How 'Games for Windows' Will Change PC Gaming 392
Joystiq has a short piece up talking with Windows (GFW) Marketing Director Kevin Unangst and PR Manager Michael Wolf about the future of the 'Games for Windows' initiative. With the launch of Vista, Microsoft is making a big push to turn PC games into a 'console-like' cohesive brand. Instead of relying on the good name of individual publishers to sell titles, Redmond is requiring that all titles use similar packaging and a distinctive logo. Along with the new gamer-centric features in Vista, and the tie-in to Xbox 360 with 'Live Anywhere', this is meant to reinvigorate the PC games market for the sometimes not-so-savvy consumer. From the article: "By making gaming a priority in the Vista experience, Microsoft is molding a powerful pairing of the Games for Windows and Xbox 360 brands. To some extent, this is based on a hope that Live Anywhere will be embraced by GFW developers and publishers, pulling Xbox Live (and your Gamertag) outside of the 'Box, in turn encouraging an unrivaled virtual community. But there are simpler touches that also spark our interest. For example, start up Vista's Minesweeper, connect your 360 controller, and enjoy a subtle rumble each time you slip up. It's the melding with the familiar that will drive new and lost consumers to the Games for Windows brand."
Re:If they can pull it off... (Score:5, Insightful)
But ultimately that would just turn PC gaming into second-rate consoles.
Personally I'd like to see the exact opposite -- PC gaming that is more appropriate for a PC. For instance windowed gaming: There are a tremendous number of games that can only play in fullscreen mode, yet I like the ability to hop between applications without a time sucking, crash-inducing schism, not to mention that I like to see all of my other windows.
New and lost? (Score:4, Insightful)
So they have given up on all the current gamers, eh?
Besides that amazingly stupid thing to say, which I'm sure was more of a slip-of-the-tongue-while-trying-imitate-Nintendo, PC games have always been wildly different. Trying to make them somehow the same by making them all use the same box design is crazy. (Same meaning moreso than they already are, considering they are all the same shape and size, etc etc.) Requiring the logos to be the same spot, and the requirements in the same spot, etc etc will only stifle the creativity of the box designers. It will not somehow create a community for pc gamers that didn't exist before and draw in people that have been resistant to PC gaming.
Those people DO NOT CARE.
If you can build a Wiimote for PC and not get sued, THEN you can probably get some non-gamers to care. (Or another suitably wonderful and fun controller.)
Re:If they can pull it off... (Score:5, Insightful)
Honestly, I think Microsoft has the right idea except they're only 10 years too late. 10 years ago, in the wake of Window's 95, everyone wanted someone to make PC gaming a more user friendly experience that didn't require endless patches and work to play games; today if people want something that is inexpensive and easily plays games they're going to buy a console without even considering a PC.
Another Tactic to Discourage Multi-Platform Titles (Score:5, Insightful)
Windows games (Score:5, Insightful)
Hey Sony, Nintendo, and Apple, Listen Up! (Score:5, Insightful)
This is your wake up call. MS intends to leverage their OS monopoly to give themselves and advantage in the gaming console market. This also provides another layer of defense around their core, OS monopoly. This is bad news for all of you, Nintendo, Sony, and Apple. They're also trying to build out DirectX tools to make the PC and Xbox a one stop shop. This is their classic strategy and it works, unless the existing players form a good, open standards based partnership. You're all influential OpenGL houses. You all have a vested interest here. Sony has already moved towards making OpenGL models key to their gaming platform. Now is the time for all of you to abandon trying to build lock-in strategies in this field and start making a concerted effort to interoperate. Build a game development toolset that makes OpenGL games on Windows, PS3, Wii, and the Mac a single entity. Beat MS at their own game. Give Blizzard and Id a call. You've got one shot at this guys, and if you fail your media enterprises are going to be easy targets. Get to it!
Re:Another Tactic to Discourage Multi-Platform Tit (Score:3, Insightful)
One of the top reasons people cite when they reconsider moving to another platform is the unavailability of the games they like, or the reality that the games don't become available until months later. That's an advantage MS would like to preserve. Every game written for DirectX 10 / Vista rather than OpenGL / multiplatform is a step in that direction, and every effort to make OpenGL a second-class 3D API on Vista is too.
Re:Windows games (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Hey Sony, Nintendo, and Apple, Listen Up! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Windows games (Score:5, Insightful)
Besides, what true gamer would limit their FPS experience with a friggn' console controller?
I don't think MS is going to remove the ability for developers to target the keyboard and mouse, I think they just want the gamepad to work as well, which isn't too bad of an idea - giving the user a choice is always a good idea.
Re:If they can pull it off... (Score:4, Insightful)
However, the two are not going to be mixed anytime soon. Windowed games are going to be less performant, simply because you're going to be operating your desktop at a much higher resolution than you're going to be playing your game (unless you have an uber-card that can do 1900x1440 at 120fps, in which case your game window might not *fit* on your desktop).
Monopoly Abuse Again (Score:4, Insightful)
Spend $2K to play console games? (Score:2, Insightful)
Has M$ done something to prevent a USB mouse and keyboard from being plugged into the XBox360? Why isn't the future of PC gaming a console with a mouse and keyboard?
Re:Hey Sony, Nintendo, and Apple, Listen Up! (Score:5, Insightful)
You must be on crack if you think that Microsoft's push of DirectX will sway the console wars.
Yeah, people have said the same thing about other markets they embraced.
Game studios which put out multi-platform games are not interested in abandoning their multi-platform market in favour of the oh-so-lucritive[sic] PC and XBox market.
MS already owns a lot of those game studios. They will buy more as they need to. And they don't need to change the minds of entrenched players, if they can win over the new development shops. Already a lot of games are developed with DirectX tools, simply because the tools and skills are cheap and easy. Some of those new companies move on to make good, multi-platform games, but some have enough important people with a DirectX-only skill set that they stay with it out of momentum. Every one of them, is just that many more Windows/xbox exclusive titles that contributes to their win. Maybe it won't happen with the Xbox360, or even the next generation of consoles, but it only needs to hit critical mass once, and then it is theirs.
There is much more money to be made in selling the same game on numerous platforms instead of only 2.
There are different types of costs. There is overall cost and their is up front investment cost. If a new company wants to make a game and they can cheaply use existing DirectX talent and kit the Xbox and Windows, they'll do it. Hell, a whole lot of small time companies already do so and all they hit is the Windows market. Unless they have a toolset that competes and lets them hit a similar number of end users for similar or lower upfront cost, this number will slowly grow.
The only explanation for your reasoning is that it will simplify development - but the only one who is having trouble with their dev kits (at this point) is Sony, so your argument goes out the window.
Game developers always complain about dev kits, for every platform. Anything that makes it easier, or cheaper in the short run is a real competitor. This is a proven market strategy and it will be benefitting MS. The only question is how much will it benefit them and will it be countered.
I love it! (Score:3, Insightful)
Now, finally, I feel vindicated. "Games for Windows" games will get all kinds of features that won't work on non-"Games for Windows" games.
Hopefully, this will be make OpenGL, OpenAL, SDL, etc. . . look even better (as they've been rapidly improving of late) in comparison to the DirectX suite of APIs.
Re:New and lost? (Score:5, Insightful)
Most likely, they're talking about the rapidly-growing "casual gamers" crowd.
They want a super-smooth and polished purchase, install, and play path for casual gamers. They want an experience as reliable and smooth as that of purchasing a game for a console, but for a computer with Windows installed.
On a console, the hardware is basically identical. The OS software is basically identical. The controllers are standardized, and perfectly regular.
There is never any ambiguity, in a Nintendo Wii game, about what the "(A)" button refers to, and what the "[B]" button refers to. The same on a PS2 controller, with an X, a triangle, and so on. The game developers know exactly how everything is laid out.
There are never install problems, you just put the disk in, and it works. If it doesn't work, it's because the disk is bad. There are very simple decision trees at work here.
When you're in the store, looking for the Wii games, there's no difficulty finding them. Not only are the sectioned, but all the titles have the same look and feel. Hoards of consumer psychologists have found out that Brands Work.
They want to make it possible for there to be "Windows Games," which work on Windows just like N64 games work on an N64. Platform, platform, platform.
It's a sensible strategy.
They're not talking about games that hard core gamers play. They're not talking about your community. They are talking about a super-fast growing market segment. Businesses love super-fast growing markets, it's where all the action in determining what the landscape will look like is. Things that don't grow are basically set in their patterns, and change is only made very slowly, unless the market is being torn apart by some obsoleting force.
Re:New and lost? (Score:5, Insightful)
Keyboard & Mouse for Xbox360 (Score:3, Insightful)
Terms: Unconditional Surrender (Score:3, Insightful)
is there anything that Microsoft could do as a business that would ever please you? Honestly?
To paraphrase the animatrix: Surrender your code and you will enjoy a new life of the mind. You have no choice.
While I think that the only way for them to prevent a repeat of past abuses is to GPL their code, most people would be happy if they would just quit trying to FUCK EVERYONE. You know, stop threatening to sue everyone, shoving formats onto media, quit the drive to "trusted computing" where everyone must pay a fine to run on "their platform" and nothing else runs on any computing device made, stupid totalitarian shit like that. I don't have anything to do with their garbage, yet still they bother me. I have to trade files with people who still suffer on their platform. Worse, I have to put up with all the silly restrictions they force onto ISPs, which do little to stop the further damage their OS does to the networks every day. If drawing up little rules about packaging for what constitutes a game on Windoze is any indication, they are going in the wrong direction. They are flexing muscles they should not have to no good purpose. It's an exercise in pure annoyance that announces the future stagnation of Windows gaming.
The funniest thing about all of this is that it's suicidal. By sticking to their own junk and the non free way, they are falling further and further behind. Had they spent the last six years porting to free software instead of building Vista, they would be much stronger today. Instead they are about to take a huge fall: Vista is going to be a washout and revenue from Office is going to dry up.
Their death will be good for the rest of the industry. There are plenty of good distributions out there, ready, willing and able to configure PCs for vendors. Their biggest roadblock is M$'s cross licensing and vendor intimidation to keep specs out of their hands. Microsoft's downfall will bring real and honest competition to an industry that's been hamstrung for decades.
Re:Why feel the need to hate Microsoft so much? (Score:4, Insightful)
Microsoft has destroyed the market for Linux by disallowing Microsoft OEMs from shipping other operating systems (SEE BeOS, for instance). Microsoft fucks over other people, including their customers, just to maintain dominance.
That's why I hate Microsoft. If they played fairly, I wouldn't mind their incompetence and terrible products so much. But, since that's they only way they can survive, I guess I shouldn't hold it against them.
Re:Why feel the need to hate Microsoft so much? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:New and lost? (Score:3, Insightful)
It's easy. Stupid easy. Easier is better if the functionality dosen't suffer.
-GiH
Microsoft is entitled to leverage its power. (Score:3, Insightful)
But what has the open source community or other companies done all these years regarding gaming? is there an open source gaming library that covers all aspects of game programming and is cross-platform and easy to use? in other words, is there a Qt for gaming? nope, there is not. As there is not a simple yet powerful operating system (Linux is powerful but not simple), a powerful Office Package without bugs (Open Office has quite a lot of them) etc.
Please don't tell me that it is the monopoly of Microsoft that determines the success of its products. It is simply the quality of the experience: Microsoft products offer the right quality for the right people (system admins many not be them though). Open source can do it; take Firefox for example: great open source success, because the product is of very high quality.
Re:Oh please. (Score:3, Insightful)
Granted it doesn't happen in every game but often enough that it's a pain. And when it does you're definitely not looking at "a few minutes" to set up the damn thing.
I tended to start at the "recommended settings" and work up from there. Usually they were good enough for the FX7600 I have (or think I have, not sure of the exact number now).
This reminds me I'll have to reinstall Windows one of these days. If only to play Company of Heroes which has been sitting on my desk for ages...
Re:If they can pull it off... (Score:3, Insightful)
I remember trying to game on my only 286... now that was freakin' hard.... I remember making batch files of batch files, messing withg EMS, XMS, and whatever other crazy memory BS , not to mention the CGA, EGA, VGA, stuff going on.... making boot disks for each particular game, just so it would load properly, all the while installing something on 30 floppy disks (5 1/4" bitches!)... etc..... It generalizes down to two principles:
1) I pretty much got my interetest into computer science from trying to play games on my various systems (and trying to tweak out whatever I could to play games).
2) Other people are stupid and/or lazy and/or spoiled.
If I had mod points I'd mod you up!