Heavy Rain - Playing a Story 217
Edge Magazine is running a piece about Heavy Rain, a thriller by Quantic Dream that's been in development for a few years now. Edge spoke with David Cage, the game's writer and director, about using graphics technology not simply for breathtaking landscapes or realistic lighting, but to bring the characters to life and make them more believable. Cage walked the folks at Kotaku through a demo, and they provided details on how the controls will work. From Edge:
"'We worked very hard on motion capture, especially facial motion capture,' explains Cage. 'As you know, eyes are incredibly hard to do: the minute movements they constantly make mean you can tell whether something is human or not. We created a technology to motion-capture that from actors.' The shaders applied to the lead character's eyes and the skin that surrounds them also conspire to nudge Heavy Rain's characters closer to believability. The 'deadness' that so often afflicts such digital mannequins has been significantly chipped away, and we are presented with Madison, a character whose facial features, though attractive in an expectedly unnatural sort of way, also carry blemishes that succeed in breaking down her artificiality."
So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meeting (Score:5, Insightful)
All this realism stuff gets on my nerves. Sure it looks more realistic but is it actually a better game? Are the graphics on the Wii "realistic" hell no, they are basically cartoons but the games play well and I don't care about the graphics. So the eyes flicker around in this new game like the eyes of people in a meeting just waiting for it to finish, flicking to the clock, back to the notes and then gazing out of the window in a day-dream before flicking back into the room in case they are asked a question.
Realism isn't always the best way to convey the most emotion and impact, look at the finest paintings from the likes of Rembrandt, and its that impact that games companies should concentrate on rather than on yet another way to make a dull game look pretty.
Re:Is it live or is it Memorex? (Score:5, Insightful)
I think you probably do need to say it. What's your point? That every attempt to improve facial features is doomed because of the uncanny valley? That this technology shows that the uncanny valley worries are unjustified? That this project has achieved a lot but still fails due to the uncanny valley? That despite suffering from the uncanny valley, this project nevertheless has achieved a remarkable level of empathy?
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:3, Insightful)
The games industry is becoming more and more like Hollywood. They think pretty pictures, famous names & loud noise will make up for a lack of story.
Games were more playable on the 8-bit computers & consoles than on today's supercomputers/superconsoles. Yeah the graphics were shitty at times but you still got more immersed in the game than you do these days. Its hard to get too involved in an 'interactive movie' with a few decisions/actions.
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:3, Insightful)
However, I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I love technology... I like to watch it advance before my eyes... and in no other place is that quite as startlingly evident than video games.
Of course, I can get hooked on a good video game with ok graphics (I LOVED Alpha-Centauri for years), but great graphics done properly can add quite a bit to a game, IMHO.
And in terms of parent's comment, I'd say that's a very good point... the obvious place to push the envelope (and the easiest, in certain respects) is graphics. Once we've reached the threshold of "realism", the creative impulses can move in other directions.
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:5, Insightful)
It's not that games were somehow better back then, it's that you were younger and had more time to spend selecting and learning to play video games - and that you're comparing random games from today with your best memories of the best games of the past.
My best memories of, say, Deus Ex are much better than Crysis was... but I'm sure they're much better than Deus Ex actually was too.
Re:So real you'll feel like you're in a chat room (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:3, Insightful)
All this realism stuff gets on my nerves. Sure it looks more realistic but is it actually a better game?
Sometimes, yes.
I don't care about the graphics.
Yes, you do, you just don't realize it.
I've said it before, and probably better, but every part of the game affects gameplay, and can make a game better or worse. More realistic graphics can, in fact, make a game better.
Now, granted, Crysis was mostly about pretty pictures and who's got the bigger dic^Wvideo card. But that doesn't mean this particular game is going to be another Crysis.
Realism isn't always the best way to convey the most emotion and impact,
Not always, but sometimes.
Look at film. Certainly, there's a place for anime, and it often does a better job than a summer flick which is focused purely on pretty pictures. But there are also films which are vividly realistic, both in video ("graphics") and in story and dialog -- downright gritty. And everything in between.
Taking your example:
So the eyes flicker around in this new game like the eyes of people in a meeting just waiting for it to finish,
Have you never seen a movie which makes good use of facial expressions, even eyes?
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:3, Insightful)
Quote: "the obvious place to push the envelope is graphics"
The main problems in games is not graphics. Good 3D models and high resolution textures are common and realistic lighting is being pushed more and more.
The two main problems are lack of detail and lack of realistic physics. The lack of detail is evident in just about any game. I am not aware of any game for instance where dust is modeled as individual particles. Outside scenes are even worse. Roads are often textured rather than modeled meaning that if you see an imperfection in the road and look at it from different angles up close you do not see different lighting conditions and shadows. Foliage is still not realistic despite much progress. Etc...
Physics is in some ways doing better. Many games define their own and that's the way the game works. But we do expect people and animals to move a certain way (regardless of what the game tells us about its physics) and to have certain facial expressions. Those have to be dead on. And so far, no game can even make a human being walk right, let alone respond to a wound realistically. Grimacing is horrible.
So to recap, there is much more to a game than "graphics", whether you mean polygon counts and shaders or simply pretty still shots. There are many places in dire need of pushing the envelope and graphics is not the main one of them. In fact, with so much in need of improvement I honestly doubt we will see truly realistic games in my lifetime (next 30-50 years).
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:3, Insightful)
Really? Wolfenstein 3D immersed you more than Crysis? Yeah, ok...
What are these interactive movies that you're referring to? I haven't played an interactive movie since the mid-nineties when they were still being made. I've heard people say MGS4 is an interactive movie, but that's just one game out of thousands.
When discussing the present state of video gaming, there are two extremes. On one side you've got the drooling, slack-jawed idiots who are easily distracted by pretty colors and shiny things that go boom, and one the other side you've got posers who want to appear hardcore (or what they perceive to be hardcore) by damning modern games as heresy because they aren't Pong. Both camps are equally worthless.
Re:Short summary; (Score:3, Insightful)
Look at the figures in the rest of the world. PS3 is outselling the Xbox now, and catching up on install base.
It's only really the US that's in love with the 360. Probably because in much of the rest of the world saying the name "Microsoft" leaves a bit of a bad taste in the mouth.
yes, MGS4 doubled PS3 sales for a short while. But even when they fell back they're higher than the 360 sales.
Re:Short summary; (Score:3, Insightful)
Where did I say they're an invalid form of art? Did I or did I not specifically say "made to date?"
We're not talking about average films.
There's nothing artistic about either game.
All that work for nothing... (Score:3, Insightful)
All that work for nothing, because the game will be terrible. How can you tell? A focus on 'quick time' events. This type of game play is not even remotely fun. Please developers, stop using this aged and pointless game mechanic.
Re:So realistic you'll feel like you are in a meet (Score:3, Insightful)
The Rose Tinting Effect of Memory. You remember the games/movies/albums you liked in those days, and tend to forget the rest. The signal to noise ratio has always been the same, you're just forgetting the noise. Also, your tastes and standards change over time. As a kid, Tron was orgasmic to me. Watching it now i could see more flaws and not be as entertained by this or that.
Wish i had mod points for ya.
Re:We've hit rock bottom, FSM save us all. (Score:3, Insightful)
I regularly watch excellent films. Maybe you should watch something other than mainstream Hollywood productions.
Length != quality.
Re:We've hit rock bottom, FSM save us all. (Score:3, Insightful)
Anyone who claims that quality films are few and far between and that there aren't any films with an excellent story is obviously not well versed in films. It's like saying that there aren't any games with good gameplay.
Which doesn't mean that length is the same thing as quality.
Re:It's Like The PS3 Is An Entire Generation Ahead (Score:3, Insightful)
Can you actually cite any of that?
You speak in generalities, that the U3 engine is "outdated" and "relies on normal maps" but are there actually any benchmarks that show the Cells can push a lot more similarly-processed polys than the 360's graphics?
I'd love to think that devs have thus far only unlocked a fraction of the possibilities lurking beneath the glossy plastic sitting in my entertainment cabinet, but from what I've seen, games thus far look pretty comparable between the two.