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Quake First Person Shooters (Games)

Augmented Reality Quake 255

Posted by CmdrTaco from the sure-why-not dept.
DrGonzo writes "Take a tour of campus an shoot some monsters. The Wearable Computer Lab at the University of South Australia has developed a prototype wearable Quake suit. " I'm a little skeptical of this, but it sure would make the frisbee golfers on campus look like the normal ones.
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Augmented Reality Quake More

Augmented Reality Quake

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  • Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:09PM (#3567782)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • But if it really works like is shown on the site, it'd definitely be something worth looking into.

    I could just imagine it:

    "Die you worthless demon die!"

    "Billy! Stop pointing that thing at Grandma"

  • What about respawns? (Score:3, Funny)

    by loucura! ( 247834 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:11PM (#3567799)
    It has to suck to be playing a multiplayer game of augmented reality quake, and respawn where you died. Of course, now you have physical recourse against spawn campers.

    Roschambeau?
    • You could implement it so that you have to walk back to one or more respawn points in order to respawn, and in the mean time, you wouldn't be able to shoot. I suppose you could run around dead trying to knock people's guns out of their hands, until somebody got mad and turned off augmented reality and started chasing you down to beat you to a pulp in *actual* reality...

      I'd like to see them implement rocket jumping too. :P

  • coming soon - the Blind Date mod (Score:5, Funny)

    by count0 ( 28810 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:11PM (#3567801)
    now that's augmented reality with a market!

    cz
  • That would be the ultimate form of paintball for me. Laser Tag meets Paintball meets Quake III Arena.

    I know I have something witty to say here but I can't stop thinking about live action first person shooter death tournaments!

    Although the picture of that guy with the gun makes me wonder how many people would get shot by cops not knowing the difference.

  • Grand theft what? (Score:3, Funny)

    by 68030 ( 215387 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:13PM (#3567818) Homepage
    Please tell me someone wrote a GTA mod for
    Quake 1 some where way back when.. I want to
    get points for stealing cars in real life.
    • Well, I don't think you could actually steal cars in 'Quake Rally', but I'd settle for driving around with a rocket launcher strapped to the roof.

      "Get off the fscking phone, SUV-driving soccer-mom!" ::boom::

      "Use your turn signal, Mercedes-boy!" ::boom::

  • LAN Partys just got a lot more expensive... (Score:5, Funny)

    by nob ( 244898 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:14PM (#3567828) Homepage
    because now I'm going to have to rent a stadium!
  • This could take personalized models to an all new level. Wonder what happens when they gibb your model (like blow up your corpse).

  • Weird (Score:3, Interesting)

    by quantaman ( 517394 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:14PM (#3567831)
    I know that the division between reality and gaming can be confusing for many people but this is a new extreme. Doesn't anyone else think it would be a little disorienting to see horrifying monsters running around your campus? (not with standing fellow undergrads of course:)
    • Or the wise guy that glosses over a bush so you walk right into it. Or covers up a hole and you fall into the sewer.
    • Talking about a division between reality... Based on the half paragraph of text and three photographs on the web site, I guess they are probably just about done. Better start saving those nickles, it will probably be ready by the fall semester.
    • If people can't separate reality from Quake or other future games, they have a bigger problem than we care to address.
      want to keep an idiot occupied for hours? CLICK HERE!

    • Re:Weird (Score:4, Funny)

      by mgarraha ( 409436 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:27PM (#3567959)
      Horrifying monsters? I'd be plenty worried if I saw Ed Harris in a dark suit following me around campus! Especially if he urged me to get back to work!

  • Campus Security (Score:2, Insightful)

    by hether ( 101201 )
    You'd definitely want to let campus security know before you went out ot play your first game.

    Looks like it wouldn't be that comfortable, and of course you'd look out of place. Otherwise cool. I wonder if the shots they show are real or what they propose it would look like.
  • That doesn't look like much fun really. A better use of such marvelous technology would involve fully animated imagery of that Mexican songstress Shakira, a forty ounce of the funk, and some "self time".

  • Leap of Faith (Score:5, Insightful)

    by prator ( 71051 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:16PM (#3567844)
    That one shot with the bridge is scary. I can't tell if the bridge is really there or not. With sufficiently good graphics, you could easily break a leg/neck.

    -prator

  • Reminds Me of... (Score:3, Informative)

    by Astin ( 177479 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:17PM (#3567847)
    Photoquantigraphic Lightspace Paintball, played by Steve Mann [wearcam.org] and his "cyborgs" at the University of Toronto. Wearcomps and flashguns to paint the Univeristy and the players in their own mediated reality. Fun, fun, fun.

    • Re:Reminds Me of... (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Yet another self propogated Mann-myth, I've never seen this imaginary game actually being played or a video of it (something you'd might expect given the nature of the apparatus used to play).
      Although I do see him mention it often.

  • Always run? (Score:5, Funny)

    by bpfinn ( 557273 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:17PM (#3567850)
    I'd better start training now if I want to win some deathmatches.
    • WHAT? You mean you actually want me to get EXERCISE while I am englazed in a trance of joy playing video games?

      NO THANK YOU.
      • When you're running for your life because your friend has a rocket launcher and you're all out of machine gun ammo, if you can be made to believe sufficiently that you're in peril, you won't even notice the exercise part of it. That's the beauty of it. Ever play paintball? Your lungs become less important and not getting hit with a 125mph paintball becomes paramount. And in the end, it's a great workout. which is a good thing, because it allows you to eat more doritos.

        My concern is that I'd trip or something and land on the computer, or the glasses, and break 'em.

  • Disc Golfers... (Score:5, Funny)

    by ImaLamer ( 260199 ) <john.lamar@g m a i l . com> on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:19PM (#3567874) Homepage Journal
    Hey, watch it about the Disc Golfers!

    Hey at least we can get "Augmented Reality" for about five or ten bucks... depending how much the mushrooms are going.

    This seems to be paying a lot to do the same thing :)
  • Finally an affordable Holodeck setup.

    I want this real bad....
  • Warning: Too many connections in /globallib.php on line 30

    Error connecting to mySQL server...blame the admins!


    Anybody got a mirror?

  • Micro$oft, $cientology and (Score:5, Funny)

    by Glowing Fish ( 155236 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:23PM (#3567903) Homepage

    CmdrTaco certainly does have a knack for attacking all the masive power blocks in our society. When will he stop his suicidal habit of making powerful enemies, such as Microsoft, Scientology and the all powerful Frisbee Golfers, with their hordes of vicious lawyers? If the Frisbee Golfers don't get this article eaten before 5 PM, I will be surprised.

  • ::drool::

    Wow, I almost got arrested for playing real (not augmented reality, without guns of any type) capture the flag the other night. This just multiplies the fun.
  • This guy could be Professor Mann's child :)

    -----
    Can't afford Apple's hardware? How about a raffle ticket? [macraffle.com]

  • What a great way to get some exercise (Score:5, Insightful)

    by jcsehak ( 559709 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:25PM (#3567929) Homepage
    If you wanted to play paintball, but didn't have any friends who did, this would be a great way to get outside and have some fun. It could also take the paintball/lasertag-style game to the next level. Instead of just shooting each other, you could launch a coordinated attack on the horde of monsters at your school. Buffy expansion pak, anyone? I don't play paintball, but I imagine that it's mostly running around and you only shoot a couple of times. This sounds like you could shoot stuff all over the place.

    The obvious problem is looking like a complete idiot in public. But for some of us, that happens anyway, so who cares?

    The obvious useful application for this is the military/police force. I can imagine them setting up common scenarios that soldiers/officers would be required to run through on a regular basis. This would almost be like getting real experience, and it would keep everyone in shape, too. Much better than computer simulations where they sit down, or are confined to a room. I wonder if they plan on making a bundle selling this to various enforcement agencies.
    • Regarding the paintball thing:

      Depends what type of game you're playing. I am an indoor "Arena-ball" player, and I've been known to go through 150 paintballs or so in a 5 minute game. And I'm not even one of the trigger-happy guys!

      Otherwise though, I think your training concept sounds pretty cool.
      • Not shoot a lot in paintball? Only if you're one of the good players. On "Speedball" and "Hyperball" matches though, you just go through a lot of paint no matter how good you are.

        I play about every other month. Most players burn through a lot of balls...probably about a hopper of 200+ per map.

        Besides, I've seen some players with "Gamer Physique" out on the courses, and they generally last 2-3 maps, max. I think this is going to be much better for cops than it will be for gamers. Judging by the lot of people at E3, most gamers can't even stay MOVING for very long, much less attempting to dodge, and pick up the rocket launcher again.
    • "The obvious problem is looking like a complete idiot in public" Problem? Hey, looking like an idiot never was this much fun :D I'd buy it for the cool looks alone :P
    • I don't play paintball, but I imagine that it's mostly running around and you only shoot a couple of times.

      How much paint you use depends greatly on a lot of things. For example, I sometimes play at a course frequented by church groups and father/son beginners. You'll get 20 minute games (with regeneration, so you're never "out" for long) on 2 acre fields with like 60 people. That means lots of targets, so that means lots of shooting. I once played on a real small hyperball field (about two basketball courts in size, with large tubes and such for cover) with 25 people per team. I went through a lot of paint then too. But then again, I've played on large foresty fields with 5-10 players per team, and haven't shot more than a hundred rounds or so in 15 minutes.

      The type of gun you have means a lot too. I recently upgraded to an electronic gun (a Matrix [pbreview.com], in case you wondered) to replace my older semi-auto mechanical Spyder (a decent entry-level gun). The electro shoots like 22 paintballs per second, although I can't shoot that fast (it's semiauto only unless you upgrade the chip). But I can shoot it a lot faster than the Spyder. Much faster. I used to go through about 1000 paintballs per day (that's all day: 9am to close, playing every match), now I can go through more than a case of 2000 easy. Meaning I have to stay mindful of my paint consumption. But I usually play as a "back player" (hang out in the back/middle and longball people running around), so that means more paint. Think one step up from spray-and-pray. :-) But I have a big, heavy, accurate and quiet gun, so that's my lot in life (although the Matrix makes a great hide-and-go-seek gun since it's about the quietest gun there is, so I play that way every fifth time or so).

      Back in the old days of pump guns and single shot pistols with powerlet cartidges, going through more than 50 paintballs was really shooting it up. Now, that's nothing. The hoppers hold 200 rounds, and you see guys carrying 1200 rounds in their pod carriers (six 150 round pods) who are using electronic semiauto guns with 88cu. in. compressed air tanks filled to 4500psi. I always carry at least 800 rounds with me every match, even though I rarely use that much in one go. My wife sometimes runs out, my buddy drops some, etc. Where paintballs are concerned, it's always better to have extra than not enough.

      But, yeah, most people shoot a lot when they play paintball. And the more expensive your gun, the more paint you tend to shoot. BTW, paintball isn't so much running around as it is sprinting a little and crouching a lot.

      -B

      • I don't understand. How do you avoid the "I hit you!" "No, you didn't, that spot was already there!" thing? Do you just shoot people and get the satisfaction when they say ow? Wouldn't they just shoot you back? How does respawning work? I always figured a bunch a people went out and the last person (or last team of people) with no paint on them was the winner.
        • I don't understand. How do you avoid the "I hit you!" "No, you didn't, that spot was already there!" thing? Do you just shoot people and get the satisfaction when they say ow? Wouldn't they just shoot you back? How does respawning work? I always figured a bunch a people went out and the last person (or last team of people) with no paint on them was the winner.

          Well, you assume that every shot means one splatter. My new gun is pretty accurate, and I could maybe hit a paper plate 5 times out of 10 at, say, 40 yards. With no wind. And the first shot I'd have to use to guide the rest in. And I'd stand a good chance of having maybe one in four paintballs being slightly out of round, having a seam stick up, etc. which would make them fly weird. That's accurate in paintball. Rental guns are wildly inaccurate. You probably couldn't hit that paper plate once in 100 shots. So you tend to use a lot of paint just shooting "at" someone.

          Sometimes, you have to pin a couple guys down behind a bunker so a buddy can advance. Here's where speed comes into play: if I can spit out at least 10 balls per second, then figure I can be just as useful in providing covering fire as maybe 5 guys with rentals or slow guns. And you don't always use convering fire -- it's a really good way to get everyone on the other team to shoot at you (so a quiet gun is good). But if there's three or four guys keeping down a teammate who wants to move up, 10 balls/second hitting the board in front of you is enough to make you want to stay down, believe me. :-)

          Paintballs have a very bright, albeit highly soluble, paint. Some paint is thicker than other paint. Some is like Crisco/butter/wax consistency. I use bright pink, waxy paint. It's hard to claim you weren't shot. But it happens. It's called "wiping", and wipers get kicked off (sometimes for the day) if the ref catches them. Wiping is to paintball as a stick in the spokes is to bicycling. It's the #1 no-no.

          Again, here's where fast is good: If you jump up and run and I shoot you once (because I have a slow gun or something), you may or may not know you're hit. Balls bounce off all the time. It has to break on you to count. So you get shot once, maybe have a little splatter, maybe not. But you have to check, and you'd do it when you get to where you were going. If you jump up and I lay into you with a fast stream, you probably get hit 5-10 times (depending on when you said you were out, how far away you were, etc). See, I keep shooting until you yell "out!". After a couple hits, you just know you're hit. One hit, you don't just yell out automatically. Also, it's impossible to wipe off four or five hits. Everyone knows you're hit, so you leave.

          As the day wears on, you get to know who the wipers are. You shoot them more. Everyone does. They know they are cheating, and they know they'll get hit more because people want to make sure. But there's nothing sadistic about "lighting someone up" like that. It's part of the game. Now, if you do it to a guy you know is out, or he's really close, that that's bad form and not nice. Might get you punched, too. I've seen it happen, and it's really unpleasant to watch. Beginners do it a lot. I ususally give them the canned "sportsmanlike conduct" speech, and they usually listen since I'm a pretty big guy (and it's usually a kid who does it).

          People do shoot back when they are hit. I've seen people kinda keep shooting even though they know they're out. It's kind of a judgement call at that point. If you know you got the person out first, by a wide margin -- like they were walking off and shot you -- then you just keep playing. Like when your own team shoots you (again, this is usually from a kid, and usually at the start of the game), you have to decide if you want to get out or not. If it's late in the game and I'm in a weird place (like on th eother team's side; I tend to do flanking stuff a lot and sneak around) and I get shot by my own team, then I call myself out. I figure at that point, they'll have lost a good player and the team's match will suffer so they'll learn to check before shooting.

          A corollary to this is blind-fire. It's where someone holds the the gun up in the air and shoots at stuff they can't see -- while they hide behind a bunker or something. It's a cowardly, dangerous (you never know if someone has their mask off) thing to do, and I usually call the ref if I see it. If I get shot by blind-fire I stay in (since you can't blind-fire legally, any paint launched that way is illegal and therefore doesn't count -- like if someone from another field shot at you) and hunt the person down and shoot them real close if I can. That sounds mean, but there's no other way for them to learn that they could blind someone because of how they break the rules. I nearly always talk to them about blind fire. Again, it's typically a kid with a rental.

          The respawning thing is something you see every once in a while, usually on big fields with a lot of players. It keeps things moving (and it keeps people shooting, which is one reason why you see it more on fields that make you buy the more expensive paint from them instead of bring your own). It can also be a part of the game you're playing. For example, one game I play is called "Attack and Defend". It's very commmon. On the field I play at, the defenders have lots to hide behind and they are at the top of a hill. Their flag is out in the open, though, and easy to get. So you have to aggressively defend it. The attackers have to cover open ground, uphill. So when an attacker gets shot out, they go back to the bottom of the hill, out of site. Every couple minutes, the ref there will send the group who's been shot back into the game. This makes another wave of attackers. Trick here is that defenders are out for good once shot. Did you ever see Starship Troopers? It reminds me of that. Just waves and waves of attackers, relentlessly coming up the hill, through bushes, etc. It's scary. Think of it as The Alamo or something. You'd think being a defender would be nice since you have good cover and you don't have to run around a lot, but you shoot a lot and they just don't stop coming. And the attackers get better after they'v been out a couple times. If you have a neat trick or a hidey hole you're shooting them from, trust me, they'll come back and try to find you. Being an attacker is hard work, and you get shot a lot, but you have fun trying to outwit an entrenched defender.

          But that's one type of game. There are probably hundreds of types of games. Heck, I know of groups of a thousand or more people that get together once a year to recreate battles like D-Day at Omaha Beach. Seriously. They turn old golf carts into "tanks" and such. There are companies that make paint mortars, claymore mines, grenades, etc. Check this out [tippmannordnance.com]. Yeah... Heh heh. That's a little out there for me. But usually, it's standard "capture the flag" stuff. It's basically Quake in real life, which is why I play. It's hellaciously fun, and good exercise.

          As an aside: I once was in a paintball store and a guy came in and asked the fella working there "What kind of paintballs hurt the most?" Everyone in the store wanted to beat him up. The owner told him to get out and never come back. Those are the sort of people I'd like to see never play again. I'm very much into playing fairly and having fun. It's all about fun, not putting some other guy down, or being sadistic. The guys that want hard paintballs are the kinds that tortured animals as kids or hit women. They have personal self-worth issues and need to hurt others to make themselves feel good. They are honorless and I have no respect for them.

          The satisfaction in paintball is not hurting people by shooting them. Paintballs don't hurt all that much anyway. The real satisfaction is trying like mad to run/sneak/hide/shoot/whatever better than the other guy. I like the games where it takes a couple minutes to survey the landscape, get some real teamwork going, figure out a plan, and then execute that plan. It's being out of breath, trying to burrow cover behind a 10" tall log, fire coming in from all sides, adrenaline pumping and then finally figuring a way out. It's running over a hill and finding ten members of the other team in front of you. Run or shoot? Think fast. The fun is taking five minutes to slither through the bushes and sneak up behind the enemy team to get the drop on them. It's making that "I only have 10 paintballs left, so fsck it" mad dash for the flag. It's looking for and finding the sweet cover so you can play like you're a machine gun nest and ambush a couple flag runners or holding an entire half field at bay. It's having one "nemesis" who's been shooting you out all day and finally working your way into a place where you can get him. And it's also just plain fun laying down a suppressing fire by shooting a lot of paint "over that way" where the enemy is running around. :-) If you play with really good players, better than you are, and you can outwit them, then that's the real fun.

          Anyway, sorry for the long-winded response. I haven't been able to play for well over a month, so I was vicariously re-living the moment. You ought to try it some day. Take a look at warpig.com, pbnation.com, or pbreview.com for more info.

          -B

          • Oh crap. I don't have the time or the money to get into something else. But maybe I can give up /., and pawn some stuff--paintball sounds like a hell of a lot of fun.

            So if I wanted to give it a shot, would you recommend I should get my own gun or use a rental? It sounds like rentals are annoyingly inaccurate, which I'm sure would frustrate me, but I don't want to make a large purchase on something I might only use a couple of times. Are there any entry-level guns that are reliable and accurate? Are places likely to rent these guns? Another thing that always prevented me from trying it out (besides not knowing anyone else who wanted to play) is that I figure I would want to use a single-shot gun, because they're cheaper (I assume), but also because I think it would be more fun shooting carefully rather than just spraying paint around; but I imagine it would be really frustrating to go up against guys with 10 shot/sec guns. Do places do things that require all guns to be an equal level, or is it pretty much "use the best gun you can afford?"

            Anyways, thanks for the great treatise. The last time I got such a wonderfully lengthy reply from a simple question was when I asked a fly shop owner about the basics of fly fishing. It turned out he had a masters in entomolgy. He talked my ear off for about half an hour and I was hooked. (Boy, that was the second inadvertant stupid pun in this post) Now I can't wait till the waters clear up...
            • Oh crap. I don't have the time or the money to get into something else. But maybe I can give up /., and pawn some stuff--paintball sounds like a hell of a lot of fun.

              It's very fun, and very addictive. Even if I were predisposed to, I could never do drugs because I can't afford them after paying for paintball stuff. It's athletic crack. But so is golf or tennis for some folks. It takes all kinds. But if you like Quake/FPS games and you play paintball once, then you're in serious trouble.

              So if I wanted to give it a shot, would you recommend I should get my own gun or use a rental? It sounds like rentals are annoyingly inaccurate, which I'm sure would frustrate me, but I don't want to make a large purchase on something I might only use a couple of times. Are there any entry-level guns that are reliable and accurate? Are places likely to rent these guns?

              If you want to try the game, then use a rental the first time or four. They aren't that great, but if you don't like the game they aren't a commitment. If you play at a place that has a lot of rental customers (look for places that advertise at churches, have father/son days, etc.) then you should be fine. The first game is the worst (and most exciting). You have a lot to worry about then, and having a rental gun which can be dropped, mangled, lost, folded, spindled, etc removes a whole set of worries out of your mind and lets you concetrate on the game.

              Many fields have several "classes" of guns that you can rent. Thebottom of th rbarrel are the ones that probably have bent barrels. They cost (new, like if you bought one) about $35. You get what you pay for. If you go with a fraternity or church or your dept at work or whatever and everyone gets one of these, then it's all good fun. Having a "race gun" when everyone else has a crappy rental isn't going to be much fun for you or the guy you shoot. Now, if you go out with agroup and you decide to pay the extra $25 or whatever to upgrade to a better gun, then you're The Man and nobody can give you grief because they are just cheap at that point. So you'll see like three classes of rentals: the normal cheapos, the middle types (which aren't much better than cheapos), and the good ones. They good ones are typically fairly decent guns. They see some wear, but they are well made and can handle it. Look for names like Spyder and Tippman and Pirahna; any of those should be fine. My first marker was a Spyder TL+, which I see as a rental quite often. I had a non-stock barrel, but it was essentialy the same gun as a high-end rental. Oh, pricing. If you go to a full service place that has structures and scenarios and everything, then you likely won't need to bring anything but tennis shoes. You'll pay about $25 for entry and basic rental. Then you might get an all-day air refill for another $5. Then you can rent mask, coveralls, etc for another $30. Paint is about $50 for a case of 2000 of the cheap paint. You'll need 500-1000 the first time (since the hopper on your gun will only hold 200 and you'll have no other way to carry extra paint, you just can't shoot very much more than that). I'd say that for $50 you could have an all-day affair. Way cheaper than skiiing.

              Another thing that always prevented me from trying it out (besides not knowing anyone else who wanted to play) is that I figure I would want to use a single-shot gun, because they're cheaper (I assume), but also because I think it would be more fun shooting carefully rather than just spraying paint around; but I imagine it would be really frustrating to go up against guys with 10 shot/sec guns. Do places do things that require all guns to be an equal level, or is it pretty much "use the best gun you can afford?"

              You hit the nail on the head: you want to go with one or more friends. For some reason, paintball is hardwired into our lizard brains as a communal activity. You'll get out there and want to know where your buddy is. Even if he's shot out and watching you from the sidelines it'll be comforting. And a couple guys working as a group -- even if they know less about what they are doing -- will usually do much better than every man for themself. I guess that's why you see paintball as a teambuilding thing all the time.

              A single-shot is almost unheard of. I can tell that you've shot real guns (or know something about them). You are thinking of paintball as an Olympic sport, where marksmanship counts. That isn't the case, per se. And because most markers have very little recoil (think pellet gun or maybe .22), then single shot vs. semi isn't a very big issue. You'll use a semi, guaranteed. And you'll see a guy running and just pull the trigger until you get him. Remember, the barrel isn't totally smooth, the projectile is (almost) round, and there's no rifling to give a gyroscopic effect to the paintball. You'll get the drop on a guy, line up a shot, and the ball will corkscrew like mad. At that point, he's heard you, so you just keep pulling the trigger. :-)

              You probably won't go up against guys that have guns like mine, or who have a lot of experience. It's not fun for anyone. Fields typically split people up into groups based on what experience they have; the better the gear, typically the more experience the player has. If I show up in the beginner group wearing a jersey with my $1500 gun [27.org], then they'll know something is up and find me a new group. (BTW, the pic at that link was taken when I was with a beginner group that had never played before. But since I wanted to stay with the group I brought -- about 10 people -- then I had to play with the beginners. So I agreed to stay at the back of the field. If you go forward through the series, you can see my buddies coming up to join me, and then me pointing out where to shoot, which spools to move up to, and such.)

              Having said that, you can go spend $150 and then show up with what amounts to a super quality rental. You could spend $400 and show up with a very nice semi auto. You could spend $2000 and show up with a top-end electronic gun. All without every having played. They won't prevent you from playing with the beginner group.

              Anyways, thanks for the great treatise. The last time I got such a wonderfully lengthy reply from a simple question was when I asked a fly shop owner about the basics of fly fishing. It turned out he had a masters in entomolgy. He talked my ear off for about half an hour and I was hooked. (Boy, that was the second inadvertant stupid pun in this post) Now I can't wait till the waters clear up...

              Heh heh.... you're very welcome. Thanks for reading it. I guess I sensed interest or something. It's the same with any passion I suppose. I'm a little older than most players (35) and so I tend to get more esoteric about it. So if anyone asks me about the game and I can tell that they really want to know, I can give them a detailed analysis. And it's a big topic, with a lot of opinion in place of hard fact (accuracy of aftermarket barrels or certain brands of paintballs being a big one).

              Summing up, I'd say that you should find someone who's played for a bit locally. Your locale means a lot to what sort of experience you'll find (Georgia has more woodsy fields than Oakland, and so different types of games). If you can't find a friend who's played, then find one wiling to play. Find 5, actually. Then go to the nearest paintball store, buy a case of paint, and ask the owner where the best field for beginners is. He'll talk your ear off better than any fly fisherman can... :-)

              BTW, pardon my atrocious spelling. My fingers don't seem to work right. I've been finishing a big project at work, and my carpal tunnel to me....

              -B

    • I don't play paintball, but I imagine that it's mostly running around and you only shoot a couple of times.

      Where I come from, we have this thing called Accuracy through Volume. The logic is that if you take ten shots that have a 10% chance of hitting, or if you take those ten shots and then take another 100 that have a 1% chance of hitting, you've essentially doubled your chances. Unless I'm bad at math; a definite possibility. But if you came to the match with 500 paintballs and you leave with 450, chances are you suck at paintball. Either that or you're perfect. Either way, it's more fun to go off the deep end and rain death upon your opponent kamikaze-style than to camp out and snipe at them.
    • I don't play paintball, but I imagine...

      Hey, it's slashdot. Of course these sorts of opinions are valid :)

      But at any rate... paintball games can vary a lot. If you're on offense, and are running the flag, you spend most of your time running like hell, and you don't shoot much.

      When I'm camped out in defense and people are swarming my base, I'll go through 100-200 rounds in a fifteen minute match, and won't have moved at all.
    • you could launch a coordinated attack on the horde of monsters at your school.

      Last guy who tried that was shot and arrested pretty quick.

      http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/05/11/stein ha eusers.funeral/index.html

  • Other articles (Score:5, Informative)

    by Target Drone ( 546651 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:25PM (#3567931)
    Info Satellite [infosatellite.com] has an article [infosatellite.com] with a little more detail. There is also an 8 page PDF [unisa.edu.au] giving complete details.

    The main problems with the system seem to be

    1. The system uses GPS which is not quite accurate enough for this type of application
    2. The GPS is only updated once per second, where as the game is updated at 30 frames per second.
    3. Anyone that sees you will think your crazy.

    • Re:Other articles (Score:3, Informative)

      by dew ( 3680 )
      Differential GPS can give you the precision you need, at the time resolution you need. Internal gyroscopes (yes, they can be made small) can integrate "last know good" positions over time periods where GPS is unavailable (tree cover, ducking in a hole, tunnels) and give you lots

      As for the people thinking you're crazy bit...well...hm. Give them a helmet too, then they'll see what all the fun is about and never take it off. =)
    • The GPS is only updated once per second, where as the game is updated at 30 frames per second.

      Wait - you mean real life has lag too? Argh! And I was getting used to this real-time feedback whenever I shut down Quakeworld...

  • UserFriendly (Score:4, Funny)

    by Amazing Quantum Man ( 458715 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:25PM (#3567932) Homepage
    Has anyone told Stef about this yet?
  • Does anyone remember de gargoyls from snowcrash?
    i'd give a lot to have something like that, enhanced vision with added tags to identify items around you!
  • Warning: Too many connections in /globallib.php on line 30
    Error connecting to mySQL server...blame the admins!

    Poor admins! :)
  • I think it's less likely that people will run around campus with these things on and more likely that laser tag arenas will adopt this (since the gear looks roughly similar and will add a new dimension to gameplay.
  • ...because without the ability to bunny-hop constantly, I will get 0wn3d. I knew that I should have learned how to aim better...

  • OMFG (Score:1, Troll)

    by Wind_Walker ( 83965 )
    Can anybody say "Photoshop"? Jesus, I've always heard people complaining about how the Slashdot editors don't verify their stories, but at least look at the linked images, for Christ's sake!
  • Just stamp "I'm a huge dork" on your head and save some serious cash.

    Really the cops wont shoot you. People who hate geeks will kick your butt and take away your toys.

    This is in a word - lame.

    .
  • The last picture on the page was obviously directly copied from George Lucas' film archive. That was the early Boba Fett prototype when Lucas was on a budget.

  • hello, World of Darkness (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Bogatyr ( 69476 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:33PM (#3568005) Homepage
    Given the popularity of Vampire: the Masquerade and similar games gone live-action on nearby campuses, I can envision these adapted to enhance reality for less aggressive, slower-twitch games. And once people are used to walking around campus in a cape as a flag to other players they're someone to talk to in character, a headset kind of thing isn't any bother. It'd be useful for flagging the invisible players instead of having them have to walk around with their arms crossed over their chest and saying "You can't see me!", thereby breaking the whole mood/suspension of disbelief thing.... d
  • I would love to have a get-up like this. Maybe wait till it doesn't look so stupid, but I'd definitely like to get one.

    Currently, at my LAN parties we sit on our asses all night and consume a weeks worth of calories in soda, chips and pizza. It would be awsome to turn that into a physically demanding sport where I can burn off some calories and get my fat ass into shape.

    Nothing burns calories like a real-world deathmatch!

  • I would really like to see some virtual reality gear become commercialized bastardized and available at my local http://www.thinkgeek.com . They had lame 640x480 headsets back in the descent/doom days with (bad)head tracking for around 700$. I know I'd pay the same for something based on todays technology that looked nice and worked well. Anybody else think so or is VR just dead?

    jeremy
    • Had it been 640x480, it would have been worthwhile. Unfortunately, most of the headsets were in the low 200x300 range, often much less. The sheer technical difficulty of getting an LCD that small to give a reasonable resolution is a big barrier to doing neat things with VR headsets.

      Not a dead technology, but an expensive and slow-growing one.

    • Re:Virtual Reality (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Bullschmidt ( 69408 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @03:44PM (#3568077)
      Having done research with HMD's (Head mounted displays), I am pretty sure they never had 640x480 headsets for $700. The problem is that the optics and screens are super expensive, if you want them to be wearable for any reasonable amount of time. A couple of problems: Even if they could manufacture a really nice high quality HMD for $700, there STILL isn't a large consumer market for it. They would need to build something that wows people for $200, which just isn't possible with current display technologies. The other problem is field of view. Most modern consumer headsets have pretty limited FOV. Increase the FOV, and you effectively blur out the image. Makes text tough. I wouldn't wait for any cheap HMDs.

      As for your question, VR as popularized by fiction, is a LONG way off. I don't think it was ever really alive. The problem is just that there are too many parts missing, too expensive, or just not there yet (good quality feedback, sourceless tracking) for anything more than expensive research projects.

      I think maybe once we figure out some sort of brain-computer interface, we may see some real consumer VR. But I doubt much before that.
      • "Fied of vision"

        Look at your computer right now. Think about when you play FPS games like RtCW. You hear footsteps but you can't see anyone on screen, you turn and still can't see anyone. Also quality wouldn't need to be that good except you need to be able to see something in front of you without hitting it.

    • My two cents... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by cr0sh ( 43134 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @04:32PM (#3568397) Homepage
      Right now, the main research is focused on AR - augmented reality, of which the "research" mentioned in this /. article is part of.

      As far as "virtual reality" is concerned, number one, it isn't called VR anymore - it is called "virtual environments" (and I even think use of that term is being "discouraged"), or "VE".

      Basically, most researchers are having a hard time getting funding for anything with the word "virtual" in it, as it is seen (by potential investors) as a money hole.

      It doesn't look like there are going to be any "breakthroughs" soon - you probably aren't going to go out and buy an HMD at Fry's within the next 5 years. It is strange, but it is mainly because of "no market". What is strange is that there is a HUGE market - FPS players. However, FPS players won't be satisfied with just an HMD, they will want at minimum full tracking of head and "gun" position. I think if a home version of Q3A coupled with the HMD, "wand", and tracking system of a Virtuality 2000 came on the market cheap enough, people would flock in droves to it, but it won't happen, because the HMD and tracking isn't cheap.

      It is crazy, because the tracking should be cheap - there have been (and still are) a few projects on the net to homebrew magnetic trackers, many with enough details to replicate them yourself. Sourceless head trackers are also fairly cheap (though you can't use them with a mag tracker). HMD's are hard to homebrew, but it has been done. Parts are cheap enough, though plans are scarce. I have a ton of the plans from the early 90's, but no rights to reproduce them. Some are available online, though.

      If you are real lucky, you might manage to scrounge a "pro-level" HMD off of ebay (there is pro level VR gear on ebay - stuff that used to go for thousands, now goes cheap - I have seen polhemus mag trackers on ebay, and last year I managed to "snag" a General Realities CyberEye CE-200M HMD with head tracker CHEAP).

      Most of what is on Ebay is the old stuff, but it can be had fairly cheap, too - old Victormaxx HMDs and Forte VFX-1s go fairly cheap. Powergloves can be found as well, though they are starting to get real scarce.

      Your best bet, if you really want to see this personally, is to build it - that is really the only way you or I will get to use this kind of stuff, and it is likely that the homebrew people will be the ones to really create the apps...

  • Getting hit (Score:2, Insightful)

    by The Magic Yak ( 559288 )
    I have a few issues with this. I wouldn't care what other people thought I looked like but I would care about being hit by a car or jumping into someone. Are there alternative to differentiate between humans walking around or do the monsters pass through them? Is there anyway to "recognize" a moving object to warn the user not get "hit" by it? I see enough people have trouble walking without the added distraction of playing a game at the same time. For many people, I think mixing reality with electronics is a recipe for distaster (ie: cellphone and accidents).

  • website /.ed (Score:1, Redundant)

    by the_2nd_coming ( 444906 )

    Warning: Too many connections in /globallib.php on line 30
    Error connecting to mySQL server...blame the admins!

    more like the /. editors :-)
  • A while back, Slashdot ran a story comparing some random wireless networking device or other to the "Navi" computers from Serial Experiments Lain. Yet those who watched the series might find something even more familiar in this "Augmented Reality Quake" -- a combat game superimposed upon reality.

    In Lain, the conspiratorial organization known as the Knights of the Eastern Calculus attempts to break down the boundaries between the real world and the "wired", or online world. One of their mechanisms for doing so is a game called "PHANTOMa", an augmented-reality role-playing game. As it happens, the particular technologies the Knights use to "augment reality" have some unfortunate psychological side effects for the players.

    Augmented reality is an interesting idea, but I really have to wonder whether we really need or want any more mediation in experience than we already get.

  • imagine construction site where a electrical tech is installing some wire and with the goggles sees a overlay of blueprints for pipes or other wires and such.

    Or Helping a person walk through his new house before the walls are finished.

    Even Firefighters with a systemlike that overlaying blueprints of a apartment complex so when they are walking through the smoke they could see general things like walls.

    Oh the fun that can be done with this.

    Well besides video games.
  • Hippies and drunks have been running around shooting at things that aren't there for years now..
  • I would definately buy it, it would be so fricken cool. On the other hand, could you imagine if this thing got a virus:

    "Holy shit what the hell is- ACK!!!!!!!!!!!!"
  • Rocket jumping would suck, and youed get tired, but its would be a good way to work of the pounds running around shooting your freinds.....
  • Noclip doesn't work! I thought this thing would let me walk through walls... I wonder if God mode works... I could take on the entire police department!

    ---

    Next at eleven: Psychopath challenges entire police department to gunfight. Psychopath dies.
  • Hey, this sounds like a really expensive way to play a game similar to paintball, but not nearly as fun. Why not just play paintball instead? Or if you want to go the more 80s route, you could play Lazertag instead.
  • Ok, how fucking nerdy is this? Hey, the techs nice, but I wouldn't want to be caught dead wearing it just as I wouldn't want to be caught dead wearing a pretty pink ballgown.

    Someone start up a donation jar to get these nerds laid. Some tits and pussy action till fix those nerdy fuckers right up and make men out of them.

    • I know the guy who does this, and he probably gets laid a hell of a lot more often than you do. It's not like this is something he does in his free time - it's a job.

      Said guy was actually proposing doing a workshop at Linuxconf on how to wear deoderant and talk to girls. I'll tell you when he's running it, so you can apply.

      Discussion still reigns as to whether he wears the AR gear while he does the deed. I'm sure he's tried it once - but then, who wouldn't?

      • "I know the guy who does this, and he probably gets laid a hell of a lot more often than you do."

        Sex with men and barnyard animals doesn't count.

  • Registration required (Score:3, Informative)

    by Animats ( 122034 ) on Wednesday May 22, 2002 @04:46PM (#3568511) Homepage
    The really hard part is getting the virtual and real worlds to register exactly. GPS isn't that good. Differential GPS is sometimes that good, under optimal conditions, with no obstructions, maybe. But it's not fast enough to track fast movements. Inertial systems corrected with GPS can help, but they're not that good either. Camera-based systems potentially might work, but suffer from ambiguities. A full inertial/differential GPS/video matching system is a lot to lug around.

    The motion capture people have been struggling with this for years. Motion capture in big spaces is still a problem.

  • When you die, where do you re-spawn?
    • Way I'd do it: When a user dies, require him to walk back to a real-world location indicated by AR beacons. Upon reaching this point, the player would be "reintegrated" into the game world, but not until then.
  • How does it handle rocket jumping?
  • Check out Matt Groves' [servicentric.com] visionary ideas for augmented reality in the future, including Virtual Gifts, personalized street signs, new sporting events, and my favorite, getting attacked by the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man as you're heading home from work.

    Vernor Vinge's Hugo-nominated short story, Fast Times at Fairmont High, shows a our society becoming dominated by AR, 25 years in the future. People change their clothes, housing, decor just by updating the shared database. Kids even cover up their zits with AR rather than Clearasil. There are no more computer monitors because you can conjure up a virtual monitor and attach it to any surface or just let it hang in mid-air. It's an astonishing technology in Vinge's hands. (...more on the story's use of AR [transhumanism.com])

    Then take a look at some current work in the field [rit.edu], with videos showing a small CG clock tower superimposed on a piece of cardboard being waved around. It jitters a little but overall it looks pretty good.

  • What's better than virtual reality?

    ** REAL Virtuality!!

    (** Just in case noone has ever coined that expression first, I did it first and I'm copyrighting or trademarking or patenting it or something...)

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