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XBox (Games)

Insightfully Critical Fan Review of Halo 2 57

Posted by Zonk from the jawwing-about-bungie's-baby dept.
Anonymous the Cowardly Lion writes "While browsing the tome of data that is the online-Halo-community I came across 7hr33.org, a group apparently known for their pioneering work in the Tricks scene (contemporaries of the infamous Warthog Jump). What caught my eye was their critique of Halo 2 from December 2004: The Page of Woah|Woe. It's a little too in-depth for the casual player at first, but by the final third it really encapsulates the reactions of core players to the sequel." From the article: "The assessment is in: Halo 2 is... well, different. And I don't mean that in an entirely negative fashion. A lot of the changes are for the better, and we should certainly hope so. Online play, dual-wielding, boarding, the energy sword, stunning new vistas, and a compelling story arch... in many ways, H2 is a phenomenal game. There isn't another like it."
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Insightfully Critical Fan Review of Halo 2 More

Insightfully Critical Fan Review of Halo 2

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  • Games (Score:4, Funny)

    by MyLongNickName ( 822545 ) on Friday February 04, 2005 @11:56AM (#11573353) Journal
    Reviews of reviews of games? Even I don't have this much time on my hands!

    Now, back to my Dukes of Hazard marathon...

    • Re:Games (Score:3, Funny)

      by bigdavex ( 155746 )

      Reviews of reviews of games? Even I don't have this much time on my hands!

      Now, back to my Dukes of Hazard marathon...

      I found this comment insightful, but lacking in detail. I give it 3 out of 5 stars.

  • The review was a good stray away from the large amount of review that rate it on the hype alone. This one actually details it's flaws. While I think Halo 2 is a great game it is not perfect (especially the ending) which 90% of the reviews you find will try to convince.

  • Halo 1 (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 04, 2005 @12:18PM (#11573599)
    The author keeps claiming Halo 1 was completed in 6 months. I remember Bungie working on Halo since the late '90s, at least a few years in total.
    • Halo 1 definately wasn't completed in 6 months. It went from a mac game -> pc game -> xbox game. It was more than a year in development. If anything it was porting it from pc to xbox that took 6 months.

    • Re:Halo 1 (Score:3, Informative)

      by EnglishTim ( 9662 )
      The first reference I found to it on Usenet is from Steve Job's July 1999 Apple keynote address - I assume they'd shown some footage, so it must have been in production for bit before then.

      Halo was released in November 2001, so I'd say they probably spent about 3 years on it (at least)

      It *certainly* wasn't completed in six months!

    • Re:Halo 1 (Score:3, Informative)

      by hollismb ( 817357 )
      It's Xbox incarnation was. From the time Microsoft bought Bungie and told them they needed to have Halo ready or the Xbox launch, they had six months to make Halo 1 as it existed on the Xbox. We all know that all that RTS stuff got totally thrown out. Heck, even Halo 2 was pretty much only done in the last six months or so if you watch the special edition DVD.
  • And to think I just got criticized for calling Bungie games groundbreaking . . .

  • Good review, but leaves one thing out. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by pikakilla ( 775788 ) on Friday February 04, 2005 @12:36PM (#11573792)
    What really annoys me about halo multiplayer is how it is so untested and unrefined. My brother and i only have one xbox and want to play online in regular games. We cant use optimatch system (because guests cannot play in ranked (optimatch) games), so we must play custom games.


    This would be fine with us, but the problem is that there is no custom game search feature like in every other online multiplayer.


    I just hope that they put in a game listing room so custom games (without inviting friends) can be played easily. However, i really dont have my hopes up considering there has not been any extra features added since i last checked (mid january) :(

    • You can still use optimatch to play Rumble Training or Team Training games. From there, try recruiting folks to join a party.

      I'm always seeing random people join open custom games. Are you sure there's no way to find them? Maybe randomly, via quickmatch?
      • I'm always seeing random people join open custom games. Are you sure there's no way to find them?

        These random people are random friends of people playing in your 'open' custom game. If you don't want random people joining, you can set a custom game to 'invite only'.
        So the advice early on to have people to play with: whenever you play with someone you wouldn't mind playing with again, send a friend request. You want a massive friend's list, I'd bet most people don't even know/remember where they found
        • Good advice on building a friend list. Accepting a clan invite is a good idea too, if you're given one. I have yet to find a clan that as many active members, but if you're looking for people to join a custom game it's another big list of people to spam.
      • There isnt. Ive tried looking. The problem is that guests of an account cannot play ranked games (im not in the mood to shell out 50 more dollars a year so my bro can play online with me). Thankfully we play in enough lans that this isnt a big deal, but it is still very very frusturating.

        I am REALLY suprised that there isnt a match search system. EVERY other game on xbox live has some form of a match search system. I cannot, for the life of me, understand why Halo 2 (the most popular xbox game) doesnt hav

        • Well, I suggest you write bungie about it. The addresses I find seem to have to do with either bungie.net problems or Xbox Live problems and this is neither. If you can figure out what address to write to about this failing, I'll write a letter about it too.
        • I am REALLY suprised that there isnt a match search system.


          I still don't understand why you and your brother don't just use the training match system... when i have guests over (or my roommates wants to play) that's all we play.
          • Now that i know there is a ghetto way of doing it, ill do it, but it is still inexcusable that there isnt a custom game searching mechanism coded.

            Every other game has one, so it makes sense that the biggest xbox game of the year should have it also.

            • Now that i know there is a ghetto way of doing it, ill do it, but it is still inexcusable that there isnt a custom game searching mechanism coded.

              What exactly is ghetto about it? You and your guest(s) are in the same party, just as you would be if you were playing ranked games, and the playlists are the same (Rumble Training = Rumble Pit, Team Training = Team Skirmish). The only difference is that it's not ranked, nor should it be.

              A custom game search would be nice, but I can't really blame Bungie for

        • Yes Pikakilla, but just stop and think for a moment.

          At any given time, there are thousand of custom games open. Some of these games don't use the predefined game types, they make their own. Just think how long it would take to search thru it to find ONE game that you like. And then try to think of the time it'd take to create that list for you to search thru.

          As on of the posters above said, why not just go to Team Training and make some Friends there, then play with them now and then.

          Or even play when yo
    • You can also use a number of free alternatives to xbox live.

      Try XBoxConnect (www.xbconnect.com) or XLink Kai.

      It's more of a chat-room-channel sort of idealogy and imho works better than live. People can cheat easier since modded boxes can play on it too but it's usually really obvious (just learn how fast the BR fires and know what's faster and what's not, that's a good indicator.)

  • Bought It, Enjoyed It (Score:4, Interesting)

    by FozzieCDN ( 798889 ) on Friday February 04, 2005 @12:57PM (#11574100)
    It's easy to look back at this stuff in retrospect or to compare what the game was supposed to deliver if you were a fanboy and followed all this stuff and say that it didn't live up... but you can do this for any game that has been on the market.

    I will agree that there are things I didn't like about Halo 2 (the only notable issue being its "ending") but there were many things that I did like as well. I personally feel though that I got a great entertainment value out of it so I am going to categorize this article in the "you can never please a fanboy nor a so-called hardcore gamer because they will always find something they don't like" section.

  • Bungie's biggest mistake (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Moryath ( 553296 ) on Friday February 04, 2005 @01:19PM (#11574347)
    Bungie's biggest mistake was removing falling damage from Halo 2.

    It completely changed - for the worse - multiplayer tactics by making suicidal leaps an everyday occurrence.
    • It completely changed - for the worse - multiplayer tactics by making suicidal leaps an everyday occurrence. With the advent of flying vehicles in multiplayer and more sniper spots way up high, the lack of fall damage is a good thing. If you get stuck someplace up high and your vehicle is gone, all you have to do is jump off. I really don't see how no-fall damage is a change for the worse. More attacks from above, I suppose, but nothing too drastic.

      • Re:Bungie's biggest mistake (Score:1, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward
        If you get stuck someplace up high and your vehicle is gone, all you have to do is jump off.

        That's exactly the problem. If you get stuck somewhere up high, that's your mistake -- but you don't get punished for doing it, since you can just jump ten stories down to the ground, firing all the way. It's one fewer element of strategy required to play the game.

    • Re:Bungie's biggest mistake (Score:1, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Bungie's biggest mistake was removing falling damage from Halo 2.

      I certainly wouldn't call it their BIGGEST mistake, but it's definitely a mistake. What really kills me, though, is their reason for doing it: when you'd lunge with the sword at someone who was below you, you'd take fall damage. I mean, this company wrote an entire game engine -- they're telling me they couldn't figure out how to fix THAT?

  • But, but, but (Score:3, Funny)

    by Knights who say 'INT ( 708612 ) on Friday February 04, 2005 @01:45PM (#11574633) Journal
    it's made by microsoft so it can't be any good, can it? *Head explodes*
    • it's made by microsoft so it can't be any good, can it?
      I'll bite.

      The Halo games aren't developed ("made") by Microsoft; they're developed by Bungie Studios [wikipedia.org]. Microsoft publishes the series.

      (Yes, Bungie is owned by MS.)

  • A "simple" summary (Score:5, Informative)

    by MrHen ( 847144 ) on Friday February 04, 2005 @02:01PM (#11574795) Homepage
    • If you don't want to read the whole thing (it is rather long), here is a "quick" summary of what they gets into. They get into a nice little bit on all of this and actually
    • think before they write.
    • From their own conclusion: Even our own re-readings of this article leave us wondering if we've been a tad too hostile. Perhaps we have; please use salt liberally when needed.
    • Weapons
    • Simple details seem to be missing (such as the shotgun's reloading).
    • The pistol from H1 has no suitable replacement. They admit it was broken.
    • The Magnum and the Battle Rifle could have used a bit of tuning (they also mention ammo).
    • The grenades were nerfed.
    • The rocket-launcher is too easy to use in dogfights.
    • Weapon roles seem confused. "Removing the (I thought) rather clever ability of the energy weapons to freeze opponents removed a crucial variation and advantage of the energy weapons. Without it, they're just another bullet hose."
    • "[M]any of the guns just don't feel like they are the actual instrument firing the bullets seen on screen."
    • Paired weapons are mentioned. "... Now I find myself standing on top of a shotgun, trying in vain to trade it up for my slung needler, while trying to maintain my Sarah Michelle Gellar (SMG)/Pistol combo."
    • The Sword is mentioned.
    • The Covenant weapons are mentioned. "... the plasma pistol has been downgraded to "accessory" status."
    • "Though the weapons are supposed to be more balanced than in the first, they invariably end up feeling rather impotent and bland, and the weapons that most teams scramble over each other to get at are the sword and the rocket launcher, leaving those unequipped or unwilling to use them with no truly effective countermeasure (ie. a powerful, universally distributed mid-range rifle, etc.). "
    • Feel and Consequences
    • "Campaign seems to lack many of the pensive, clandestine sections and well designed confrontations so treasured in the first..."
    • The HUD: no health meter, the shield meter is "rather bulbous, compact shape, is difficult to read on the fly."
    • Removal of fall damage.
    • Draw-In
    • The graphics glitches.
    • "The added detail and plethora of shadowed nooks and crannies end up making the game feel, for lack of a better word, grungy."
    • The "Teaser" Cinematic Redux"
    • Yeah.
    • User Interface
    • The menu's UI is awkward.
    • "To our disappointment, it honestly doesn't feel as though much care was put into the basic Heads Up Display and game status feedback features as well."
    • "And if only the tutorial messages weren't displayed in the dead center of your screen. While being shot at, I've got more important things on my mind than being told how to play with the flashlight or flip a banshee..."
    • Reasonable Difficult
    • "This philosophy [H1's Legendary] was not kept up in H2, and seems to have been replaced with the single goal of making H2 Legendary especially impossible, as though H1 Legendary players had to be put in there place somehow."
    • Glitches
    • Some examples. "These and several other quirks contribute once again to the beta version feel of the game."
    • Bosses
    • All they had to say about it: "Most notable quote during play so far: 'If I wanted to play Metal Gear Solid, I'd have bought a Playstation.' He he."
    • Levels and Encounters
    • Campaign levels seemed "stretched, anticlimactic, and by game's end leaves you feeling like the entire experience was made up of only 2-4 huge landscapes, rather than the 10+ levels you supposedly just played through."
    • "Ironically, the removal of the between level loading times and the new flow from one level to the next without moving to a different l
  • "Online play dual-wielding, boarding, the energy sword, stunning new vistas, and a compelling story arch... in many ways, H2 is a phenomenal game. There isn't another like it."

    If you took out boarding, then you could say the exact same thing about Shogo: Mobile Armor Division.

    Compelling story arch? Maybe. But the story ARC for H2 was very disappointing. Especially with the worst ending of all time.

    • Also Shogo MAD featured giant robots which I don't know if they're in Halo 2. I gotta have more giant robots.

      • and more cow bell.
        • Oh come on! How could no one have modded this funny?!? Are you people dead to the Blue Oyster Cult world?!?
          • While Christopher Walken's "more cowbell" bit on SNL was a comedy classic, if you listen carefully to the original "Don't Fear the Reaper" by Blue Oyster Cult, you will find that there's actually no cowbell in the song... it was a wood block.
    • If you took out boarding, then you could say the exact same thing about Shogo: Mobile Armor Division.

      Damn. I knew Halo 2 was overrated, but... damn.

      Rob
  • That it's news when a review is "Insightfully critical". Shouldn't all reviews be that?

  • There isn't another like it (Score:5, Insightful)

    by joeytsai ( 49613 ) on Friday February 04, 2005 @06:29PM (#11578111) Homepage
    I liked Halo as well as Halo 2 and will play it for a few hours every week. I think it's a great game and Bungie should be proud of it, but I also don't think it's the most amazing thing ever made. While I did think this review was pretty complete (and certainly long), I had some of the same observations at first but now I've come to better appreciate Halo 2. Since all my Halo 2 gametime is spent in multiplayer, that's where my comments will be directed.

    I'm not going to comment on the small details the writer of this review thought are were very important (the pump of the shotgun on reload, or the emission from the plasma weapons), because, well, I just don't think they're important. I understand it's a level of polish and can appreciate it, but as a developer myself I can see why you tend to remove superflous details and concentrate on what's important.

    H1 Pistol vs H2 Battle Rifle + Magnum
    In H1, the pistol was pretty unbalanced, and a slight skill difference between players would become a pretty large margin when one of them has the pistol. The zooming capability in itself makes a weapon more powerful, and I think a good compromise was reached with the Battle Rifle and the Magnum. I don't know why the reviewer says the Battle Rifle doesn't have range - anyone who plays on Colossus knows otherwise. It's not unfairly powerful like the H1 pistol, but mid-range you can usually beat someone dual-wielding SMGs.

    As for the magnum, most new people to H2 don't think it's very powerful - until you find out that a headshot from one of them without your shields = death. I agree ammo for the magnum is scarce, but I think that's because for nearly all weapons there's just too much ammo.

    Gernades
    Gernades are definitely different in H2 and I can see difficulty in trying to balance them. I was really used to them in H1, and the author is right that not using them isn't a big disadvantage of dual-wielding. On the the other hand, when you want to play a game like H2, you want your kills to be a sign of skill, not just some lucky toss (which happened a lot in H1).

    Rocket Launcher
    I agree, there's no reason a close-range rocket kill shouldn't at least severly damage the shooter.

    Covenant weapons
    I hated the H1 covenant "freeze", and was fine to see that go. But clearly Covenant weapons are more effective at taking away your shields, so there is still a useful distinction. However, I do agree having both the human and covenant version of a Battle Rifle, Sniper, etc. does seem a bit silly.

    Picking up dual weapons
    The example of trying to exchange your non-current weapon, while a bit contrived, simply demonstrates one of the disadvantages of dual-wielding. When you're playing a fast-paced game like a FPS, you need to quickly decide what weapon suite you'll carry. If you're in a situation where you're going to be killed quickly, don't go through all those steps. It should also be mentioned that if the shotgun is that important, you can also just pick it up by holding X (though obviously you'll lose your dual guns).

    Energy Sword
    I think the energy sword is well balanced. You can only whip it out in the short range, try it in midrange against dual-SMGs, or even in close range against two people and you'll find it's hardly a superweapon.

    Needler
    I'm willing to be surprised, but I agree this weapon remains useless.

    Melee
    Like the gernades and the pistol, melee was really powerful in H1. Unless you're assassinating someone, I wouldn't count on meleeing someone to death without shooting them a couple times. I think this a much more realistic feel than H1.

    Campaign
    Honestly, I don't think either H1 or H2 have very interesting campaigns. The graphics are great, the AI is great, the gameplay is great... but the level design and story just don't do it for me personally.

    Simplifications
    I really like the simplificatio
  • "A complaint frequently lodged against the first game (that I have never really understood) was that it suffered from too many duplicate textures and rehashed levels."

    Umm ok can anyone say FANBOY!!! how could anyone not find the levels in H1 unrepetitive? 90% of all of the levels on the covenant ship, er same exact thing!!! ugh, battles against the flood? sheesh... what about master chief's ship?

    same exact levels over and over again, it was like they made 5 levels total, each with their own sets of textu
    • I'll straighten out your exaggerations, because it's clear that you've never really played Halo for any extended period of time. There were ten levels in the campaign. Out of all of them, three of them had you backtracking through certain parts of earlier levels. Two Betrayals had you going backwards through the second half of Assault on the Control Room, plus some added places that were only accessable via Banshee. Keyes had you backtracking through the second half of Truth and Reconsiliation, with an
      • "I'll straighten out your exaggerations, because it's clear that you've never really played Halo for any extended period of time."

        I played it through 2x, once with a geforce4 (which got really crappy framerates on PC btw, and the xbox is a geforce2? weird) once with a geforce 6800 to see how much better it played (which was like night and day IMHO).

        My main point was what you said exactly "There were literelly(sic) dozens of rooms in many of the maps that just looked the same, or at least very very similar

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