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XBox (Games) Hardware

Microsoft Reveals 360 Shortage Reason 81

Posted by Zonk from the chips-are-down dept.
Matt writes "In a recent interview Steve Ballmer has been quoted as saying that the shortages everyone is experiencing are simply down to lack of chips because of low yields - they even considered delaying the launch because of it. In the end they decided to push on and just try and get as many consoles out there as possible." From the article: "Repeating the company's official line on the shortage crisis, which is now threatening to entirely undo Microsoft's attempts to win the next generation war, Ballmer said, 'We are making more. All stores are getting new units each week. Can we make as many as people want? The answer is no, but not because we don't want to.'"
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Microsoft Reveals 360 Shortage Reason More

Microsoft Reveals 360 Shortage Reason

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  • What about power supplies? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by artifex2004 ( 766107 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @05:37PM (#14214022) Journal
    They probably had to drop one vendor for power supplies, or at least kill a batch of bad supplies from their inventory. You'd think they might have delays while repacking some boxes still in warehouses.

  • Right..... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Iriel ( 810009 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @05:42PM (#14214061) Homepage
    So instead of waiting until the Christmas-ish time to make everyone's gaming season merry and bright, they decided to tease us with a mediocre launch of a paltry sum of systems? Some of which were even admittedly defective, and still haven't been replaced.

    It's not the open-source geek in me that says this, but as someone who has seen good and bad marketing: I can't buy that story. They want to keep the problems to a controlled population so they don't have to pull a massive recall across the nation. The thing that I can't quite get is why they did this for hype (which I'm still convinced of, until intelligently rebuked) when they could have waited a little longer to make everything go smoothly. They still would have been several months ahead of Sony.

    This is why I never buy new systems until at least 6 months after release. I'll let everyone else go through the beta-testing machines and titles before I toss a few hundred dollars into something that could end up sucking for another few years. (and that goes equally for Sony and Nintendo)
    • So instead of waiting until the Christmas-ish time to make everyone's gaming season merry and bright, they decided to tease us with a mediocre launch of a paltry sum of systems?

      Waah? They did release at Christmas-ish time. I'm confused.

      The thing that I can't quite get is why they did this for hype (which I'm still convinced of, until intelligently rebuked) when they could have waited a little longer to make everything go smoothly.

      So, do you believe every unsubstantiated rumor until it's proven to be u

      • Re:Right..... (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Iriel ( 810009 )
        Well my idea of Christmas-ish time is a little different thant the commercial one. I don't even think about Christmas until after Thanksgiving. That's just me and my view of things, and so feel free to disagree with it.

        On the other hand, marketing tactics are almost always rumors even after the marketing drive is over. No company like to say why they did it because nobody wants to feel like the sucker for buying into someone else's ploy. From any reasonable business standpoint (note the word reasonable, I'm

        • Most current console/portable games have disappointed the hell out of me, and I'm hoping that '3rd-gen' can bring something with more substance than another 90 Madden titles and rehashed FPS'. Call me jaded if you will, but I'm just trying not to buy the system that's over-loaded with unoriginal garbage for games after it's first year.

          I hear you on this, but have you tried Fahrenheit? I just started playing it on my Xbox the other day, and it's really the most intelligent and interesting current-gen console

          • Actually, being the RPG addict that I am, I'm waiting to get my grubby little nubbies on Magna Carta for the PS/2. It's getting harder and harder to find RPGs with original stories that aren't just plain stupid anymore.
            • It seems it's all about slashing through as many enemies as possible before the game ends. It's really disheartening. I did really like Fable, but before that one, I think Planescape was the last good one. I wish someone could come up with something that had the quality of Ultima 7 and the visuals of Fable :).

              I hadn't heard of Magna Carta, is this the one: http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/rpg/magnacarta/review . html [gamespot.com]
              If so, it doesn't seem quite like my cup of tea, but thanks for the heads up anyway.
              • Personally, my old fav for many years on PC (that I still haven't finished) was Daggerfall. In case you don't know, it's the prequel to Morrowind. Daggerfall itself is actually the second in the Elder Scrolls series, which was started with Arena when PC games had two colors: pea soup green and a sort of fucia that should be outlawed. I have high hopes for Oblivion, but there's something in me that worries that Bethesda could degenerate the series into a world that appears to be fantastic with no real substa
                • Oh yeah, I remember Daggerfall, and Arena as well. I remember countless nights playing Arena on my 486 - fun times. It had an inventive spell making system that let you create your own spells. I made a spell that did a lot of things simultaneously, including destroying the wall you were facing. That made a lot of those endless dungeon missions quite easy.
                  That said, I never finished either of them (nor Morrowind for that matter). I do have high hopes for Oblivion (I already have it on preorder...), but ther

    • Re:Right..... (Score:4, Informative)

      by Blakey Rat ( 99501 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @11:23PM (#14216290)
      Some of which were even admittedly defective, and still haven't been replaced.

      Source?

      Microsoft's official line is that they will use next-day shipping to exchange or repair any crashing Xbox 360s that were purchased. Do you have a source that says otherwise?

      (I guess if you have a defective one, and didn't call Microsoft or return it to the store you bought it from, then yes some "still haven't been replaced.")

    • Re:Right..... (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Nintendo had lock-up problems (pretty severe ones) with the Famicom in Japan in 1983. They did the same thing Microsoft is doing now: offering free replacement/repair/take-care-of-it and all you had to do was contact your retailer. For this, Nintendo was hailed as a hero and company of the highest integrity in Japan, and the Famicom went on to control over 95% of the Japanese gaming market for half a decade... to say nothing of what it did as the NES here in America. Nintendo HAD to take that chance and
    • So instead of waiting until the Christmas-ish time to make everyone's gaming season merry and bright, they decided to tease us with a mediocre launch of a paltry sum of systems?

      Do you realise that if they'd released it say a couple of weeks before Christmas, then several times LESS people would have been able buy one for Christmas? That's what you want?

  • Picture (Score:4, Funny)

    by daeley ( 126313 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @05:43PM (#14214065) Homepage
    The picture of Ballmer in that article is priceless: all he needs is a shiny helmet and a big picture of the Bill "Our Undying Leader" Gates projected on the screen behind him. :)

    That and electricity arcing between his outstretched hands as he creepily intones "De. Velop. Ers."

  • Tin foil hat theory (Score:2, Interesting)

    by NTT ( 92764 )
    Lets see here....
    Who is making the chips???
    IBM? Correct?
    Think this is IBM's way of getting back at M$ for buying "licenses" from SCO?

    Fun to think about....

  • Major PS2 Similarity (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Puhase ( 911920 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @05:50PM (#14214149)
    As I remember, the PS2 had its lower release number due to the complete meltdown of a chip forging plant. Yet Sony, by producing its own hardware, had enough in backup store in order to at least satiate a heathly part of consumer demand.

    Ravenous demand is great if you can push your product out the door to feed the slobbering consumer zombies. How many parents are going to buy their kids $400-$600 giftcards so they can pick up the box later? I'll save myself by not wagering a guess, but my own experience is that kids want something to open and play with on Christmas, not the promise of getting something, and then maybe not even before they get back to school starting. This is not a debate on the merits of the system itself, but a revelation once again of how the marketing/finance departments simply don't communicate with the nuts and bolts guys. A bad situation just got worse.

    • Game ratings (Score:2, Insightful)

      by tepples ( 727027 )

      How many parents are going to buy their kids $400-$600 giftcards so they can pick up the box later?

      Given the association of the Xbox platform with T and M ratings on original games, not as many as one would think.

    • Re:Major PS2 Similarity (Score:4, Insightful)

      by badasscat ( 563442 ) <basscadet75@NOspAm.yahoo.com> on Thursday December 08, 2005 @06:40PM (#14214561)
      As I remember, the PS2 had its lower release number due to the complete meltdown of a chip forging plant. Yet Sony, by producing its own hardware, had enough in backup store in order to at least satiate a heathly part of consumer demand.

      Yeah, and people thought that was bad. I waited in line for that launch, didn't get a unit and was really pissed off. But I had preordered online also and got a second shipment system - one week later.

      I don't recall a time when a system launched and then was sold out completely for more than a week or so. I mean Ballmer's saying stores are getting weekly stock replenishments - what stores? Obviously not any of the big ones or we'd be hearing about it on all the tech blogs. My thinking is he's just pulling this out of his ass to make people feel better. I don't think they've shipped a single unit in the US since launch.

      If we go a month between shipments (which seems pretty possible), then I don't even think you can call this a launch. This is more of a "test market". A launch is when you can actually put product in consumers' hands. A test market is when you test demand and also see how the system stands up to consumer use. That's what this feels like to me.

      Game publishers can't be very happy about this either, especially as rushed as some of the launch titles obviously were. No doubt they'd have loved to have had another couple of months to finish up. And the stupid thing about it is, it's not like MS is getting any extra revenue because of Christmas out of the November "launch", because they don't have enough systems to satisfy demand in any case. They would have sold out regardless even if they launched in February or March.

      It seems pretty freakin' clear at this point that this launch was rushed. I don't think there can be any argument about that anymore.

      • I think it's been said that Microsoft are shipping to the retailers every week. But you don't generally ship directly to each induvidual shop, they're shipping them to the retailers distrubtion centres, and it's up to the retailers if they ship them immediatley to the shops, or hold back so they have a large number of units they can put on sale a week before Christmas. Apparently in the US, the big stores are using the latter stratergy.

        I have heard reports here in the UK that some shops have got new stock t
    • How many parents are going to buy their kids $400-$600 giftcards so they can pick up the box later? I'll save myself by not wagering a guess, but my own experience is that kids want something to open and play with on Christmas..... Yup, and the next best thing for parents to buy is...(drum roll) THE PSP!!! WAY TO GO BILLY, for FORCING everyone who was not BLESSED enough to be able to buy your wonderfull (and deliberately undersupplied) CrapBox 360! Now, All Sony has to do is some kind of clever tie in w

  • Comment removed (Score:3, Funny)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @05:58PM (#14214216)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • What's kludging up the yield? (Score:3)

    by hal2814 ( 725639 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @06:00PM (#14214241)
    Ok the yield of the chips is lower than expected. Which chips and why? Is the 360 finicky about the chips or are the chips just coming out bad? Are we talking about the main processors, the graphics processors or what? Just curious who really dropped the ball here (if anyone). Also wondering if this is just a load of bull (though don't immedeately see why it would be).

    • Re:What's kludging up the yield? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Keith Russell ( 4440 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @06:44PM (#14214583) Journal

      One issue may be that they can't bin the cores or GPUs.

      (For those unfamiliar with binning: With your general-purpose parts, any chip that can't run at, say, 2.4GHz gets tested at 2.2GHz. If it passes at that speed, it gets labeled "2200" instead of "2400", and doesn't go to waste. The only chips that are completely rejected are the ones that can't pass at the minimum spec'd speed.)

      In the case of a game console, there's no "range" of chip speeds. There is one fixed target clock speed, so the final test is a strict pass/fail.

      The typical pattern for a new chip design is for the lower clock speed parts to arrive first. It takes a while for the fabs to work out the kinks that keep the top-speed yields low. Since the X360's core and GPU chips are custom designs, it's no surprise that it's taking a while to ramp up production.

      It's easy to pick on Microsoft, especially in these here parts, but look at the evidence. Overheating power supplies, low chip yields, Perfect Dark Zero discs being pressed before the game was certified...

      "Deadline or Bust" == Bust.

      • Great information on binning, but you leave out one very likely explanation. The chips are tested at their maximum possible speeds, but are clocked lower for the production unit. They probably ARE binning, just locking all chips down to a specific minimum speed.

        That said, they don't have the option of selling lesser performing chips at lower speeds, and that'll kill your yields every time.
      • with something like a new console system, one that's planned to be a stable standard platform for a number of years to come, wouldn't it be commonsense to delay a launch in order to ensure that there's no incredible publicity buzzkill like these bugs and shortages? personally, i was eagerly awaiting drooling over one of these, but now i'm thinking four, five, even six times if it's worth it to drop 300 smacks on something that was rushed out of the launch gates. that kinda bad publicity has gotta at least
        • "and i think they'd bite the bullet and wait for a later deadline if they were reassured that the product would be bug free."

          i really don't think it would work like that, people want what they want "right now!!" and then when they get it, and it doesn't work, they bit** about it not working right, even they were the ones that caused the rush in the first place... we expect a perfect product at the deadline, and we need to learn that it's not going to happen, companys like microsoft can only test the console

  • Someone has been lying (Score:3, Interesting)

    by badfish99 ( 826052 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @06:20PM (#14214391)
    Either this story isn't true, or else this [slashdot.org] story isn't true.

    Since this is the official Microsoft version, I know which one I believe.

    • Yes i am so with you on that one. i read that other one http://games.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/11/03/ 0026241&from=rss [slashdot.org] way back when it was posted. now i saw this new thing from the MS people.. hmm how can we know that anything MS says is true? well you cant unless they say it needs an update. I have always defended MS to my Apple friends and have boycotted the iPod like it is my religion. I think MS is killing themselves trying to strong arm into the gaming industry. X-Box has only been around for
    • Gee, did you REALLY believe that this was a MS imposed "shortage"?!? Low processor yields and delivery problems were quite apparent. No company is going to spend millions to ship a product before Christmas and then hold back... for what gain? They weren't planning on charging a premium for the consoles so a self-imposed shortage would have been idiotic. The only ones who made out were the retailers who sold overpriced bundles, and even they were hurt by not having more stock. It was bad business the whole w
    • You mean Slashdot might have posted an anti-Microsoft story that wasn't entirely true? GASP! SHOCK! HORROR! HUGE DOSE OF SARCASM!!!

  • Every week? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by RealErmine ( 621439 ) <commerce@nOspaM.wordhole.net> on Thursday December 08, 2005 @06:25PM (#14214429)
    "All stores are getting new units each week."

    This is an outright lie. I, and I'm sure others of you, have asked at stores such as Best Buy if they had yet received any more 360 units since the initial shipment. The answer was "No, but hopefully soon." This was last friday, a week and a half since the initial batch. Maybe there is a single Wal-Mart and a single Best Buy, etc. somewhere that got one or two more units after launch day, but that stretches Ballmer's assertion pretty tight. By no means was it "all stores".

    • Re:Every week? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by brkello ( 642429 )
      Or the employees are buying them up and selling them on ebay.
      • You think Best Buy employees have n times $400 USD to spend on consoles every week?

        Why are they working at Best Buy if this is the case?
        • Each time they sell one they can afford a new one. Or more than one.
        • how about the following options?

          1: buy with credit card sell on ebay before card bill comes through.
          2: sell on ebay before buying (requires you to know when the stock you plan to divert is coming so you don't hold up your buyers too much).
  • All stores are getting new units each week.

    Not one store I've talked to in my area has received a second shipment, let alone all stores, as we head into week 3 of release. I wonder if a definition of *all* is what we need?
    • Microsoft ships to distribution centers. It is up to the distribution centers to decide which stores get the product. Just because the distribution centers decided the stores you talked to were a low priority doesn't mean Microsoft isn't shipping product to those distribution centers...

      -everphilski-

  • Talk about missing the boat... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by meanfriend ( 704312 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @06:39PM (#14214547)
    MS wanted to release this season so they could capitalize on having the Xmas season all to themselves and jump on as much early marketshare as possible in the next-gen console wars. Next Xmas will be too late. All three consoles will be available and it will be a free-for-all at retail. Thier window of mega-opportunity is right now, and they are failing to maximize on it.

    Now the $500 purchases that would have gone to MS are now being spent on other gifts (not necessarily console related) and come January, people are going to be worrying about paying off holiday bills, not spending even more. How much in sales, and more importantly marketshare, have they thrown right out the window simply by not having an adequate supply?

    Microsoft is all about ubiquity, not scarity. Having consumers not being able to buy however much MS product whenever they want is totally counter to thier MO. The admission by Ballmer about poor yields as quite telling. Publicly, they are disappointed. Behind the scenes, they are probably furious and ready to vomit with rage. The supply issues may not be thier fault, but that doesnt lessen the damage...

  • Apple's Switch- More Proof? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by millia ( 35740 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @06:43PM (#14214578) Homepage
    Preface: I love the PowerPC.

    Okay, so, Microsoft is having problems getting chips. Don't know exactly which chips, but I'm going to make an educated guess and say it's those spiffy new powerpc chips.

    Sorta makes Steve Jobs look somewhat less irrational, doesn't it? If Microsoft can't get all the chips it needs for something they're spending billions on, how on earth is Apple expected to?

    That being said, I wish somebody- Motorola, IBM, whomever- had gotten their act together and come out with PowerPC chips that could compete in the (irrational) battleground that Intel laid out.
    • The battleground wasn't irrational; Intel knew exactly what they were doing when they chose it. And it was indeed good for Intel (if not the rest of the industry) until the rise of AMD.

  • Ballmer could sink Microsoft (Score:3, Insightful)

    by petrus4 ( 213815 ) on Thursday December 08, 2005 @07:41PM (#14214991) Homepage Journal
    The man is a complete incompetent, and his repeated tendency of making a fool of himself in public cannot be good for the company's business. On top of that, we've had the large amount of grumbling on MS staff blogs recently about his policies behind closed doors, as well.

    Gates should replace him, and soon, before he does too much more damage. If there's one thing Microsoft can't afford these days, it's deer-in-the-headlights leadership.
  • no wait... hah-hah-hah-heh-*snort*-hehhehehe... OK.

    Now where are all the MS fanboy's who tried to say I was wrong about the low yields now??? Hehhehe

    Let's see, they already cut back one of the "cores" to increase yields, and they still can't even get a decent yield. Massive power draws, and PSU problems, random crashing, no killer app launch title... NADA.

    Let's just call a spade a spade here: MS fucked up. They got greedy and fucked themselves over better than Sony or Nintendo could have ever hoped to do. I
  • One would think that before Microsoft decided to run with the PPC chips they would have looked at the problems Apple had. Apple ran into similar supply issues with the G5, not to mention IBM's inability to live up to promises it made about speed increases. Those problems were affecting Apple a long time ago, and the stories were all over the tech gossip sites. Perhaps if Microsoft had kept stealing ideas from Apple and dumped the PPC chips for Intel this wouldn't be a problem.
    • Your rationale here makes too much sense. MS should have been able to see that Apple has had longstanding PPC production issues with both Moto and IBM, but their hubris keeps blinding them into thinking that these are problems with Apple itself, and not something that they (MS) wouldn't be able to overcome.
  • supply and demand.
    Not that I just hate microsoft, but I really think this is a clever ploy.
    1. They can beta test on a limited number of systems, so any recalls would be very small.
    2. They can get all their units sold quick, not waste any sitting on shelves for a week. By sending out more of the higher end systems, you could convince someone who was waffling between the base and the high end to buy, just by being able to.

    Oh, and I imagine that's what Ballmer looks like when he's constipated, great picture!

    • 2. They can get all their units sold quick, not waste any sitting on shelves for a week. By sending out more of the higher end systems, you could convince someone who was waffling between the base and the high end to buy, just by being able to.

      Actually, I think it's the reverse. Now that there is a real shortage, I bet the only systems you will see on the shelves is the "Core."

      People will buy the "Core" system because it will be only thing they can get their hands on. It costs more to upgrade a "Core" s

      • huh. Didn't think about that, but it makes sense. It kind of makes me want to goto my local Walmart and see what's there. This might be a fun economics experiement.
    • supply and demand.

      Stack Overflow. Stick to the word limit next time.
      • I did...
        [reference.com]

        Together with or along with; in addition to; as well as. Used to connect words, phrases, or clauses that have the same grammatical function in a construction.

        The 'and' signifies the joining of two other phrases, in this case one word phrases. It is not meant to be part of the two words. I guess I figured CS people might understand that using the '|' does not make the '|' part of the expression, just join's em.
        I'll rephrase for you:
        $supply = 0x01;
        $demand = 0x10;
        $result = $supply | $demand

  • As has been already mentioned, IBM is the company fabricating the chips for Xbox360. Its also doing the same for ps3 and revolution. What usually happens with a fab like IBM, they share the same manufacturing lines between their products and their clients (ie MS,Nintendo and Sony.) Hopefully they are not all being manufactured at the fishkill plant....
  • If they had not released the console on time, or puched the launch back, we would have heard "Haha M$ is teh SuX0R". They release it on the promised date in limited quantities and they are still evil. I want a 360 because three of my freinds have them. They are an impressive machine. I love the controller so much I am buying a wired version to use on my PC.

    What is the big deal, it sucks I have to wait til next year, but, i heard similar lamenting about the PS2. Why does one company get a free ride while the
  • You go Ballmer.. Awww, I feel so sorry about this people who have crashing game systems. You know anything from MicroSuxx rots. Excuse me while I go play my Dreamcast. *puts in a burnt CD* Wow! it plays, learn from the fallen , XBox..
  • It's like THIS: 1. Gifter wants to get recipeint an Xbox 360 2. Xbox 360 unavaliable, because (FOR WHATEVER REASON) M$ Fucked up 3. Now Gifter gets the "next best" gaming related gift, the PSP. (the gifter has to give something for Xmas) 4. Now that the recipeint has a PSP, Sony wins more software sales. 5. When person has disposable income again (probably a good 6 months with the amount spent on xmas nowadays) to buy Next Gen Console himself, he buys the PS3 because of the UMD adapter that is avai

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