Map-Making Software for RPG Campaigns? 57
mandrake*rpgdx writes "I'm looking into downloading/purchasing some map making software for my Table Top RPG group. I've heard about the free (GPL'd) AutoRealms and wondered if anyone with experience can compare it to commercial products like Campaign Cartographer, and if there is any Linux based map-maker I can grab?" The one I've been most impressed with, and might pick up at Gen Con this year, is Dundjinni. Anyone else have any software favorites?
Yeah but Dundjinni can't zoom into maps (Score:5, Informative)
Game Table (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.galactanet.com/gametable.html [galactanet.com]
"Gametable is a remote RPG host/client app that allows use of a D&D style battle map, die rollers, etc online."
Not exactly what you're looking for, but in the ballpark of nifty RPG related software.
Re:Game Table (Score:2)
Re:Game Table (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Game Table (Score:2)
Most apps I've used on Mac written in Java have had a specific Mac build or release, so not seeing one I assumed there wasn't one. I'll have to run a checksum on my inner geek and see what part of my brain has rotted.
Re:Game Table (Score:3)
Re:Game Table (Score:1)
Another option for just sharing the tabletop is MapTool. Like Gametable, it is a program designed to simply address replacing the tabletop without all of the fluff.
Check it out at: http://www.rptools.net/maptool.html [rptools.net]
</shameless plug>
FractalMapper (Score:5, Informative)
Bruce
Re:FractalMapper (Score:1)
Linux Options? (Score:2, Insightful)
AutoRealms could be ported to Linux, save that it would depend upon Borland's Kylix Open Edition (free as in beer).
CC and its cousins are nonfree/nonopen, windows only.
The same seems to be true of Fractal Mapper.
I was always i
Other problem with Fractal Mapper- (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Other problem with Fractal Mapper- (Score:5, Informative)
My bad- (Score:2)
Re:Linux Options? (Score:1)
My wife would say otherwise. (Score:5, Funny)
Umm... (Score:1, Interesting)
Why bother, without this! (Score:5, Interesting)
A good question... (Score:4, Interesting)
Campaign Cartographer (Score:1, Informative)
Why did you log on as AC? (Score:2)
I got an email... (Score:1)
I'll probably help out, as soon as I finish getting the new version of my other project [cluon.com] to a release state. (Work on which will resume as soon as it's no longer crunch time at work.)
Re:I got an email... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:I got an email... (Score:1)
It's enough for me to get my XP box working again.
I must wonder... (Score:5, Insightful)
GENERIC OMINOUS SOOTHSAYING SAGE (GOSS): You need to go to Ramadamadingdong, which is eighteen hexes out from your location and standard rules are to roll for encounters each hex. Check hex D14 on your map.
Players: Ok. Let's see we'll need 18 standard ration units then, let's make it an even 20.
---- vs...
GOSS: That which you seek lies in mysterious and distant lands unknown (stretches gnarled finger to emphasize that whole "way out there" thing). Your path is perilous, your tread is treacherous, your fly is unzipped.
Players: This journey, how many days? And thanks (zip).
GOSS: I know not, but this burned fragment of a map drawn on the skin of a Dire Wallaby shall guide your path. Beware, for the hand of a madman was that who authored, or the madman guided the mad hand, or perhaps a sane hand of a mad man--
Players: --Yes, this shall do! (snatches map)
GOSS: Oh, I merely ran out of tissue...
---
OK, I'm feeling a little silly, but you can see how even realistic props can enhance silliness. Nothing wrong with the GM having the hex maps, but for godsakes, please stop exposing these to the players.
Re: I must wonder... (Score:2, Insightful)
It sucks when your dm and you lose track of travels times and such; the players may notice and remark; and while it may be forgivin easily; its just another thing that adds depth and believe-ability of the table top experience
AutoRealm is nice... (Score:5, Interesting)
AutoREALM is pretty nice, however, there's some small clumsiness in the UI. It's the kind of software that you want to use to create really complex maps, because it sure isn't smooth enough to do anything really simple.
It's sure very powerful, has some nice drawing tools and such. Very nice layering functionality too. The symbol library feature helps too.
The only problems I had were with snapping/accurate ends, zooming and panning (there's a separate pan tool, no mouse shortcut, and panning tends to screw up the display until done). Also, in this day and age, I'd definitely expect the program to do EPS or SVG exporting, but nooo-oo, not yet! Okay, it's been an year since I used it - hope it's being improved a bit...
AutoREALM had one curious feature, too - name generator, based on context-free grammars. I found it a pretty strange coincidence that I spent this day tweaking my context-free grammar based text generator, and the first thing I see in Slashdot after that is some question about AutoREALM. This generator of mine [www.iki.fi] happens to have one AutoREALM grammar as an online demo =)
Handwritten here. (Score:3, Interesting)
I've played with most of the mapping software out there[1] and it all has problems that limit how useful it is, especially for a GM that does not work off a laptop when gaming. I've seriously thought about writing my own; I have many pages of notes on how to implement the system and a few directories full of testbed code and graphics. My biggest problem with mapping programs is how they force you to think within their structure rather than being a more freeform tool.
Here's a map [cheshirehall.com] I'm using in my current Firefly GURPS game.
[1] I have not played with Dundjinni. It looks very "pretty", but I prefer Tolkien-esque lineart maps for the simple fact that they don't use four gallons of ink to print out.
--
Evan
SVG for maps (Score:5, Interesting)
I'd suggest looking into using SVG for game map creation, because there's getting to be a lot of Open Source tools out there (like Inkscape [inkscape.org], that I help develop) that can edit, convert, etc. them. I've done some map making with it and while it lacks many of the advanced features that commercial map tools have, it's got the basics, plus if you can code, you gain the option of adding the feature in yourself. ;-)
Making maps with Inkscape / SVG is different than using CAD-style software like Campaign Cartographer, but you can achieve pretty much the same things. With features like alpha blending, text-to-shape, layers, grouping, shape fills, tiling, and infinite zoom, you can make much "prettier" maps in much less time than it'd take to do in a CAD-like program. See the screenshots [inkscape.org] to get some ideas of what can be done with these features. It has a fancy calligraphy mode that could be quite handy if you need to hand-write calligraphic text on a map. There's also a nifty bitmap-to-vector tracing tool that might help in converting hand-drawn maps to vectors. Also comes with several useful tutorials (in the Help menu).
There's also a site for sharing SVG clipart (like map symbols), the Open Clip Art Library [openclipart.org]. Not a lot of RPG art yet, but there's some and it's likely going to grow a lot. Plus, since all of its content is Public Domain, there's no restrictions at all placed on your maps if you use it. I could *easily* imagine this being a way for RPG mappers to collectively build an open library of RPG map symbols and artwork.
CC if you want REAL maps. (Score:5, Informative)
The majority of the other "map" making software out there is really drawing software. Dunjinni fits into that category. You can draw pictures, but they are just that, and not functional as real maps. They may be prettier, and easier to use if you have more experience with drawing programs.
Re:CC if you want REAL maps. (Score:2)
Re:CC if you want REAL maps. (Score:1)
Not that that helps much. There is unfortunately a tendancy on the CC-2 mailing list to ignore such problems. All I can suggest is the standard response you'll get there: Download the UberManual (requires registration of purchase), Do the tutorials, ask questions on the mailing list (Yahoo...Uggh.)
That third part is probably the biggest help. The community is actually very helpful. But if you haven't done the first two, expect to get a lot of responses that point you
Dundjinni and Canvas (Score:3, Informative)
I personally use Canvas from ACD Systems [deneba.com]formerly Deneba, since I mostly do deckplans for Traveller. Canvas is wonderfully well suited for doing deckplans, easy to use, and very powerful. But, it's too expensive ($250-$400) for casual use and only practical if you need it professionally (like I do).
Campaign Cartographer (Score:3, Funny)
I want somthing that *automatically* makes the map (Score:1, Troll)
All this does is draw things that I can imagine. I want it to make maps for me.
Re:I want somthing that *automatically* makes the (Score:1)
Re:I want somthing that *automatically* makes the (Score:2)
I wonder if any of these drawing programs have API's that I could build off of.
Completely Off Topic (Score:2)
Re:Completely Off Topic (Score:1)
http://tiled.rpgdx.net/ [rpgdx.net]
Its Java based, so theoretically it should run any OS that has a Java implementation. The screenshots show it running in both KDE and Gnome environments, so it looks like it should run on your Linux box.
Re:Completely Off Topic (Score:2)
Re:Completely Off Topic (Score:3, Informative)
Try these:
Re:Completely Off Topic (Score:2)
Campaign Cartographer is probably safest choice (Score:4, Informative)
Like someone already said, most of the other programs are bitmap-based, wherease CC is a real CAD program and thus vector-based. The difference is that there is very little you cannot do with CC (aside from the primary RPG use, I have used it e.g. to draw floorplans for selling an apartment, and plan to use it for garden design). Also, CC is professionally produced software - the UI might not be completely "Windows Standard", but it does work logically and provides all the functionality you need (I have had some bad experiences in this regard with other software where UI design has been less competent).
The tradeoff is the steeper learning curve, though the manuals are quite OK. The available extensions cover most if not all RPG illustration needs, so you can expand the software as your needs grow. A host of free content (maps and symbols) is available from the Profantasy website.
I guess it mainly depends on the quality you want to get and the time and money you are willing to invest. If all you want is to sit down and quickly create some relatively simple maps, then you are better off with a simpler and cheaper program (or pen and paper...). If, on the other hand, you want to have the ability to create beautiful and detailed maps and are willing to spend some time on it, then it is worthwhile to invest your money and time in CC. It is worth repeating that both investments are required - frequently people who have the money don't have the time, and vice versa :-(. If you e.g. wanted to create maps for illustrating a fantasy novel, CC would really be your only sensible alternative.
By the way, if money and time is no object (I wish...), look into the Vue Esprit [e-onsoftware.com] + Poser [curiouslabs.com] combination for creating illustrations. You can get some pretty decent results without any drawing ability, but buying both the software and the content will cost you an arm and a leg, not to mention a significant chunk of your time.
Disclaimer: I own CC and most of its extensions. I have not tried all possible pieces of mapping software that exist so there might be something better out there but I seriously doubt it. I am not in any way affiliated with Profantasy, e-on software or Curious Labs.
Re:Campaign Cartographer is probably safest choice (Score:2)
Press Release? (Score:1)
Flash Magic Map (Score:4, Interesting)
Dungeon tile maker for mini gaming (Score:2, Informative)
Pen, Paper, Stickynotes (Score:4, Interesting)
If you already have a map, that's another matter.
I don't like Campaign Cartographer specifically because it's a CAD program. It's slow and a pain to fix or alter things on other layers. The one thing it does better than (so far as I can tell) any other gaming-mapping program is link and keep track of notes. In today's XHTML computing world, though, this isn't that impressive.
Even so, I've seen more interesting maps drawn by inartistic DMs using a pencil than I have with inartistic DMs using mapping software.
But that's just map-MAKING software. What I'd love to see is software that has a GM map and a player map on the same computer. The GM map would include pop-up notes for the GM, icons for who's where, but the player map would only have those areas flagged by the GM to be player-viewable. I'd love a SIMPLE interface, or an interface I could use simply.
Normally we just use a Battle Mat, erasable markers, and dice representing where we are. We save more money for pizza and elvish hookers that way.
There are simply so many ways and reasons that someone would want, or care for, RPG Map-Making Software. I just touched on the two that meant the most to me.
Re:Pen, Paper, Stickynotes (Score:2, Interesting)
Give me a program that allows the GM to create a map, including creatures, traps, doors, passages, etc. Let the players view the bits of the map (remotely even, possibly through this thing they call the "Internet"?) that I want them to see. Allow the GM to reveal
Re:Pen, Paper, Stickynotes (Score:1)
Very true. For any non-trivial map, I would start with pen and paper and only move to CC once the paper version is at final draft stage. The editing aspect is what makes using a program really worthwhile (aside from getting really nice looking maps); after a few editing cycles and a few dozen game sessions pen-and-paper maps get smudgy and hard to read, not to mention lost. For maps that you only use a few times though, pen and paper might be better (if you don't care about getting that nice professional lo
some pointers (Linux, Windows) (Score:3, Informative)
Pro Fantasy [profantasy.com] used some of my pictures and plans of castles [holoweb.net] from my pictures and texts from old books [fromoldbooks.org] Web site, so I link back to them, but as far as I can tell their products or for Microsoft Windows. They gave me a free Castles program, but I didn't try it under WINE.
On Linux today I'd probably look at using either Grass (a fairly complex GIS program for the hard-core enthusiast) or a vector-based drawing program such as Inkscape.
It's useful to have a drawing program that handles layers (Inkscape does these days), and a vector-based rather than bitmap program is good because (1) the maps print OK, (2) when you ditch that old 640x480 screen and go for 24,000 x 9,000 pixels
If you insist on using a raster/bitmap program like GIMP, use a separate layer for everything and keep text layers as text for as ong as possible, so you can edit them. Maps with spelling errors look really stupid. Plus it's neat to be able to go back and add detail during the campaign.
If you give the players a copy of the map file, export it to a bitmap first, with the layers containing your own notes well hidden! Or first save the file, then carefully delete the layers you don't want them to see, and then save a copy under a different name and send that. But that process is error-prone especially if you're tired.
I sometimes gave players incorrect maps, e.g. badly remembered or done with "poor cartography", and they'd end up piecing the truth up from the obvious contradictions. E.g. one had an entire country whose existence was censored
There are a number of clip-art fonts around with map symbols. Some are commercial (I'm sure you respect commercial licences, since you want the GPL to be respected, right?) such as Adobe's Carta, but there are some free ones too. There are also some low-cost fonts especially for making RPG maps by David Nalle at Fontcraft's Scriptorium [fontcraft.com]. I think they have some non-Free non-free software for Microsoft Windows too.
An alternative to clip art fonts is to make your own symbol library, e.g. by drawing pointy muontains and so forth with a pencil, colouring them with crayons, and scanning the result before and after adding colour. You could then trace these in a program like Inkscape, too.
Liam
Irony Games (Score:1)
They have sevearl web-based apps and links to some perl scripts and other little files (Some GPL, some not).
Definately worth a look.