Halo 2 Goes Gold 359
schmiddy writes "This just in -- Halo 2 has officially gone gold as of today. Bungie has confirmed the story with an announcement on their front page. Trailers and such available here ."
You know you've landed gear-up when it takes full power to taxi.
H.L. 2 (Score:2, Funny)
Better update my mtach.com profile (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Better update my mtach.com profile (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Better update my mtach.com profile (Score:5, Interesting)
Christmas two years ago, I gave his son a copy of Halo 1 (after checking with my friend to see if he was okay with his son playing a FPS). He (his son) was excited as hell.
After New Years, they invited my SO & myself over to their house for dinner. We show up and find my friend and his son in the living room in front of the big screen, engaged in a Halo CTF match.
Imagine, seeing a middle aged guy who had shown absolutely zero interest in gaming before playing with his 12-year-old son. And you really couldn't tell who was more excited. Don't get me wrong.
Before that, he would have just shrugged and muttered something about kids, violence and video games had he been approached by his son about playing a multiplayer game. He really had absolutely no interest in games whatsoever. But for some reason, he found Halo compelling enough to try it out.
Long story short, the guys (me & him & his son) ended up playing Halo that night while the girls (his wife, my girlfriend and my friend's daughter) laughed at us.
I usually don't pay too much attention to "the mainstream". But that's exactly what I like about Halo - diversity. It's just a fun game. It's still, even after all this time, fun to pick up the controllers, kick back and play (and this isn't just about replay value; it's about being able to just sit down and have fun with your friends).
Re:Better update my mtach.com profile (Score:5, Funny)
Whoa, could you slow down a bit? I think that you just lost most of us.
XBConnect and Aquaduct for Multiplayer (Score:5, Informative)
I completely agree with you. I still find myself playing co-op missions or against each other in TS or CTF. Its one of those games that just rocks in every aspect and never gets old, whether you're playing by yourself or against people.
I'm sure just about everyone on slashdot knows and agrees with this, but I would highly recommend XBConnect [xbconnect.com] to everyone who owns an XBox and PC (Aquaduct [postpose.com] for Mac users). It tricks your Xbox into thinking players around the world are on your LAN so you can play against them in halo system link mode (or a range of other games). Its similar to XBox Live but free.
Re:XBConnect and Aquaduct for Multiplayer (Score:5, Informative)
XLink is available for Windows, Linux on 10/16 and Mac OSX shortly thereafter.
XLink also works with PS2 and GameCube games that support LAN play. Read more about that at my tech blog [sagetechnology.com].
Re:Better update my mtach.com profile (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Better update my mtach.com profile (Score:3, Funny)
Well it ended up being a shot every 10 or so the first hour... every 5 or so the second and then we started to get too drunk to play and he went to bed and I came here. This is getting modded Offtopic isn't it?
Anyway, it's nice to be able to sit down and just play and
Uh-huh (Score:5, Funny)
GF, eh? I suppose you have a copy of Duke Nukem Forever as well?
Re:Uh-huh (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Uh-huh (Score:4, Funny)
Just for XBOX! (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:2)
How's this for a troll?
How can you be a UT2K4 fan and give a crap about Halo 2? :-)
UT2K4 4-EVER!!!!1!
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:3, Insightful)
Think about that. Bungie weren't far off releasing Halo for PC when M$ bought them. We then had to wait 18 months for the XBox port, and another 24 months for the more-or-less identical PC version.
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:5, Insightful)
Please point me to where I can get one of those setups for $149, or $100 used.
Hell, for the price of just the FX6800 I can get *3* X-Boxes and games and plug them in around the house for network head-2-head play!
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:2)
Hell, for the price of just the FX6800 I can get *3* X-Boxes and games and plug them in around the house for network head-2-head play!
The difference is that I already have a PC. The marginal cost between an office-use PC and a PC that can play games from six months ago is $200-$300. The marginal cost between an office-use PC and a PC that can play games from three years ago is $0.
If, like me, you're one of those people who doe
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:2)
Now, you might be thinking that you were going to upgrade anyway, and that's a point. But unless by "waiting for games" you mean "waiting 5 years for games," you're not going to beat the console upgrade c
Consoles are like wine... (Score:3, Interesting)
Even if it's 3 year old underspec'ed piece of shit, talented devs now know the platform so well they structure the game engine around it and manage to squeeze every bit of perfomance out of it (without worrying about compatibility).
With PCs you gotta aim at the average PC specs, cause there is no incentive coding features that only a minority are gonna enjoy now (the only benefit you get from wasting $2000 on a top of the line PC is a slightly higher framerate and highe
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:2)
Which 3 Though? (The X-Box Game Libary) (Score:2, Insightful)
Copying an old post I made elsewhere on this topic, here was a list of "hot games" for the beginning of Sept 8, 2004:
-------
Here is what they claim is hot for XBox:
- ESPN NFL 2K5
- Madden NFL 2005
- MLB SlugFest: Loaded
- NCAA Football 2005
- NASCAR 2005
- Rainbow Six 3: Black Arrow
- Sudeki
- Spider-Man 2
Here is what they claim is hot on PS2:
- Dog's Life
- Gho
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Just for XBOX! (Score:2)
I run my computer at > 1024x768 res and very, very few televisions can handle this.
If you want to restrict yourself to 800x600 and below, then go ahead and hook your computer up to your TV. Yes, SOME of them can do 1280x800 and the like, but those are damned expensive and most people don't have them laying around.
-Charles
This just in (Score:4, Funny)
In a related story... (Score:5, Funny)
"Do you know what it's like to run down a 12 year old and shoot him in the back, Mr. President? I do!"
Slashdot is not Wired (Score:2, Insightful)
Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console games) (Score:4, Interesting)
From the first day, I've been given a horrible impression by all modern consoles. PS2, GC, and XBox. My issues is with their controller setups. I absolutely despise the concept of dual joystick and I think the XBox controllers are the worst yet. Many people would surely agree with me that they're oversized and poorly laid out. There are of course third party replacements.
This leads me to a conclusion that PC gaming is just "better" from a usability standpoint. In a PC FPS I get freelook with the mouse, and 5 individual buttons to map (at least on my mouse). On the left, I get movement and strafe as well as any other function I want to bind near those keys. The classic "Quake" layout. And I can change this layout at will. It is far more powerful and far more natural.
Beyond that, PC games have readily available multiplayer over the internet; the apex of multiplayer gaming. Console games are only just now getting this, and some of them are even subscription only.
In short, if I were to purchase Halo, I wouldn't touch the console. I'd get it for the PC. It's just a superior gaming experience. I don't see how the negligible (to me) convenience of plugging in a console and playing the game could at all be anywhere near the gaming experience you get on a PC with its infinitely customizable interface.
In short, if Halo 2 is available for PC (and Linux in my case), I would consider it. But as long as any game remains locked into a console with what is IMHO an inferior interface it won't be worth my time and money.
Tell me, anyone, what is the lure of console games? Is it merely the plug it in and go aspect? Why settle for an inferior user interface? Or am I missing something important here regarding the design of modern contollers? I did like the N64 controller as well as controllers like the Gravis Gamepad Pro. But dual-joystick just isn't a substitute for a mouse and keyboard for me.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:5, Insightful)
1) Not having to wonder if you system can handle said game...it just works
2) Not having to upgrade your system to play said game...it just works
3) Not having to know your system inside and out.
It's gaming for the masses.
Controllers, I love the Xbox and GC controllers (PS2 can suck it) because of the placement of the dual analogs. Your argument "freelook with the mouse" is done with one analog, and the other is movement and strafe, just like any PC setup. Besides that, many games offer custom controller setups (Halo did) if you don't like the default.
The original Xbox controllers were big, they were big enough to be comfortable like a pillow in your hands after a few hours of gaming. Initially I thought they sucked as well, until I used one for a while and realized how well it was layed out.
It's hot in here..I forgot where I was going with this (if anywhere)
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:3, Informative)
Using your right thumb to freelook
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
(And this point applies even more so to connection, CPU,
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
You forgot one... (Score:2)
Cost to upgrade your PC to play latest iteration of Doom: ~$700
I just spent $500 on upgrades on my PC, and Doom 3 still runs horribly at 800x600... sigh.
Re:You forgot one... (Score:2)
A 9800 Pro will run it nicely at 1024x768 and can be had for less than $200. A decent Athlon XP and mobo for around $120 together (maybe less, I haven't priced them lately). That's $320 and will kick ass at 800x600...I use a very similar system and play at 1024x768 with everything on except for the completely uncompressed texture mode and it plays like a dream.
Also (Score:2)
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2, Insightful)
This makes it easy for someone who hasn't played to just jump right in. The draw back is poor aim.
Other plusses for consoles:
-cheap hardware, don't h
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
But the beauty of it is if you find such a setup unusable, you can use any controller in a PC. Even an XBox controller with a suitable adapter.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2, Interesting)
Um, have you seen an Xbox controller since the controller 'S' was released? Sure the first one was like holding a pumkpin, but the controller S is in no way too big. Secondly people play console games for several reasons. You don't have to upgrade consantly, some people actually like controllers better, you're not sitting in front of a computer, you can sit on the couch, it's more social and mutliplayer friendly, it's cheaper, games take better advantage of the hardware (for the most part), there aren't har
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
To put it bluntly, I'd say that the cost for decent gameplay is the same for consoles and the pc...the only real diffence (appart from how you spend the money) is
Now, I do have to say that consoles are getting the
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
I'd just like to add one more reason PC games are superior: graphics. 1024x768 @ 76Hz on a 20 inch monitor beats the pants off of a (non-high definition) TV any day. That makes me wonder - anyone know if the current consoles support HTDV?
I swear, if I stare at a console game for longer than 15 minutes, my eyes start watering from the low refresh rate...
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
So I guess you never watch more than 15 minutes of TV either?
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
How can you sit there commenting on PCs vs Consoles when you don't even know one of the main features of a console that was released years ago (XBox)?
"if I stare at a console game for longer than 15 minutes, my eyes start watering from the low refresh rate..."
Do your eyes water when you watch TV too? Or do you sit 1 foot from the screen when you're playing console games?
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:3, Insightful)
There's a major difference. When watching TV, one focuses on the picture as a whole and every frame is not important. If I blink for an extra sec or rub my eyes, I don't miss anything.
In a game, one has to pay close attention to small subsections of the screen, focusing on individual sprites which may not be bigger than a few pixels if the object is far away. Blinking at the wrong moment or for a slightly extended period can be fatal
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
For me, I prefer a console because it isn't a PC! PC's are incredibly expensive in comparison, and they're a constant battle with keeping up as they evolve so quickly. No thanks! More importantly though, a console is more sociable and fits in with life better. It sits unobtrusively in the living room (where there's no way in he
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
The Lure of paying $150 for a console, instead of upgrading your $2000 desktop machine with a $300 video card and joystick (if you're so inclined, which apparently you're not. I agree with you on this).
Lure Theory 2:
Exclusivity of titles - LOTS of people bought an X-Box JUST to play Halo. Just because it wasn't available on any other platform for the first year. Certainly, this is an artificial benefit, constructed by the gaming industry. But this factor exists, nonetheless.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
The first reason is that it's just a pain to play games on consoles. I agree that the mouse + WASD is the best way to play first person shooters, but honestly the Halo controls are actually very good. But the endless driver updates, game patches, getting new hardware, etc. is just something I don't really want to be bothered by. I used to think all that "tweaking" was fun, and I know a lot of people
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
s/The first reason is that it's just a pain to play games on consoles./The first reason is that it's just a pain to play games on a PC./;
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
volume.
people who play a lot of games get consoles. I don't understand it myself, but some people will buy or rent a game a week or every two weeks. If you go through that many games you really have to go the console route. You save money and headaches in the long run.
As for me, I play a very few games. I'm very picky. So, I stay with the PC.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Volume of new games? Now you've got an argument. But we're dealing with a lock-in concept. You HAVE to buy a Gamecube to play SSBM. Period. The user doesn't have a choice. If Nintendo game the user a choice, their sales figures would be vastly different.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
And I don't even have a console...it's just too expensive and consoles don't have 3d modeling suites (or run Maple, for that matter
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Are you off your rocker? Dual joysticks are great. You have 360 degrees of analog input without rasing your thumb. The modern game pad i
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
As for the lure of console games: When I play a PC game, I have to wonder "am I playing the game that I paid money for, or a buggy example thereof"?
By and by, you are missing one other very im
The couch factor (Score:2)
Several other people have mentioned price, exclusive titles, etc. But I still think the main lure of consoles is the 'couch' factor. I've had great times with friends playing console games, competing with each other in GT:3 or playing co-operative games. A party I was at recently featured a hacked XBox with a bunch of emulators (and ROMs), plus four or five XBox games on the hard drive. We had fun all night passing the controllers around, trying to
Re:The couch factor (Score:2)
Identical to the real thing.
PCs are fully capable of this couch factor market.
Re:The couch factor (Score:2)
I don't want to spend 10 hours setting up my PC to emulate Super Smash Bros (not even a current-gen game!), going to find N64-to-USB controller adaptors, certainly not in even store on the block, hooking up your computer to the TV, having to MOVE your computer into the living room and have it stick out like a sore thumb atop your nice entertainment center, having to slide your 200lb TV around to get at the s-video port, having to buy a video card with s-video o
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:5, Interesting)
"Give us better weapons!"
"No."
"But the game won't be fun unless you do!"
You know, power isn't everything. Sometimes part of the fun is not being godlike. In PC FPS games, you're pretty much guaranteed to be able to snipe people, instantly, with a machine gun, from two hundred yards away. And you know, I don't care. It's not interesting.
In Halo, it's a lot tougher. "Fire for effect" becomes a reality. Sometimes you're not really trying to hit anything, because you can't, you're too far away - you're just trying to keep their heads down.
To me, a game isn't necessarily fun just because I can kill things more easily. It's fun because of the challenge. It's fun because of the story, or the coolness. I'm told they jacked up the difficulty when they moved Halo to the PC - is it more fun now? I mean, sure, you're more powerful. No argument. So are they. So why is it now "more fun"?
I'd agree that there's a level of frustration when you just can't make the controls do what you want. But I didn't encounter that in Halo. You can snipe easily, if you have a sniper weapon. You can aim if you put a little time and work into it. It's far above the frustration point - so what's the issue?
Compare Starcraft and Total Annihilation. In almost every way, Total Annihilation's interface was far superior. You could select an unlimited number of units. You could queue up any commands, up to and including construction commands (yes, that's right - thirty seconds of clicking and you've got fifteen minutes of construction set up.) Does this mean TA is a better game?
No, of course not.
A game is a good game if people enjoy it. That is necessary and sufficient. Deer Hunter is a good game - for its target audience, it fills the exact need. Halo is a good game.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
I went to a xbox party where even the noobs were sniping with the pistol when targets were so far away they were just pixels.
Halo is just as susceptible to bad physics as any other game. You want realism? Try Doom 3!
Just kidding. Games aren't realistic, and Halo less than most.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Also, keep in mind that "so far away they were just pixels" isn't all that far away at 640x480.
I'm not particularly going for realism, I suppose - just balance. When any gun can snipe, that just sucks. Oddly, the pistol in Halo is an extremely powerful and accurate single-s
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:3, Insightful)
Seriously, since when did "sniping" mean "stopping in the middle of battle and firing off a shot in half a second"? You can snipe someone in five or six seconds, if they're not moving all that fast - three seconds or so if they're not moving at all. Even that is horribly unrealistic compared to reality, but, hey.
If they're dodging, of course, you have basically no chance of sniping them unless you get really lucky. Which is how it should be.
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:3, Insightful)
On the PC I played a lot of FPS, and a few RTS. I didn't like anything else. I'd sit there with headphones on, staring at the screen, and not talking to anyone.
On a console I play a lot of other types of games- platformers, 3rd person shooters (different beast than an FPS) sports, driving, flying, etc.
Try playing Burnout 3 on a PC. First of all- it doesn't exist. Secondly, driving games such big time on a PC, unless you buy a wheel. I had a racing wheel, and I still didn't really li
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
Sorry, where were the triggers on your mouse again?
I have an xbox (modded, 40+ games on a 250GB drive ready to go instantly). Hook it up to a projector and we have 4-player action straight away for Halo, Unreal, FIFA, NBA, NHL, etc.
Don't get me wrong, I like FPS' with a mouse/kb combo, but console FPS games are adapted to require less accuracy and they're still very effective.
I've never had an Xbox game complain about my computer being out of memory, not having the required video card,
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
With a single console, you're locked into a very small set of game availability. Out of 200 titles on one console, how many are actually good? A few dozen? Most console gamers buy multiple consoles. In general, "good" games are spread across too many. Need PS for FF series, need Nintendo for, well, Nintendo games (Mario, Zelda, Metroid, etc), need XBox for Halo. I'm sure you can think of m
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
According to this: http://msxbox-world.com/xbox/games/index/ [msxbox-world.com] the Xbox has 750. (I thought it was more like 500, but who knows)
Playstation 2 has at LEAST that number- probably about double.
The Gamecube has at least 300 games.
Your comment stating that PC gaming was vastly cheaper than console gaming is highly debatable.
I probably have spent the same amount of money on console gaming in the last 2 years, as I did on PC gaming in the previous 2 years.
The only difference i
Re:Why I dislike Halo (and all modern console game (Score:2)
I love bees... (Score:5, Informative)
And there's a whole bunch of .wavs on the site if you go digging.
-T
...not offtopic (Score:5, Informative)
Latest development has been that a set of coordinates for payphones and times were decoded from the site, and people have been going to those payphones, picking them up when they ring, and speaking to "the operator".
Neat, kinda spooky, and coming to a head with the release today.
-T
"going gold"? (Score:3, Informative)
Doh! (Score:3, Funny)
Feel The Burn (Score:2, Funny)
Carpal Tunnel here I come!
Real Ultimate Power?!?! (Score:5, Funny)
going 130 miles per hour through a hospital zone,
being chased by helicopters and ninjas
And, the ninjas are all on fire, too."
--Jason Jones
Bungie Studios
for more sweet ninja action, go for www.realultimate power.net
Weekly update video torrent (Score:3, Informative)
Halo Haiku! (Score:5, Funny)
Where did that grenade come from?
Red team-flag returned!
Most interesting to me (Score:2)
What is the deal (Score:4, Funny)
In addition, during this file transfer, Gotham Racing will not work. And everything else has ground to a halt. Even Tony Hawk Underground is straining to keep up as I type this.
I won't bore you with the laundry list of other problems that I've encountered while working on various XBoxes, but suffice it to say there have been many, not the least of which is I've never seen a XBox that has run faster than its Wintel counterpart, despite the XBox's faster chip architecture. My 486/66 with 8 megs of ram runs faster than this 300 mhz machine at times. From a productivity standpoint, I don't get how people can claim that the XBox is a superior machine.
XBox addicts, flame me if you'd like, but I'd rather hear some intelligent reasons why anyone would choose to use a XBox over other faster, cheaper, more stable systems.
Re:What is the deal (Score:2)
Also, nobody would claim the XBox is a superior machine from a productivity standpoint, because nobody uses it for productivity. It's for games. Games that are not about file transfers.
And frankly, I hope we both get modded off-topic. No XBox zealots have even posted on the thread yet...
Re:What is the deal (Score:3, Funny)
Re:What is the deal (Score:2)
Re:What is the deal (Score:3, Funny)
Dang. Misread the headline. (Score:2, Funny)
There for a moment, I'd read the headline as Half-life 2 goes gold, got excited, and then wondered what Bungie or Microsoft had to do with it. Oh well.
/Still waiting for Duke Nukem...
dammit (Score:2, Funny)
yes, you read that correctly, i'm a disgrace to all slashdotters
Blow me away (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Newsworthy, yes; Discussion needed? hmm . . . (Score:5, Funny)
So we can all argue about why it's being released on XBox, but not PC, extoll how much better it will be than D3, complain about the code not being OSS, point out miniscule contradictions in the screenshots, post mirrors, make jokes, argue about why it's being released on XBox, but not PC, extoll how much better it will be than D3, complain about the code not being OSS, point out miniscule contradictions in the screenshots, post mirrors, make jokes, argue about why it's being released on XBox, but not PC, extoll how much better it will be than D3, complain about the code not being OSS, point out miniscule contradictions in the screenshots, post mirrors, make jokes, bitch about dups, get off into some tangent about video cards, and make jokes.
You're new here, aren't you?
Re:Newsworthy, yes; Discussion needed? hmm . . . (Score:2)
then why is it on /.?
So we can all argue about why it's being released on XBox, but not PC, extoll how much better it will be than D3, complain about the code not being OSS, point out miniscule contradictions in the screenshots, post mirrors, make jokes, argue about why it's being released on XBox, but not PC, extoll how much better it will be than D3, complain abou
Re:Newsworthy, yes; Discussion needed? hmm . . . (Score:2)
Re:Newsworthy, yes; Discussion needed? hmm . . . (Score:2)
halo 2 goes gold where's the pc port, dudes?! x- box sux, l o l!
Re:Newsworthy, yes; Discussion needed? hmm . . . (Score:4, Insightful)
Because any time you see ANYTHING about Halo, it ends up in a 'This was a Mac game first' (Have you SEEN the original game, before it was ported to the Xbox? What a steaming pile THAT was...)
After the Mac people get involved, you've got the PC people, who will tell you how crappy the game is on the Xbox. It's better on a PC. Of course, it really isn't that good anyway, but the Xbox controller sucks compared to a keyboard and mouse. You should only play FPS on a PC.
Late in the game, the RPG fans will step in- they'll just tell you how crappy FPSs are. And how the levels are sooo repetitive. It's a brainless game, without any real depth.
Even with the detractors, the game still chugs on. This will be a huge seller. But I will NOT say that anyone will be proven wrong. The detractors will still have their opinions, and that won't change.
But when you give something this much attention, we start to wonder why you hate it so much...
Re:PC version (Score:2)
Re:PC version (Score:2)
But besides that, I will not be buying a console system anytime soon, especially an XBox. I like my PC for gaming and eventually I think a dual G5 would be a great gaming system as well. I just do not plan on buying a dual G5 for a while. In the meantime my PC will have to do.
Re:Missing feature? (Score:2)
Re:Hmm (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Halo Stolen from the PC (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Halo Stolen from the PC (Score:3, Informative)
Re:BLAH (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Halo 2, not Tribes 3? (Score:2)