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Comments: 93 +- Games: Turning Classic Literary Works Into Games on Monday August 03 2009, @05:16AM
Posted
by
Soulskill
on Monday August 03 2009, @05:16AM
from the meet-william,-my-level-80-bard dept.
from the meet-william,-my-level-80-bard dept.
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Adventure Classic Gaming is running an interview with Chris Tolworthy, an indie game designer who is working on a project to make video games out of various literary classics. His decision to develop these kinds of games was sparked by a desire to reach out to gamers who want more "serious" subject matter, as well as finding an audience among people you would find in a book store, rather than a game store. Tolworthy has already released one game, an adaptation of Les Misérables, and has almost finished Dante's Divine Comedy. After that is done, he'll move on to other works, including Theogeny, by Hesiod, and Shakespeare's Julius Caesar, aiming for two or three releases a year. He said, "I try to keep as close as possible to the original text. When I create a game I simply go through the book and adapt it chapter by chapter. As far as possible all my puzzles are based on ideas in the original book. So my Dante's Inferno is a lot closer to the book than EA Games' Dante's Inferno that changes Dante into a warrior with a giant scythe! Although I stick closely to the story, I would find it boring to only give the straight text, so my games always give a different twist. For example, I show Les Miserables from the point of view of a minor character who dies early on. In my Divine Comedy I show other points of view as well as Dante's, and they don't see things the same way. Really, what I'm doing is what theater directors do when they put a Shakespeare play into a modern setting. It's the exact same story, but presented in a new way."
leverage, n.:
Even if someone doesn't care what the world thinks
about them, they always hope their mother doesn't find out.
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Spoiler? (Score:4, Insightful)
Kinda ruins the game, already knowing the ending and major plot-devices, doesn't it?
Anyway, it'd be great to see games dominate the popular iconographic imagery of literary classics in the same way that films have. Will Frankenstein be perceived as a beautiful artifice once again, I wonder...?
Re:Spoiler? (Score:4, Insightful)
Kinda ruins the game, already knowing the ending and major plot-devices, doesn't it?
"No, but I've seen the movie" becomes "No but I've played the game" when "Read a book" becomes "Watch a movie". Strange times we live in.
Parent
Re:Spoiler? (Score:4, Insightful)
"No, but I've seen the movie" becomes "No but I've played the game" when "Read a book" becomes "Watch a movie". Strange times we live in.
If you really want to appreciate some literary work, try translating it into another language while giving back the full literal meaning, the full meaning in context, and preserving the author's style. You'll know it's a good book if you give up on page one, or after the second line in a poem.
That's something no movie or video game could ever give back. Examples: The Count of Monte Christo, The Hitchhikers' Guide to the Galaxy, and pretty much everything Endre Ady ever wrote.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
So how did you translate "almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea"? "Not coffee"?
Re:Spoiler? (Score:5, Insightful)
Kinda ruins the game, already knowing the ending and major plot-devices, doesn't it?
Anyway, it'd be great to see games dominate the popular iconographic imagery of literary classics in the same way that films have. Will Frankenstein be perceived as a beautiful artifice once again, I wonder...?
Why would it ruin the game? Were the LOTR films ruined by the previous publication of the book? And many other examples. If the game is made well and interesting, knowing hte story won't ruin it, knowing the story will make you more immersed and will let you experience the story in a whole new perspective.
I think it's brilliant, just imagine what fun it'd be to experience the chilling effect of The Pit And The Pendulum in something as immersive as a game, or, I dunno, fighting lobstrosities on a forgotten beach yourself instead of just reading about it.
Parent
Re:Spoiler? (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
Re:Spoiler? (Score:5, Insightful)
It's because many films released nowadays have no substance besides the plot and big explosions. Once you know the plot and seen the explosions there's no reason to watch it again. No moral lessons to mull over, no questions left unanswered, no bits you might have missed that require a second watch, no scenes that rocked you to the core that you just *have* to see again.
Movies with twist would normally require more than one viewing just to 'get' everything - revealing the twist would ruin the film if all the film was relied on the twist. You'll get one viewing out of it (if that) and it'll basically be your second viewing, having missed out on that Raw viewing you have when you don't know what's going to happen. The fun of guessing to yourself through your first viewing. Even KNOWING there's a twist at the end may spoil a truely Raw viewing. I remember watching the Usual Suspects for the first time, years after it came out on DVD, expecting a crime thriller like The Untouchables, but got something truley exceptional - which is why it's one of my favourite films, and one I can watch again and again. Once you have watched that film, and got the twist, even after the second viewing, when you're watching it for the third time, it's still an excellent Crime Thriller.
Or take a film like Watchmen, something that's so layered with plot that you might come out of the cinema underwhelmed and confused. But underneath it is some hard truths about our own society, more than enough morality moments, every plot thread within it having it's own twist revealed was something brilliant.
Even if people say 'it wasnt as good as the comic' - it was still excellent for a movie.
A film that's enjoyable with prior knowledge is a rare and fantastic thing. Films like that are also usually more enjoyable that first time round, when everything is a surprise.
Parent
Re:Spoiler? (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
However, I disagree with the case of Usual Suspects. The ending basically undoes the entire movie. What you just watched was completely made up by Spacey's character. A slightly more sophisticated version of "and then I woke up." At the end, if the interrogating officer is left looking
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Strange, this is not the impression I walked away with at all... I was impressed by the Spacey character's ingenuity in fooling his captors, I never felt that his captors were fools for believing him. And I think that knowing the ending makes it more enjoyable to watch the film again through the lens of knowing the ending. It does not seem that there were that many clues left as to
Re:Spoiler? (Score:4, Funny)
I know the Usual Suspects in particular demands many repeat viewings to pick up on all the subtleties.
you don't really need to watch it repeatedly. Go to Menu --> Subtleties --> English=ON
There. All subtleties exposed.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
A film that's enjoyable with prior knowledge is a rare and fantastic thing. Films like that are also usually more enjoyable that first time round, when everything is a surprise.
Yet even those films which are enjoyable on repeat viewings have an additional joy the first time you watch them. No matter how good a movie is on repeat viewings, I still want to be surprised the first time.
Re: (Score:2)
I didn't think Watchmen was as bad as some of the reviews it got. Also, it looked like a movie that had been edited to please a studio.
I'm betting that when the Director's Cut comes out, it will be even better. I'm not saying it was a masterpiece, but it wasn't as bad as some said.
And yes, I'm a big Alan Moore fan.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
What i like in the book is to see things unravel one by one in a process that leads you from a starting situation till the unknown final situation. I like to ask myself "hmm this will probably ends like this", "will that character survives ? I'm not sure", or "can the character get out of t
Re: (Score:2)
Were the LOTR films ruined by the previous publication of the book?
No, they were ruined by the extremely poor characterisation, the gratuitous extraneous plotlines, and the over-reliance on CGI at the expense of acting.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Not every work of classic literature has to have *all* the major plot twists known. Hell, I bet the core gamer target for Pride and Prejudice and Zombies [wikipedia.org] hasn't even read Pride and Prejudice!
Re: (Score:2)
Kinda ruins the game, already knowing the ending and major plot-devices, doesn't it?
Not necessarily. When Titanic came into theaters ten years ago, everyone knew the ship would sink, but it still drew in the crowds. It's not always how the story ends, but the path it takes to get there.
Re: (Score:2)
Romeo and juliet (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
So, Fallout 3?
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
Whoever said the book ending is a winning scenario?
Just like a film adaptation then? (Score:5, Insightful)
Now apart from the obvious point of "errr so we know where this is going" which just means its a directed rather than open-ended game this is really just like using the standard film adaptation approach and applying it to games.
Its not that it is really new, Infocom's Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy did something similar many moons ago. Playing on throw away lines to drive the puzzles (tea and no tea) in some cases but generally following the plot of the book.
Really not a new idea either in concept or application.
Re: (Score:2)
Microsoft's attempt (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
On his thirtieth birthday, a senior bank clerk, Josef K., who lives in lodgings, is unexpectedly arrested by two unidentified agents for an unspecified crime. One of them looks like Clippy.
I'm waiting for Pride & Prejudice (Score:5, Funny)
Navigate your way through the maze of 18th century social etiquette!
Avoid Mrs Bennett's attempt to ensnare you with unsuitable gentlemen!
And of course, there's always the zombie version:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pride_and_Prejudice_and_Zombies [wikipedia.org]
Ren'ai sims are more popular in Japan (Score:3, Insightful)
I can't wait for the game of Pride & Prejudice
Might it be the first dating sim in quite a while to become a hit on this side of the Pacific Ocean?
So, we need higher quality games, what else is new (Score:5, Insightful)
Back in the days of adventure games, there was a bit of focus on the older gamers as well as the younger players. So you could have games with a lot of material that WOULD appeal to the crowd Chris Tolworthy is targeting. The problem is that in those days, you didn't see enough marketing to try to draw in that sort of customer.
Take a look at Gabriel Knight 3, which came out well before Da vinci Code even was written(1999 for GK3, 2003 for Da Vinci Code). Yes, the 3D engine wasn't very good, and there were things that could have been done better, but the writing was very good, the puzzles were pretty solid, and if it were to get a face lift(using a new 3D engine), it would appeal to those who prefer books to most games.
After the death of Sierra and Interplay, there has been a shortage of publishers willing to back games targeted at an older audience. It seems like the focus is the teen market, and if you are older than 25 years old and prefer something other than a first person shooter, your choices are more and more limited.
If every movie were rated PG, with the content of a PG movie, it wouldn't be long before the majority of adults would just stop watching movies. People grow up, and want things that THEY find entertaining. If the movie industry can have a wide variety of movie types, from the really bad formula action adventure movies, to the highly artistic types, to romance, comedy, and drama, then why has the computer and console game industries focused primarily on first person shooters that only appeal to one type of game player?
Hays Code (Score:3, Informative)
If every movie were rated PG, with the content of a PG movie, it wouldn't be long before the majority of adults would just stop watching movies.
You mean like Hollywood under the Hays Code [wikipedia.org]?
The Dark Eye (Score:2)
Let's not do Hemmingway. (Score:4, Insightful)
A video game of The Old Man and the Sea would suck even worse than the book.
-jcr
Re: (Score:2)
will these fare better than film adaptations? (Score:2, Informative)
Adapting stories from other media for videogames isn't a new idea. It's just that films have been the usual source, perhaps because they're culturally/commercially closer, especially if you compare the AAA game title to the blockbuster Hollywood film. Films also come with a built-in visual style to adapt, which helps with the recognition. The practice has become prominent enough that the only major general study of adaptation [amazon.com] between mediums that I know of actually spends a decent amount of time discussing
This gives me a great idea! (Score:2)
Rewarding success vs. failure (Score:4, Insightful)
Methinks the biggest problem with translating a book to a game is: with a book, the main characters usually make some grand mistakes (very specific ones) and then spend the rest of the tale trying to recover, while with a game the emphasis is NOT making mistakes - any mistakes. Readers want to see characters fail and overcome; players ARE the characters, and don't want the hit on their ego. We're fascinated by characters in books, but rarely would want to _be_ that character.
Re:Rewarding success vs. failure (Score:4, Interesting)
You've got it exactly... but some games do a pretty good job with it, though... they can, for example, play a couple of prologue/training levels and then take over in cutscene, depicting the fall, and then you give control back to the player so they can pick themselves up again. The real problem with adapting books to games is that books follow a linear story, where gamers these days expect a go-anywhere-do-anything environment. They expect to be given the choices, where they're made for you in a book.
Perhaps the answer is to take the setting/universe of a book, and set a game there? That might work for MMO-type stories. The alternative is to tell a story/adventure based on a minor side character in a major literary work... the action is an aside from the main storyline depicted in the work it's based on. The story revolves around the one we all know, and events in the one we all know are referenced, but the main storyline in the game itself is different. In a sense, we get told two different stories at the same time... I'm thinking of the play Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead as a perfect example of the kind of meta-story I'm talking about.
They could also set the game in either the epilogue or the prologue surrounding the events described in the book we all know. American McGee's Alice is a perfect example of that kind of storytelling.
Parent
Say what? (Score:2)
For example, I show Les Miserables from the point of view of a minor character who dies early on.
So ... it's a really short game?
The Divine Comedy? (Score:4, Informative)
I mean, I am genuinely puzzled. I know the Commedia fairly well, and I've read most of it in the original. And I simply cannot imagine how you turn it into a game.
Unless of course the author has merely nicked the characters?
Re: (Score:2)
Unless of course the author has merely nicked the characters?
Or characters with the same names and a few vaguely-similar character traits. After all, it works for Hollywood...
Re:The Divine Comedy? (Score:4, Informative)
I was wondering the same thing. Certainly, for the "big budget" EA adaptation of the Inferno, I think that we're just going to get a God of War clone which lifts the names of its levels from Inferno.
I suspect you may be familiar with it already, but others reading this thread might not be, so I'm going to give a quick plug here to Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle's 1976 adaptation of Inferno. It distorts or subverts some of the key theological conceits of the original, but it's a fun and thought provoking read (which populates Hell with a more up-to-date cast). There's a more recent 2009 sequel to it, which, despite being rather luridly titled "Escape from Hell" is also pretty good. The amusing thing is that both books contain sections which will challenge/offend (depending on sensitivity) Christians and atheists alike.
Like I say, they're not perfect, but they're still a damned sight more faithful to the spirit of the Divine Comedy than what will inevitably turn out to be some action game where you press X, Circle, X, Square, X, Triangle in sequence during a quick-time event to make Dante decapitate the big Demon and springboard off the body onto a motorbike.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Here's the problem... (Score:3, Insightful)
All of these great literary works were never intended to be interactive... as in "something that changes the outcome of the story based entirely on the audience itself".
These writers didn't leave much in the way of "what if..." contingencies involving their characters and plots. If they had, there never would've been a market for all those "choose your own adventure" books they used to hock on us during school book drives when we were still growing up.
That said, wouldn't a series of adult-themed "choose your own adventure" style books be kind of interesting? But, instead of simple "turn to page x" instructions, you'd have to solve various puzzles to know where to go next. Oh, and maybe a mechanism to slice off fingers for wimps who can't commit to their choices...
steinbeck (Score:5, Funny)
The air in the main barn is stuffy, almost claustrophobic,
despite the large size. Beams of late-afternoon sunlight
angle down, with flecks of hay and dust suspended in the
stagnant air. A barn door leads out.
There is a broken puppy here.
There is a broken Candy here.
> out
[ Curley's Ranch ; 34 points ]
> go through gate
[ Entrance to Curley's Ranch ; 35 points ]
> go down path
[ By the Pond ; 36 points ]
You see a crying Lenny here.
> ask about the rabbits
Lenny sits down and tries to explain about the rabbit farm
of his dreams again, calming him somewhat.
> shoot lenny
THE END
36 points
Apples and Oranges (Score:3, Insightful)
this youtube video is spot on and makes about 99% of the points that apply to this discussion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jdG2LHair0 [youtube.com]
Ultimately I hope you'll all forgive my skepticism. The classics are required reading in most high schools for a reason - there is some degree of cultural significance to the works. Still, written classics have the problem of being written stories designed to be passively consumed by the viewer, while video games require a world in which the audience participates. Linear stories don't work extremely well for this. If what I do doesn't "matter", why would I bother doing it? I remember playing "Deadly Tide" a few years back, and it sucked because it was basically a rail shooter. There was no real point to it except to get through the game without dying and take down as many enemies as possible in the process. I was bored with it in about half an hour. Conversely, take Mass Effect, a game where choices you make throughout the game will always have some sort of affect on what happens. I played through that game twice, and am working on a third.
If one were to make a video grame out of "Pride and Prejudice" for example, it would take some serious ingenuity to figure out a way of designing it such that the game stays true to the book and gives the player something to do besides just running around and talking to everyone (which essentially makes it an interactive movie, and very minimally so at that), has the player participating in the story whereby they have some sort of effect on the outcome, yet can stay true to the book. If it stays too true to the book then everything is predetermined and it doesn't make for much of a game, and if it doesn't then there is little point in tying it to a piece of classic literature.
Re: (Score:2)
If one were to make a video grame out of "Pride and Prejudice" for example, it would take some serious ingenuity to figure out a way of designing it such that the game stays true to the book and gives the player something to do besides just running around and talking to everyone (which essentially makes it an interactive movie, and very minimally so at that), has the player participating in the story whereby they have some sort of effect on the outcome, yet can stay true to the book. If it stays too true to the book then everything is predetermined and it doesn't make for much of a game, and if it doesn't then there is little point in tying it to a piece of classic literature.
I believe you're looking for this:
http://www.amazon.com/Pride-Prejudice-Zombies-Classic-Ultraviolent/dp/1594743347/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1249308176&sr=8-1 [amazon.com]
For the love of God, just don't use... (Score:2)
...1984! Your game might get auto-deleted!
Richard and Alan's Escape from Hell? (Score:2)
Bah, we've already got Richard [chello.at] and Alan's [uvlist.net] Escape from Hell [abandonwaredos.com].
(which may or may not have been part of the inspiration for Bill & Ted's Bogus Journey, or visa-versa, as they came out within a year or so of each other)
Our Town (Score:2)
I'm ready to adapt Thornton Wilder's Our Town [wikipedia.org]. It will be painstakingly true to the original play I struggled to pay attention to in high school. The game will deliver each slow, achingly dull line of dialog with Freddy Krueger flashing on the screen at random 10-20 minute intervals, requiring a quick key-press to prove you're awake. You fall asleep, you die.
How about 'Grapes of Wrath'? (Score:3, Interesting)
An even better subject for a Steinbeck game would be "Grapes of Wrath". It could play well as both a historical learning game, and as a current events social commentary game.