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Games Entertainment

This Year's Top Game Design Innovations 169

Next Generation has one of those end of the year 'top 10' lists we all love so much, with plenty of room for discussion on this one. They claim to have picked out the top 10 game design innovations of 2007. It's hard to argue with elements like Portal's portals or Mass Effect's conversation wheel, but was Metroid Prime 3 on the Wii really as good as a mouse-and-keyboard PC FPS? "When people ask 'How do we make a good shooter on a console' what they really mean is 'how do we make a shooter that feels as quick and responsive as a PC shooter on the console?' Apparently the answer is the Wii mote. I was blown away by this fact. Nintendo had always been the 'family friendly' console to me so I didn't consider the FPS ramifications of the Wiimote but clearly it's the best tool for the job. With some tweaking and some refinement down the line I could see the Wii (or a console with Wii like controls) becoming the platform of choice for hardcore FPSers, even over the PC. If this does become the case it will owe it all to Metroid Prime 3."
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This Year's Top Game Design Innovations

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  • Wii FPS controls (Score:5, Insightful)

    by moderatorrater ( 1095745 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @02:44PM (#21674391)
    The only reason this is controversial is because the wiimote doesn't have good enough aim. It's often off by an inch or more on smaller tv's. This is hard on hard core FPS fans, but for me this isn't a problem. First, between wrestling with the auto-aim feature on a lot of shooters and using two analog sticks to control my movement and aim, I find correcting for the wiimote's bad aim to be easy by comparison. I'd rather have faster, more responsive aim that's off by a consistent amount than have to use a regular controller.
  • by edwdig ( 47888 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @02:54PM (#21674567)
    but was Metroid Prime 3 on the Wii really as good as a mouse-and-keyboard PC FPS?

    Metroid Prime 3 hit a weird spot. The first two Prime games certainly featured first person shooting, but didn't play anything like an FPS game. They played like an adventure game with a different camera angle. Prime 3 moved much closer to the FPS realm. If you're an FPS fan, you'll probably like the beginning and end of the game and tolerate the middle. If you're a Metroid fan, you'll probably feel the reverse.

    There's no doubt Wiimote+Nunchuck beats the keyboard part of mouse+keyboard. Precision moving and jumping is far easier with an analog stick than with a keyboard. If like me you rarely play FPS games, the Wiimote is easier to use than a mouse. But my gut feeling is over time, the mouse would be slightly easier to be precise with as it's on a flat surface rather than being held in the air.

    Of course, I play for the adventure, not the shooting, so I just left lock-on turned on, which means for the most part you only had to aim at bosses. If you found a good sitting position where you could rest the Wiimote on your knee and aim from there, you might be able to beat a mouse in precision.
  • by trdrstv ( 986999 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:05PM (#21674723)

    There's no way the Wii mote compares to a mouse and keyboard for shooters.

    The only reason it's usable at all in Metroid Prime 3 is because the Z button auto-locks your view onto the target.

    If it wasn't for that feature, the controls would be hopeless.

    On the default "n00b setting", yes it does this. On "Advanced" the Z button locks the camera on a specific target, but gives you free range shooting ability anywhere. This is the way it should be played.

  • by Moraelin ( 679338 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:05PM (#21674727) Journal
    You know, some time in 2003 or 2004, I was talking to a gamer coleague about FPS on consoles, and bitching about how much it sucks with twin sticks compared to a good keyboard and mouse. And from there it went into the all time nerd favourite, singlehandedly solving all the world's problems, like Picard. In this case, well, how would _you_ make a console controller that works well in FPS.

    So what we came up with was: a trackball. No, really.

    Think a standard console controller. Say, a Dual Shock, because everyone knows it. But it's the same principle for an XBox pad, Dreamcast pad, Gamecube pad, whatever, really.

    Now think replacing the right stick with a small, thumb-operated trackball.

    Think about it. A trackball has much the same advantages a mouse has, because it _is_ a mouse turned upside down. You can turn around 180 degrees at the flick of the thumb, and stop on exact pixel you want to. The problem of joystick vs mouse is really that moving with a joystick can be very fast or very accurate, but not both at the same time. A mouse lets you do both. So does a trackball.

    So, really, why doesn't anyone do just that?
  • by edwdig ( 47888 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:05PM (#21674739)
    I haven't played any pure FPS games on the Wii, only Metroid, but you're not really pointing at what you want to shoot. It works essentially like a mouse - just tilt the controller a little and the view & crosshair moves in the appropriate direction. You really shouldn't even know what the Wiimote is pointing at.
  • Wuh? (Score:1, Insightful)

    by DJCouchyCouch ( 622482 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:06PM (#21674751)
    "It's often off by an inch or more on smaller tv's. " What the hell? You point the wiimote at the (size-fixed) sensor bar, not at the TV. Doesn't matter what size TV you have.
  • by HalAtWork ( 926717 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:13PM (#21674863)
    You're way off base here. The way I play Metroid 3 is on the most sensitive setting with no lock-on targetting... The only time I ever use the lock-on button at all is because when you hold that button down, it locks your movement into strafe, which makes it simple to walk across straight and narrow areas like tiny bridges or whatever... or if I want to jump a lot but still want to be facing forwards. Even then, when lock-on mode is turned on in this way, you can still move the targetting reticle around to aim at different areas of the screen, all it does is it freezes the screen in the direction it was in when you pressed the button... you still have to aim at what you want to shoot at.
  • by edwdig ( 47888 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:16PM (#21674921)
    On the default "n00b setting", yes it does this. On "Advanced" the Z button locks the camera on a specific target, but gives you free range shooting ability anywhere. This is the way it should be played.

    Advanced sensitivity + Z lock for me. It's an adventure game, not a shooter. Why make disposing of the wildlife time consuming when the terrain is your real enemy?
  • I'm a believer... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by TheGreatGraySkwid ( 553871 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:18PM (#21674943) Homepage
    I've played several FPS games using the dual-analog scheme consoles have relied on to this point, and it always destroyed the immersive effect that is the FPS game's chief advantage. No matter how good you get with the sticks, the resultant motions on-screen are always jerky and mechanical. Robotic. It's a grating difference from the much more organic WASD + mouse scheme.

    Metroid Prime 3: Corruption is the closest to that organic movement I've experienced. It's still not perfect; the aim is a smidge twitchy, and it would be nice to be able to spin a bit more quickly. Those faults aside, it's deeply intuitive. No, it's not light-gun aiming, but neither is any other successful FPS scheme (rail shooters are the only games I've seen with light-gun aiming), so I don't know why anyone who's an FPS fan would complain about that. As I said, the slight jumpiness of the aiming means sniping isn't really do-able, but relative aiming is what anyone who has used a mouse control system is used to. Just hold the Wiimote at your side, where you're not tempted to look down the barrel, and let your wrist do the work...you'll adapt to it in an instant.

    And yes, using the motion control for the grapple and combination locks and the like is *very* satisfying. Really, I highly recommend any FPS gamers out there to give this game a look. I think you'll like what you see.
  • by IceCreamGuy ( 904648 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:34PM (#21675185) Homepage
    While I've been know to aggressively lash out at close friends for even positing the idea that a controller comes anywhere close to the accuracy and functionality of a mouse and keyboard, I have to disagree with you here. First off, who the hell plays that game with Z-lock on? It's like playing OoT with Z-Lock on; sure if you've never played a video game before it can be helpful, but it's more satisfying to actually become skilled at something like that; which brings me to my main point; when you become very familiar with the Wiimote-controls for Metroid Prime, the potential is greater than a mouse. I play Half-life through once a month on hard using only the pistol until I get to the giant testicle boss, I play CS, I play Unreal... I'm not some jackass who doesn't love his mouse, but to completely dismiss the Wiimote's potential like that just seems to me to be a little flippant.
  • by lpangelrob ( 714473 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:38PM (#21675241)
    Super Mario Galaxy might be one of the few games I play again from start to finish. :-D

    Video games have played with gravity in the past, but applying the concept of planetary gravity (with slightly non-realistic physics, but when you're orbiting around an ice cream cone, does it really matter?) to a 3-D platformer was the best idea I've ever played.

    At some point I'm going to find the smallest, most isolated planet I can find and try to see how many times I can orbit it with a long jump.

    That they did this without making me nauseous also deserves some sort of award. I seriously wonder how they did it.
  • EVE (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Cornflake917 ( 515940 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @03:43PM (#21675307) Homepage
    Honestly, how in the hell can a graphics upgrade be innovative? I can think of at least a couple more innovative things in EVE, and I think the game is a total bore.

    I'm sure other companies have thought of upgrading their MMO's graphics engine. I can't think of anything off the top of my head, but I'm sure other MMO's have at least improved some part of their graphics. I think this top 10 list will find it's way in to my top 10 list of "Most Poorly Thought-out Top 10 Lists of 2007."
  • by king-manic ( 409855 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @04:07PM (#21675567)

    There's no doubt Wiimote+Nunchuck beats the keyboard part of mouse+keyboard. Precision moving and jumping is far easier with an analog stick than with a keyboard. If like me you rarely play FPS games, the Wiimote is easier to use than a mouse. But my gut feeling is over time, the mouse would be slightly easier to be precise with as it's on a flat surface rather than being held in the air.
    I strenuously reject this statement. The wiimote + nunchuk are on par for some things but a magnitude worse for responsiveness. there is a notable lag between action of the mote and action on screen. partly due to the wi fi partly due to the slowness of the motion sensors. Given a choice I'd go KB+mouse 100% of the time. Metroid 3, Zelda, Rayman et al have not shown any promise that the wiimote will be better then kb + mouse. Wiimote+chuk is better then dual sticks of course. The wiimote and chuk only beats the keyboard and mouse in catagory: more intuitive to learn. Other then that WASD+mouse has it beat in every way.
  • by edwdig ( 47888 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @06:29PM (#21677509)
    Two issues:

    1) A keyboard is strictly digital buttons. It's no where near as precise as an analog stick for movement.

    2) Ease of access. You have plenty of keys, but a giant grid of keys isn't nearly as easy to use as something you wrap your hand around that has buttons placed so that they can be easily reached without confusion. Keyboard keys require more force and press down further than controller buttons, making them not as fast to hit. When you're trying to use 26 keys with one hand, it's easy for your hand to get lost on the keyboard, requiring you to either look down or take the time to reorient yourself.

    The only advantage a keyboard provides is that it has a lot of buttons, which just isn't necessary for the vast majority of games.
  • Innovation (Score:3, Insightful)

    by DaveCBio ( 659840 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @06:30PM (#21677521)
    People always prattle on about innovation, but in my world everything takes a back seat to fun. I don't care how "ground breaking" a game is, the big question is whether or not it's fun. So, if you want to talk about changing gaming and doing something new and different go for it, but just remember, it's still a game.
  • by grumbel ( 592662 ) <grumbel+slashdot@gmail.com> on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @06:42PM (#21677655) Homepage
    ### the resultant motions on-screen are always jerky and mechanical. Robotic

    Kind of like real soldiers, so I don't consider that a loss. Almost all FPS are utterly ridiculous in modeling a human being. They model a cylinder with a bit of wobble and a gun, thats it. No legs or stuff that actually matters a lot in actual movement. What WASD+mouse has going for it is that it doesn't have restrictions, you can turn as fast as you want, you are not limited by the game, only by your mouse skills. Which might be interesting for eSports, but for immersion I find it quite awful, since well, reality simply doesn't work that way and even SuperMario doesn't allow you to turn around on the stop, yet most FPS do.
  • Re:Unimpressed (Score:3, Insightful)

    by grumbel ( 592662 ) <grumbel+slashdot@gmail.com> on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @07:15PM (#21677919) Homepage
    ### Bioware usually does that kind of stuff with conversations

    I haven't played Mass Effect, but I did play KOTOR and Jade Empire and the dialog system in Mass Effect looks quite a bit different. For one thing KOTOR and Jade Empire are awfully black&white, you can do good thing and bad things, but basically never anything in the gray area, which makes all the dialogs feel very forced and unrealistic. Also your hero never talks in either game, other then indirectly through your dialog choices, which isn't exactly a good thing for cinematic feel. From what I have heard Mass Effect has far more gray-area choices and your choices are topic/thought based, instead of being exactly what comes out of your heroes mouth, also your hero talks in the game, making the dialog feel much more alive.

    All that said, its still nothing really new. It might be new for Bioware game, but realtime dialog was already done in Fahrenheit/IndigoProphecy some years ago (in general one of the innovativest games I have played in a long while), Dreamfall also had something similar, but without the realtime component. And looking back at older adventures one will also find quite a few that aren't based on strict dialog trees.

    ### but usually just with a single spherical world, not several you can jump between.

    Psychonauts had tons of individual gravity and some MegaMan games had inverse gravity in some areas. But I haven't played SMG, so I can't really comment on it.

    Overall innovation these days seems to be more a thing of "hasn't been done that often", "hasn't been done in a while", instead of a "has never been done before". But then with 30+ years of gaming, that is to be expected. Still a little sad that most games just copy last years block buster instead of copying a bit more creatively from other games in video game history.
  • by vux984 ( 928602 ) on Wednesday December 12, 2007 @07:50PM (#21678219)
    but if it doesn't make you a better player it's crap

    Except that the controller doesn't exist separately from the game, and games are designed around controllers.

    Consider how you move, jump, and climb, in an FPS with wasd? Its all *automated*! You run to a ladder and push forward and your avatar slings his gun and climb upwards. The designer removed all sorts of things from having to individually move your feet and arms and coordinate those actions, to having to sling your gun.

    The holodeck sim has let the designer put all that stuff back in, and made the experience more immersive. So now if you pit a holodeck player against a keyboard and mouse player, but forced the keyboard and mouse player to individually move hands, feet, fingers, torso, etc, they'd be almost unable to move.

    So, the keyboard and mouse is only a "better" controller if the game **compensates for the controller** and automates moving, running, climbing, etc.

    But its a pretty arbitrary place to set the automation. And its set there because it creates 'reasonably easy control while allowing for reasonably challenging play', and that's a game design choice. Some games make you push a key to climb, some make you put your gun away, some games have auto-run, some games simulate fatique and have it affect your reticule size etc...

    The keyboard/mouse could have even more automation, and do auto-aiming, auto-headshot, and auto-jump, auto-run (oh wait... autorun is already an option on most titles, and auto-aim is pretty common too...) that would make the game even easier to win than it already is; would that make it a 'better control scheme'? Does it make you a "better player"?

    Alternatively if the keyboard mouse scheme did LESS compensation then the holodeck guy would suddenly start winning. If the keyboard mouse scheme does NO compensation, and you had to use the keyboard/mouse to articulate all your limbs then the only way you'd beat the holdeck player is if he laughed himself to death watching you try to aim your gun at him.

    The point is that the 'controller' isn't just the hardware, its the software that interprets the controls, and the software part is pretty arbitrary. If a console player has dual analog sticks but the game auto-aims while the keyboard/mouse player has to cope with a reticule that floats around trailing the cursor instead of being the cursor... would keyboard/mouse still be superior?

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