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The Grown-Up Video Game 152

Posted by Soulskill
from the getajob-hero dept.
Phaethon360 writes "Now, more than ever, we're seeing many Mature ratings (M+, 17+, 18) being distributed by various national media regulators. But that isn't the only indicator for a game's intended audience. It doesn't take a thousand swear words, scantily clad women or gratuitous violence to differentiate a ten-year-old's game from a twenty-year-old's. The spectrum of human emotions encompasses a wider palette than just revenge, fear, and loss, but the games that shy away from these are frequently mistaken as being for a younger audience. From the article: 'The human experience is one that is made up of great hardship, pain, loss, death, and a multitude of experiences seemingly designed to destroy a person. However, that same experience is also filled with joy, love, laughter, family and friends. ... These so-called “grown-up” games need not be relegated to the category of niche gaming. In fact, at times we find that these video games are capable of reaching mass popularity among the gaming community. It is here that we find one of our generation’s outlets for the expression of conflict.'"
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The Grown-Up Video Game

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  • the game (Score:4, Funny)

    by LiquidCoooled (634315) on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @10:34PM (#31255072) Homepage Journal

    you just lost it.

  • by xzvf (924443) on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @10:37PM (#31255092)
    How about games for 40 year olds? No, not Pac-man and Pole Position, but games adults can play and enjoy now. Apologies to the middle aged that play FPS and others of the new genre, but there is a market for less intensive product.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      There are tons of games that are absolutely gripping but have gameplay so slow it would put most FPS players to sleep. One of my favorites is the Silent Hunter series. On the higher realism settings it often requires a calculator to triangulate ship positions and velocities, taking up to an hour to set up a torpedo run on a convoy. Awful to watch, but extremely satisfying if your calculations work out.

      If you're looking for fun but relaxed, there's really no shortage. Simulator games abound, as do puzzle gam

      • by Boronx (228853)

        "including tons that don't require inhuman micro-managing but do require thought and planning"

        The last one I'm aware of is Command HQ from 1984. Give us a list!

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      I'm 42 and I like to play the same stuff as the teenagers and the twenty-somethings. Fun is fun.
      • by Inda (580031)
        I'm not far off your age and it's true, fun is fun. I just wish the kids wouldn't play some of these 18+ games. I can't stand their high pitched voices and their constant nagging to shoot this, go here and go there. That's when fun is no longer fun.
    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by Is0m0rph (819726)
      I'm 40 and the game is Modern Warfare 2. There's a million puzzle games if you are 40 and want to act 60!
    • by Itninja (937614)
      Here's my list [unlettered...dinary.com] of games I would love to play.
    • A game for 40 year olds? Well I don't really see too much of a market for "Change the Baby" or "Do Chores Around the House"!
      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by vlm (69642)

        A game for 40 year olds? Well I don't really see too much of a market for "Change the Baby" or "Do Chores Around the House"

        "The Sims" sold pretty well and its not much beyond that.

    • by Khyber (864651)

      "How about games for 40 year olds? No, not Pac-man and Pole Position, but games adults can play and enjoy now."

      I picked up my pre-order copy of Heavy Rain today. Already chopped my poor guy's finger off two different ways. Oh fuck yes, this is an adult game.

    • by tsa (15680)

      Try an adventure [adventuregamers.com] game [justadventure.com].

      • by Clovis42 (1229086)

        Try an adventure game.

        But he said he didn't just want to play old games\genres like Pole Position ...

        • by tsa (15680)

          Pole Position is not an adventure game. And have you checked the links?

          • by cayenne8 (626475)
            I still prefer Robotron 2084 [wikipedia.org] .

            MAME is such a wonderful thing....

            :)

          • by Clovis42 (1229086)
            I was just joking that adventure games are on old forgotten genre. You might as well play Pac-man or something. I love AGs by the way, and am happy when a good one comes out. I've visited those websites before.
    • by TheLink (130905)
      The last I checked lots of adults play stuff like bejeweled, minesweeper, solitaire, sudoku, farmville. That sort of stuff.

      I don't think the majority of adults want to play games with so much "real emotional depth" or "lots of sex and violence".

      The evidence is they don't want those sort of games.

      Similarly, it's only a small percentage of moviegoers who go for movies with "real emotional depth" or movies with "lots of explicit sex and violence". The rest go for stuff like Avatar, Titanic, Lord of the Rings,
    • As someone close approaching 40, I've been keeping my eyes open more and more for games outside the 18-30 demographic. I'm pretty burnt out on FPS games. I pretend I like RTS games, and I do like learning how to play them, I'm just no good at them past the first few scenarios (maybe because of my tendency to want to build lines of towers for defense).

      I enjoy American-style RPG games the most (e.g. Bioware and Bethesda games). Steam has been a godsend with all its classic games offerings. I've picked up thin

    • How about strategic games. I’d say Civilization is a really great game, especially for the older management type.

  • Grown up games... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by blahplusplus (757119) on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @10:37PM (#31255098)

    ... I don't believe there is such a thing. I've seen grown men in their 40's+ rushing out to get the latest Call of duty or Mass effect 2. Games are NOT movies this call for emotionalism or "emotional depth" in a game is nonsense. What does final fantasy's story have anything to do with being a grown up? It's probably one of the most graphics heavy and story laden game series and yet their stories have nothing in common with anything one might consider "grown up".

    I don't play games for emotional storytelling, I can get that in movies. I play games to be a participant in the world, kill stuff, shoot stuff, solve puzzles and indulge my imagination. I want games to be FUN, what does a plumber stomping on a bunch of mushroom people have anything to do with being grown up? Yet many millions of grown ups certainly enjoyed playing mario, I can vouch for the fact that my own mother got into playing mario kart series from 64 onwards.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Kopiok (898028)
      For many people being told a story IS fun. I enjoy watching a heavy movie from time to time because it's thought provoking and the emotional pull is a nice experience (from time to time). I read books because of the thrilling events captured in words. Games don't have to lack a story to be fun. Uncharted 2 has won many awards for its storytelling and has been reviewed very highly, having great game play that is entertaining to the player. You brought up Final Fantasy... have you ever played any of them? The
      • "Games don't have to lack a story to be fun."

        But no amount of story can really make up for a bad game, that's the problem.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by quadrox (1174915)

          I disagree. I have played several games that were buggy and/or where the gameplay itself was awkward up to annoying, just to see the story unfold.

          I hate how the shift has gone from singleplayer to multiplayer and even MMO games. While multiplayer is fun as well, what I really really want is an immersive game world with a good story. That's the main reason I play video games. Which is probably why I love RPGs.

    • Re:Grown up games... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by ClubPetey (324486) <clubpetey@@@yahoo...com> on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @11:00PM (#31255272)

      You and I must be exact opposites. I play games specifically for their rich story lines. Sure, I play MW2 or Borderlands to blow some stuff up on occasion, but I enjoy rich stories like Lost Odyssey much more.

      Games are 40-80 hour movies to me. With that length, each character can be explored, their background and motives explained, creating a richer involvement in the story. The reason those games are "grown-up" is because it takes a grown-up patience to play them. Most 10 year olds aren't going to have the patience to watch all the FMVs and read the dialog in a game like Final Fantasy.

      I for one certainly hope that more games like Lost Odyssey are released. As the "original" video game generation gets older, I think we'll see more of these games.

      • by sammyF70 (1154563)

        Thanks for making me feel younger. When I play a game, I don't want to be ~entertained~ by hours of non-interactive stuff which might look pretty but is NOT a game just to get to the next "press two buttons to get the next cutscene" ~game-part~. If I did, I'd buy a DVD with a few serious scratches on it,and ~play~ the ~find the correct time and chapter~ game.

        There are ways to make a game tell a compelling story without falling back on FMVs, be it just good mission design, interesting and varied dialogue op

      • Re:Grown up games... (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Khyber (864651) <techkitsune@gmail.com> on Wednesday February 24, 2010 @12:52AM (#31255970) Homepage Journal

        "Games are 40-80 hour movies to me."

        From what I've experienced so far, it looks like Heavy Rain will be way, way, way, way, way, WAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYY longer than that. with tens of thousands of different paths to take the story, and you can pretty much kill off every main character and keep going, is nuts.

        Oh, and be warned, this is a VERY mature. Holy mother of god it can get dark.

        • Re:Grown up games... (Score:5, Informative)

          by Evil Shabazz (937088) on Wednesday February 24, 2010 @01:27AM (#31256164)
          The review on Gamespot said the game is only about 10 hours long, and has limited replayability due to the way the storyline forces you back to a singular path regardless of your choices?
          • by kalirion (728907)

            So it's basically another Indigo Prophecy?

            • by Khyber (864651)

              Indigo Prophecy with a much better storyline, yes.

              It's made by the same people that made IP so you'd pretty much expect it to be the same, but it's not, not by far.

        • It's pretty hard to make really long games (that aren't boring grindfests) because of the attention to detail that would be required from the development team. It would make the game insanely expensive -- even more so than they already are.

          Heavy Rain sure sounds great but I doubt it would last longer than 10-15 hours.

        • by npsimons (32752) *

          Oh, and be warned, this is a VERY mature. Holy mother of god it can get dark.

          It is sad that "dark" is considered "mature".

          • by gknoy (899301)

            I hope this isn't a spoiler, as all I've seen is the promotional videos.

            It's not "mature" merely for being dark, but because it's about the nature of moral choices, as well as dealing with loss. I think it takes a fairly mature audience (perhaps even a parent to fully empathize with a father character whose son is killed in front of him. I am sure kids or teens or even single young adults will recognize that there's some loss there, but I'm not sure that they could fully understand the dark place that suc

            • by Khyber (864651)

              "I'm assuming that the rest of the game deals with the father character's OTHER son getting kidnapped, and his choices of how far he wants to go in his pursuit."

              This is exactly what the game is about - the tagline "How far are you willing to go to save someone you love?" is not a joke - they capitalize heavily upon that bit throughout the entire game, especially during the trials of Ethan.

              Wire cutters, butcher knife, or axe - which one are you going to pick to lop off your finger to save your son? Kill anot

        • But what crazy person will actually play all those paths. By the way: I won’t be tens of thousands of paths. Because that would mean tens of thousands of script pages and of voice recordings being done. Something impossible in normal time scales.

          Usually most paths end up joining again at a later point. Or they are ordered in a matrix of factors. E.g. one dimension being “good vs evil” and the other being “stealth vs rushing”. So in the end you end up with an illusion of much mo

      • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

        by xtracto (837672)

        . Most 10 year olds aren't going to have the patience to watch all the FMVs and read the dialog in a game like Final Fantasy.

        Howdy, good that you added a "Most" there! however, that is still a generalization.

        The 10 year old in me begs to differ. I *learnt* a good chunk of the English language while playing Dragon Warrior, Final Fantasy and Ninja Gaiden (all NES) reading the dialog in the game. Granted, the first 10 times I read it did not make sense, but after asking my parents and looking at dictionaries I learnt several words. And I was around 10 years old!

        What is funny is that, as sibling poster (SammyF70) said, nowadays I get

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by gknoy (899301)

          Part of this is, I think, that it takes some time to digest the lore nuggets that the games spew at us, especially when it's done from the firehose of an FMV or other cutscene. I like lore-heavy stories, or games with a plot, but it can sometimes be hard to geta good idea of "what the hell is going on" if you don't play something regularly.

          I'm several hours (5? 4? 6?) into Twilight Princess. The story is great so far. However, I haven't played in a year because every time I think about it, I can't remembe

          • by emj (15659)
            Agreed, it's very hard to play games an hour at a time you need a solid chunk of time to concentrate on them. I would really like to be able to skip trough a game in high speed just to be able to remember what happened in the game, and not having to play it all again.
      • by brkello (642429)
        I like a lot of games. I tend to go for more of the games you talk about. Something that has an interesting battle system and a deep plot that can explore multiple characters. I wouldn't really say that was "adult" though. I liked that type of game since I was a kid.

        As far as the article goes, I don't necessarily agree. We are given books in high school like "Of Mice and Men" that are pretty screwed up. Can you imagine a video game like that being approved for Teens? There is a double standard that
      • "You and I must be exact opposites."

        No you just like slower paced passive entertainment, in which you are not required to partake in the action or engage the world beyond a minimum.

        I'm sure you love the adventure genre, I can take adventure games in moderate doses. But as a gamer I play games for the interactivity. Games can tell stories but they can't be a passive experience, but I don't play a game for the story. Mass effect 2 would not be the same experience without the action sequences and that was

      • I love a rich storyline as well- been playing RPGs since, well, "Adventure" on the 2600. :-) Hey, OK, some of the early games required some imagination on the player's part. I had all sorts of tales spun about those duck-dragons and that bat.

        However I'm not looking for any emotionalism. I really liked Fable 2, but I felt nothing for the dog. And when I had to choose between bringing back the dog and bringing back thousands of dead people, I brought back the dog. Why? Did I get attached after all? No, but th

    • by Eivind (15695)

      Sort of. There -is- a lot of graphics and story in Final Fantasy, but it's fundamentally, stories for kids, or at best teenagers. Children enjoy stories, as do many adults, but the stories tend to be DIFFERENT, and the stories in Final Fantasy, tend to be essentially fairytales.

      You'll get young (typically 10-15 year old) characters, struggling with things like the relationship to their parents, their first love and daring to actually express same, clumsy misunderstandings, coming to terms with being respons

      • by delinear (991444)

        If you contrast, for example, the Romance in FF-10 with say the potential romance between Morrigan and the main-character in Dragon Age Origins, you can't help but conclude that the latter is more mature. Not primarily because there's sex (there is, but it's not the main focus), but also because the characters behave like, you know, ADULTS with adult issues, stuff you'd NEVER see in Final Fantasy.

        I can't comment on FF10, but take away the sex in DA:O and it's certainly not what I would call a good example of adult relationships. Characters who only "like" you if you do sidequests for them and bring them a ton a presents? Yes, a cynic might say that's true enough but it doesn't go any way towards describing the true complexities of adult relationships. Without the sexual connotations the relationships here are exactly how you would expect kids to behave - I'll only be your friend if you buy me those

        • by Eivind (15695)

          Your critique is true, but I feel it's missing the point. No the game doesn't succeed in (nor even try) really simulating the complicated world of human emotions, doing so would be incredibly hard, so what you get is a very much simplified linear system where feelings for you is represented on a one-dimensional scale from bad to good, and is influenced by dialogue, gifts, plot-choices, and performing special character-quests.

          My point though, was that where the characters in Final Fantasy dream about one day

    • by Targon (17348)

      The fact that most games have very little depth does not mean that games should not be developed that DO branch out. Those who are younger tend to prefer the more action based games, but those who are older look for more than shooters and non-stop action. Now, I am NOT talking about games where you play someone sitting at home chatting with the family or anything like that, but at the same time, do all games need to have the player control loners, soldiers, ex-soldiers, mercenaries, gang-bangers, and ot

  • by Anonymous Coward

    Seriously. This sounds like nothing but a stealth advertisement for Heavy Rain. Yay it came out today! Just say so and be done with it instead of trying to sneak it in with this self-important navel-gazing.

  • Hmm (Score:2, Funny)

    It doesn't take a thousand swear words, scantily clad women or gratuitous violence to differentiate a ten-year-old's game from a twenty-year-old's.

    No, but it helps.

  • Heavy Rain anyone? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Retardical_Sam (1002763) on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @10:52PM (#31255202)

    This on the day that Heavy Rain is released. Preliminary reviews seem to say that it's much more adult-oriented, and not just in terms of the things that cause more adult ratings.

    • by Khyber (864651)

      I guess you haven't played the demo which has been available for like, three weeks. This game is beyond mature. This game is DRAMA at damn near it's finest.

      And I will almost never give ANY game such a review that simple and shining. The only thing that SUCKS is the control scheme for moving around, and that is it.

      *goes to whack off another finger*

      • by gknoy (899301)

        I saw a promo video for Heavy Rain and it looks ... awesome. Kindof makes me wish I had a PS3. And yet, it's SO disturbing that I don't know my wife would let me play it. Kudos to them for making a game that explores such themes though.

        • by Khyber (864651)

          They aren't fucking joking - How far ARE you willing to go to save someone you love?

          This game is living up to the hype for me. And that's very rare.

          In fact, I'm about to try out the new STALKER game, we'll see if it lives up to the hype, despite the outdated engine it supposedly fixed major glitches and even gives a free play afterwards.

          First STALKER rocked despite MP issues and glitchy ass engine. Second one was just a cheap hack to implement DX 10 features, and poorly, at that. This one promises to be muc

          • by gknoy (899301)

            They aren't fucking joking - How far ARE you willing to go to save someone you love?

            I pray that I never have to find out. It's a frightening enough idea that I am not even sure I can handle thinking about it much. It's an emotional cthulhu. ;)

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        I didn't like any of the control scheme, and I actually did well with the demo. Won the fight and everything. But I found I was staring at the screen like a mental patient watching for random icons and not really paying attention to what was being said. Some would slowly fade in during conversations and blend in with the background. My classic copy of Apple's Human Interface Guidelines ran screaming out of the room.

        The first time I had to choose a conversation gambit, the three selections appeared right on

        • by Khyber (864651)

          "The first time I had to choose a conversation gambit, the three selections appeared right on top of one another, and just as they started to pull apart and become readable they drifted behind the character's head."

          That's part of the game. Dependent upon your emotional state, choices can either be very obfuscated or blurry-fast, or very clear, slow, and out in the open. Everything depends on how you did in previous scenes.

          "And, honestly, was the drama really anything all that special?"

          I'm on my fourth playt

          • They were in the calm state, but right on top of one another, and then hidden behind the guy's head. And then the game got mad at me for *it's* interface quirk. Eh... like I said I'm going to rent it to give it a fair shake (literally in the case of the guys asthma inhaler).
    • I'm waiting to see sales, while people might SAY the y want "adult" games, the true test is - is the paying market big enough to support such games?

      • by delinear (991444)

        Considering the massive hype around this game, I'd be surprised if it didn't generate huge sales. Better to watch the sales of the slew of "me-too" games that are bound to follow, as these will be a better indicator of whether people actually enjoyed the experience or just bought into the hype.

        I have to say, from the few videos I've seen (and they're now running ads on the TV, the before the watershed version showing a peaceful resolution to an in-game situation, the post watershed not so much) it just look

  • by fyrie (604735)
    So.... It's time for text adventures / IF to come back?
  • by LordZardoz (155141) on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @11:01PM (#31255286)

    The difference between adult gamers and younger gamers is partly a factor of time pressure, and partly a factor of content.

    The time pressure element is obvious. Aside from a typical work schedule for an adult taking more hours then going to school, an adult has more demands on their time. A 14 year boy old does not have much beyond school and some minor chores. A 24 year man old has a work day, probably has a girlfriend, and possibly has children, in addition to some amount of chores and errands. As much as the 24 year old may want to pull a 6 hour world of warcraft marathon, he probably has to make sure he has groceries, that the bills are paid. While holding onto the girlfriend is optional, it probably takes precedence over the games. The same applies to children. On top of that, the adult potentially has the money to do other activities (ie, going out to a bar, going to a rock concert, hockey game, going skydiving) that may also take precedence over video games.

    The content factor is trickier. The 14 year old and the 24 year old will have a great deal of overlap for what they like in general terms. The only difference is that as the 24 year old has less time to waste, the content must be of a generally higher quality. Having mature themes is probably going to be the difference here if it is done right. The 24 year old wont play a game just because it has "hot horny nympho sex and buckets of blood". While that is still pretty sweet, it lacks the novelty value it has for the 14 year old. Having moral shades of grey, believable characters, and solid writing will help.

    But gameplay is still king. Nintendo has pretty much proven beyond all doubt that if you can deliver good gameplay (Mario kart, wii sports, Mario Galaxy), you can hit the mark pretty solidly.

    END COMMUNICATION

    • Another factor is the economic we are all in. If you're out of a job, your either looking or too broke to be purchasing new games. If your employed however (like I am), expect to be bled to to death with 60+ hour work weeks to make up the loss of ex-employee help previously available.

      For those living in a happy-medium. I truly envy you!

    • by feepness (543479)

      The 24 year old wont play a game just because it has "hot horny nympho sex and buckets of blood".

      Geez man! Speak for yourself and don't ruin it for the rest of us!

    • by porttikivi (93246) *

      I am 46 and the only games I play are New Super Mario Bros. and Mario Kart. I think it remains to be proven, that a computer game really needs a story beyond what Mario games have. It's all about flickering lights, controls, playability, rhytm, learning curve, balanced challenge... Just like sports is, except this is mental and finger candy, not physical! I want stories? I read books or go to movies!

  • For some... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Samah (729132) on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @11:23PM (#31255438)

    Now, more than ever, we're seeing many Mature ratings (M+, 17+, 18) being distributed by various national media regulators.

    In your lucky, sensible country perhaps. Here in Australia, this man [wikipedia.org] thinks that any game other than Mario and Puzzle Bobble is evil, so we should PROTECT THE CHILDREN at all costs.

    • by gblackwo (1087063)
      We have are own crazies here in America, see: Jack Thompson [wikipedia.org]
      • by Samah (729132)

        We have are own crazies here in America, see: Jack Thompson

        Luckily for you, Jack Thompson has little to no influence anymore. Not a lot we (as in, anyone outside the electorate of Croydon) can do about Michael Atkinson.

    • by Nazlfrag (1035012)

      Are you kidding? Mario ingests psychadelic musrooms and crushes innocent turtles to death, blithely kicking away the remains. Puzzle Bobble involves playing a monster who uses dangerous weapons to crush and destroy. Both are clearly unsuitable to anybody apart from drug addicts, animal abusers and vandals and anyone found in posession of such depraved material should be tried as such.

  • by Joe The Dragon (967727) on Tuesday February 23, 2010 @11:28PM (#31255470)

    It's time for PINBALL to come back as a big thing and THEY ARE STILL MADE IN THE USA!!!

  • The idea that stuff that should be unavailable to children is automatically more mature, has been spectacularly antiproductive.
    Example of logic: "Wow, Bobby got drunk and slept with the teacher, and he's only a sixth grader! Awesome! I'm gonna ask him how he does it!"
    Labeling things "M" adds about 25% interest among young teenagers, because we advertise sex and drugs as too fun to be legal. People reach for things they think will be useful in making them happy. For inexperienced people looking for fun, il

  • Fitting that SotC would be the first game he mentions. It was the first to pop into my head. Also, props to whoever tagged this story "Mother 3." Definitely a grown up game, and it's a damn shame it never officially left Japan.
    • by Khyber (864651)

      SotC should be rated mature on the simple fact most children and teenagers today are pretty much incapable of appreciating the focus on artistic capability and awe-inspiration rather than constant action and dialogue.

  • The Stock Market (Score:2, Insightful)

    by ntufar (712060)
    Not on topic but I'd want to mention the stock market as a good game for adults. I played computer games in my teens and twenties but now, in my thirties I find them quite boring, predictable and repetitive.

    For three years now I picked up a new hobby: stock market. I watch CNBC, I read business newspapers, i follow a ton of finance blogs, I think, I make hard decisions, I put my money at risk, I master my impulses and emotions. I throughly enjoy it.
  • You mean the kind I can put one a USB-stick and can hide realy quickly when the boss get near me?
  • Sure, it had some D&D-obligated women in skimpy clothing, but everything else that made it good was clearly targeting a mature audience:

    - 100,000+ words of text to tell the story -- sure, kids read books like that these days, but at a video game's pace? Not so much.
    - Your character could do almost anything to anyone purely out of self-interest, and most of it wasn't physical. If you didn't manipulate a particular someone to your own ends over the course of the game, you probably didn't talk to them at a

  • by Aceticon (140883) on Wednesday February 24, 2010 @07:41AM (#31258070)

    Personally I always wished that MMORPGS had age segregated servers available.

    Not because of adult content (as somebody pointed out in another story, naked pixels are only really tillitanting when ur a teen), it's simply because an environment where teens can run around anonymously controlling powerfull avatars and there are no adults in supervisory positions tends only be fun - if at all - for the teens themselfs (things like griefing, being loud, obnoxious and showing off which look cool when ur 13 and have no life experience just look like signs of social/emotional desperation once you become mature enough to understand people).

    I don't want all servers should be age segregated, I just whish there were such servers available - with, for example, a 25+ age limit - for those that want the option: I would even be willing to pay extra for it.

  • Who the hell tagged this story 'astroturf' and 'flamebait'? It's neither. Several different games are compared, and Heaqvy Rain is only mentioned once. I'm submitting the opposite (see my subject line) and would urge everyone else to do so as well.

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