Ad Viewing Required For Free Zune HD Games 131
UnknowingFool writes "In releasing the Zune HD, Microsoft decided not to open up software development on the new Zune to third parties yet. Today, Microsoft released a handful of free games for the Zune HD: Texas hold 'em, Sudoku, Space Battle 3, Shell Game, Of the Future, Hexic, Goo Splat and Chess, as well as calculator and weather apps. Users, however, are required to view an ad (up to 30 seconds in length) while the game starts up. While ad-supported free games are also on other platforms, like the iPhone, the difference here is that those iPhone games are from third parties and not from Apple."
Reader Rock3t notes related news that the Zune HD will be getting 3D games.
Not really... (Score:4, Insightful)
Not really a surprise. On the old MSN gaming network they had them, and there are permanent ones in the MSN client, and the games started over the client had them too. ;)
Microsoft have to make their money somehow, and it's not looking like it's going to be through their software
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Microsoft have to make their money somehow, and it's not looking like it's going to be through their software ;)
What about the money you just paid for the device itself?
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Re:Not really... (Score:5, Insightful)
You pay for an iPhone/iPodTouch then pay for the apps
You pay for a mobile phone, then pay for the apps
You pay for a computer, then pay for the apps
You pay for a zune, then pay....oh shit its microsoft must resist the urge to troll!
Seriously you buy the hardware, then they charge you (in the form of adverts) for additional software, big woop!
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It is not additional software if I can't get a Zune without it. They are showing ads on included paid-for software, not additional software. Wouldn't you be upset if your TV showed an ad every time you turned it on or switched inputs?
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There's also freeware, & adware (and every other *-ware) on those platforms as well.
It's not really trolling; Basic games like chess, card games, and so on, usually come free with a PC, so previous Windows users are surprised of having to pay for MS's Chess game.
I agree though, it does seem like a bit of an overblown reaction.
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You pay for a zune, then pay...
Re:Not really... (Score:4, Insightful)
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I think Douglas Adams had a neat idea called the Electric Monk. Just as you have devices for recording TV, etc., an Electric Monk believes things for you. Here, I believe we want an Electric Gumby; its job is to watch all the advertising for you so you can be free to concentrate on actual content rather than effluvium from Business School Product.
A what? (Score:1, Troll)
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that shiny brown turd
Fixed it for you...
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They haven't been brown for years and years.
The Zune 80/120 is a pretty good device.
The Zune HD is even better.
Better UI than iPods (Nano/Classic), and far better desktop software than iTunes. Great sound quality too.
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Incidentally, the sound quality is entirely dependent on your compression algorithm for this kind of device.
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Well, as I said:
1) I like the UI on the device a lot better
2) I like the software on the PC a LOT better
3) More featured (at least until this latest iteration of iPods... things like built in FM tuners, wireless access to the media store, etc)
4) Better quality sound from the same tracks on the same headphones. The DAC and hardware does make a difference here, it's not JUST the encoding.
5) Zune Pass
The Zune Pass is actually really killer... for $14.95 a month, you get 10 downloaded MP3 tracks of your choice
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I think the original was made by Toshiba, and re-branded as Microsoft.
Dunno about this new one, which will also fail to sell in any significant numbers.
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I've got an iPod, and I don't even like Apple! It was just the cheapest, large capacity mp3 player around when I needed one. That wasn't the case when I bought my previous mp3 player (Creative Zen Xtra), and who knows if it's true now. It's a tough call - Apple vs Microsoft. I'd rather buy one from just about anybody else - one's run by marketing twats and the other by lawyers. I'm really suprised a Japanese company doesn't pull its finger out and come out with something amazing. And I'm really, reall
Genious Marketing (Score:3, Insightful)
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Old habits die hard. They're used to being able to cram down anything their customers' throats because they can't escape it anyway.
Re:Genious Marketing (Score:5, Insightful)
Sure Microsoft, that IS a good idea! Ad-supported native software, straight from the mothership.
You get two choices.
Either the "free" games are sponsored or they are paid for by everyone who buys a Zune - whether they want them or not.
Which would be the Slashdot geek's next complaint.
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it's not an ad, it's a feature!
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No. With the IPod model, I get a marketplace where games and business models compete. Sure there are some free ad sponsored games. But there are also low cost no ad games. And some expensive games. And there probably are some free, no ad games as well. Point is that the consumer has their choice. Not just what the guys at Microsoft dream up.
Re:Genious Marketing (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, with an iPod model you have the choice of whatever Apple choose to approve....
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Yes, with an iPod model you have the choice of whatever Apple choose to approve....
Yeah, after one year you're limited to only about 70,000 apps!
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No. With the IPod model, I get a marketplace where games and business models compete. Sure there are some free ad sponsored games. But there are also low cost no ad games. And some expensive games. And there probably are some free, no ad games as well. Point is that the consumer has their choice. Not just what the guys at Microsoft dream up.
No. Point is with the Zune model, I don't have to go through their app store. I can just download one anywhere online that anyone programmed with visual studio and place it on my zune with no restrictions or ads or whatever. I could make an app and sell them for money without giving microsoft $100 for the privilege of deciding whether the apps I make that year will be allowed in the store or not.
Microsoft is evil, but don't ever use Apple as an example of a less evil company. Next to Apple, Microsoft's
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I can just download one anywhere online that anyone programmed with visual studio and place it on my zune with no restrictions or ads or whatever.
Ads aren't something Apple forces. If an app has an ad, it is because the developer put them there. You will run into that same problem no matter the platform.
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I can just download one anywhere online that anyone programmed with visual studio and place it on my zune with no restrictions or ads or whatever.
Ads aren't something Apple forces. If an app has an ad, it is because the developer put them there. You will run into that same problem no matter the platform.
I mentioned ads because the parent did as if Microsoft was requiring them on all applications. In that sentence, my complaint about apple are the restrictions. Your application needs to approved by Apple before you can place it on your device.
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Microsoft is evil, but don't ever use Apple as an example of a less evil company. Next to Apple, Microsoft's evil seems like they are small annoyances. Apple will place you in a torture rack and charge you for the privilege. Because the torture rack is really beautiful, has rounded corners, and an easy-to-use interface.
Why weren't you modded up as "+n Funny" ?
Clearly you missed all the legal cases against Microsoft, mounted by governments around the world. You managed not to see or hear all the evidence of
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I doubt there's any free game with no ads on the Apple Store, simply because the devs have to recoup the costs of the Apple developer license one way or another.
And then there's the whole Apple approval thing, though as long as your business model isn't "pay per baby shake" I don't see how it'd be a burden economically. Still bothersome, though, and a problem that IIRC the Zune lacks.
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Either the "free" games are sponsored or they are paid for by everyone who buys a Zune - whether they want them or not.
Which would be the Slashdot geek's next complaint.
Like the way we constantly complain about Minesweeper and Solitaire being bundled in Windows... or snakes being bundled on almost every Nokia phone ever..
I'm so proud that Linux distributions never do stuff like that.
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No. A "free" Zune Game published by Microsoft would be "subsidized"
by EVERY MICROSOFT CUSTOMER. This includes every Xbox user, every
forcefed Windows user, every forcefed msoffice user and even every
poor sap that has to run Microsoft's RDBMS product.
Somehow, I think the biggest software monopoly on the planet can
manage a few loss leader bits of software like they have included
with their Desktop OS since the dawn of time.
What's next, ads in the Win8 version of Solitaire?
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"We don't believe in coming to market like Apple - high margin, high quality, high price. We believe in high volume and low price." - Steve Ballmer speaking to TechRadar UK [techradar.com]
Personally, I prefer the Apple way but if you want to be a cheapskate and be forced to sit through ads to use a device you bought like in some cyberpunk B-movie be my guest.
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I find it most interesting that he commented margin/volume and price, but didn't comment quality...
Good for Microsoft (Score:1)
This is just like those view ads to get paid sites - except no one is going to get paid! Except for Microsoft, that is-
I think they've just taken consumer exploitation to the next level.
Don't worry... yet! (Score:1)
Isn't "HD" High Definition? (Score:2)
What does HD stand for in this context? Does it really mean high definition when they're putting out games like poker, chess, and sudoku, does it? WTF do you need high definition for that - prettier backs on the poker cards?
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"Zune HD" is the device's name..
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Ah, that's another brilliant piece of marketese, everyone assumes it has something to do with HD video. In reality, it refers to the Hybrid Digital FM radio.
Yes, really.
Re:Isn't "HD" High Definition? (Score:4, Informative)
You're confusing the definition of HD radio with the Zune HD.
Re:Isn't "HD" High Definition? (Score:5, Informative)
Do you really have to spread your fud? I'm not a microsoft fan, but at least be honest.
"The Zune HD utilizes the Nvidia Tegra 600 chip [3], allowing it to play 720p video through the optional HDMI Zune dock on a high-definition television. Otherwise, content will be scaled down to 480x272 pixels on the player's OLED screen.[5]" From wikipedia.
Also from wikipedia:
# Video support: [14]
* DVD resolution and frame rate, up to 10 Mbps bit rate, CBR or VBR for:
o H.264, Baseline profile up to Level 3.1 + B-frames support [14]
o WMV Main and Simple Profile, Advanced profile up to Level 2.
* 720p HD resolution and up to 14 Mbps bit rate, CBR or VBR for above supported video profles
* MPEG-4 Part 2 Simple Profile up to 4.0 Mbps bit rate
# 720p high definition video output - HDMI or Composite (additional dock required for both)
Re:Isn't "HD" High Definition? (Score:5, Informative)
Yes, you can playback 720p if you buy a $90 dock, for a $219 player. Meanwhile, back in reality, this means that the Zune cannot play HD video (it's only 480x272) unless you spend a significant amount of additional money (40%). They should have called it the Zune HD-ready.
The HD in the name, however, does not refer to that feature, but to the HD-radio.
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The Doc isn't just a doc, it offers wireless remote control and full functionality of the zune on your tv - including syncing, HD radio playback and HD video playback and alll other zune functionality.
The HD in zune does relate to High Definition video.. only someone severely ignorant of the direction of microsoft could claim otherwise. From 1080p instant watch HD content through Zune on Xboxlive to the 720p TV, Movies & Videos that you can download and watch on your device through either the docking s
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Guess Apple should change the name to iPhone-ready too, since you can't use it as a phone without a plan costing more than the phone itself.
Or perhaps you're just nitpicking to make the Zune look worse than it is.
Re:Isn't "HD" High Definition? (Score:4)
By that definition Apple should be calling their products the "iPhone 3GS HD" and "iPod touch HD" since they too can output "HD" video via an "optional dock".
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allowing it to play 720p video through the optional HDMI Zune dock
So really it should be Zune HD*
*HD sold separately
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Should bluray players that don't include an hdmi cable also say that?
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The price of a HDMI cable is not 40% of the price of the player (unless you let yourself be ripped off)
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Blu-ray player, new (not refurbished). $149.99
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=9245514&type=product&id=1218067604633 [bestbuy.com]
"Reasonable" HD cable: $29.99
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8427106&type=product&id=1181832627516 [bestbuy.com]
Percentage of price: 20%. Is that significant?
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I bought all of my HDMI cables for $7 or less (off of newegg), so they're a bit less than 5% of $149.99.
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Should bluray players that don't include an hdmi cable also say that?
Yes, if the blu-ray player also didn't include a blu-ray laser pickup. Then it would be:
Blu-Ray* Player
*Blu-Ray laser sold separately
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Accessory (sold separately) required to view HD on an HDTV. Zune screen shows HD videos at 480x272 - not HD. See side panel.
So your statement IS what it says.
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Let me know when it runs Android, and I'll buy one. Used, of course. WinCE is aptly named, I've never not hated it. And M$ DRM? Do not want. (My lady likes it though, so she can play WMA audiobooks... on her Zen Vision.)
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You're clever and original. Know what's better than winning the special olympics?
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The Zune HD supports both an HD radio tuner and (just barely) HD video.
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zune_HD [wikipedia.org]:
The Zune HD utilizes the Nvidia Tegra 600 chip [3], allowing it to play 720p video through the optional HDMI Zune dock on a high-definition television. Otherwise, content will be scaled down to 480x272 pixels on the player's OLED screen.
You've gotta wonder who is going to spring for that dock; I know that I've never seen a big market for video adaptors for other hand-held gaming platforms. But what do I know, I hardly ever use the external iPod speakers I got for Christmas last year.
A bit further down the same page you can find these nuggets:
The specifications as listed by the official web page of the Zune HD[...]:
Only PSP-3000 has had composite out (Score:2)
I know that I've never seen a big market for video adaptors for other hand-held gaming platforms.
By "video adaptors for other hand-held gaming platforms" are you including Super Game Boy and Game Boy Player? These take a different approach, adding a slot for a handheld's game cartridges to a console.
As for adapters that connect to the handheld system itself, Nintendo never made one to sell to the public. (There were a couple Game Boy systems with video output for demo kiosks in stores, and there was IS-NITRO-CAPTURE for authorized developers and the mainstream gaming press, but the general public ne
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You don't understand the beauty of the Zune marketplace!
Of course practically no one bought the original Zune at the original price... but when I bought my brown Zune for $75, that was a damn good buy for a 30GB player at the time. And say what you will about Microsoft in general (and I usually do), but they've keep the upgrades getting better, and kept them free. That doesn't suck.
As for the dock, when I got my Altec-Lansing dock for the orginal Zune for $30, I got to laugh at all the iPodden out there buy
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Goo splat? (Score:3, Funny)
Maybe I spend too much time on the wrong kind of websites, but I don't even want to know what that game is about!
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Goo Splat? Maybe I spend too much time on the wrong kind of websites, but I don't even want to know what that game is about!
Nothing too fancy. It's a single player puzzle game.
Something like a single player chess where the pieces' movement (or "skills") aren't fixed but depend on their shape (gooey) on that turn. The shape depends on the size and color (indicates density) of other pieces or blocks that the piece has eaten before.
There's a 3D version for the PC where the board inclination can be changed each turn, influencing the pieces' shape.
As you may have guess by this point, I just made up all that crap and I've never heard
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They must have a special department (Score:2, Funny)
There is no way any company can so consistently get things just a bit wrong every single time.
You got to wonder what the hell the person who came up with this was thinking.
Dev1: "Well we can't do squirting again."
Dev2: "And brown has be done too."
Dev3: "I know, we give them ADDS for crappy games that we offered for free with every windows version and are available everywhere for free!
Dev1 and Dev2: "Wow! They don't call you Dev3 for nothing!"
I guess it's the future... (Score:2)
Developers need to be paid. As much as we want it, it is highly unlikely that all software in the world will be developed in the form of open source projects.
While open source projects will undoubtedly continue, the paid software and software that contains ads will also always be there...
Youtube also has ads at the start of the movies. I've already adopted a strategy to have my mouse of the volume control as soon as a movie starts.
~I prefer creative advertisers who push their message into my brain to volunt
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The FOSS world has payment, too, it's just a different form of currency... sometimes. You have company-supported open source projects, paid in cash just like any other software engineering work. And you have the volunteers, who work on projects for fun, renown in the FOSS community, "building one's own toys"... eg, it's a hobby, or a technical challenge they may not find in the day job. But they all have day jobs. A sterling reputation in the FOSS community doesn't put food on the table... even Linus has a
Zune? (Score:1, Flamebait)
Zune? What is a Zune?
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It's the iPod that nobody buys and it has this feature that causes it to stop working for a few days towards the end of the year.
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http://lmgtfy.com/?q=zune
30 seconds? (Score:5, Insightful)
A lot of games on portable devices are something you might play for a few minutes to pass the time waiting for a bus, etc. If you have to wait 30 seconds for a game to start, then that's a sizeable percentage of the playing time which is ridiculous. It's even more annoying than all those trailers/adverts/previews/etc. you have to sit through at the cinema or the film preview you used to be forced to sit through on certain DVDs. And once you've seen the ad once, you're not going to watch it again for 30 seconds. If you have to advertise, put up an advertising splash screen for a few seconds with the option of the user pushing a button to exit the screen sooner.
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Are you kidding? Haven't you ever heard of PSP games that take 7 minutes to get to the gameplay?
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This could certainly explain the popularity of the Nintendo DS both
in the American suburbs and on Tokyo subway trains. A 30 second delay
on startup is going to kill the gaming experience for a lot of adults,
nevermind small children and teenagers.
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And Sony wonders why people have hacked their PSPs - a hacked PSP running the game off memory stick is much more enjoyable (mostly because it removes those crappy seek times - hey look, SSD makes life better!). Or why they're releasing the Go.
Sony should do on the PSP what Microsoft did on the Xbox360 - let people copy games to the memory stick (with DRM by having the disc in the drive, but redirecting drive read
MS going same way as Sun? (Score:2, Interesting)
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Can't it be both?
So, what is the problem? (Score:2, Insightful)
I'd rather have a selection of free games available, than none at all.
Having ads in front of it is only logical for them to make some money out of it.
Microsoft has been doing the same with Live-Messenger for quite some time: If you start up a webcamchat, you first get to see an ad for about 20 seconds.
I got very annoyed by this, so since then I've been doing my (webcam)chats through Skype. It's
Pardon the Rant on Mobile Game Ads (Score:5, Insightful)
Why is this annoying? Well, suddenly you have add boxes over key game elements, the game starts up slowly while ad loads (i.e. the much watch ad), or new start or splash pages appear that include the ads. Also, since everyone appears to use the same few ad networks, I get the same ads on every application. I feel like I got hit with some kind of bait and switch. I'll also note, that the update's description never mentions the new and exciting ad feature.
I started developing apps for the iPhone so I can understand the desire to be paid for your work. So, please think about your revenue model (and minimize the impact to players if you have ads) before your first release or better yet just sell it at a fair price. I will buy a good game. I will delete games that become unplayable and rank accordingly.
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One of things in the iTunes app store that is really getting on my nerves, is developer adding ads after the game is released. The progression goes: release a free game, wait until it is in the top 25 or gets popular, then create an update that includes ads.
This is exactly when I delete the app and give it a one star review. Quite convenient they give you that option while deleting an app.
If they're going to give me a free or "lite" app, don't jack me around later and try to turn me into a revenue model. Make a game good enough Im willing to pay a few bucks for the full version
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What I think is a greater crime are all the "lite" apps or "some other stupid clone of Wars game w/ microtransactions" that clutter the Top 25 free lists. Seriously if I'm looking for free games I want an actual fully functional free game, not a cocktease that requires me to pay you in some way for the full experience.
On that note, if anybody knows of any good up to date iPhone game directories that are 100% no strings attached free to play please for the love of god post a link!
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You can't really say that "lite" apps are useless from a consumer's perspective, since they offer you a way to try before you buy. Sadly, at the moment, it's the only way to do so.
Apple should create a separate category for demos and the Top *** lists should not contain anything from the demos category.
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I didn't say anywhere in my post that lite apps are useless. Just that they are misleading with their current categorization as "Free." Agreed that there needs to be a demo section or a "requires microtransactions to do anything worthwhile" section.
Philip K Dick : visionary (Score:5, Insightful)
"The door refused to open. It said, 'Five cents, please.'
He searched his pockets. No more coins; nothing. 'I'll pay you tomorrow,' he told the door. Again he tried the knob. Again it remained locked tight. 'What I pay you,' he informed it, 'is in the nature of a gratuity; I don't have to pay you.'
'I think otherwise,' the door said. 'Look in the purchase contract you signed when you bought this conapt.'
In his desk drawer he found the contract; since signing it he had found it necessary to refer to the document many times. Sure enough; payment to his door for opening and shutting constituted a mandatory fee. Not a tip.
'You discover I'm right,' the door said. It sounded smug.
From the drawer beside the sink Joe Chip got a stainless steel knife; with it he began systematically to unscrew the bolt assembly of his apt's money-gulping door.
'I'll sue you,' the door said as the first screw fell out.
Joe Chip said, 'I've never been sued by a door. But I guess I can live with it.'"
("Ubik", Philip K Dick)
How long until we'll be begging our Zunes to let us use our software ?
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How long until we'll be begging our Zunes to let us use our software?
About when we'll starting begging our hot girlfriends for sex.
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They Shoot Horses (Score:2)
Old news. They did this on the last version (Score:2)
Gotta watch ads for the articles too (Score:1)
Here's a video example (Score:2)
Trying to play Chess on a Zune:
http://vimeo.com/6612641 [vimeo.com]
They're doing it wrong (Score:1)
I'm not a huge EA fan but this is the perfect time for MS to copy them. Instead of a thirty second add they should have poker sponsored by Hoyle and use cards with their logo on them. The weather program can be "brought to you by the Weather Channel" or something. There are ways to advertise while minimizing the amount it pisses people off.
XNA for Zune HD (Score:1)
Re:big deal? (Score:4, Informative)
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did my mod wrong oops
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If you mean an App Store SDK, not sure what that is, but I'd bet MS will host 3rd-party apps soon.
If you mean a development SDK, they've already released one:
http://blogs.msdn.com/xna/archive/2009/09/15/xna-game-studio-3-1-zune-extensions.aspx [msdn.com]
Look for SDK support for NVidia graphics soon.
I agree with this guy, Zune game programming could be a great educational platform:
http://blogs.msdn.com/alfredth/archive/2009/09/16/zune-hd-as-a-programming-teaching-platform.aspx [msdn.com].
If you teach kids to write Zune games, you