Sony's Conference The Day After 199
I believe the best way to describe the reaction to yesterday's Sony Press Conference would be underwhelmed. The Guardian Gamesblog always says it well: "Jetlag means I'm not entirely sure what day it is, but what was Sony's excuse? Today's conference was a muddled mess that essentially confirmed widespread rumours of a problematic PS3 launch build-up. The games shown were of varying quality, with perhaps only Heavenly Sword really showing the undoubted potential of the PS3 ... Sadly, on today's evidence, 360 owners shouldn't worry about missing out, as the PS3's visuals seem broadly similar to their machine. Impressive then, but not the leap we had truly hoped for." Chris Kohler nails the real problem with the lower-priced model: "This just made Microsoft's $299 Core Pack look like a genius idea. At least it's possible to upgrade an Xbox Core. I don't know what kind of arcane magick will have to be executed to give a crippled PS3 actual functionality."
The Day After... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:The Day After... (Score:3, Funny)
Oh, no wonder. Sony released the pricing for the PS3.
Re:The Day After... (Score:2, Funny)
Clearly, he was doing a practice terrorist run. Duh.
Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:3, Interesting)
I am glad to see Nintendo innovating rather than just extending their past consoles, which it seems like all Microsoft and Sony want to do ("MORE POWER, ITS LEET!!! WOOO!!").
I was going to buy a PS3 for Metal Gear Solid 3 and Gran Turismo, but now I might just have to get the Wii.
Not To Be A Butt, But... (Score:2)
I could be wrong, but I am pretty sure that it will play the same as it plays on the PS2
Seriously, though, MGS4 is the primary reason I am picking up a PS3 as well...
Xbox isn't ALL graphics (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2)
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2)
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2)
Yes I would. You see I don't care what anybody else thinks. I went to see Shriek and I enjoyed it. I can watch Twelve Angry Men, Citizen Kane, The Seven Samurai, and Bugs Bunny cartoons from the 40s and enjoy them all.
You see when you are an adult you really don't care about looking like an Adult. The fact th
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2)
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2)
How many GBAs and DSs? How much money do they make.
Nintendo is the only console maker that is actually making a profit selling games and game systems.
Sony and Microsoft have both been loosing money to get "mind share".
I work at a software development firm. Everyone has a GBA and or a DS. Not one person here has a PSP. A few have play XBox, a few play PS-2 and a few play GC. I have both a PS2 and a GC. Everyone here is excited about the new Nintendo. If they Nintendo can live up t
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2, Insightful)
Just substitute "kids videogames" for "fairy tales", and you've hit the nail on the head.
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2)
Nintendo seem rather unwilling to do it themselves (for fear of tarnishing the brand?) and leave it to 3rd parties, but lately they've been having a lot of trouble attracting them. Perhaps they should create a Miramax or someth
Re:Graphics 1, Gameplay 0 (Score:2)
Sony overconfident? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Sony overconfident? (Score:2)
The real question is what happens to those people that are turned away in the long lines? Do they pick up an Xbox or a Wii? Sony is what it is... the real battle is between Microsoft and Nintendo this holiday season.
As for the Sony's final market share, that will become apparent as early adopters let the world know if the system is worth it... or worth it at what price. People run ar
Re:Sony overconfident? (Score:2)
I think it is worth mentioning that the Sony controller is a poor pretender to the Wii's technology. An accelerometer (PS3's tech) will tell you the controller has moved some direction, which is fine. At least until you need to reorient the controller to a comfortable position. There are good reasons accelerometers haven't got a lot of attention outside of the occasional fishing title.
The Wii (from reading press releases anyway) kno
Re:Sony overconfident? (Score:3, Informative)
I'm not so sure the problem is overconfidence. I think the fundamental problem is that blue-ray HD-DVD drive.
I understand Sony is trying to make blue-ray drives the defacto next generation HD-DVD standard, but the problem is that the 1st generation drives are so expensive ($400 by one estimate I read) that it's p
Blam! There goes the other foot! (Score:3, Insightful)
Gee, I hope you know, that they weren't expecting anything innovative in the way of games that might rely of features that half of shipped PS3s won't have.
This is the same shoot-yourself-in-the-foot mistake that MS made with the 360. Only, at least with the 360 you can actually upgrade your "core" system later. You know, buy a hardrive.
Oh wait...I get it, Sony will release upgrade kits consisting of some prebuilt ICs, a hacksaw, a soldering iron and a 300-page manual!
I'm not gonna mention the half-assed motion sensor implementation...
I'm no fan of Sony, not since their arrogantly stupid root kit stunt in particular but I'm always interested to see what such companies can do in terms of pushing out new technology. But this is turning into a complete shambles so far...
Bah..One console is gonna be a pile'o'poo, one violates my (admitedly shaky) code of ethics and the third sounds like part of my early morning wake-up ritual. Although it's clear which one I'll end up purchasing.
So disapointing...I need a hug!
Re:Blam! There goes the other foot! (Score:2)
Let me offer a contrary view: I'm looking forward to the half-assed motion sensor implementation.
First, let's deal with half-assed. Is Eye Toy [wikipedia.org] half-assed? Yes. Is it fun when it works? Sure. It wasn't an original idea, but it was an attempt to take controls "to the next level," a layer of experimentation that I commend.
Now, as far as motion sensors go, I can't wait to see. If it works half-assed, and is able to take advantage of
Re:Blam! There goes the other foot! (Score:2)
I like the idea of alternative inputs. I own a DS and some of the stylus-based games are just fantastic.
Likewise the console-formerly-know-as-Revolution appears to have a fantastic, full-spatial motion sensing system and, from video clips at least, is very responsive, natural and open to all sorts of innovative uses.
Sony's implementation is poor by comparison. It uses a gyro and accelerometers to calculate movement. There is no absolute spatial positioning. And, mos
The best thing (Score:2)
That being of course "PlayStation ThWii" :)
I'm still planning on getting a PSWii of course, well, once the price has gone down a bit anyways, which is sad because i got both PS2 and GameCube on the day of release. But regardless of the merits of the rest of the system you've got to laugh (or perhaps cry) at the blatant "me too"ism of the controller. On the plus side as someone else pointed ou
Re:The best thing (Score:2)
So while the PS3 will sorta know how you're moving the controller around, the Wii will know how you're moving it, where it is relative to the screen, and probably most importantly, where it's pointing.
The point is, Nintendo's set-up is far more useful, not to mention the years of R&D headstart they've had to get it working well.
If anyt
Let's compare for a moment... (Score:4, Interesting)
And here's what Nintendo has been criticized for:
And on top of that, Nintendo's pre-presentation announcement of the name has gotten them far more attention than Sony's actual presentation.
What they could do to save the PS3 (Score:2)
Sony make it a also a PVR! Then come out with a video Walkman to compete with Apple!
Another option is a really wild one. If it doesn't already run it put Linux on it. Allow it to become a simple general use computer as well as a Game machine. Allow it to become the Commodre64 of the 21st Century.
It has a hard drive, network connection, and USB ports...
Re:What they could do to save the PS3 (Score:2)
It has a hard drive, network connection, and USB ports...
So does the $200 weekly beige-box special at Fry's, at less than half the price. And guess what, TurboTax doesn't run on the PS3.
Re:What they could do to save the PS3 (Score:2)
Re:What they could do to save the PS3 (Score:2)
2. It is larger than the PS3.
3. Most kids don't need TurboTax.
4. Most kids do need internet access and a way to write papers for school.
5. With a real OS the PS3 could edit video and photos which does fit into the Sony ideal.
6. That $200 special at fry will not hook up to your HD-TV or play Blue-ray DVDs.
Re:What they could do to save the PS3 (Score:2)
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
It's already been announced that the GameCube game Twilight Princess will be 16:9 when played on a Wii. No reason to believe that Wii games won't be able to do what GameCube games will.
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
And I bet the HD adoption rate of gamers is higher than the general population by a significant margin. And while HD adoption rates right now are low, the price of HD TVs is approaching standard TVs, and the release of HD-DVD and blu-ray playe
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
1)The harcore gaming market is a small percentage of the overall gaming market. WHile HDTV is higher in the hardcore gaming market, its still not high. A small portion of a small portion of a market isn't something you should cater to.
2)Nintendo is trying to build a system for the masses- they want it in casual gamers and non-gamers hands. This means HD is less important to them, as those markets have lower HD penetration than average.
3)No, the Wii won't look worse. Jud
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
That and the "Look I'm just like an iPod, I'm innovative too!" case design.
How about all those extra features that aren't in the entry level PS3:
Card reader
Does anyone actually care that the barebones PS3 isn't going to have a card reader? Last time I checked the XBox 2 (or "360" if you must) doesn't have a card reader and the Wii only has SD. How many people will use card readers on a console? Doesn't everyone u
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
The people that want to use their old saved games from PS2 and PS1 games.
"Well, the XBox 2 has that, but you have to pay an extra $100 for the privilege."
But the price of a full Xbox 360 plus the price of a wireless adapter is the price of the bare-bones PS3.
"I suspect that the vibration had to be taken out due to a patent troll."
Justification doesn't matter to the consumer. It's a feature not only in both of Sony's compet
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
What are you talking about? The PS2 didn't come with a hard drive at all. Do you perhaps mean the 40GB drive that came with the PS2 Linux development kit? I don't think that really counts.
I would hardly call something a mere 0.5 increment if the full 1.0 increment has a couple of features that nobody would use.
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Actually, I was thinking of the 40 GB drive that came with Final Fantasy XI. There were also a few other titles that used the hard drive as an option accessory.
"I would hardly call something a mere 0.5 increment if the full 1.0 increment has a couple of features that nobody would use."
Aside from the fact that those features "nobody would use" are currently being used, I'd say it's a little to
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Actually, the "card reader" feature of the high-end PS3 is for memory sticks, SD cards, and the like... I haven't seen any mention of Sony omitting the slots for their own proprietary PlayStation memory cards. Indeed, the vaunted backwards-compatibility of the PS3 with PS1 and PS2 software wouldn't work very well without that support...
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Here you go. [slashdot.org]
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Sheesh, just get a WaveBird, then.
Besides, PS2 owners have the option of turning it off, but PS3 owners will not have the option of turning it on.
"Let's see how badly Nintendo is criticized after their press conference today before proclaiming Wii to be the savior of the universe."
There's little left for Nintendo to announce. There's one more secret feature they've been teasing us wit
Re:Let's compare for a moment... (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
PSwii60 (Score:4, Funny)
Overpriced, but models not that much different (Score:2, Insightful)
Before the whining gets completely out of control, can we stop and look at the differences for a moment?
Smaller hard drive - yeah, but at least unlike the 360, the low-end model still has one. Since this is going to be used for downloadable content and caching from the optical disc, I can't see how the extra 40GB is going to make much difference. And after all,
Re:Overpriced, but models not that much different (Score:2)
Making the issue sound cute doesn't make it any less of a problem. No HDMI - and how many gamers even have TVs with an HDMI input? This should only be an issue for people who want to play BluRay movies on an expensive TV set. And if they can afford a $2000-$5000 plasma HD set, maybe they can afford the extra $100 for a premium PS3?
This is true, but honestly it raises more questions than it answers. Sony's betting rather heavily that the cross-branding of the PS3 and Blu-Ray will help both te
Re:Overpriced, but models not that much different (Score:2)
Re:Overpriced, but models not that much different (Score:2)
Re:Overpriced, but models not that much different (Score:2)
First off, who's going to have that much money left over after spending $500 on a console and $60 on their launch title?
More important, though is the issue of backwards compatability.
Hypothetical: I put a PS2 game into my PS3, intending to play it (even though there won't be any rumble). The PS2 game says "Please insert Memroy Card into slot 1." On the core PS3, there is no "slot 1."
Rig the PS3 to automatically save PS2
Re:Overpriced, but models not that much different (Score:2)
I mostly agree but: There will not be a USB memory stick reader peripheral any more than there was for the PS2, on which it would have been equally possible. The fact that the memory card for the PS2 was just a memory stick in a different form factor didn't hurt PS2 sales any. Also, HDMI is critical. The lack of it means that practically no one is going to buy the PS3 as a blu-ray player. That feature won't even enter their mind, and here's why; DVD is not going away anytime soon and it's already better th
The most distressing thing about the PS3.. (Score:2, Insightful)
The PS3 will have the same exact problems the 360 had last year with production, maybe even more if they keep throwing everything into the system (motion detection??)
Re:The most distressing thing about the PS3.. (Score:2)
If the 360 wasn't compelling to buyers already, and the PS3 isn't doing it for them now either, it seems the winner becomes Nintendo.
The lesson here, regardless of what happens, will be that the analysts were wrong, and we listened to 9 months of obnoxious fanboy flamewars about what the analysts were saying for no good reason.
Everyone Panic!! (Score:5, Insightful)
The unit has 4 USB 2.0 ports, which would imply that a USB memory card reader can be added on.
The unit has an AV MultiOut port, which would imply that HDMI could be added as a seperate dongle. Considering how many HD TV sets have been sold that don't have HDMI ports, I don't see what everyone is bitching about this for anyway. If the outputs include an Analog HD cable, then you're pretty much set. Sony and all the movie studios are already backing away from enforcing their movies to downgrade themselves because they know the public backlash from people who don't own an HDMI capable set would kill their chances of selling HD movies, so this really seems like a non-issue.
The controller sucks. Well, I'd be very surprised if Penguin or MadCatz doesn't make a controller with Rumble to satisfy your needs. Unless the PS3 comes with 2 controllers you'll likely end up bying an additional one anyway.
The base unit doesn't do Wi-Fi. Well, how many of you who own an original XBox or PS2 don't already have some kind of Wi-Fi adapter around the house, if that's your thing? Considering how quickly Wi-Fi speeds change and that the lifespan of a console is around 5 years, who wants a locked in Wi-Fi anyway, you'll just be bitching about how slow it is 3 years from now.
The price isn't cheap, but most of that's the Blue-Ray player. The higher price will help to ensure that the people who really really have to have a PS3 now will be able to get one while production ramps up and and prices can start to drop. There are many critics saying that the XBox360 is underpriced and it doesn't even have an HD DVD player.
Re:Everyone Panic!! (Score:2)
Umm, rumble support doesn't just happen by magic. It has to be built into the games, and I seriously doubt very many game-makers are going to waste precious resources adding in rumble effects for the tiny portion of the market using third-party controllers that support rumble.
"The base unit doesn't do Wi-Fi. Well, how many of you who own an original XBox or PS2 don't already
Re:Everyone Panic!! (Score:2)
Actually, I felt that 3rd party controllers would be most usefull when playing PS1/PS2 games that already had Rumble on your PS3. Whether or not new games for the PS3 are developed to take advantage of the Tumble-tilt or Rumble is for
Re:Everyone Panic!! (Score:2)
This statement implies that there will be a USB Storage Device driver on the console's base OS that won't be missing when the game comes up. Having said this, the rumors of Linux being the base OS coming from of the game dev community that have actual access to development units, you're probably right, so long as they put all the other systems support pieces for USB Storage hotplug in place. It also probably a
Re:Everyone Panic!! (Score:2)
The problem with Nintendo is the games. They in no way attempt to reach the same game market that Sony/Microsoft strive for, so any success for there console will be limited to
You can sure tell who the fanboys are ... (Score:4, Insightful)
Xbox Fanboy: "Uhh those shortages, it's going away next week. I heard they're bringing on another factory, I heard it myself from my sister's-boyfriend's-coworker's-friend-of-a-frien
Nintendo Fanboy: "Hey guys, it's just a name! Let's be mature now. The console itself hasn't changed. Guys
Sony Fanboy: "Actually, having two SKUs isn't that bad, it gives the consumer more choices, yeah that's it. And you don't REALLY need HDMI or WiFi or rumble-features. Oh, and the high price means that you'll really be proud once you finally afford that premium PS3! Blu-ray forever!"
Re:You can sure tell who the fanboys are ... (Score:2)
Re:Everyone Panic!! (Score:2)
True, but until all or a majority of the HD capable TV's sold in the US are HDMI capable, then i
Re:Everyone Panic!! (Score:2)
Can you show me a document that states that the "base" PS3 will have no upgrade capablility to HDMI through a new adapter dongle? You are only assuming that the PS3's AV Multiport is not an upgr
The Next Generation (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:The Next Generation (Score:2)
Re:The Next Generation (Score:2)
Re:The Next Generation (Score:2)
Irrelevent Nitpick: The Saturn cost more, and the PS's hardware still blew it away. Not a totally bad example, though. The Saturn's original goal was to improve upon the 2D 16-bit graphics, instead of wandering into 3D. Sony announced their move to 3D, and Sega over-reacted by trying to band-aid in some 3D processing hardware. The result was a more expensive machine th
You answered yourself (Score:2)
ridiculously high price point (reminds me of the Saturn)
Sega was on life support after the Saturn. Sony's massive hype machine surrounding the PS2 effectively pulled the plug.
Sony will win... (Score:3, Funny)
After all, how can they lose when the logo is basically two men staring at a pair of breasts [googlepages.com].
Or am I the only one to see this?
Re:Sony will win... (Score:3, Funny)
Slightly different perspective (Score:2)
However, in other respects, I thought this was fairly promising for Sony. They clearl
Except... (Score:2)
Except that it's not a reasonable equivalent. It's a joke.
Nintendo has utterly nothing to worry about. They must have laughed all the way to the bank after Sony's presentation. What a letdown.
Re:Slightly different perspective (Score:2)
With the HUGE price difference between the systems, the PS3's lack of anything like X-box Live Arcade or Virtual Console, and the half-hearted motion sensing technology in the PS3's controller (apparently incapable of detecting tilt unless the controller is moved) with its inability to detect how it's being held in relation to the screen, which has always been Wii's true
Things aren't that bad for Sony... (Score:3, Insightful)
Price, short term. The 360 and DS Lite launches prove that early adopters are willing to shell out twice the MSRP or more to get their grubby game-mitts on the system at launch. The h4rdc0re, Sony whores, and simply free-spending are going to be all over this thing, and the money goes to Sony rather than the secondary market. Of course, the higher price means any shortages-and-hype situation, if any, is going to be less impressive than the 360's, and time will tell whether it was a smart tradeoff, but it's not some kind of crazy gamble.
Price, long term. Anybody else expecting a price drop next spring? I wouldn't be suprised if they cut it to match whatever price the 360 is at by then. If they don't, yeah, it's probably gonna hurt them badly, but if the high price is just Sony planning around launch-day demand, then we can expect that they're not going to cede this area to Microsoft.
Crappy cheap version. For some gamers, the cheap version could actually be a good deal. In fact, I could imagine this being the case for a lot of people. No wireless IEEE? Statistically, only a tiny minority of console owners take them online in the first place- I think it was like four percent? Being limited to a 20GB hard drive probably isn't going to make a big difference for anyone- especially if you're one of the vast majority who aren't downloading any content. What's more, the hard drive thing, IMO, means the cheap PS3 is actually LESS crippled than the cheap 360.
The motion-sensor thing. I really think this is a bad move on Sony's part- but still, there are at least a couple ways this could work out for them. In the first scenario, Sony actually gets its motion-sensing shit together between now and launch. The controller still can't compete with the dedicated Wii controller that Nintendo spent so much time and money on developing, but if its basic functionality is solid, we could see ports of some Wii titles- at least, the ones that use the technology in fairly simple ways that the PS3 can emulate. The 360 would end up being the third wheel in this scenario, since everything on it that isn't exlusive (and Sony's probable exclusive properties are at least as strong as Microsoft's) is going to end up being ported to the PS3.
Second possible scenario? Sony's motion-sensing technology sucks ass but hurts Nintendo by confusing the market. Breathtakingly cynical and twisted if things do work out this way, of course, but what are you gonna do?.
A few counterpoints... (Score:2)
No mention of linux (Score:2)
"crippled" is such a misnomer (Score:2)
1. 20GB vs 60GB HDD - the XBox360 is a choice of 0 vs 20GB. How is the XBox360 upgrade genius here?
2. Memory stick, etc - no other console has it or has had it. Not missing much unless/until Sony actually writes software that would use it anyway.
3. no 802.11g - no other console has it, and you can always add it via a gaming adaptor.
4. no HDMI - no other console has this, and it will still support HD output via component.
From TFA: "I don't know what kind of
Re:One thing to consider. (Score:2)
Re:One thing to consider. (Score:2)
Anonymous physician, heal thyself (Score:4, Insightful)
Seriously, wait for PS3 to launch, and since it packs everything you need in your life so "tightly" and you can't afford one, put money together with some friends and Buy One!
Glass house. Stones. Throwing discouraged.
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:3, Insightful)
Okay this guy is a total retard! "Happiest are those working for Mr. Gates?" Um, hello? The PS3 just blew the competition away, are you scared?
What does the PS3 have to do with the happiness of Microsoft employees, exactly?
I'm pretty sure that "blew the competition away" is a blatant lie here. From what I've seen, the response to the conference was "underwhelmed" at best, if not just plain let down.
He's whining about features the controller has and what it can do; Wow motion sensory t
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:2)
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:2)
The problem with Microsoft's two versions and the reason everyone criticized them for it is that only one of them has a HD which makes it highly unlikely that developers are going to use the HD.
The differences between Sony's two versions make no difference for the games.
The
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:2)
I took that as a given.
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:4, Funny)
Well, I agree with you there. Everything about the PS3 was amazing. The price was amazingly high. The controller was amazingly ripped off from Nintendo. The game demos were amazingly unamazing...
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:3, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Okay this guy is a total retard! (Score:2)
Re:HDMI (Score:2)
It's a "cripple" because, if it does become the norm, it's not just Sony that will be regretting it, it'll be everyone who bought system that only costs half a grand.
Re:Wha...? (Score:3, Informative)
Sony titles (Score:3, Insightful)
I guess this explains Sony's prior announcement [arstechnica.com] that their movies wouldn't force down-converting on analog outputs. At the time it looked like it was just an attempt to improve Blu-Ray's chances against HD-DVD, but now it looks like the decision was driven by the limitations of their low-end PS3.
Re:European market (Score:2)
Re:What saddnes me (Score:3, Insightful)
You're saying that the PS3 is junky and that irrational Sony fanboyism is more prevalent than irrational MS or Nintendo fanboyism?
Hahahahahaaaa
snort
(wipes tear from eye)
Thanks, I needed that.
Re:What saddnes me (Score:2)
Re:$500 PS3 = PS2 (Score:2)
We're about to se
Re:Console Length of Life (Score:2)
The only problems it's had is that it's really slow to load discs on startup, though not during play, and wont load some PS1 games at all anymore. It's also caked with dust, so I assume the lens might just be getting filthy.
TO be fair though, I do have a friend