Microsoft Seeks Patent On Shaming Fat Gamers

theodp writes "A newly disclosed Microsoft patent application — Avatar Individualized by Physical Characteristic — takes aim at fat people, proposing to generate fat avatars in gaming environments for individuals whose health records indicate they're overweight, limiting their game play, and even banning them. From the patent application: 'An undesirable body weight could be reflected in an overweight or underweight appearance for the avatar. Only requisite health levels are allowed to compete in a certain competition level. A dedicated gamer could exercise for a period of time until his health indicator gadget shows a sufficiently high health/health credit in order to allow reentering the avatar environment.' Linking one's gaming avatar to one's physique, explains Microsoft, will produce healthy and virtuous behaviors in individuals. Microsoft also proposes shaping gaming experiences by using 'psychological and demographic information such as education level, geographic location, age, sex, intelligence quotient, socioeconomic class, occupation, marital/relationship status, religious belief, political affiliation, etc.'"

Brilliant

[tsotha]

Brilliant idea. Take people who don't measure up to everyone's expectations, and heap shame on them in the one place where they can take a break from it all. Microsoft should also file for a patent on a method to lose money.

You think this doesn't effect you

[Locke2005]

Does this mean I won't be able to play as a 36-24-26 blonde woman anymore? If Microsoft starts actually checking players appearance and gender, I predict there will be absolutely no "hot chick" avatars in the Microsoft MMORPGs! Is this "sausage fest" environment really the result they are looking for?

Re:Digital medical records

[Anonymous Coward]

I thought one idea of games was to escape various aspects of the real world, by pretending to be somebody we aren't (like a would-be ruler of the world)?. Why do we want to be dragged as ourselves into the game enviornment????

WTF???

[gstoddart]

Microsoft also proposes shaping gaming experiences by using 'psychological and demographic information such as education level, geographic location, age, sex, intelligence quotient, socioeconomic class, occupation, marital/relationship status, religious belief, political affiliation, etc.'

Where, exactly, does Microsoft think it's going to get this stuff from? The summary actually makes reference to health records.

Heck, I'm not sure most government agencies should have access to most of that information. Microsoft sure as fsck has no business with it.

Welcome to the dystopian future, fat boy. This is actually kind of scary.

Cheers

Exercise stimulates endorphins

[Akido37]

So I want to play games, so I have to exercise. Exercise releases chemicals causing pleasure in my brain.

Eventually, I enjoy the exercise more than video games. I stop buying new games, and EA/Microsoft/Sony/Nintendo go out of business, and thousands of people lose their jobs.

Thanks a LOT, Microsoft!!

Re:So they want discrimatory features into games..

[wizardforce]

Sometimes patents like this one can serve the public interest merely by reducing the likelihood of bad ideas like this one from being put into general use through fines and legal action.

Re:Patent Office

[Nadaka]

Thats right. Nothing says progress like granting a extortionate monopoly on a drug that could save millions, if only they could afford it.

Re:Digital medical records

[Anonymous Coward]

funny you should mention that. When I read the summary my main response was something along the lines of it being impossible to implement even if the stupid patent was approved simply because:

NO GOD DAMNED GAME COMPANY SHOULD BE ABLE TO ACCESS YOUR FUCKING MEDICAL RECORDS TO FUCK WITH YOUR GAMING TO BEGIN WITH. (For ANY reason really.)

Re:Brilliant

[Archangel Michael]

MS isn't losing money on Vista. They are just charging for Vista SP3, AKA Windows 7.

Discrimination

[PenquinCoder]

Not only for the workplace anymore! Now standard on all MS games. If Microsoft seriously gets this 'patent' approved for the US gaming market.... how will it actually hold up against the constitution? If it's illegal to discriminate against people for the above reasons (sex, socioeconomic class, marital/relationship status, religious belief, political affiliation, etc) for things like a job, a loan, housing; then what makes it alright for MS to use those for 'shaping gaming experiences' ?

limiting much?

[Anonymous Coward]

_In this great People's Republic of China,we seek to control games in order to keep our youth healthy mentally and physically) Oh yeah, China is definitely gonna want this for their youth

Re:It's a Free Market

[TheCarp]

I seriously think I would be busting a gut laughing no matter who came out with it.

So... lets just forget all about HPAA or whatever other health record privacy regulations you may be subject to. Lets just assume they can get around all that in a reasonable way.... and figure out how to get all the data that they want from health records....

So now, I can diet all I want, but my avatar wont get skinnier until I go in for a checkup? Will my insurance be expected to cover extra checkups to keep my avatar current?

Wouldn't people who are overweight, just.... not play the game. It seems a lot easier. Especially since, there are many other games that wont force them into a suck gaming experience.

This smacks to me of the drug war. "Look kids, drugs are bad, because if you do them, we will throw you in jail". That doesn't make drugs bad, it makes you a dick. Its "I don't approve of your condition and the negative impacts that it has on your life, so I am goin gto impose new negative impacts to help you".

Its exactly the sort of attitude that you resent when your friends and family take it with you... and you expect anyone is going to put up with it from Sony?

Re:Prior art: Nintendo Wii Fit

[Itninja]

Or one could say her life was made miserable because of her weight. The grotesquely obese (of which i am a member) are such by choice. There may be genetic traits that can lead one to being overweight, but so what. There are also genetic traits that make certain people's breath smell like death, or make people gravitate toward alcoholism. We are not animals. We are not slaves to every wisp of DNA-inspired urge or weakness. I, for one, am still fat because I have not yet chosen to make the lifestyle changes needed to lose weight. I am not a victim.

Re:And presumably all this will be done....

[adbge]

Yeah, cause the Linux kernel isn't bloated or anything [slashdot.org], right?

Funny, the OP didn't mention Linux... Cute straw-man.

What about the sick and handicapped?

[Anonymous Coward]

I know a guy who's been a quadriplegic, with limited upper body function, since a stupid motorcycle accident. Playing games using a special controller is one way he passes the time. Will he get a pass? Or will he be put in a motorized wheelchair in the game too? What about people getting chemo? Amputees? Will kids be made short? Will the elderly be given bad knees? Etc.?

Re:Digital medical records

[tsa]

My reaction was exactly the same when I saw that website. Why should I willingly enter all my medical data on any webpage, let alone one that is run by Microsoft?

Re:It's a Free Market

[badboy_tw2002]

Check off humorless and touchy as well!

Re:Digital medical records

[Atrox666]

I used to think this until I realized that I was paying Blizzard for the simulated experience of waiting for public transportation.
I could get a more immersive experience by putting on a troll mask and riding the subway. There are even some dialects of Chinese that sound a little like murloc. On the other hand I'd love for my IRL military training to count in call of duty.

Re:Patent Office

[FooAtWFU]

Nope. We just assume that taking away the multimillion-dollar monopoly incentive won't have any effect on pharmaceutical developments and the drugs available (outside of patents) for your children's generation, or even your generation when you retire in 40 years. No effect whatsoever.

I mean, come on, dude, is a little bit of a balanced perspective on a nuanced issue too much to ask?

Is the picture really necessary?

[Anonymous Coward]

If shaming fat gamers is wrong, then why tack on the picture of The Greatest Nintendo Warrior? Hasn't this poor slob suffered enough?

Rage against the (M)achine

[NixonNowhere]

I can't quite express the shock and bile that this article literally provoked with me. I have a reason or two to be invested in this, though I'd love to think that I would be anyways. I'm both a fat chick, and disabled. The one easily has been associated with the other. Among some of my medical issues, I have several neuromuscular diseases that have resulted in partial paralysis with repetitive motion(such as walking, or any other 'continued' type motion, including brushing my own hair). My legs and arms routinely gimp out. I'm in a wheelchair if it's more than a very few steps. I need lots of help with my routine life. I'm also in severe neuropathic and musculoskeletal pain, due to nerve damage, chronic muscle spasms, spinal degeneration, et al. I only preface my rant with all of this in order to prove a point relevant to this topic:

I have spent copious amounts of time online in various MMORPGs, from the very inception of Everquest, to the beginning of WoW, and have tried most of them in between, including the mostly 'social' ones. I have learned the game mechanics, as much as I'm able, and have participated socially, as much as I've been so inclined, at various times in my life (It's funny how that's decreased drastically in increments from EQ to WoW), and I have paid into the economy with the subscription fee associated with each. I have not, at any time, been an MMO addict, in that a pixelated game could ever interfere with my perception of 'real life', and its priorities.

I have, however, used these games as a form of escapism from my pain and discomfort. To say otherwise would be a blatant understatement of the facts, and why? I don't see using an MMO, either one of the more strategic 'hack 'n slash' fantasy or sci-fi types (WoW, AO, Runescape, Eve Online) or a social (Sims Online, There, or Second Life) venue as being an unhealthy coping mechanism for a disabled person. We often spend so much of our time in a house, trapped inside of bodies that don't work, or are screaming silently with pain. To be able to thrive, leap, dance, run, and maybe kick some butt in a pixelated body is liberating. Never mind the opportunity to interact socially, unhindered, in the aesthetic form of our choosing, because isn't that what we -all- like to do?

What this all essentially means is: Microsoft wants to nerf handicapped people.

I'm barely going to get into the fact that Microsoft has alluded to the fact that they want to dig into my socioeconomic and medical data, because that both defies belief and insults my intelligence on a level to a degree that I truly believe they'll be reamed by people much bigger and badder than I am. (And I mean that on a less than literal level to any smart asses out there. =P )

I'm going to imagine, for a moment, that I actually had the motor skills to play CoD6 with my best guy friend and his cool crew, Team Drunky. *Team Drunky moves in to engage the enemy with a tactical strike, having decided against the comedic, but less effective death-via-precision-supply-drop. A skirmish begins. Ferret likewise is out the gate, sniping at the opposing clan, but glances over his shoulder, unfortunately, at Nixon, who is slovenly shuffling in his general direction, in a cold sweat, upper body graced with an ill fitting flak jacket, an M16, that she cannot lift, sparking as it drags along the pavement. Ferret groans inwardly as he faces the dilemma of whether to join Team Drunky, and live, or whether to try and save his soon-to-be and as-good-as-dead friend, whose right leg has now completely ceased to work. "Save yourself, you idiot! This is completely fruitless!" Nixon yells, right before catching one dead between the eyes. Sadly, Ferret was relieved. Team Drunky was relieved. The opposing team was sorta relieved.

Apparently Microsoft and America were relieved, because another fat person was kept off the net... back into the obscurity of their dark living rooms, in front of the television... where they belong... or something.

I've often

Re:Prior art: Nintendo Wii Fit

[Itninja]

Friend, my logic is not flawed. Both ones race and ones religion are federally protected in all democratic societies an the planet (at least on paper). People are not born fat (as black people are born black). And are no forms of worship that I know of that demand (or even encourage) obesity. There is no Constitutional protection for being fat. It's easy to point at the fat guy and laugh, sure. But it's also easy to point at the stumbling drunk or the teenager with raging BO. People are mean to other people sometimes. That is not a discrimination; that is life.

Maya Anjelou once gave a great statement on this concept. She said (among other things [thinkexist.com]) "The real difficulty is to overcome how you think about yourself."

Re:Wii Fit

[Monkeedude1212]

Does not Wii Fit already do this?

No. It does not.

Proposing to generate fat avatars in gaming environments for individuals whose health records indicate they're overweight, limiting their game play, and even banning them

The Wii Fit does not make your avatar appear bigger or smaller than how you set it. The closest thing that comes close to any kind of discrimination is it making constructive criticism on how to improve your health, not to shame you.

Microsoft is trying to shift the blame of "Video games making people fat" by taking all the social stigma of the real world against obesity and putting it into their games.

Save the Children + Patent = Monopoly

[stoicfaux]

1. "Everyone" "knows" that video games are unhealthy and are the reason why kids are fat nowadays.

2. Tell the politicians that you've developed a way for video games to help prevent kids from getting fat.

3. Tell the parents that you've developed a way for their computer/video games to *automatically" help prevent their kids from getting fat.

4. Get a "Save the children!" law passed requiring that this Anti-Fat-Kid-Rights-Management software be mandatory.

5. You have a patent on the Anti-Fat-Kids-Rights-Management idea.

6. Profit from the monopoly.

Re:Digital medical records

[Have Brain Will Rent]

Not being yourself will be available as a future upgrade for a slight additional cost. After all escape from reality shouldn't just be free, right? Think of how that would cut into the profits of drug deale... errr drug manufacturers... and the makers of fine alcohol.

Re:Its an american problem again.

[mckinnsb]

You mean the reason why Europe has fewer fat people is because europeans don't treat the obese like fucking monsters? No way! Thats crazy talk.

I have long believed that is the American obsession with image and sexuality that has aggravated the problem of obesity. Nearly every 'good' cure to obesity (omitting dangerous diet pills or starvation diets) involves social interaction of some kind. Lampooning people who suffer from obesity only furthers their isolation and in no way is productive towards recovery.

I was an overweight, acne-ridden, isolated kid all through middle school - but it was the social interactions I made through multiplayer gaming on the internet (specifically, MUDS - yeah... mega dork) that gave me the confidence to approach people in real life (high school), and later lose weight with their encouragement (senior year).

Also, isn't there a beauty to anonymity? Do we really need to see everyone's physical appearance to judge if we want to kill some mobs and grab some lootz with them? I personally would prefer not to. If I'm looking for women, I go to a supermarket, mall, or bar. On the net, my intent is otherwise focused, and I don't need to see what my digital comrade looks like to figure out if I'm having a good time playing my game. That much is usually implied.

Acceptable Prejudice

[Gogogoch]

Sizeism is one of several prejudices that seem currently acceptable by society. Imagine if the M$ news release said that game experience would change if the player were black; levels inaccessible because you were the wrong colour. Or female. Or gay. Or disabled.

25-30% of Americans are obese, but much of society (including the obese) seem to buy-in to the view that skinny is good and obese is obscene - and so nothing changes. Look at the comments here. Similar comments against gays or blacks would be dismissed as troll, but here we're having a good laugh. Anyway, with so many people being targeted by M$ I doubt that M$ is doing itself much of a favour.

Slashdotters who are quite happy to say: "fuck you, go on a diet ha ha" might do better by standing up for minorities that don't include themselves. In today's world we all have a job to protect our rights from the fucked-up ambitions of government, interest groups, and business, and divide-and-conquer is one of their ways of eroding rights.

"Lets have DRM, filtering, and inspection because some people are pirates", "Let's have biometric responses and limitations because some people are fat", "lets limit others because of IQ", "lets fuck with them because they are a minority, and the majority will let it pass". Well its possible to make up distinctions that catch all of us - we all belong to one minority or another depending on how creatively you cut the cake - and if we go down this path we all get fucked. So we have to stick up for others as if it were ourselves.

OK, help me get down off my soap box. Anyway, I'm a fat bastard and always have been. Nothing I can do about it. But I'll be alright so long as besides having fat avatars you can have avatars with 10" dicks :-)

Re:*cough* HIPAA

[Mister Whirly]

Yes, because there is only one small team in the government that is in charge of all 3 of those projects. When you have something other than a "I just don't trust the government to do anything" strawman argument, then we can talk seriously. Look at it this way - if you screw up with HIPAA, you will never get hired by anyone anywhere to do any more research. If that isn't incentive enough, I don't know what is. All the other crap you talk about - drones, voting machines, open source vs. closed source is just smoke and mirrors and have nothing to do with what we were talking about.

Nah

[BigSlowTarget]

All your HIPAA rights are waived in the TOS. Did you click 'I agree'?

Re:Digital medical records

[Anonymous Coward]

Can you please explain...

Re:Hope you have permission for that photo -- poor

[raehl]

I hope that the photo of the overweight dressed with Nintendo garb is from someone you know, and that they gave permission for you to humiliate them in front of thousands of other people.

What makes you think the picture is humiliating?

If you think the picture is humiliating, aren't you the problem?

If we all thought there was nothing wrong with the picture, then there wouldn't be anything humiliating about it, would there?

Re:Digital medical records

[terryducks]

Well for one; HIPPA regulations (in the US).

Tis a slippery slope down to MegaInsCorp refuses to let you buy that bag of Doritos. The car didn't start as the CORP tells me I need to lose a few pounds.

Re:Digital medical records

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, if you know body fat and muscle mass, BMI is kinda useless. BMI is used to estimate how 'fat' you are (so I guess it tries to predict your body fat), but having a lot of muscle will give you a high BMI even if you are not fat. Now I'm not one of them BMI-haters, I believe it is quite useful for the average person to give an indication of how healthy their weight is, but if you have better data (body fat and muscle mass) by all means ignore BMI.