What Pinball Looks Like When the Stakes Are High 133
siobHan writes "The PAPA World Pinball Championships recently concluded in Scott, PA (near Pittsburgh), as covered on Slashdot already. The organizers recorded full 1080p/60 HD video of the playfield during the final games, and have uploaded the entirety of the crucial deciding game, with commentary (direct link to just the video). The winner of this game received $10,000 for his skillful play."
I wish (Score:1)
I would not want to see the breakdown by hour (Score:5, Insightful)
Granted the time at the tournament would make it look good but if you average all the time spent getting there. The payoff is recognition amongst your peers more than monetary rewards.
To get to that level you need like own games and p (Score:1)
To get to that level you need like own games and play alot and then you have to pay to get in to the Championships and the good players enter like 4-5 times or more on the same game hoping to get a good qualify score and you need to do on more then one game.
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Monitor (Score:5, Funny)
I knew I had my 20" monitor oriented vertically all this time for an eventual reason - to play this video optimally.
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At least in Firefox, "Zoom Out" is also an option.
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I thought the same thing when I saw this video pop-up: why in the world would anyone make this vertical with widescreen monitors being so prevalent? Any vertical resolution less than 1000 would have a hard time viewing this whole video, and I've seen a lot of laptops offering less than 1000.
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Um, because pinball games are vertical? Seriously if the orientation were different there would be a lot more complaint. Pinball isn't built for widescreen...
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Or just get a higher res one.
The video, at the res that it was embedded on the page, fit perfectly on my screen. And my browser window, Opera reports, is 1508x972 - so any 1050 pixel or taller laptop display should be able to view it.
(I was about to say, get a 2048x1536 screen in a 4 year old laptop, like I did, but then I realized my browser window isn't full screen, and you don't need anywhere near that.)
Re:Monitor (Score:4, Insightful)
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The question is; why do people buy so much widescreens? The only good reason I can think of is if you watch widescreen movies on your PC a lot.
My 23" 4:3 is nice, and it could even pivot if Windows could handle the pivotting without blue-screening after three or four flips.
A square screen would probably be ideal for general productivity work but I haven't seen one yet.
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Because Fallout 3 looks so friggin' awesome in 1650x1080.
Seriously, that's why I bought mine.
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I can't speak for anyone else but it's because I got them cheap. Dell was pretty much giving them away with the purchase of a vostro for a while and I brokered a deal that left me with this monitor and the buyer with a 17" 4x3. I got my 20" gateway LCD with a $125 Athlon 64 X2 4000+ :D
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The question is; why do people buy so much widescreens?
As another poster said, side-by-side windows. I never bought into dual monitors, but I love widescreen. I also use it to watch movies and play console games.
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Because your eyes field of view is wide rather than tall.
Problem is that industry choose to change the AR from 4:3 to 16:9 keeping the diagonal size constant, while they should've kept constant the height (or, at least, the vertical resolution).
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Because I often have multiple pieces of content playing at once. Widescreen (like a book) provides the best format for presenting multiple lists concurrently.
Why are widescreen monitors so prevalent? (Score:3)
Because wide-screen monitors permit you to to view 2 vertical windows simultaneously?
Because with vertical content, it's preferable to scroll vertically rather than horizontally?
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Hahaha!
That was similar to my reaction when I opened the page with my 26" portrait oriented monitor. I said "yeah! take that! landscape mode suckers!". I was waiting to say that for over a year...
Too bad I found the video boring... but it still fills my entire screen so I can see its boring-ness in all its glory!
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Re:Pinball Fantasies (Score:5, Insightful)
Pinball Fantasies is the best software pinball game that I've ever played. Stones'n'Bones kept me busy for weeks in all its 320x400 pixel glory, scrolling with silky smoothness on a 386 CPU, and awesome tracker music that never got old.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinball_Fantasies [wikipedia.org]
Some brazilian guy is currently building a full size replica of the "Party Land" table. [flickr.com] It looks pretty good already!
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I'd say pinball dreams is in many ways better. My brother has probably got the best scores for that in the world on all tables.
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They're both by the same developers. They also had a third pinball game, Pinball Illusions, which was also great.
It has always surprised me that those guys could do excellent pinball games and pretty much all other pinball games to this day (except Metroid Prime Pinball on NDS) have sucked big time.
Sure, they looked great and had all kinds of whizzy effects, but the physics just feel wrong in most pinball games. And since it's essentially a game about physics, that's a pretty big problem.
I've always wondere
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There's a pinball game on DSiWare by the makers of Metroid Prime Pinball, supposedly a very good one as well. Pinball Pulse [nintendolife.com].
Maybe choosing the right variables is hard to get just the right amount of friction, bounce and gravity into the game. Maybe other developers don't pay enough attention to how real machines behave.
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You know, thanks to the Source engine (and consequently Havoc physics) being available for making mods for free to anyone who owns a Source engine game, I'd wager that it could be used to make a pretty realistic pinball game with the built-in physics. I wonder why anyone hasn't done it yet. =|
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As an Easter Egg in Pinball Fantasies, the developers gave some technical info about the game code on the table score boards. If I remember correctly, the ball physics are updated 200 times per second, rather than at the monitor refresh rate.
I did a RAM Scan of the Amiga version, and there's a full-sized 2-color bitmap for the physics. It's rather strange, and appears quite sophisticated. Any line only 1 pixel in width was for the table angle, and 2 or more pixels was a border. Different cross hatching
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Because it's a very hard problem, much harder than physics in your typical shooter. Usually in a shooter you don't have to model physics at a very
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They're both by the same developers. They also had a third pinball game, Pinball Illusions, which was also great.
It has always surprised me that those guys could do excellent pinball games and pretty much all other pinball games to this day (except Metroid Prime Pinball on NDS) have sucked big time.
You should check out all of the pinball hall of fame games. The physics are spot on and they are all great recreations of old real pinball tables. Here is a wiki link with the two versions: pinball hall of fame [wikipedia.org]
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I don't know what it is about Brazil, but I've seen a lot of creative electronic engineering come out of that country.
A friend's friend purchased an arcade cabinet with a South American version Street Fighter II. It's is a special (I believe bootleg) version of Street Fighter II with all kinds of mods - pressing Start during the game changes characters in the middle of a round, for instance. Slow Hadouken curves upwards, medium goes straight, and fast goes downwards. You can throw a lot of moves in the air
Re:Pinball Fantasies (Score:4, Informative)
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I am completely in love with Metroid Prime Pinball for the DS. I'm not a pinball aficionado, and have no idea if it's really that good, but when I need a short distraction, that's my go-to game--more so even than TetrisDS.
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It's a massive hit - my wife likes it, my kids like it, I like it...it's great. Pinball Dreams is where it started for me though - the Nightmare [youtube.com] table is massively play
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I second that. Had a version on the PC and it was the first time I got to play pinball without running out of money in 3 seconds. Anytime I happened to get a high score on a table my dad would be sure to crush it utterly though hehe.
When high (Score:5, Funny)
What Pinball Looks like When...High:
BEEB BEEB BEEB...LIKE WH0A...NOM NOM NOM NOM...O NOES...
o....when stakes are high...
"I mean if Pacman affected our generation as kids, we would all run around in darkened rooms eating pills and listening to repetitive music."
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Yes, pinball at high stakes is very different, but what if you were playing pinball for YOUR LIFE.
now thats high stakes.
Re:When high (Score:5, Funny)
Careful there, you are dangerously close to actually getting the joke.
Kinda makes me nostalgic for Windows (Score:2, Funny)
Ah Pinball (Score:2, Interesting)
Memories of misspent youth and quarters.
I could pop a quarter in an Eight-Ball Deluxe machine and play all day. I was able to hit most of the specials and rack up credits for free play. Sometimes I even left a few on the machine when I had to go.
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"Make the eight ball, corner pocket..."
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For playing with real tilt on a computer:
n900 + dosbox + acceleromymote.
Start the joystick emulation. Run dosbox and the keymapper -- with all those games using port 60 instead of the BIOS you have to remap physical keys anyway; you need left shift, right shift, then whatever you need to start the game (F1-F4 in Pinball Dreams/Fantasies). Then, remap the joy up event to space. Play PD/PF/whatever else.
Laptops don't have accelerometers and are too unwieldy, iPhone has no keyboard. It might be possible to
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For years, there was an Eight Ball Deluxe machine in the Minneapolis airport that didn't have a functioning tilt sensor. I looked forward to flying through that airport every time, until they finally removed it...
However, for other machines that had sensitive tilt sensors, I couldn't consistently win games, as it much too often ran the ball right down the middle, without my ever even getting a chance at a save.
Love that machine. I haven't played for a while, but do remember there being a functional simula
Where are the women? (Score:3, Funny)
I noticed something very strange: It's all men. Where are the women players? In the audience? At least, why didn't the audience bring their wives and girlfriends?
Re:Where are the women? (Score:5, Funny)
Pinball is in a sad state. (Score:5, Interesting)
There is only one pinball manufacturer in the world right now, and they didn't get there by being the best engineers, artists or designers. They got there by being/having the scummiest lawyers. Now we're stuck with horrible designs, bad gameplay, and most of the best IP buried in an unmarked grave in wrigley field.
Re:Pinball is in a sad state. (Score:5, Informative)
Tilt: The battle to save pinball is a great documentary to watch.
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I don't understand the lawyer comment. Stern is a continuation of Sega. We have one manufacturer in the world because Williams left to make slot machines and pinball doesn't make much money. If Stern dropped out then we'd have 0 manufacturers and nobody would take their place. Stern has made some pigs, but they also made Simpson's Pinball Party, Family Guy, and LOTR which are all great games.
Re:Pinball is in a sad state. (Score:5, Interesting)
You've obviously never had to service any of them. Stern has a nasty tendency to release their designs before fully testing them. For an entertaining read check out the code revisions and dates for Pirates of the Caribbean.
Back EMF is a recurring issue on several modern Stern designs; due to things like poor wire routing choices and underspec'ing diodes on larger coils.
Want a nightmare? Check out the membrane switches under the motorcycle toy on Harley Davidson.
I could literally rant for hours about Stern and never repeat myself. They are garbage whose horribleness is only eclipsed by the complete shite rolling off the lines of Gottlieb starting in the early 70's and culminating with Water World.
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Re:Pinball is in a sad state. (Score:5, Informative)
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You're dead on with that. The spider chips on those cursed System 1 boards made the damn game boards into toxic cheese graters as soon as they failed.
Good riddance to them, the aftermarket replacements are much better products. Now if something could be done about the flawed ramp designs and their "smart switches".
The one thing I do like about Gottliebs from the solid state era is their choice of connector for the interconnects. The rest of the industry's choice of the 0.168 and 0.1 tension pins will plag
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Re:Pinball is in a sad state. (Score:4, Funny)
> Want a nightmare? Check out the membrane switches under the motorcycle toy on Harley Davidson.
That was on purpose. It pays homage to the years AMF owned Harley.
Stern originally wanted to make them leak oil too, but their lawyers vetoed the idea since patrons might hurt themselves walking on greasy floors.
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Re:Pinball is in a sad state. (Score:4, Insightful)
Granted Bally had some stinkers, but with a roster like this it's hard to back up your argument:
The Addams Family
Attack From Mars
Cactus Canyon
Champion Pub
Cirqus Voltaire
Safecracker
Theatre of Magic
The Twilight Zone
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Having lived about half a mile from there, I'd have to agree with you. That's a pretty run-down area, even for Pittsburgh.
I even mentioned this story to my wife, who said she couldn't imagine giving someone directions to the site, from the nearest freeway.
PC! (Score:2)
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Pinball really is a lost bit of nostalgia. I bet you a LOT of money could be made if classic machines such as Dr. Who, Attack from Mars, Revenge From Mars, Terminator, were adapted to the PC. I mean, Maxis' Full Tilt Pinball is the last decent pinball sim I can think of. And that was circa Windows 3.1
I agree. Although, while I haven't followed this in a while and I don't use Windows at home anymore, I was thrilled 7 or 8 years ago with vpinmame and Visual Pinball for machines like The Twighlight Zone, the Adams Family, and, well, Whirlwind, since I played that a lot in college. Actual ROMs, photographs of the tables as backgrounds, and real physics you could even edit, and it was all free (except for the ROMs technically, I guess...). Not sure what the status of these projects is these days, but I am
Re:PC! (Score:4, Insightful)
http://www.vpforums.org/ [vpforums.org] is the site you seek.
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Pinball really is a lost bit of nostalgia. I bet you a LOT of money could be made if classic machines such as Dr. Who, Attack from Mars, Revenge From Mars, Terminator, were adapted to the PC. I mean, Maxis' Full Tilt Pinball is the last decent pinball sim I can think of. And that was circa Windows 3.1
There are the two pinball hall of fame games [wikipedia.org] that have some of the great gottlieb and williams games. I'm hoping they do a bally one sometime too. At least midevil madness was one of the ones they have ported.
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There are the two pinball hall of fame games [wikipedia.org] that have some of the great gottlieb and williams games. I'm hoping they do a bally one sometime too. At least midevil madness was one of the ones they have ported.
Oh wow, I had never heard of either of these. Thanks for the tip! Unfortunately it looks like they have some tables exclusive to PS3 and 360, which is rather annoying considering I am a Wii owner only. A Bally one would be good because that would cover Dr. Who, Attack from Mars, and Revenge from Mars all in one shot. Glorious day that would be.
The best, easily-accessable pinball setup I saw (Score:4, Informative)
There were two:
The arcade at Dixie Landings in Walt Disney World. They had an entire wall that was nothing but pinball machines...at least 20-30 in a row. The second was at a place in Gaithersburg, MD that shut down about 12 years or so ago, called Sportland America. They too had an entire wall of just pinball machines, although they had closer to 40 or 50 of them.
Such good times. I miss pinball machines :(
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If you're ever in Phoenix, stop by Castles and Coasters... they have 20 or so pinball machines in the arcade, if I remember correctly.
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If you ever visit Oslo, Norway, check out the place Tilt (pictures [pinball.no]). They have 15 machines, selected from the owners' collection of 230.
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Pinball Museum (Score:1)
http://www.pinballmuseum.org/ [pinballmuseum.org]
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http://www.shortydog.com/
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OCNJ on the boardwalk go to Jillies... they have a bunch of good machines there. 15-20. Open 24 hours too.
meh (Score:2)
If it's pinball and it's not Medieval Madness, it almost certainly sucks.
TROLLLLLLLSSSS!
OT: Pinball on a Stick (Score:4, Informative)
If you are in the twin cities area, go to the MN State fair. There's a room with nothing but pins. This is a welcome change from the increasing numbers of shooting gallery & ticket redemption machines invading the fair.
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This is near(ie in the same building) the Penny Arcade or Playland, whichever one exists.
What it looks like (Score:3, Informative)
What it looks like is unfortunately amazingly boring. Most of the game is the player holding the flipper up so the ball stops, releasing, then making a good shot.
The shots take skill, and there's always the trick of using the right amount of tilt etc, but I find it near unwatchable.
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I was surprised at the bumping the first ball got without tilting. And that player held the ball a lot more than the 2nd player/ball. Got boring after that for me tho so that was my limit.
I got a cheap home pinball machine one year for christmas. I thought the name was "flying circus" but looking around I don't see it. The scoreboard was analog - it was a giant wheel numbered 1-100 around its circumference, and showed the score by showing a small patch of the dial at the top. Every time you hit a ramp
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That's why I like the 4th guy. He's a bit more random in his playing style, but he actually nailed several ramps back-to-back, unlike the other perfectionists. His score didn't go quite as high, but he spent a lot less time idling and played it like a normal person rather than a committee-designed robot.
Those guys who just sit there all day, planning their shot like a goddamned golfer, are indeed ultra-boring. There was a crap pin, I think it was Stargate, that had a truly game-breaking oversight in that
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Oh man (Score:1)
Pinball is great, even for the young generation.
In the basement we have 24, Theater of Magic, and Spiderman :)
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Sports that are boring to watch: (Score:4, Funny)
Golf
Bowling
NASCAR
Pinball
Tennis
Bicycling
Sailing
Swimming
Gymnastic Ribbon (WTF is that)
Water Ballet
You forgot these boring sports to watch... (Score:2)
Cricket
Darts
Crown Green Bowling
Curling
Snooker (Or Pool or Billiards - all painful)
Oval Car Racing (not just NASCAR, but IndyCar also guilty)
Marathon Running
Weightlifting
Dressage
Baseball (sorry, US folks, but it's interminable if watched live)
Archery
Fishing
What Pinball Looks Like When the Stakes Are High (Score:5, Funny)
looks pretty much the same as when the stakes are low.
Low Maintenance Tables? (Score:1)
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Check the pinball 101 pages on http://www.flippers.be/ [flippers.be] that should teach you most you have to know when buying your first pinball machine..
Insert Coin (Score:3, Funny)
"The winner of the $10,000 prize purse at the World Pinball Championships has requested his entire winnings in quarters."
Ah memories... (Score:2)
Most of my college years were spent in front of the Creature From The Black Lagoon table (The table in the article + Licensing Deal). I could drop a 20 pence coin in there, play 5 or 6 games and walk away leaving multiple credits behind.
I don't know that I'd handle the consistency of play required to get into this sort of competition, but my averages were way above what these guys ended on, with a personal best of 911M and change.
Re:Table Selection (Score:2)
I didn't get any of the MetaGame from the article, so the best I can figure is that suppose you were indeed a deadly hotshot at Lagoon, the champion might know 5 machimes, and stick the results on Knight Rider or something.
Ramdom Guess here, but certain people can be am expert at any one machine, so if the Champ plays the MetaGame right, his 3rd best machine might leave you ruined.
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Yeah, no argument there.
Lagoon was the only one I really aced, though I could hold my own on Twilight Zone (even with its accursed ceramic ball) and the 90's Star Wars table (The one with the mini-game video games on the LED's up top).
But yeah, like I said, no consistency of play. Put me in front of any table other than those 3 and I was laughable at best.
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There's a reason why every pinball videogame includes buttons to nudge the table. Hitting it without triggering the tilt is part of the game.
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Pinball machines give you a certain number of warnings when the sensor goes off before you actually lose your ball. Notice that the display says "danger" when he does it and it also seems to give an auditory warning, but I can't make out what it says.
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Actually, I meant to say the display says "warning", not "danger". The one time I accidentally hit submit instead of preview and it actually goes through instead of telling me to wait longer and this happens.