Warhammer Producer Discusses Australian Launch, Game Details, and More 30
Josh Drescher, associate producer for the upcoming Warhammer Online, recently had a chance to chat with Gamespot about some of the recent changes on the horizon. Good news for Australian consumers who are slavering over EA's new title, it will not only be launched in Australia at the same time as the US and Europe but local servers will be set up to allow for better play. "From the very beginning the Australian fans were very vocal. One of the first strange packages that we got in the mail a couple of years ago was from an Australian fan who sent us a bunch of drop bear stuffed animals, and he attached fangs to them and there was blood all over their faces — and was basically threatening [producer] Jeff Hickman and letting him know that if there weren't Oceanic servers, that he would send a drop bear invasion to attack the developers physically."
stuffed animals lol (Score:3, Funny)
Proof (Score:2, Insightful)
prediction for Warhammer online (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:4, Funny)
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:2)
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:2)
I don't know if planned obsoletion is a good idea especially for game balance. Look at the trouble WoW is running into - the gear difference between 60 and 70 is so enormous that lower levels start buying services from lvl 70s to run them thru instances, inadverdently creating a tertiary economy, unplanned by Blizzard and while-not-technically against the terms of service, defeating the spirit of the game via loopholes.
And then the introduction of new lands (outlands, northrend) causes the previous thriving lands to be barren wastelands sitting there doing nothing but wasting cpu cycles on mobs just roaming around waiting for someone to kill them. That makes old raid instances literally gather dust - even though there may be enough people interested in still seeing those places, there isn't enough critical mass to make it worthwhile, especially since everybody is split up in different servers (Naxx, anyone?).
While Blizzard tried to come up with a series of hotfixes to remedy MMO issues that we've always wanted, they are nothing more than placeholders to keep players busy - simply for the sake of not leaving WoW.
If WAR is to follow the same path, it's pretty much a guarantee that they will fall to the wayside to pick up the scraps that WoW has left behind - kinda like the Lord of the Rings MMO or EQ2. Sure, LOTR/EQ2 may be popular, but it is nowhere near as popular as WoW. They need to do something different. Instead of doing yearly expansions like WoW does, I think it would be more interesting to see more of a microtransation-type upgrade. You know, like an experience that is more... minuature-like.
How about expansions that don't necessarily introduce new lands, but new classes to play? That will retain the individuality of each account holder without the feel of planned obsolesence. New lands can come in free, keeping older players to check out new stuff, new classes for the rest of the less-than-casual MMOers that want/need to have everything. Or expansions to introduce unique game mechanics.
Or new races for their expansions. With a third faction (why shouldn't we be allowed to play skaven?). What makes an MMO memorable is the journey, not the destination. Unfortunately most next-gen MMOs focus on the destination, which acts as the carrot on a stick and keeps players paying for more. This also produces a lot more internet animosity when grouped with people that don't play as hard - the whole idea of "He's bringing the whole team down, kick him from our team and lets pick up someone more worthwhile" is misconstrued and generally led by the most xbox-kiddie-vocal-dickheads you'll run into.
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:2)
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:1)
Unfortunately, no MMO out there so far really seems to aiming for v2.0 - Conan and WAR might be trying, but from what I've heard so far, at best they might make v1.5
The problem with trying to make an MMO v2.0, is that so much needs to be done differently to the current games, from scratch - and it doesn't seem like any company is going to take that opportunity - sorry - 'chance'.
So, what elements would make an MMO at v2?
The main one is an RPG system that:
a) scales up the wazoo as easily as possible, (to make it easy to add more depth)
b) is also modular, to make adding other additional game-play mechanics easier
And I'd also like to see:
c) making the game-play scalable too - so that two players, say, could play the same game in two different ways - (say as an adventure game (with RPG elements) or as a full RPG, in ways that are both BALANCED and COMPATIBLE - meaning if someone doesn't give a damn about character development/advanced combat systems, and is happy with everything on rails and auto-combat, and the other wants the opposite - then they can both have that, WITHOUT compromising each other...
As far as the general game-play, and the in-game content goes though - (though not quite so much the game-world, (though it will still play a part) (whether you are happy with a fully static world, (like we tend to have atm), or don't mind randomly generated areas) - which is another matter) - there's just one word which matters here:
DYNAMIC.
A lot of companies are already thinking about the latter - but I'm telling them, that if they try it without the former - (a good RPG system) - then it'll never reach it's full potential - and a good RPG system should be the FIRST thing you start working on...
Now, don't get me wrong - I might - (and only 'might' unfortunately
So I'm writing a 'little' paper, to try and help them with that - I just don't know what to do with it when I've finished it?
The first 2 parts are here, if anyone is interested in reading it?:
http://rpgforumsonline.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20613 [rpgforumsonline.com]
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:3, Insightful)
Let's have an MMO which has some actual game to it, rather than just being a giant chatroom with a combat system that makes Golden Axe look advanced.
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:2)
There's not a real technical limitation here - building new towns and burning them down again in real time, for example, is a solved problem within the resource limits needed (and has been done in several MMOs already). Designers just haven't accepted that this tool is in the toolbox, so we're still in the "EQ but it sucks less" generation of MMORPGs.
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:1)
TBH - the only 'dynamic' MMO I've played so far - (and about the only MMO I'd go back to - (if I didn't have a crappy usage cap on my internet connection
Basically, my main philosophy about MMO's is either make them PvP OR PvE first, then see how far you can go before thinking about making any compromises to add in the other. So many MMO's feel too heavily compromised IMO because the game nearly always tries to do both and generally sucks at it... (Jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none... etc..). I think the main reason Eve Online Works is because it's obvious they specialised in PvP as much as they could, then added the PvE afterwards - which seems to work much better than the other way round...
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:1)
I disaggree (Score:4, Interesting)
1. EQ2 already tried the blatant commercialism route, where even single instances get sold as "adventure packs" if they aren't big enough for an expansion pack.
Heck, most of their expansion packs are the kind of micro-transactions that you seem to favour, only priced too much. Their _largest_ expansion pack, Echoes of Faydweyr, introduced... two races, their newbie-ish areas and capital cities. I.e., it was pretty much comparable in size to the Draenei and Blood Elves of Burning Crusade, including their two zones each. But without the whole Outlands, which made the meat of Burning Crusade. I.e., it was pathetically small compared to Blizzard's one EP.
I don't think it did much to bring new players. It did, however, leave a lot of people with a bad sensation of being fleeced, quartered and dimed by Sony.
2. More classes just create more confusion, and a bigger chaos trying to balance them all. Plus, since there are only so many types of actions that even make sense in a game, you either
A) end up with classes which are almost identical, and add nothing new except confusion. (Did we really need 6 f-ing kinds of priests, among which two almost identical druids, in EQ2? One is slightly better at healing, unless you put your talents in offense, and one is slightly better at offensive magic, unless you put your talents in healing. Or did we really need Brigand, Swashbuckler and Assassin as different _classes_ instead of Rogue specs? Seriously, wtf? One class and 3 talent trees would do the same job just fine.)
B) have to restrict what other classes can do, so they don't overlap. (E.g., to have a class whose specialty is healing over time, you have to not give others such spells, or a severely gimped choice of them. Or to make a sub-class of mage recognizable by its AOEs, you have to have a different one that's got none or very few/weak. See EQ2 again. Or better yet, see COH.) Unfortunately that also makes the class less interesting to play. One of the attraction points of WoW is that there's so much different stuff you can do, and combine in interesting ways. A class which mostly just does the same thing over and over again, is repetitive and ultimately boring. And that's what you get if you try too hard to slice classes too thin.
Even in miniature games, you have more than one kind of unit in your army, and can alternate what you take in your army. So you can have narrow-focus "classes", because the player can then just make a mix of several of them.
In a MMO you play exactly one character (at a time.) If that one character is pushed into a very narrow role, and just pushes the same few buttons over and over again, it becomes boring fast.
3. Unused instances don't require any CPU cycles, because they're, you know, not instanced. And it's fairly trivial to not update some NPCs if noone is within range. I don't know how Blizzard coded it, but I wouldn't be too surprised if they're not wasting much.
4. As someone who still plays lower level alts too, I can tell you that virtually no outdoors zones became baren Wastelands.
You can't do much in the Outlands until level 58. Technically you can get a portal there earlier (I had Shattrath as my home on one char as early as level 11), but it's not like you can even take any quests or do much there. So you'll still have to level up from 1 to 58 the old fashioned way. Other than a couple of level 55+ zones like Silithus or EPL, nothing was hit too hard by the expansion pack.
The former grind instances are pretty much the only ones which became wastelands. But let's be honest: that grind sucked to start with. That's why people dropped them as soon as they had half a choice.
5. The "boosting" market isn't that horrible a phenomenon. Sure, half the people do their low level instances by following a level 70, but you still can find others which do their instances the old fashioned way.
If anything, it's more of a problem of class than an
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:3, Interesting)
A bigger cause of empty zones is they are hard coded for characters of a specific level. Elwynn Forest and Dun Morogh become just a path to get someplace else, an no one goes to Teldrassil unless forced to by a quest. As you advance through levels you abandon a tier at a time. LOTRO has the same problem with parts of Bree, the Shire, and Evendim. Which seems like a huge waste of zones and quests. Not to mention there are some zones you like, and some you hate, but in the current system you have to play them all. When I find that I'm losing interest in a MMO, it's usually because I'm in a zone I don't find all that interesting. And have to stay there until I pick up 5 or so levels.
If they changed the zones so that they adapted to the character, then you could complete quests and explore the zones for your own race and then move into the next. And then go back as more quests are added to existing zones. If done right, it would also make it possible for characters with wide differences in level to group together without power leveling. If your character is supposed to be able to do 10% damage to a bear, it doesn't matter what zone it is in our how many hit points it should have. This, btw, would be a big advantage for long time players looking to introduce friends to the game.
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:0)
If you want a level-based RPG, like most MMO's are atm, then some things simply arn't going to work that well... Percentages in combat etc. are most definitely one of them - though for more skill-based RPG's (similar to Eve-online, or adventure games), it won't so much of a problem.
Since, in a level based MMO, there will always be a large ratio between the capabilies of individual characters, trying to make them function together properly in a group will be extremely hard.
If thats the sort of thing you want - go for a skill-based RPG instead - if it's done right, then the differences between characters that have played for 2 years and those that have played for 2 days will be more, (though not totally), about the TYPES of skills/equipment etc. the characters can use, and not the use of individual skills or items... (For instance - if you gain 1 Million XP and unlock a sniper rifle, then, game-play wise it isn't THAT much better, (but still is - (there has to be some progress in relation to the time played)) - in general use, than the starting weapon - it would, however, be a LOT better in some circumstances, (but worse in others). (Like I said - think Eve-online, but not space-based)
As far as level-based MMO's go however - it's all about making sure that EVERYTHING within the game-world - (from players to missions to loot and all other resources) - is, or can be, spread well throughout. Basically - if there's any empty regions, or everyones clumped together in one area for purely game-play reasons - then it's simply a case of BAD DESIGN.
I see no reason why all content for all levels cannot be spread well within the entire world, (though fairly - having an area of low-level content surrounded by high-level content wouldn't really work
Again - it should be up to the player as to what sort of challenges they wish to face, (and therefore what sort of rewards they can get). (which is also why I hate the auto-levelling systems - (like Oblivion) - the player has less choice, and not just about the challenges, but also about the GAME-PLAY).
Having said all that - this is the one area where a dynamic game-world and content system - (missions/loot/mosters etc.) - would really start to come into it's own... (Though building a system will be a big job - but the time is right for such a system to appear/be created now...).
Anyway, read my paper (well, what I've done so far) - (link in a previous post).
Re:prediction for Warhammer online (Score:1)
They have bigger problems... (Score:1)
As the Australians say, "No worries" (Score:2)
I don't think it's a cause for concern. The bears would probably get lost on the flight between Australia and Los Angeles.
Rob
Blood bowl (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Blood bowl (Score:2)
Blood Bowl [wikipedia.org]
As a customer (Score:2)
At the moment the make-up of my guild is about:
30% aussies
55% americans
5% asians
10% europeans
What making all these segregated servers is going to do is break up one of the oldest and, imnsho, the best guilds in the history of their games.
Signed,
An Australian who doesn't send stupid fucking ideas to game makers without thinking of consequences.
Re:As a customer (Score:1)
If, however, they force people to play on a specific regional server based on their location, you're right, this is a terrible idea.
But, of course, there's always the option of buying/registering your account from a different region and just ignoring what they want you to do.
Re:As a customer (Score:2)
The problem is, if we chose a US server, the aussie players will have no one to group with (aussie peak will be dead) and vice versa if we chose an aussie server.
One server farm for whole world, we have learnt to put up with 300ms of lag.
Imho instead of servers why not pay for a oceanic cable for dedicated WAR servers in the states to decrease the latency to around 200-250?
Re:As a customer (Score:2)
Because the price of laying a cable across the world's widest body of water is going to be hundreds of millions, if not billions of dollars.
You probably can't afford that.
Even leasing dedicated space on the existing cables will run into millions per year (I worked with a company that leased a line to India, cost hundreds of thousands per year for a low quality line just enough for a few hundred simultaneous voice calls; expect a high quality line to the US for a few thousand data connections to cost a lot more).
You probably can't afford that either.
Unless... Jamie Packer? Is that you?
Re:As a customer (Score:2)
Still, the cost of several computing clusters, the people to admin them, the bandwidth to remote patch them...
Remember of course you only need the game data routed over them, the patching could go via regular paths.
And afaik there is still dark fiber on the east coast aus link, at least internode seem perfectly able to lease new ones when they find time to upgrade.
Re:As a customer (Score:2)
- Frequent server crashes with no one to reboot the servers until Monday if it crashes Friday evening because they don't work weekends
- Servers getting hacked, random monsters spawned everywhere and summoned upon various players
- Passwords reset on every single account and new ones not sent out to people for anything up to a month as a result of said hack
- No in game support whatsoever and instead a web based support service that can take between 3 days and 3 years for a response
- Billing of customers who have cancelled their accounts
- Database corruption due to a faulty processor in a server that apparently has no temperature monitoring, no error checking, and apparently no proper backup regime hence leaves you unable to play for 3 weeks followed by having all your characters gutted and left to start from scratch.
- Bias from gamemasters in selectively choosing which sides to penalise whilst allow the others to get away with carrying out the exact same violations of the rules as the side who got penalised
- Game masters that actively got involved in trolling and flame wars on various forums
- No set rules so game masters could change the rules as and when they saw fit, what was acceptable one minute could become permanently bannable the next then acceptable again a day later.
- An upwards of 3 months delay on patches
- Free additional bugs that don't come in the US version, some being severely damaging to game balance whilst simultaneously having their existence denied until a fix is available at which point they accept there was a severely game damaging bug and fix it (note, this could take up to 6 months)
If there's one thing Mythic should've learnt from DAOC it's to keep server management and in-house thing and not sub-contract the game to 3rd parties. Unfortunately, as they've not only not learnt this but chosen GOA to host the European game again I wouldn't have much faith in them being able to properly maintain any servers outside the US, as such if I do play I'll be importing a US copy of the game as I had to with DAoC to be able to play it the way it was meant to be played.
Mythic were actually the best MMO subscription service I've had the pleasure to subscribe to, it's just a shame their European operation ironically was by far the worst service I've ever subscribed to.
So Aussies, if I were you, I'd play it safe, ignore this snippet of news and just get the US version which also had the advantage in DAoC of having much healthier game populations when the game was dying, 24/7 populations due to the international player base hence no 5am raids on other teams relics, cheaper subscription, earlier access to expansions (by months) and outright better service by an absolutely massive amount. The only problems I ever had with Mythic were game related rather than service related in that they were shit at game balance to the point some character classes were 10x better than other classes could ever be and that they were much too slow to deal with the cheating (radar) problem even though they got there in the end.
Re:As a customer (Score:2)
The only thing interesting about this (Score:1)
Re:The only thing interesting about this (Score:0)
Good call! Blizz should learn (Score:2)