Arma III Developers Arrested In Greece For 'Spying' 162
An anonymous reader writes "Kotaku reports that two employees of Bohemia Interactive have been arrested while on a photo-tour of the Greek island of Limnos, on charges of spying. The developers were taking reference photos for the upcoming military simulation game Arma III, which is to feature Limnos as it's primary setting, when they were arrested (Google translation of Greek original)."
Re:Spying? Really? (Score:5, Informative)
There have been similar incidents in the past in Greece involving people taking photos of military aircraft, air bases etc. It's illegal in Greece to photograph military property, and if you do so arrest is likely. With Arma being a military game, my guess is these guys were doing exactly this, and should have known better.
Re:Spying? Really? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:wha why? (Score:5, Informative)
You leave out the part where the 'scenery' they were taking pictures of happened to be a military installation. No granted, I think espionage charges for such a thing are more than a little ridiculous (and I doubt that is what they'll actually be charged for) but just about every nation on the planet has laws against photographing their military bases.
Re:Spying? Really? (Score:5, Informative)
They were taking photographs of a military installation that they intended to reproduce inside Arma III. That almost certainly means moderately detailed shots of buildings, security measures, and military personal, which is illegal in some (most? all?) countries.
Note: in the US, you can take pictures of aircraft or historical buildings, but not restricted areas. The point is to prevent surveillance intended to find weaknesses in security that can be exploited, aka "casing the joint". Pretty standard practice in the military. They should have definitely have asked for permission first.
Not really the first time in Greece (Score:2, Informative)
They tend to be jumpy about photographers near military installations. (they still seem to anticipate a Turkish invasion at any moment)
Like the plane-spotters they arrested 11 years ago.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/1953654.stm
Re:No Cameras (Score:5, Informative)
Feel free to take cameras with you and take pictures of the beautiful scenery, monuments and people. When however, you go outside military facilities that have big "NO PHOTOGRAPHY ALLOWED" signs (in english and actual no camera icons in case you don't know english) and start taking detailed photographs with your DSLR and 70-300 lens, expect to be arrested if caught. The devs should absolutely have requested a license to do it, they didn't care to do it or got caught in the bureaucracy that is to be expected with these affairs, they got arrested for breaking the law. If they were caught doing that in the US (say, outside Nellis AFB), I wonder what would have happened to them.
Re:Spying? Really? (Score:5, Informative)
being greek, i've read some of the original articles. The problem is, they were taking photographs and videotaping active military bases. I'm pretty sure, the guys are not spies but gathering intelligence on foreign military installations constitutes spying in most of the countries i know
Normal reaction (Score:4, Informative)
Most of the commentators here are speaking out of their asses. Let me tell you somethings, being greek and all.
First of all ,Limnos is one of the Greek islands that is very close to Turkey. There have been a lot of incidents in the past there. Maybe the whole point of the clashes were moot, maybe not, but i can't blame the officials for being extra carefull.
Secondly, personally i believe that the guys did not mean harm. But, they were photographing and videotaping active military camps. Sure there's satellite photos of everything on the island on google maps, but gathering intelligence on military installations is one of the most basic espionage actions. If that's not spying, i don't know what is.
Finally, for all those talking about tourists and tourist activities, that's a whole lot of hors*shit. Next time you decide to come for vacations, try to stay at the beach. The military bases are off limits.
Re:wha why? (Score:4, Informative)
You may doubt it, but I do not. I took over nearly two year for a group of tourist plane spotters to be acquitted of espionage charges [bbc.co.uk] in 2001. At the initial process 8 of that group were convicted to three years in jail.
Re:Spying? Really? (Score:5, Informative)
>>>Note: in the US, you can take pictures of aircraft or historical buildings, but not restricted areas. The point is to prevent surveillance intended to find weaknesses in security that can be exploited, aka "casing the joint". Pretty standard practice in the military.
In the U.S. the courts have ruled again-and-again that people may not be forbidden from recording that which is in public view. ("Per the first amendment citizens have a right to record the activities of their government officials in public areas." and "There is no expectation of privacy when in public view.") It is why places like Area 51 are surrounded by miles and miles of "buffer zone" so nobody can get close enough to see the place.
Re:Spying? Really? (Score:5, Informative)
So if I was there as a tourist, would I get arrested?
Or is somehow putting your island into a video game now sedition or something?
TFA is pretty slim, but I'm having a hard time imagine what law was broken.
This shouldn't be all that surprising. I'm not familiar with Greek law but in the US one can only be certain that photographing a military installation is legal if one has written authorization from the base commander. See here [gpo.gov]. Speaking from personal experience, if one were to stop on US Route 2 heading through North Dakota, photograph one of the Minuteman nuclear missile launch facilities just a few yards off the road, a visit from Minot Airforce Base security is quite likely. Again, speaking from personal experience, these security personnel have brand new shiny M-4s (not those beat up ones from the sandbox) and a .30 cal machine gun mounted on their HUMVEE. If one were to continue photographing, this is once again from personal experience, they will call the sheriff's deputy (who happens to be a serious hottie) and she will threaten arrest for disorderly conduct.
My guess is that the Minuteman launch facilities are considered off limits. They have signs which say "Restricted Area" and federal statute considers these areas off limits in terms of photography. According to statute, it seems that even photographing these area from a distance, such as while standing on a publicly traveled way such as US Route 2, is likely prohibited. The signs on the nuclear launch facilities say they will shoot you if you actually climb the fence. There are hundreds of these facilities across northwest North Dakota. It seems to me that the sheer number of launch facilities would make it difficult for a tourist to photographically document their vacation to beautiful North Dakota.
I don't see why it's surprising that other countries have similar laws in place
Re:Spying? Really? (Score:5, Informative)
Czechs and getting footage of a military base, they'd sure be instantly classified as terrorists.
Eh? The Czech Republic is an honored member of NATO. The U.S. has already sworn to shed its own blood and spend its own treasury to defend it. One NATO member spying on another is none of the U. S. 's business. Hell, one NATO member at war with another [wikipedia.org] is almost none of the U. S.'s business, except for the diplomatic pressure to encourage them to stop.