUs by retailers, as SKUs are NOT assigned by the manufacturer. The manufacturer assigns the product an EAN.

    In fact, the XBOX360 will probably have hundreds of SKUs if you consider the number of retailers that will carry it...
  • by Botia (855350)
    It looks like your cost will be:
    $399.99 for console
    $ 49.99 for a second wireless console
    $ 59.99 for a game
    $ 59.99 for a second game
    -------
    $569.96 for a system

    Then you must wait until the PS3 comes out to get Halo 3. While I'm extremely excited about the XBOX 360, I may have to wait a while before I pick one up.
    • + tax, of course, + the monthly fee for xbox live gold which will allow you to play games online (as mentioned by another reply) I'll wait, thanks.
  • by Anonymous Coward
    Dreamcast 2.

    But without backward compatibility. (Yes without Xbox 1 compatibility either.)

    That's it.
  • by Turken (139591) on Monday August 22, 2005 @10:52AM (#13372365)
    Here we go with everyone complaining about the base price of the console, but we should really be all up in arms about the accessory prices.

    One look at the brochure, and all I can say is HO...LY...CR...AP that stuff is expensive!!! $40 for a memory card?!? $40 for a WIRED controller?!?
    $30-40 for an AV cable ?!? I can't think of any console in recent memory that cost THAT much for BASIC accessories, let alone the specialty ones.

    And combine this with the news from a few weeks ago that says that 3rd part manufacturs will have to pay up to MS or their hardware won't work with the system, so there goes any chance of cheaper options for cables and such.

    Folks, we are getting ripped off here, regardless of which package we buy!
    • From a UK perspective, those prices seem about the same as I'd pay now anyway.

      I looked through the UK RRPs (Recommended Retail Prices), and all the various acessories seem about the same price, RRP-wise, as the Xbox 1 equivelants (or in the case of the wireless controller, the Nintendo Wavebird). And they tally with the US prices you give, in rough GBP->USD conversions.

      Although looking at PS2 accessories, they're slightly cheaper than Xbox stuff. (PS2 controller RRP is £20, Xbox is £25, same
    • by Anonymous Coward
      $40 for a memory card?

      You mean as opposed to $25 for an 8MB Playstation 2 memory card? That's $3.1 per MB vs the 360's $0.63 per MB (assuming it's 64MB) - for the capacity the 360's memory card is five times cheaper.

      http://www.ebgames.com/ebx/product/181973.asp [ebgames.com]

      $40 for a WIRED controller?

      The ceramic white Playstation 2 controller is $45. Sure, the regular ones are $30, but my point is: there's a wired Playstation 2 controller that you have to pay more than $40 to get (if you can get it) anywhere:

      http://f [google.com]
    • Folks, we are getting ripped off here, regardless of which package we buy!

      You're only getting ripped off if you, you know, actually buy one. Nobody's forcing you to do so.
  • by tprime (673835) on Monday August 22, 2005 @12:27PM (#13372910)
    Yes, the lower model is a colossal mistake, talk about segmenting your user population. The only mitigating factor is that I can't figure out why ANYONE would buy the cheap version for $100 less. Wireless controller is $10 more, Component HDAV cable is $40 more, headset $20 more, Hard drive $100 more = $170 diff + no premium (good) games and no xbox1 games.
  • It seems to me everyone is bitching and moaning about having to buy an Xbox 360 at $400 and a PS3 at god knows how much (I'd get my bank's loan department on speed dial) so instead why not buy Revolution? Yes I'm suggesting you forgo getting the latest and greatest from Sony & MS and yes you probably won't be able to play GTA on it and you won't be able to play Halo on it but look at what it's got. First off it'll probably retail at $200 so that puts it at a $100-200 advantage against Xbox and god knows
  • Wasn't that part of the original XBox 360 proposal? I guess those IBM processors are pricier than originally anticipated.

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