Video Games Linked To Reckless Driving 337
An anonymous reader writes "'A new study suggests video games that involve reckless driving may play out in real life. Researchers say their data should not be taken lightly since car accidents are the number one cause of death for teenagers.' Just a case of video games being used as a convenient scapegoat, or could there be some truth to this?"
Kudos (Score:5, Informative)
Bingo. Driving games could cause reckless driving in real life. Or people who drive recklessly enjoy driving games. Reckless go-kart racing could also be associated with both games and automobile driving, but that wasn't the focus of the study.
I'm glad TFA admitted that one isn't necessarily the cause of the other, thereby bypassing the whole causation != correlation argument. Kudos for that.
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I gotta admit that I imagine throwing some red shells while driving after playing mario kart, but I can't find the button on the steering wheel so it's "back to reality" and no multi-car pileups for me.
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When I got involved in airplane modeling, I wrecked my first machine. So then I went out and bought an R/C simulator to practice at home, and about two months later I tried again.
Video gaming taught me how to fly
.
Re:Kudos (Score:4, Interesting)
I've done a little bit of research on the transfer of training from video simulations to real life. Research has shown that not everything transfers to real life, but what does transfer is procedural knowledge. If you're practicing on a flight simulator, you will learn the correct order to pull out the carb heat, drop the RPMs, lower flaps and gear. But it's a pretty rich environment up there, and there is no substitute for feeling the bumps of turbulence and engine vibration.
I've also done some practicing on an RC simulator, and it's a great way to learn without wrecking your kite. Different mental model, as you don't have the "first person" perspective of being in the plane, though.
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Does playing some mostly realistic racing game help you drive in everyday life
There are certain maneuvers it can help you with that apply to regular road driving.
When cars go into either understeer or oversteer, the natural reaction of most people is to slam on the brakes. This is fine for understeer but only makes oversteer worse. The correct reaction there is to countersteer a bit and apply more throttle. It's not enough to know technically how to do it--you have to be able to do it reflexively when you weren't expecting it to happen. A good sim racing game can train you to do that
Re:Kudos (Score:4, Insightful)
I, for one, remain skeptical. My wife doesn't play driving games of any sort and she's an awful driver. I don't play driving games either, and I'm about as boring of a driver as you'll find outside of rural Iowa. (I've been to rural Iowa, everyone drives exactly 3 miles under the posted speed limit.)
Can we do a controlled study on this? Subject some non-gamers to a large dose of GTA for 6 months and see how their driving changes with respect to a control group? Can we do actual science instead of bullshit stuides? Also, get off my lawn.
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You can't do a controlled study on this because video gamers are a self-selecting group. If you were to have two groups, one of new gamers and one of not-new, you'd not be gathering anything useful: the people who play games are, quite possibly, the same types who would have drag raced for pink slips in the 1950s.
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Re: Kudos (Score:2)
The findings do not directly link playing video games to reckless driving. They only show an association. Researchers say the impact of playing games like "Grand Theft Auto" is minimal.
I'm glad TFA admitted that one isn't necessarily the cause of the other, thereby bypassing the whole causation != correlation argument. Kudos for that.
Funny, the very last thing I did before bringing up this story was skim a newsletter from my alma mater, which included a story "Study shows teens wired to engage in risky behavior".
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It's much more likely that younger drivers like playing video games, and younger drivers are shown to be more reckless. But then again maybe not. Either way, correlation is all we have here.
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Bingo. Driving games could cause reckless driving in real life. Or people who drive recklessly enjoy driving games. Reckless go-kart racing could also be associated with both games and automobile driving, but that wasn't the focus of the study.
I'm glad TFA admitted that one isn't necessarily the cause of the other, thereby bypassing the whole causation != correlation argument. Kudos for that.
My thoughts exactly. [shakes fist] you got to it before me!
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Normally I would also be one to throw up the correlation != causation flag, but in this case, I'm leaning towards actually believing that there is a causal effect. I know that when I play video online games, the swearing rubs off on me and I curse like crazy for the next day or two (or, when I still played WoW, the next year and a half). I know that after I played Burnout or Need for Speed, I was harder on the accelerator and more likely to change lanes instead of slow down when approaching a car in front o
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Normally I would also be one to throw up the correlation != causation flag, but in this case, I'm leaning towards actually believing that there is a causal effect. I know that when I play video online games, the swearing rubs off on me and I curse like crazy for the next day or two (or, when I still played WoW, the next year and a half). I know that after I played Burnout or Need for Speed, I was harder on the accelerator and more likely to change lanes instead of slow down when approaching a car in front of me.
Of course, this is one person's anecdotal evidence, but when it corroborates the findings of a study, I find it hard to dismiss. This would be relatively easy to actually experiment on, though. Just take a random sample of teenagers who can drive, give them a random task to perform for an hour, including, but not limited to, playing racing games, then put them in the driver's seat on a controlled course. If the ones that played racing games complete the course faster or more recklessly than the ones who played other types of games, then you can demonstrate causation, if not, then you can't.
Actually that wouldn't show causation at all, because you've put them on a controlled course where pretty much anyone with an interest in driving would want to experiment. After all, that's what a controlled course is best for!
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I think it comes more from male tendencies to show off, flaunt power, and general aggressiveness that is built into us. Hell, that's
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How do you feel about the word "reckless"? Because that's the one that applies here. Kids who learn their driving habits in games aren't likely to remain wreckless in real life.
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I pity you and your shallow life."
Hmm..not sure what shows me to have a shallow life because I state that in general men seem to enjoy fast/powerful cars on a level far above what the same type cars mean to women?
Now, if you misread something in t
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Correclation != Correlation.
FTFY
Ridiculous (Score:5, Funny)
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Test Drive - taught me how to drive a manual - and the importance of gear ratios :)
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I really wonder how your evading-arrest, hooker-abuse and car-jacking skills have improved since you started playing GTA.
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hooker-abuse * * * * *
car-jacking * * *
I know, I know. I need to practice car-jacking, but I find hooker-abuse is just so much fun.
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Considering I can't finish a single GRID race, even in last place, without wiping out half a dozen times, maybe I should stay away from cars IRL?
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As for myself, without all those extended training sessions playing Carmageddon I'd never be able to jump from rooftop to rooftop safely.
I for one welcome this (Score:5, Funny)
Re:I for one welcome this (Score:5, Funny)
Get your car off my lawn!
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That's not a house; that's my wife, clod!
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That's not a house; that's my wife, clod!
<insert degoratory comment on airbags/bumper here>
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She's got proper safety padding where it counts, we'll just leave it at that :-)
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Naw ... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Naw ... (Score:5, Funny)
I can't believe you made this joke without using the Yo Dawg Meme.
"NEVER TELL ME THE ODDS!" (Score:2)
New genre of games ? (Score:2)
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Re:New genre of games ? (Score:4, Insightful)
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I found the opposite (Score:5, Interesting)
I do wonder, however, if being able to crash a car repeatedly with no real consequences has an impact on your subconcious risk-assesment of various manuvers.
Re:I found the opposite (Score:5, Funny)
I was really into Marble Madness. After playing the game, I found myself bouncing off walls and dropping into manhole covers.
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About 10 years ago I got really into the game "Midtown Madness" which features races where you race free-form through downtown Chicago picking your own route to hit a number of checkpoints. The game requires you to read traffic patterns, lights, etc far in advance. After playing the game, I found that I was doing the same thing in real traffic. My brain had been trained to observe and anticipate as if I were driving through city traffic at 80MPH rather than 35. I became much more aware of what was happening on cross streets, and in lanes other than mine. It faded back to normal, though, as I moved on to other games.
I find any heavily repeated experience will likely bleed over into other parts of your life. The question is whether you are weak-minded enough to let it overcome you. That's why I think it's silly to say "World of Warcraft made these kids flunk out of college" or "these professionals lost their jobs!" They have addictive personalities. The game hit on those pleasure centers and addictive behaviors went wild. They could have gotten hooked on gambling at the casino or any other number of things. It's the add
"Links" (Score:2)
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Perhaps the simplest solution is true? People who enjoy driving fast are naturally attracted to games featuring fast driving?
I think people who enjoy driving (not "cruising") also enjoy driving games. Reckless driving, however, is not defined as only "driving fast." Maneuvers that other drivers are not expecting, or maneuvers that are overly dangerous to yourself, are "reckless."
I love driving games, with Gran Turismo being my favorite. Speed is (obviously) an essential part of the game, but that part of it doesn't translate a desire for me to shoot down the road at 140mph (often). However, the handling aspects of the game
Kids are kids (Score:2)
When I was a young driver the only way I could drive was flat out, no compromises, just pure speed. Now 20 years later I'm calm and polite. I still enjoy a random race on the track, but on the road I have full respect for other drivers.
And you can see the exact same patter in online racing. Most of the youngster drive like they play a single player game.
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Not having a car is going to make it hard to be reckless with a car, but it sure didn't cut down on recklessness.
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Re:Kids are kids (Score:5, Insightful)
See? These cultural blinders we don't even know we're wearing. Only in America and related countries is it "traditional" for teenagers to be risk-takers. Decades of MTV have taken effect. I live inside another culture and here, teens are assumed to have other traits, none of which is a fondness for irresponsible behavior. In fact, the very idea of "teenager" doesn't really exist.
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers. Plato
Re:Kids are kids (Score:4, Insightful)
Because in western culture its not typical to get married early, there is a time where teenagers have a time to really decide what they want to do with their life and yes, some of it may involve -gasp- risk taking, but the entire mentality is born out of the fact that life expectancies have increased dramatically.
I'm sure in all of the other countries there are reckless kids but because they are poor they start families earlier, take more risky jobs, etc. and so its not considered to be "risky" when it really involves a high mortality rate.
In many other countries in the present and in the past, it used to be that you could die from pretty typical stuff like an infection, common illnesses, etc. since we've conquered most of that in the west with the exception of things like cancer, of course car accidents are going to be the leading cause of death because what else would a western teenager die from? We've thankfully ended the tyrannical practice of having a non-volunteer army so kids aren't being killed in wars, cured the vast majority of sicknesses, need to use very little hard labor for the vast majority of things, etc. so the common causes of death in other countries don't exist in the west for teenagers.
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Not video games... video game music (Score:2)
Try driving an SUV while listening to the Halo soundtrack. THAT'S dangerous.
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Cruise control is a necessity whenever random brings up "Truth and Reconciliation Suite". Doesn't matter what sort of vehicle.
Bunch of idiots (Score:3, Insightful)
Why they don't go and study the effects of videogames in driving on the following subjects:
- improved reflexes
- risk control (you know what happens in the vg if you do this, so I'm not trying in real life)
- steering control (see above)
Instead they just want to go the "videogames are bad" route
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There have been a number of studies on how video games can improve skills. For instance, surgeons [msn.com] who play video games are better at laparoscopic surgery than those that don't.
Re:Bunch of idiots (Score:5, Interesting)
Top Gear vs Gran Turismo [youtube.com] - Possibly the most awesome thing ever posted to
wiki reference [wikipedia.org]
I've seen this done by other gaming mags before with similar results. If someone has those links that would be awesome as well.
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2) Wrecking your own and everybody else's car without consequence is teaching you risk control? Hah! Paying 100€ for a minor scratch and the hassle with repair shops and insurance, THAT teaches you risk control.
Yeah, that as well
What I mean is "you have to brake now if you don't want to hit that wall"
Curiously, I learned how braking is "different" under rain IRL. Thankfully it didn't cost me anything.
Spy Hunter (Score:5, Interesting)
People have been claiming this since Spy Hunter came out. It was bunk then and it is bunk now. It's not video games that make you drive fast, it's the Peter Gunn theme.
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People have been claiming this since Spy Hunter came out. It was bunk then and it is bunk now. It's not video games that make you drive fast, it's the Peter Gunn theme.
Whatever, man... All I know is that when those armored cars come to try and run me off the road, I'd better be prepared to hit back.
oh the irony (Score:4, Funny)
Very Sad (Score:2)
Teens found a way of dieing by driving accidents way before video games ever came along. If there's a way to identify higher risk youths then that's all and good I suppose. This just brings me back to my teenage years where there were a few people in my schools who ended up dieing in accidents (usually associated with drinking and driving, but that's another discussion).
I'll believe it. (Score:2)
Teenagers are really really stupid.
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I'm no "smarter" at 35 than I was at 15. I am, however, a lot more imaginative about the number of ways in which you can die horribly.
I just want be prepared... (Score:4, Funny)
I'd say definitely "yes"! (Score:2)
I've gotten big into sim racing e.g. GTR 2 and I noticed that my driving habits changed in a negative way. I found myself following "the line" on roads, cutting corners, accelerating faster, and breaking harder. This wasn't intentional at all since I've always been a cautious driver to the point of paranoia. It wasn't until blew past a slower truck (in the mindset of a slower GT2 class car in my way) half on a median and half in his lane that I realized how bad I had gotten. I'm now very conscious about
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Kids suck at driving, and mostly play games (Score:2)
You can't say that just because kids play video games and also drive poorly there's any relation. Kids always have driven badly - it's just that the worst drivers are also attracted to playing games. Violent driving games are not a cause, they are an indication of the interests of the average testosterone filled youth.
The best thing you can do for a teenage driver is to give them cars with great handling but not too much engine. Something like a mini cooper (not the S), or otehr car that handles well but
alleiviates organ donor shortage (Score:2)
Overconfidence (Score:2)
While the study assumes that the gamers learn bad habits like tailgating and driving over curbs from GTA, overconfidence may be another factor (assuming causation = correlation here, which I'm not completely convinced). How many teens have spent hours driving around in virtual worlds and think it will be a piece of cake when they get behind the wheel of a car made out of atoms instead of bits/bytes.
My daughter is an expert driver in Ralley GT, but she came within 3 feet of taking out our fence the other da
The plural of "anecdote" is "data", right? (Score:2)
Or it could just be a common cause (Score:2)
It could just be that the kind of reckless idiot who drives dangerously also likes to drive dangerously in his video games. The link isn't between the video game and the reckless driving, it's between the basic recklessness and the behavior in both games and driving.
Probably so (Score:2)
If it is true, then it is probably caused by subconscious programming. Just like kata "programs" the body and mind to respond without thought, aggressive driving games probably program aggressive driving behavior. It probably doesn't effect everyone and those it effects are probably effected to varying degrees.
Some of it will come from one confusing one's ability in video games with one's abilities in real life.
Some will come from believing that video game physics are the same as real world physics.
Some wil
Grand Turismo... (Score:2)
About 8 or more years ago I spent a saturday morning playing GT on the PS/2. I was working on unlocking the various license classes, and was really into it for 2 or 3 hours. The wife asked me to run to the store to pick up something. About a mile from my house I realized I was driving like a complete maniac...
Games!??? What about music. (Score:2)
I don't know about you guys, but with myself I noticed that when my car radio is playing an "agressive" (for example, heavy metal) or fast beat kind of music my driving gets a lot more reckless than after I've just had a session of playing GTA.
In fact, interestingly enough, while playing GTA I find myself tunning the in-game car radio for that kind of tunes much more than slower/placid ones.
More effect than cause (Score:2)
Yeah because none of us that were teenagers before games consoles were invented ever drove fast. NOT.
Latest study released! (Score:2)
Study claims some people react poorly to some things! World stunned! Slashdot enraged! Members engorged! Politicians scandalized! Pointless and boring film at 11 between the police blotter and the taped report from the orchid festival!
Why am I elbow deep in 1000-pin parts and ruing my eyesight scanning 600 page user manuals for the one poorly documented "gotcha" that could ruin my whole multimillion dollar R&D? Why do I live with this stress? Where do I send my resume so I can spend my work days doing *
Race Drivin' (Score:4, Interesting)
When I was 15, Race Drivin' (the sequel to Hard Drivin') was out; it was a sit-down racing simulator with amazingly realistic wheel feedback/physics. Unlike basically every other game I've played, the car you were driving behaved much like a real car. (ie, you could fish tail, and if you steered with the slide you could recover)
The first time I ever accidentally fishtailed my car in real life, I instinctively steered with the slide and recovered. I've heard that people without training tend to turn against the slide and exacerbate the problem. I have always thought that without my really extensive Race Drivin' playing, I wouldn't have reacted that way. (And when I say extensive, I mean it - I got to the point where I could gain time on laps and once played for an entire hour and stood up with the "remaining time" at the cap.)
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Heh, slide recovery was actually one of the plot points from the Pixar "Cars" movie.
I enjoy playing the racing sims (Race Drivin', Ferrari F350, GT4, Live 4 Speed, with the FF wheel and clutch and everything) more than the arcade racers (which, to me, are indistinguishable from sliding down a tube... though I do like the Burnout series for making crash-cars fun like back in our Hotwheels die-cast car days).
I learned a lot of interesting techniques, esp. from GT4. It made driving our car (a boring 2001 Maz
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Knowing your car's limit is the best thing anyone can do to become a better driver.
Re:Race Drivin' (Score:4, Informative)
Now imagine a snowy rural highway with a 90 degree curve to the right. It's a fairly broad curve, and banked a bit so you can maintain 55 through it. You hit an icy patch and start to slide. Yes, your car will be pointed too far to the right, but since you were going 55 mph this time your rear wheels aren't just going to rotate around the front. Your vehicle is going to slide up into the opposite lane. As you see yourself moving into the wrong lane, the natural reaction is to steer to the right even more to get back into the right lane. It can be pretty damn hard to do the correct thing and steer left, especially if the shoulder is coming up at you quickly.
Re:Race Drivin' (Score:4, Informative)
If the back end of your car loses traction and wants to come around the front end, you can do a couple of things. Steering into the slide AND applying the throttle (for rear-wheel drive) will set the rear end and cause the tires to gain traction, which stops the slide. Force yourself to watch an entire NASCAR event, and you'll see this 100 times per race.
In any case, a lot of things about driving well are counter-intuitive, which explains why there are so many bad drivers. A small example would be the number of people in this thread who talk about how video games taught them to steer with the wheel better. But in real performance driving, you drive more with the throttle input and braking than you do with the steering wheel.
May be true. Still no scapegoat for common sense. (Score:3, Interesting)
People talk about having positive role models for children. This is because we, as humans, look towards those we admire and emulate them. Race car drivers, whether real, in a video game, on a movie screen are "cool" in a lot of people's eyes. What they do is cool. Their lives are cool. We envy the thrills for which they get paid.
I remember several years ago I had some sneak preview tickets for The Fast and the Furious: Tokyo Drift. Let me just say that I waited 30 minutes after the end of that movie before everyone who had just seen it had finished peeling out of the parking lot and speeding away recklessly. And these were normal people, from a wide range of age groups. Maybe the young ARE more impressionable, but that doesn't allow one to place the blame solely on the medium. Any example of alternate behavior lends itself to emulation. Whether that takes the form of a "copycat" killer or holding the door open for someone isn't necessarily the result of exposure, but merely the impulsiveness and decision-making skills of the one exposed. Whether you agree or disagree on the merits, this is why we have ratings systems for video games. And for film. To limit the exposure from those whose decision-making skills haven't completely matured, albeit deciding who is limited in an arbitrary manner.
This isn't meant to advance a viewpoint one way or the other - it's merely an observation.
Burnout (Score:2, Informative)
I used to play an excessive amount of Burnout on the PlayStation. In that game you get points for side-swiping other cars. I found myself targeting and aiming for cars in real life. I stopped playing the game because of that.
A generation gap joke re: driving (Score:2)
While driving, an amusing point and counterpoint occurred to me many years ago:
[young person] It terrifies me to think that I’m sharing the road with people who grew up before the era of videogame sensory overload.
[old person] It terrifies me to think that I’m sharing the road with people who learned to drive in an environment where they’re used to having three lives.
Catholic Priests (Score:3, Insightful)
See, I knew they'd find the cause of all this reckless driving. Now if they could only unearth what videogame causes all those Catholic Priests to become pedophiles. And which videogame turns ordinary muslims into suicide bombers. Then we'd have all the world's problems solved.
Expressed as a Manatee joke (Score:2)
You think that's bad...? What about the time I went driving with the radio on right after my all-night Amplitude gaming session?
I guess this explains things... (Score:2)
I've always wondered my driving was so reckless... and why I felt compelled to throw turtle shells out my window.
Gaming & Driving (Score:3, Funny)
I would no more drive a car immediately after playing a racing game than I would drive a car after having a couple of drinks.
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But if you drink while playing the racing game and then drive, it's OK, it all cancels out.
Tetris proved this... (Score:3, Funny)
Sean
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That made me laugh... fanx mate :)
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If we want kids to be safe drivers, we'd have to teach them that fun is bad.
Careful there. Fun really isn't necessarily bad, though they do correlate at times*. Fun just isn't always the ideal goal when making one's decisions and kids simply have a harder time overcoming the desire for fun.
* moreso the more conservative one's authority figures. This also suggests that they're both subjective and don't necessarily work on the same value scale either. E.g. While others do, I don't find knitting fun, but nobody would call it a bad thing.