Forgot your password?
typodupeerror
Image

Game Review: Torchlight 2 221

Posted by samzenpus
from the play-it-if-you-got-it dept.
CowboyNeal writes: "Last week was a big week for gamers, with the release of both Borderlands 2 as well as Torchlight 2. I already shared my thoughts on the former last week, so I got to playing the latter over the weekend. Torchlight 2 is the follow-up to Torchlight, the 2009 point-and-click ARPG created by Runic Games. What's new that the first game didn't have? And, the big question, how does it stack up against Diablo 3? Click the link below to learn my impressions of the game."

A Testimonial, and a Confession

First, I have to admit some bias here. When Diablo 2 came out over a decade ago, it was my favorite game for quite some time. Its expansion pack only cemented its position as the best game of all time, for me. It's key to note here, that Diablo 2 was only the best game ever in my opinion, and eventually it aged and got to the point where it was nigh unplayable on modern computers. I even tried going back several times in the past few years, and just found it too archaic to function properly on modern hardware. It desperately needed either some patches or a successor to bring it up to date.

When Blizzard Entertainment announced Diablo 3, I couldn't have been happier. At last, an updated version of the best game ever would be available. However, something felt odd about Diablo 3 even before I ever played it. Blizzard kept reviews at bay until after release via a restrictive NDA. That's fairly common, and not enough to raise suspicion alone, but still odd that there weren't more early peeks allotted to the usual media channels. Even after its release, the demo was only available by invite. I couldn't even download the demo for Diablo 3 unless someone who had already bought the game gave me a code. Now something smelled fishy. So I held onto my sixty dollars, which while would be a small price to pay for the best game ever, it seemed like Diablo 3 wouldn't be that game. Eventually I was able to wrangle a demo code from someone who had bought the game and wanted to lure me into playing it. I didn't get very far into the demo before I got a quest just to use a waypoint. Perhaps they didn't realize that I have killed Diablo and his brothers dozens if not hundreds of times already. I know how to work a waypoint. I need monsters to kill. Out of respect for the franchise, I kept on. I even finished the demo, but by the time I did so, it was clear to me, that Diablo 3 was going to be a giant let-down for me. Whatever fun I had with Diablo 2 was done and gone, and would stay in the past.

I had had the good fortune of playing Torchlight, and like just about everyone else, my biggest complaint was that the game had no multiplayer. Other than the lack of multiplayer, I thought it was just about perfect. Given my previous love for Diablo 2, this shouldn't be any sort of surprise. So now at long last, Runic has released the multiplayer-enabled Torchlight 2. Similar to the old "Open Battle.Net" games of Diablo 2, you can play the same character in single player, LAN, and internet games. This proved to be key, as on release day, Runic's servers melted from the onslaught of players. Internet games were finally enabled a couple days later, but in the meantime, plenty of single player and LAN games were had. Through the creative usage of some VPNs, I was even able to play LAN games over the internet.

Once More Into the Fray

The game starts off in the ruins of the town of Torchlight. Wait a second, didn't I save the town from Ordrak at the bottom of the mines and whatever else was down there? Well, it turns out that I did, so long as I wasn't playing an alchemist. The alchemist, on the other hand, was corrupted by the heart of Ordrak and immediately knew that he had to burn down the town, and leave a path of death and destruction across the land as he began his new plot to destroy the world. Okay, so the plot isn't Hugo Award caliber stuff here, but neither was "Diablo lived somehow, and you have to go kill him again," nor was "Hey, why don't you just run on into this dungeon and fetch me the Amulet of Yendor." Really the plot is just a means to goad me into venturing into areas that I haven't already taken it upon myself to go explore and kill everything in.

That brings us down to what the real fun in any point-and-click ARPG is. Taking on and killing hordes of enemies at once, securing an area, and then reaping the immediate rewards in the form of experience and loot. The Torchlight series has traded in the grimdark setting of Diablo for an art style that's a bit more cartoon-like, but the core gameplay survives. This is a feature that Torchlight 2 recreates flawlessly. Combat is fast, frenetic, and visceral. Enemies have a chance to explode into a pile of gibs, leaving bloodstains on the ground. Frozen enemies can be shattered into chunks of ice. Often the action happens so fast, that creatures can be slain before I'm even aware they exist. It's exactly the opposite of the first act of Diablo 3, which comparatively felt like drudgery.

Building the Perfect Warrior

There's four classes to choose from in Torchlight 2, and while they follow some archetypes, they're also rather configurable in how they're played via skills and weapon choices. The embermage is a classic spellcaster who uses staves and wands, and can learn many different spells to put down his enemies. The outlander is a ranged class that excels at nearly every sort of ranged weapon. The berserker is a melee damage class that can gain bonuses from using two weapons of the same type. And last but not least, is the engineer, a versatile class that can use shields, two-handed weapons, and even cannons, or some combination of those, depending on skill set. It's important to note here, that every class can wield every weapon, there's just not always a bonus for doing so. You're free to make a berserker who uses shotguns, for example, there's just not many skills for the class to support it.

Skills aren't tied to any sort of tree structure like they were before. You only need to be of a skill's required level to unlock it. Active skills such as spells, will also confer a bonus after investing five, ten, or fifteen points into them. Leveling up a character also isn't the only way to gain skill points. As you gain in fame from killing bosses and random named mobs, you acquire a skill point for every level of fame you've achieved as well.

Keep Going Back For More

It took me a little over 20 hours to save the world, on my first trip through on normal difficulty. Normal difficulty was still rather easy, and I think my next trip through the world will be at the veteran level. There are however, still a number of activities for my first character to do. Completing the game unlocks the Mapworks, a robot-run area where you can load custom maps to complete. It's also possible to create a new world that begins at your current level, so I could start a new game with that character where the first monsters would be around level 50. Because the dungeons and open areas outside towns are randomly generated, a second playthrough manages to still feel somewhat fresh. Combine that with a character class that you haven't played before, or a new set of skills for one that you have, and there's lots of reasons to keep replaying.

But is this the new best game ever?

In short, yes. I've spent time reading people's meager, whiny complaints about this gift of the gods that has been put on sale for a mere twenty dollars. Sure, you can only reallocate the last three skill points you've spent, and you can't redo all your stats and skills once you're leveled up. That's so that you learn from your mistakes and go back and play the game again. There's no one to hold your hand to find the area where the quest is at. There's a marker on your map for you to aim for, and that's more than any player deserves. The quests are still rather simplistic, and of the form to go kill someone or a group of someones, or to collect a thing, or a group of things. Again, the quests are merely a vehicle to get you into new areas. If you happen to kill the guy that advances the plot, that's a bonus. If you stop to talk to an NPC, the world does not stop for you. Enemies will continue to attack you as you choose your quest reward, because you were too stupid to clear out the area of any possible threats before sitting down to talk. I think I've now sufficiently debunked any negative points I've read in other reviews. If you don't like point-and-click ARPG games, you're not going to like this one. No one is going to change the entire genre to enable someone's crazy ideas. Well, unless it's Diablo 3, and look how that turned out. Sure it sold well, but I would now have to waterboard my friends into admitting that they fell for purchasing it.

My biggest complaint about this most perfect game, is that there's no Mac or Linux versions, yet. I say yet, because three years after the first game was released, we even have a Linux version now. You can pick it up, DRM-free, right now for a limited time, for the price of whatever-you-want, as part of the Humble Indie Bundle 6. You can donate some or all of the price to the EFF as well. Shameless plugs aside, it may take a few years but eventually Torchlight 2 should make the rounds as well. Runic Games has a lot in store for the game yet, such as console versions, as well as Steam Workshop integration, which will enable easy mod installation. Mod support will presumably let players redo their skills and stats, and cheat if they want to.

*

This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Game Review: Torchlight 2

Comments Filter:
  • Good (Score:5, Insightful)

    by i kan reed (749298) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @02:32PM (#41480615) Homepage Journal

    Since Diablo 3 is a DRM'd monstrosity, I'll give this a try, just to help show blizzard why they aren't getting money.

    • by Quirkz (1206400)
      I pre-ordered Torchlight 2 when Diablo 3 came out and I concluded I wouldn't buy it because of the always-online requirement. However, I never got any notices that Torchlight 2 had become available, so until just a few minutes ago I didn't realize it was out. Apparently Steam doesn't bother sending notices when pre-orders are released, unless a spam filter ate it or something.

      I'm looking forward to giving the game a shot, though after about 1.5 playthroughs of the original Torchlight I started to find th
    • Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday September 27, 2012 @03:37PM (#41481427)

      If you or anybody else wants to buy Torchlight because of their issues with D3, send a message to Activision/Blizzard by emailing or sending them your receipt for your purchase of Torchlight (or whatever else you spent your money on).

      Not buying their product is one thing (they might just attribute it as a loss to piracy). Showing them that you had the money *and* inclination to buy something but instead bought a competitors product is a whole other thing.

      • Re:Good (Score:5, Informative)

        by CodeHxr (2471822) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @05:46PM (#41482905)

        If you or anybody else wants to buy Torchlight because of their issues with D3, send a message to Activision/Blizzard by emailing or sending them your receipt for your purchase of Torchlight (or whatever else you spent your money on).

        Not buying their product is one thing (they might just attribute it as a loss to piracy). Showing them that you had the money *and* inclination to buy something but instead bought a competitors product is a whole other thing.

        Too bad you posted that anonymously... I will do this when I get home tonight because it will also indicate that not only did I have the money for their game, I got *four* copies of their competitor's game for the same price as their own. Bonus points for "their competitor" being developers that were originally a part of Blizzard [wikipedia.org].

      • by Loki_666 (824073)

        That's a good move i think.

        I've just downloaded the pirate version to check it out. Fell in love with it after 5 mins (and i'm not such a fan of ARPG games), but I'll be definitely buying a 4 pack of licences very soon to cover me and the kids, they deserve my money. Great work Runic!

    • Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)

      by hairyfeet (841228) <bassbeast1968@@@gmail...com> on Thursday September 27, 2012 @05:23PM (#41482683) Journal

      Dude I gotta say...TORCHLIGHT 2 ROCKS!!! I pre-ordered for me and my boys, they had a cool deal where you could pay $60 (the same as a single copy of D3) and get 4 copies of Torchlight 1 AND get 4 of Torchlight II on release, what a steal! BTW you can still get 4 copies for $60 [steampowered.com] but I don't think you get TL 1 for free like if you pre-ordered.

      Torchlight 1 is still a blast but to me its not the MP that was missing, it was the challenge. You could save up gems and build a "weapon of ultimate ass kickery" and just slaughter the entire game. Now not only did they fix this but LOOOT BABY LOOOT! The loot is cool but you gotta seriously hunt and fight and you WILL die even on normal level, these bad guys don't play around! There is this Manticore boss out in the desert and when we hit that place it was like walking into hell, just fire and explosions and lightning, and when you are playing MP with friends or family here is some KILLER things about MP..1.-Everyone gets their own loot, no loot snatching, 2.-Trading is simple and easy, if you get something your buddy can use or he gets a cool weapon you need for the set you're building? Swap in seconds. 3.-Bad guys ramp up a LOT when you add players, no going in with your buds and just laying waste, you better bring your A game because they sure do!

      I know everyone is gonna compare to Diablo 3, but I don't think that is fair or right. They built D3 to be an online only MMO style real money market thing, while Torchlight 2 takes all we loved about D1 and D2 and dungeon crawlers and just ramps it to 11, making everything better! It really makes it a community, even going so far as to say "Modders are welcome here, come on in!" so we'll be seeing cool stuff added to Torchlight for years, which is something I LOVE LOVE LOVE to see games do, it adds so much to an already great game!

      So if you like RPGs? If you like dungeon crawlers? If you liked Diablo 1 and 2? if you don't like always on DRM and real money markets? then BUY TORCHLIGHT 2 NOW! The first time we played the boys kept popping up in game "You only paid $20 a copy for this? Seriously? this rocks!" and I have to agree, its the most fun I've had in an RPG dungeon crawler in years, great loot, great sets, great drops, hard bad guys and bosses,lots of secrets and easter eggs (be sure to look for a basket near where you find the lotion for a cute "Silence of the Lambs" riff) its just a fricking blast!

    • by Billlagr (931034)
      I loved D2, and still play it occasionally with my sons (who, incidently was 1 when it was released and the other wasn't even born - I feel so old), so I really was looking forward until D3 until I found out about the always online thing, and that was the deal breaker for me. Trading house, DRM, whatever the reason, always online is just not practical nor even possible, I spend a lot of time on trains (3 hrs + per day) travelling through regional areas with spotty coverage at best. I picked up TL 1 and enjo
  • No Crafting (Score:4, Interesting)

    by oGMo (379) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @02:40PM (#41480735)

    I think my biggest complaint is the same as Borderlands 2 .. no crafting to break up the slay-collect-sell rinse-repeat. I guess if you like slay-collect-sell that much, this game is perfect for you. If you want to set your own goals for finding rare components and crafting powerful gear, you're SOL, but that's not everyone's cup of tea.

    On the other hand, TorchED is promised, and moddable games are good, which is what sold me. Hopefully someone can add to the gameplay!

    • Re:No Crafting (Score:5, Interesting)

      by omglolbah (731566) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @03:19PM (#41481247)

      You can at least merge set items and various types of equipment into new random pieces in Torchlight 2.
      Not nearly as much of a crafting system as I would like to see, but better than the usual "this item is not for my class, vendor trash..."

  • by Anonymous Coward

    Torchlight 2 still didn't manage to give me anything that Dungeon Siege 2 did...

    The WoW-esque graphics are such an extreme turn-off, and the fact that anyone from Blizzard had so major an influence on the game is just as much a boner-kill. Torchlight 2 had promise, but didn't deliver any more than Diablo 3 did. Mashing a single button and watching random numbers float by isn't fun, and is definitely not all that an ARPG can accomplish, but Torchlight 2 has literally nothing else. There's no choices or compl

    • You sound like you're the kind of person who doesn't enjoy the original Diablo games or lookalikes. If that's the case, why did you even bother with Torchlight? Its whole reason for existence is to cater to that segment of players.

  • Linux support (Score:4, Insightful)

    by drinkypoo (153816) <martin.espinoza@gmail.com> on Thursday September 27, 2012 @02:41PM (#41480753) Homepage Journal

    I had hoped that the Linux release of the original meant that the sequel would have it from the beginning. Unfortunately, this is not the case, which means I won't be purchasing this game now, I don't want more Windows software. Hopefully they'll do a Linux port of this game before it becomes irrelevant. Too bad they don't have one now, or they could have my twenty bucks, too.

    • A good Linux port is needed. Torchilght 1 as it is right now is a piece of crap on Linux, unfortunately.

  • by Freddybear (1805256) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @02:44PM (#41480817)
    I think I had exactly the same experience with this game. I like the cartoony art style and the fast chaotic battles. "Normal" difficulty seemed like Easy Mode, and I ran through it with an Embermage in about 23 hours of play. "Veteran" difficulty, on the other hand, requires some attention to get the build right and constantly keeping up with weapon and armor upgrades. But there is plenty of all that to choose from, and each of the character types can win with one of several different build styles. I might even stick my toe into the Elite waters.
    • by Qzukk (229616)

      "Normal" difficulty seemed like Easy Mode

      Yeah, that seems to be about right. I can't even imagine what Casual mode must be like. I started my first character on Normal, got through a few dungeons, hit level 12 and realized I had never invested a single skill point. I was still playing an outlander with the original one point in that throwing skill, doing just fine. On top of that, everything short of boss battles couldn't even injure my pet. I'd watch my ferret run around, on fire, taking hits from all so

      • by Wizarth (785742)

        Indeed, Normal is much too easy if you've played a game like this before.

        Veteran is still fairly easy in the first area (act?) but it does ramp up later on.

  • Pedigree (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday September 27, 2012 @02:46PM (#41480853)

    The review forgot to mention that the creators of Diablo 2 left Blizzard North and Diablo 3 was made by a whole new crew. Granted those guys have some pedigree too, but not in the ARPG genre (Fallout, Total Annihilation, etc.). Several of the Blizzard North guys eventually worked their way around to Runic games, and TL 1 and 2 are both products of the guys who made Diablo 2.

    There's a reason TL 2 plays so well and is so friendly to players the way D2 was. I've often thought but never had proof of it until now: video games are an art and are about vision of the team leads. Programming is important, graphics are important, but those are technical aspects; gameplay is an art form and very dependent upon who is making the game, not what studio, or what graphics or technical aspects it has. No set of games have illustrated this point more clearly than the recent launches of D3 and TL2.

    • Re:Pedigree (Score:5, Interesting)

      by coldandcalculating (1311907) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @03:00PM (#41481029)
      It's worth mentioning that the guy who did the music for D1 and D2 is also at Runic..

      Who can ever forget the reverberating guitar chord that welcomed you first into the world of Diablo?
    • The D2 to D3 progression reminds me of Warcraft 3 to WoW - same world; different types of game. There are many other parallels between WoW and D3, like how the games don't "start" until max level, the prevalence of an AH, the always-on internet connection, etc.

      If D3 had not been billed as the sequel to D2, I think a lot of the hate would have been held back. Had they called it "World of Diablo" (or whatever), people may have realized that they were different types of game. For example, the skill system a
  • Good deal for $20 (Score:3, Informative)

    by DoofusOfDeath (636671) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @02:48PM (#41480885)

    I haven't played D3, but I've played TL1 and D2, and I've now played through TL2.

    Cons: In my opinion, the storytelling of TL2 is somewhat less compelling and expansive than was that of D2. Also, the D2 had good cinematics, and most (all?) of its narration was recorded voices, rather than just text that you have to read.

    Pros: Lots of fun, low hardware requirements, good randomization of maps. Fun approach to playing random maps after you beat the game (I'm not going to spoil it.) No DRM.

    And last but not least, it's a great entertainment value for $20. Money very well in my case. From the reviews, I don't think I would have considered $60 for D3 to be a worthwhile purchase.

    • by ifrag (984323)

      Cons: In my opinion, the storytelling of TL2 is somewhat less compelling and expansive than was that of D2.

      Agree, the bar has been set pretty low on the story, I'm only vaguely paying any attention to it myself. But at least you can tell they put their focus in on the game play. With where it's at, I'd almost prefer the story to be scaled back even more, with just some brief hand waving about go forth and strike down evil.

      Most rogue-likes never even bothered with it at all. And if you didn't dig through the readme files or hear it from someone, the only obvious thing was "we need to go deeper" and yet peopl

      • by DudemanX (44606)

        Conversely the story in Diablo 3 is terrible. The fact that you're beaten over the head with it on each play through only makes it more annoying. Diablo 3 would be a much better game if the bad story wasn't always in your way.

        Azmodan is Baghdad Bob.

        • I agree. Diablo3 would've been much better with randomized maps + free roam, not the story mode restriction that they force on you. The story mode really ruined multiplayer aswell, it's one of the main reasons why no one plays d3 multiplayer.

          Diablo 3 got it wrong in every department, and Torchlight 2 got it right. Torchlight 2 has randomized maps, free roam, and a multiplayer lobby system with named games! Pretty much everything that Diablo 2 had that Diablo3 should've had...

  • This is not really a comment, more of a question: wasn't the biggest complain about Diablo 2 the fact that it was wide open to cheating/hacking due to the fact that you could bring online the stuff you acquired offline? I'm not really familiar with the genre, I only played like three D2 sessions and no torchlight so don't bash me for my ignorance but isn't it exactly the same here ?

    What is gonna prevent my neighbor's kid from hacking the sandworm-slaying-axe-of-madness and bringing it online to cut me in
    • It is. Basically since it is fully moddable with no server of any kind really (the game runs P2P), there is nothing stopping people from changing their char to anything. Runic did already disable console commands in multiplayer and do have a way to show that you are using a modded char, but since everything is client side, that will almost certainly be bypassed. Basically, TL2 and D3 took the 2 halves of D2 game play and went full bore in opposite directions. TL2 has no secure server of any kind, whereas D
      • by afidel (530433)

        I'm hoping TL2 will develop a community more like Neverwinter Nights where just because you can play with a modded character doesn't mean it'll be a hackfest. With the engine being so open we should see some interesting mods come out over the next year or two. The Steam version having a mod manager will probably help some in that regard.

    • > wasn't the biggest complain about Diablo 2 the fact that it was wide open to cheating/hacking due to the fact that you could bring online the stuff you acquired offline?

      Only the hackers played open b.net -- that lets you import your offline characters

      Most of the people played closed b.net -- the servers and game are 100% on Blizzard's server. It was more hack-resistant, but nothing is ever 100% hack-proof (due to lag).

      There was a bad bug where you could "fuse" items in closed b.net but that was fixed

      • by lgw (121541)

        but nothing is ever 100% hack-proof (due to lag).

        Why would lag enable (item-related) hacks? I know Blizzard games have had some duping hacks involving induced lag over the years, but that's just crappy code. As long as you don't trust your clients, there's just no opening for item-related hacks.

        • > Why would lag enable (item-related) hacks? I know Blizzard games have had some duping hacks involving induced lag over the years, but that's just crappy code.
          Agreed; but it did. Duping in Diablo 1 was trivial -- just by dropping items on the ground and picking them up fast.

          > As long as you don't trust your clients, there's just no opening for item-related hacks.
          In theory yes, in practice no. If you don't trust the client for anything you
          a) overload your servers
          b) introduce > 100 ms responses th

    • by Yosho (135835)

      This is not really a comment, more of a question: wasn't the biggest complain about Diablo 2 the fact that it was wide open to cheating/hacking due to the fact that you could bring online the stuff you acquired offline?

      That is a complaint, but not really a big one. There's a vocal minority that complains about it, but most people don't really care what other people do as long as it's not affecting their own game.

      What is gonna prevent my neighbor's kid from hacking the sandworm-slaying-axe-of-madness and bringing it online to cut me in half?

      For one, PVP is not only entirely consensual, you also have to enable the console and know the right command to enable it. It's impossible for somebody to attack you unless you both know how and consent to it.

      But that aside, if somebody jumps into your game with a level 100 character and starts one-shotting ever

  • Diablo 3 is fine. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Petersko (564140) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @03:05PM (#41481071)
    I got my $60 out of it, and so did almost everybody who's bitching about it. I don't know where anybody got this idea that their one-time payment (that has become progressively cheaper as it failed to increase with inflation) should give them hundreds of hours of entertainment.

    If you check your played time and it's over 100 hours, maybe you should stop whining about how crappy you think it is, because clearly your bitchy brain and your gaming brain are having an argument.

    Actually, the old man in me wishes the entire gaming community would benefit from a complete media blackout when it comes to video games. Then they can buy a game without expectations, enjoy it without absorbing the negative crap from other gamers, and be satisfied.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Feneban (2740683)
      I don't think the point was getting your $60 worth. D3 was in "development" for 10 years and it ended up having the main feature ended up being the Real Money Auction House. For the time that Blizzard invested in the game, one would expect more than 4 Act's of similar looking tilesets and models. I've only played through 2.5 Acts of Torchlight 2 and I'm pretty sure I've seen at least twice the models that D3 had. I was able to sell $40 worth of gear on the RMAH to at least get some of my money back on D3.
      • by Clsid (564627)

        I totally agree with you. I played the demo of Torchlight 2 and while it's fun, the intensity of the battles is no match for what you find on Diablo 3. Matt Uelmen on the other hand is Torchlight's biggest asset IMHO.

        In any case, I think you can enjoy both games. Maybe Diablo 3 isn't what people expected of a Diablo 2 successor but it still is a great game on its own. It's not like the Diablo series were the greatest game ever for me since I'm more of an RTS fan and I would take a Dark Reign sequel over Dia

        • I played the demo of Torchlight 2 and while it's fun, the intensity of the battles is no match for what you find on Diablo 3.

          Are you serious? The boss fights in Diablo 3 were a joke. The only one that was half decent was Belial. The boss fights in TL2 are far more intricate, and if you play on Veteran or Elite difficulty the bosses are extremely challenging.

          • by Clsid (564627)

            I agree that the boss fights are a joke, but I hope you agree with me that the general hack and slash is way better in Diablo 3 than it is in Torchlight. Case in point: Barbarian vs. Engineer.

            I would end up paying for Torchlight just to support those guys, since they are the original team. But the graphics style reminds me a lot of Battlefield Heroes which I don't find too appealing. The most cartoony I can go is with WoW, and after playing Guild Wars 2 even that pales in comparison. So I truly mean it when

    • by steelfood (895457) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @03:48PM (#41481547)

      What? Where did money and hours of gameplay come into this? Sure, you spent $60 (not to mention it used to be $30 for a decent game) and you expect $60 worth of gameplay. But I don't think that was ever the gripe about Diablo 3.

      Diablo 3 cannot be played offline.

      Diablo 3 cannot be played without a Battle.net account.

      Diablo 3 cannot be played without Blizzard's nod each time.

      Diablo 3 will stop working mid-way through playing if your connection to Blizzard's servers fail.

      What does hours of gameplay have to do with anything when the gripe is about purchasing a product and not be able to play with it whenever, wherever, and however.

      As far as we're concerned, that's not what we define as buying a game, at least not to us pre-MMO generation gamers.

      • by marcop (205587)

        I agree with some of what you mention, but my biggest gripe about D3 is that it wasn't fun. It seemed more like a job than a game. The AH is so heavily integrated that I was spending way too much time in the AH trying to get a good item because the drops generally sucked.

        I've only played a couple hours of TL2 so far and I like it for the price. It is fun so far. I like the D2/D3 atmosphere better. D2/D3 had better storytelling and voice acting. It made the game more immersive. TL2 has some of these,

      • Diablo 3 will become unplayable if your internet connection to those servers is too laggy.

        I tried the open beta, through my ISP it was a slideshow where I didn't know if I was alive or dead. Admittedly a few tweaks to their QOS rules probably sorted everything all out for the games release, but why should I have to risk dieing due to lag in a single player game?

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by shaunbr (563633) *

      There's definitely a lot of unfounded hate for Diablo 3. It's certainly not Diablo 2, but I got my money's worth out of it.

      The main problem with Diablo 3 is the auction house. Not even the RMAH - just the auction house in general. The main draw to an ARPG, and pretty much the entire endgame, is farming for better loot. In Diablo 2, you had to find all the good gear yourself, or make an effort to seek out other people to trade with. There was an entire rune-based economy that facilitated the trades, but

    • by MrTester (860336)
      Yeah! I agree! 100%.
      I just wish there was some way to not go out and read reviews of games that I want to buy...
    • I don't know where anybody got this idea that their one-time payment should give them hundreds of hours of entertainment.

      I think they probably got that idea from past experiences where their one-time payment got them hundreds of hours of entertainment. I could be wrong though.

      I can't even guess how many hundreds of hours I've put into Fallout, Fallout 2, Diablo, Diablo 2, etc. Shit, I have over 400 hours in Skyrim, and that's been out for less than a year. Last night I was playing through a heavily-modded Fallout: New Vegas again. I've played through both Fallout 3 and Borderlands with at least 3 characters each. I've in

      • To add to the above, that list barely scratches the surface. I didn't even mention Doom, Doom 2, Doom 3 (played that a couple months ago again), Far Cry, Far Cry 2, Crysis, Half-Life, Half-Life 2, Team Fortress, Counter-Strike, Descent, Freespace 1 and 2, Freelancer, the X-series, etc etc etc etc. I've spent hundreds of hours in each of those games over several playthroughs (where applicable) over an extended period. I am a nerd. And I have no girlfriend. But I sure as hell get my money's worth out of

    • I concur. I cannot help but be amazed at the number of people who think that Blizzard killed their puppies or something. I mean, just look at this thing... "Gift of the gods?" "The new best game ever?" I think Borderlands 2 is probably the game of the year, but I don't think anyone's granted it sainthood yet.

      And then there's this: Sure, you can only reallocate the last three skill points you've spent, and you can't redo all your stats and skills once you're leveled up. That's so that you learn from your
      • respec console command. shows online that you used it, but doesnt ban you

        • Easier: Create a throwaway character and spawn the RESPECPOTION item. Put the item in the shared stash and delete the flagged throwaway. You get your respec, and no flag.

          The flag was, as someone else on the Runic forums put it, a "well-intentioned mistake."

  • This is the most addictive RPG I have played in my life. I really love the rapid fire pace of the gear and specialization point systems and I only have one real complaint with the combat: it can be pretty hard to actually get your character moving somewhere instead of attacking once you are mostly-surrounded. Cheap deaths are pretty frustrating and the game mechanics are solid but not perfect.

  • by Jackie_Chan_Fan (730745) on Thursday September 27, 2012 @04:04PM (#41481705)

    I've been playing Torchlight 2 for a few days now, and right away I knew this was the better game. The art style is not better because its cartoony, its better because its designed by better artists, who really understand appeal, quality of animation, and design. This game not only looks better, its just more fun. Diablo 3 was a huge let down. Diablo 3 had 1 interesting boss battle and it wasnt the final Diablo battle, which was a complete fucking disaster artistically. I mean Blizzard should redo the end of the game so that there actually is a climax and a resolve. Diablo 3 is so uneventful, and so poorly designed artistically. I'll give Blizzard a nod for a good item system, auction house, and decent shading and lighting but overall Torchilight 2 makes blizzard look like amateurs.

    Even the spells, and abilities all look better, more colorful, better particles, better everything. Torchlight 2 just feels right. And hey its 6 player!

    Torchlight 2 is the best $20s you can spend on games right now. Torchlight 2 is so good, you will feel ripped off by Diablo 3.

  • I will buy this game the instant there is a native OS X version available. Loved the first one but I don't have any Windows machines any more and I'm not messing around with virtualization or whatever just for a game.
  • by pecosdave (536896) * on Thursday September 27, 2012 @07:57PM (#41483913) Homepage Journal

    The first game I've tried was the original Torch Light. I like it so much so far it's the only game I've played out of the bundle, despite some of the others looking quite appealing.

    I've been playing it on my quite powerful desktop - but I noticed it had a "netbook mode" which for some reason was checked by default. I decided to put it on my netbook. For some reason it was NOT checked by default, but after clunking around with the graphics it is actually playable on my dual core Atom using Intel graphics on Kubuntu. I wouldn't exactly call it optimal and smooth, but it's still quite playable.

    I loved the original Diablo back in the day, I even bought the expansion pack for it. Then Diablo II came out and I enjoyed it for a while. Not too long, shortly afterwards Blizzard pissed me off by dragging a personal friend into a lawsuit over BNetD, they started suing a bunch of Unreal modders they had previously helped, and I quite dual-booting Windows as I found it to be a waste of hard drive space.

    In short Torchlight has offered me everything I liked about Diablo, it works on Linux, and I don't have the guilty sick to my stomach feeling that dealing with Blizzard products gives me.

    I can't tell you enough - buy the thing. Go get the bundle, and as soon as a Linux version of Torchlight 2 is released I'll go get it. My only complaint about the original Torchlight - it sometimes crashes when a new area gets loaded up. No big deal, I start the program and I'm standing exactly where I should have been without the crash so - yeah, it's great. Also gem hunting isn't quite as frustrating as it was in Diablo 2.

  • by Ogive17 (691899)
    I played Torchlight 2 a few years ago when it was called 'Fate'. Heck, they even had pets that changed form and had different attacks depending on the type of fish you fed them.

    Demo was ok... but since I've recently purchased Civ V expansion, Diablo 3 and Borderlands 2, I don't see the need for this game.
    • by bfandreas (603438)
      Luckily for Runic the rest of the world feels a need for this game. I don't see a need for Borderlands 2 but I don't run around with a sock stuffed down my pants and advertise that as a universally accepted fact.
      I'm sorry if I have melted you, you beautiful and delicious and adorable and absolutely fabulous unique snowflake. Still love ya.
    • Not sure if trolling or just uninformed...

      Giving you the benefit of the doubt: The "need" for this game is that it's the game that Fate could have been, had WT not shat all over it.

      You see, "Fate's" designer, Travis Baldree, is one of the three people who formed Runic.

Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. -- Henry Spencer

Working...