Why Microsoft Embraced Gaming 146
wjousts writes "A interesting take on the birth of the Xbox from Technology Review: 'When the original Xbox video-game console went on sale in 2001, it wasn't clear why Microsoft, known for staid workplace software, was branching out into fast-paced action games. But Microsoft decided that capitalizing on the popularity of gaming could help the company position itself for the coming wave of home digital entertainment. "Microsoft saw the writing on the wall," says David Dennis, a spokesman for Xbox. "It wanted to have a beachhead in the living room." ... Now Microsoft is linking Xbox 360, its most successful consumer-focused brand, with others that have not been as well received. It is integrating Bing, its search engine, into Xbox and Xbox Live to enable people to search for multimedia content. By the end of the year, Microsoft is expected to unveil an updated Xbox Live design that is more in line with the look of Windows phones and the forthcoming Windows 8.'"
needs more than that (Score:1)
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In the consumer market? Yes. In the business market, you're definitely mistaken. I don't know why, but once an organization becomes of a certain size, Microsoft is unavoidable and PHBs, CEOs and other three-letter-higher-ups absolutely want only to hear about Microsoft.
As such, I'd wager to say that, yes, there are people who love Microsoft and have very high brand loyalty to it.
Of course, it doesn't have the religious following Apple has, but there are some real Microsoft lovers[1]. Events like Vista,
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I still think 7 is a polished Vista
You say that like most others wouldn't agree with you. Of course that's all Win7 is: they polished the turd that is Vista, though they actually did a pretty good job of it, fixing most of the performance problems and such, so now people just don't have so much reason to complain like they did with Vista. But yes, the interface is definitely different (I don't like it either).
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Meh. I like 7. I really disliked Vista.
I relatively regularly use Ubuntu, RedHat, Windows XP, Windows 7, Windows Vista, and Android.
now people just don't have so much reason to complain
So in other words, it's not really that bad, but people still dislike it? out of principle, I guess?
Sounds like the same thing that happens with Linux. People don't like it. Why? I dunno. It's "different" or it's not "supported" or it's "slow" or it's "communist" or who knows what else. Typically, there aren't really good answers by typical users. Actually, I'd say it'
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Sounds like the same thing that happens with Linux. People don't like it. Why? I dunno. It's "different" or it's not "supported" or it's "slow" or it's "communist" or who knows what else.
How about "not compatible with the applications that I need to use" or "not compatible with the hardware that I own"? I've run into both at various times, as you mention with Sibelius, NWN, Reaper, etc. Or they disagree with the direction in which Unity and GNOME Shell are headed, such as Unity's mystery-meat [webpagesthatsuck.com] menu bar that's often half a screen away from the focused window. Granted, Mac OS X likewise has a problem of the menu bar being far from the window, but at least its global menu isn't mystery meat hid
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Debian, Free download... (Score:1)
Re:Contiki, Free download... (Score:1)
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Even though it sounded like you were disagreeing with "Nobody likes microsft", what you said is 100% consistent. Indifference != like.
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well even tho they succeeded on launching their gaming business, I believe they really REALLY need to start building brand loyalty, NOBODY likes microsoft as a company, you might like windows, xbox, and games for windows live (why like GFWL is beyond me but whatever),but if MS went crashing and burning down today, nobody would really care about the company, about the services, yes; but about the company.. not really.
I would agree that they could use more brand loyalty. Microsoft has never been great at image; they constantly fail to look hip, cool, or caring.
Look at at their competitors. Sony has repeatedly pissed on their customers left and right, but yet they still manage to have fanboys proclaiming how evil Microsoft is. Apple has managed to convince legions that missing a feature is a feature itself, and it's scary outside the walls of their garden. They even had a CEO that was viewed as a messiah.
Then again, i
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Apple was the brand loyalty king for all of about 15 minutes until Google took that away then Facebook seems to have grabbed it
Yeah, Apple are real has-beens in the brand-loyalty stakes. That's why the iPod didn't sell that well and more recently the iPhone and iPad have been complete disasters that even their few buyers hated and didn't queue around the block or hang on to Steve Jobs' every word when the new one was due.
Seriously, what parallel universe are you living in where this is the case?
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I think MS has been reforming their image, some. Their gaming consoles have helped... I don't think they're nearly as reviled now as they were in the days of windows '95. They're too big and slow and clumsy to be 'cool', but they can still manage 'adequate'.
Sure... (Score:2)
I bought my Sega because I believed it would lead me into a larger world.
I bought my Playstation because I believed I would become more self actualised (whatever the heck that means.)
Funny how they are in boxes, gathering dust, which I continue to use a desktop computer.
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I bought my Playstation because I believed I would become more self actualised (whatever the heck that means.)
So, you were waiting for Maslow's Quest to be released too? I guess the developers just couldn't code "peak experiences".
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I don' t buy games, I get them via blockbuster, much cheaper than buying.
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That is why I only had an Atari 2600. Computers are so much better than video game consoles. :)
Computers vs. consoles (Score:3)
Computers are so much better than video game consoles. :)
I agree with you, except in one case: when you have friends over. Not a lot of PC game developers anticipate a situation with a gaming PC hooked up to a TV and four USB gamepads.
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True, but that won't happen with me these days. ;)
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I miss those late nights playing Goldeneye on 4-player, on a tiny CRT TV.
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But if everyone that comes over has their own laptop and a copy of the game being played
Which is a highly uncommon scenario in my extended family. If I asked each invitee to buy their own computer and their own copy of each game that they plan to play, I would be considered a terribly over-demanding party host. A lot of these invitees are under 18 and thus have no way to earn the money to buy a computer; they have to save below-minimum-wage chore money for months just to afford games as it is.
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Reverse It (Score:2)
By the end of the year, Microsoft is expected to unveil an updated Xbox Live design that is more in line with the look of Windows phones and the forthcoming Windows 8.'
If I were them, I'd unveil a new Windows 8 that looks more like XBox Live. I don't own an XBox, but from what I understand the online support from Microsoft for XBox is better than what is offered by Sony for PS3 and Nintendo for Wii. I do actually own those two systems and have generally found the online support to be pretty terrible.
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I don't own an XBox, but from what I understand the online support from Microsoft for XBox is better than what is offered by Sony for PS3 and Nintendo for Wii. I do actually own those two systems and have generally found the online support to be pretty terrible.
It's true, you get what you pay for. I've paid for the Live membership for over 5 years and I've been very happy with it. It's easy, they keep it fresh, and the added indie game section is a nice touch. I'll be interested to see what the live TV offering is going to be and I'm also hopeful they'll incorporate Skype with Kinect. The camera on the Kinect doesn't appear to capture the most crisp picture, but it's decent enough to get the point across.
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The 360 is all about milking the customer. No included wifi so you can buy a pricey adapter, can't use a standard HD, got to buy a expensive proprietary add-on. If you're a developer and want to give something away then forget about it
Xbox Live Indie Games (Score:2)
If you're a developer and want to give something away then forget about it.
This is just as true on the other platforms. Neither Wii nor PS3 has promotional free games to my knowledge, or even any approved indie scene to speak of. At least Microsoft has Xbox Live Indie Games in select markets.
No included wifi so you can buy a pricey adapter
This was fixed in the Xbox 360 S revision.
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The latest 360 systems have built-in wi-fi, incidentally (not that it makes that much difference in your point).
If you think the online services of the other two consoles are anywhere close to Xbox Live, then you probably don't have enough experience contrasting the services to make a reasonable comparison. You'll have to trust me that most of my friends, while not exactly ecstatic about paying $60 a year for Live really don't consider it enough of a deterrent, considering how slick and seamless the servic
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Again I would hope it's infinitely better since it's not free but for what I want I don't think it is. I would assume
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The 360 is all about milking the customer. No included wifi so you can buy a pricey adapter,
Or use the built in ethernet port. Saves money for those of us that don't see the need for wireless.
can't use a standard HD, got to buy a expensive proprietary add-on
Oh yes, the expensive proprietary add-on otherwise known as a HDMI cable. Bought mine from a supermarket for 1.5GBP (under US$3). Only the first generation of Xbox360 consoles lacked a HDMI port, and you have to remember that when they were released very few people had a HD TV, and those that did mostly had component connections
To play games online or do anything really it's $60 a year.
Well I'd consider offline play, patch and game demo downloads as something, but XB
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The 360 is all about milking the customer. No included wifi so you can buy a pricey adapter, can't use a standard HD, got to buy a expensive proprietary add-on.
The Arcade fixes the HDMI port issue and as tepples says the S adds WiFi. Let us not forget that the magical PS3 with WiFi was $600 at launch.
To play games online or do anything really it's $60 a year.
That does suck.
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Blu-Ray or no Blu-Ray, that is the question upon which PS3 purchases were justified or not. Me, I just got a BDP-S300 for five bucks, and as soon as I find a matching remote, I'll have a Blu-Ray player. I didn't have an HDTV until relatively recently (well after the PS3 launch anyway) and I'm still pretty much amazed at how good an upscaled DVD can look. So it comes down to which hardware you needed. For many people the 360 was significantly cheaper up front. I don't have Live Gold so I'm not paying for it
Bullshit (Score:2)
Microsoft saw what the hacker community is doing with the original xbox and great stuff like XBMC, they put that in Xbox360. They did not see any writing on the wall, as always they were smart in realizing the potential of what the hacker community bought to the xbox, bought that to 360. They did the exact same with Indie games on xbox 360 as people on the original xbox were writing indie games. They just capitalized on what the consumer wanted. A smart thing to do, but I would give credit to the innovato
Apple and Google (Score:2)
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force bing on people (?) (Score:1)
Windows (Score:5, Insightful)
Windows 7 is still extremely naive about handling games. There should be options in the OS to disable the windows key when full-screen applications are running, windows should be MUCH better about recognizing games, Games For Windows Live is a JOKE (this I especially don't understand, Xbox Live is actually very impressive, and it should be EASIER to provide that kind of service on a PC. Gamespy has been doing it for FREE for years, but MS continually just releases a crap of DRM they call GFWL with no "features" a gamer would ever possibly use).
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It's not just games, although games are where it comes out most. Windows doesn't understand what to do with monitors and full-screen applications, up to and including its own desktop.
I have a two-screen setup. They're cheap, but let's not get picky. The one on the left is 1024x768, a trashy little thing I've had for years. The one on the right is 1360x768, a repurposed LCD TV. (Don't get me started on its problems.) Let's say I'm playing some old game, which wants to run at 4:3. Windows, naively, put
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But Windows doesn't innovate, and they don't think.
Amen, brother. I know M$-bashing gets some flak on /. for being everybody's favorite straw-man, but seriously, this OS is embarrassing. I can count the number of useful features they've added since 98SE on my left hand.
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It's not even about bashing the company. I get that they make a majority of their money on business instead of consumer machines. I don't even really mind that they tend to focus on those clients. However, you would think them capable of using that money to make the end-result better; you know, using it the way MS Research does (the ones who do things like the giant multitouch table, and other projects that never really made it to production, but were hella impressive). Only, you know, doing that for th
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Have you tried multiple monitors on any other OS? MacOS has been doing multiple monitors since time immemorial and it has all the same problems you attribute to Windows. And don't even get me started on how crappy multiple monitor support is on Linux. As bad as Windows is at handling it, it's one of the best.
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"There should be options in the OS to disable the windows key when full-screen applications are running"
What? any programmer worth his salt can do this.
If it's not done in a game it's because the game's developers made the concious decision that people want to be able to get out of their games and jump to the start menu to do something else, we did after all change to multi-tasking operating systems for a reason.
"but MS continually just releases a crap of DRM they call GFWL with no "features" a gamer would
Capitalism? (Score:1)
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Bear with me, but my theory is they think they can make consoles at a cheaper price than people will be willing to pay for them. So crazy it just might be true.
That would be more convincing if the Xbox hadn't been a financial boondoggle. They may 'make consoles at a cheaper price than people are willing to pay for them' right now, but they'll take a long time to pay off the debts incurred in reaching that point and will soon have to blow another truckload of cash developing the next generation.
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Yup, I'm not convinced they've actually turned a profit yet from the XBox line. If they're tying it to Bing and their long line of CE/Mobile abominations, I'm pretty sure they're in the red.
OS and Office are still doing a good job of funding their delusions, mind.
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Um, according to the financial statements for FY11, the E&D business (which includes the CE/Mobile "abominations") made $1.3billion in profit on revenue of $8.9billion. This puts it around 125 on the fortune 500 in terms of profit, and about 275 in terms of just revenue, and solidly in the black. If this were any other company it would be considered a ridiculous success. (Amazon took 8 years to make a profit of $73 million, and now, at 16 years old, is making a profit of a third of the E&D division)
more people plug it into their TVs?? (Score:1)
The article states "Ten years later, the Xbox 360 is the best-selling video-game system of its generation in the United States, where more people plug it into their TVs than either Sony's PlayStation 3 or Nintendo's Wii (emphasis mine), and it's making Microsoft a contender in the fierce battle to serve up entertainment on demand, especially from Internet video services. "
That makes for a nice story but the Wii has worldwide sales of almost 90M compared to the Xbox 360's 55-57M. If you tak
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The article said "plug into TVs" not "dump in box behind TV."
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best-selling video-game system of its generation in the United States, where more people plug it into their TVs than either Sony's PlayStation 3 or Nintendo's Wii
Emphasis mine. You listed worldwide numbers. It doesn't change your argument, based on wikipedia's source, but I thought it was important to look at the actual claim.
wiki [wikipedia.org]
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Why? Consumer products are a threat to their core (Score:5, Interesting)
The last thing Microsoft wants is for people to find out or realize that you can do "computery" things without a computer running one of their operating systems. It's why they had shills in the late 80's early 90's saying: "Hey, don't buy an Amiga or ST, because you'll need to bring home work from the office and those machines don't use the "industry standard" software".
Or when Microsoft bought WebTV, which allowed people to send e-mail, use USENET, IRC chat, and view webpages on a consumer oriented piece of hardware that hooked up to the TV and didn't run Windows, and then let it languish.
Sega, Sony and Nintendo probably scared Microsoft silly when their hardware became capable of running PC style games without being cut down so much Sega's netlink and Sony's prototype PSone modem probably gave them the impetus for entering the market. "If we don't enter their makret, they'll eventually enter ours and make game consoles that people can use to browse the net." Sony's use of Linux tools for developing probably gave them fits as well.
And think of the PS2...acknowledged capable of running Linux from the start, with a slot for a hard drive and networking, and USB ports. Microsoft knew that Cony could do some kind of "web kiosk" software for the PS2 any time they wanted to, or worse, do a general release of the Linux kit. SCEE apparently had a "Live" version of the distro in the Linux kit that they tested out. Let's also not forget the Japan only release of the BBN software which let Japanese PS2 owners do a lot of stuff that we Americans only got to do upon release of the PS3.
Then came the PS3...which at one time, ran Linux out of the box, all you needed was install media. And there was at one time a plan to install it by default on all PS3's alongside GameOS. The PS3 also does media, and has a built in web browser, and support for downloadable apps (though Sony didn't add an "app" section to the PSN store till recently). That thing was Microsoft's worst nightmare come to life. Who needs Windows to play complex games? Who needs Windows just to visit facebook.
So Microsoft has to stay in the market just to keep Sony and/or Nintendo off balance enough to prevent them from getting any more ideas.
Bob (Score:2)
Now Microsoft is linking Xbox 360, its most successful consumer-focused brand, with others that have not been as well received.
Can't wait for MS Bob w/ avatars on XBox!
Halo kept the Xbox from obscurity (Score:1)
Twas the game Halo that pulled the Xbox from a race to
the bottom with the Game Cube. PS2'ers looking down waiting
to see which one folded first.
Being a PS2'er I remember when Xbox started being talked about
in a positive way, just before the release of Halo 2.
Now Xbox is manipulating game producers for perks, Being a PC
"Call of Duty" player watching as microsoft claims CoD as their own.
Seriously home media is fine but it's the games that sell the system.
I have a PS3,, the last version that was backwards compa
Failed Attempt at Establishing Another Monopoly (Score:3)
I can tell you what Microsoft was telling business about the Xbox when they were rolling it out. I was at one of their "digital home" shows for businesses, where they were trying to convince the attendees that everyone would soon have 3 or 4 Xboxes in their houses which they could use a networked PVR/gaming systems.
The presentation was pathetic with obvious Microsoft employee "shills" in the audience who lobbed softball questions to the presenters. Even worse the "networked" PVR demo was faked, they hid an extra computer to feed video to their "remote" TV in the "bedroom". It was, overall, a pretty disgusting bit of charlatanism.
The point, of course, is that it was pretty obvious to anyone who cared to know exactly why Microsoft got into the Xbox business, they were hoping to shore up the Windows monopoly by producing a gaming console that they could eventually parlay into a monopoly on digital homes. They needed to do this to prevent anyone else from establishing domination in this arena, imagine if Linux became the standard for consumer appliances, it could potentially erode the Windows desktop monopoly.
Unfortunately for Microsoft, all the digital home stuff was way too early, they didn't actually have viable products to back it up at the time, and Nintendo and then Apple stole their thunder with the Wii, and iPhone and the iPad respectively. They've been trying for a very long time to figure out how to use the Xbox 360 to expand the reach of their monopolies without tipping their hand to the regulators. Now that the regulatory period is over, they no longer have to worry about making blatantly anticompetitive moves.
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Unfortunately for Microsoft, all the digital home stuff was way too early, they didn't actually have viable products to back it up at the time, and Nintendo and then Apple stole their thunder with the Wii, and iPhone and the iPad respectively.
I think people underestimate how much the iPod screwed up Microsoft's plans. Microsoft developed media formats (WMA/WMV) and created DRM to go with it. They made deals to use their formats and DRM on online stores. They had the XBox ready to stream that media to your TV, and they had media empires ready to make their formats the default format. This would have given them a lock over the consumption of entertainment products.
But there was one little problem: Apple absolutely refused to support WMA or Pl
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Find the presentation (video, website, powerpoint, pdf, anything) and post a link. Anybody can make garbage claims. Back it up so that it's believable.
Sorry, I'm not going to waste my time trying to find evidence that you won't believe. I've told you the events I witnessed believe it or not, I don't really care. That part is merely exposition on where I got my information from, with some commentary on what they were showing and how they were able to do things that the Xbox was clearly not capable of.
Yes, how dare any company (much less Microsoft) try to protect their business, or branch out into a new area with the intent of making money? The audacity!
You seem to projecting your own anger at my revealing bad behavior on Microsoft part onto me. I'm not angry that Microsoft was trying grow their business,
They already HAD a gaming business. (Score:3)
seriously. ms sidewinder controllers and their forcefeedback controllers were _the_ best. they also dipped into game publishing before xbox - AND in the late '90s pc gaming became _the_ platform for high class gaming(which it still is) - on microsoft os, which despite everything made it possible to have pretty much random hardware and things would just work(compare that to early '90s pc gaming where if a game didn't support your soundcard you were fucked so you were better off just staying with blaster clones and other "standard" parts).
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seriously. ms sidewinder controllers and their forcefeedback controllers were _the_ best.
no, no they weren't. I have seen more MS FF sticks in the dumpster due to failure than I've ever seen in use. Logitech makes (and made) better pads, sticks, mice, keyboards, and indeed, all classes of hardware device that Microsoft has ever made. And the BEST joysticks came from Thrustmaster and Saitek (specifically the Cyborg.)
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ms force feedback pro - the first one, it beat any thrustmaster I had used as a gaming joystick. it was pretty good for playing even mech warriors, which seriously you wouldn't want to do with anything spring loaded. it was better than flightsticks we had. the reason they went to dumpster is that they used midi as interface and they didn't port the drivers over to newer windows's. I don't think much of logitechs plastics, tbh, and their keyboards come from the same factories as ms's(and the one xbox logite
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if you want simulation controls, then sure, I guess thrustmaster is ok. but it's pretty bitchy to rig up that kind of control rig to your chair so that it's comfortable and ok for use with more than few realistic simulators.
I have a rebuilt and stickworks-converted F22 Pro and it does not take long to set it up for Mechwarrior IV. And I guess my arm is just stronger than yours... a dubious honor at best.
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Logitech makes (and made) better pads, sticks, mice, keyboards
Funny you should say that, in the last 6 months I have had 2 out of 3 Logitech mice malfunctioning or DOA right out of the box.
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Funny you should say that, in the last 6 months I have had 2 out of 3 Logitech mice malfunctioning or DOA right out of the box.
Are they the same model? You have have found a magical bad run. I've unboxed dozens of Logitech products and never repeat never had one even have a problem out of the box, or indeed, until years of abuse had gone by.
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The G500 arrived DOA. Didn't get a replacement, just sent it back and bought a different one. As mentioned the G9x worked. The MX Anywhere kind of worked but the scroll wheel would quit at random times, then start working again (which suggests a software issue but I tried different drivers and different PCs and the problem prevailed. It is a wireless mouse, so possib
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I *did* get a used trackman wheel with a weird problem... called up logitech and it was disco'd so they sent me a wireless model. Hard to complain.
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seriously. ms sidewinder controllers and their forcefeedback controllers were _the_ best.
no, no they weren't. I have seen more MS FF sticks in the dumpster due to failure than I've ever seen in use. Logitech makes (and made) better pads, sticks, mice, keyboards, and indeed, all classes of hardware device that Microsoft has ever made. And the BEST joysticks came from Thrustmaster and Saitek (specifically the Cyborg.)
still have my sidewinder force feedback pro. still play mechwarrior 3 and 4 with it. I do have a brand spanking new logitech 550 wireless keyboard, though, that is about to go back to the vendor because it is the hands-down crappiest keyboard I've ever used. The tactile response is horrible, the keyboard will freeze for seconds at a time, and when it isn't freezing, it is randomly registering phantom keystrokes. I realize I'm offering only one datapoint here, but first impressions are lasting impressio
Because MS doesn't like free and open computers (Score:1)
So they got into gaming and they're making something that is expensive and locked down from the beginning so there are no expectations that you can have any s
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Only problem: the XBOX is not expensive. $300 will get you an xbox, or a really underpowered computer.
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To extend... (Score:2)
<duck>
Re:Because (Score:4, Informative)
This short-hand history does little to explain anything. The XBox did not spring forth from Microsoft, like Athena from the head of Zeus, "because they saw the handwriting on the wall".
Xbox was an extrapolation of work begun, at least, wit the introduction of DirectX in 1995. Equally, the history of MS Flight Simulator must be considered. This was rooted in a time when consoles were just a scroll and jump away from Pong.
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I remember Microsoft Flight Simulator 5 on DOS. It was awesome, it even ran at 640x480 in 256 colours (I think). It was absolutely amazing for it's time. White is Flight Simulator now? As far as I know the last release was Microsoft Flight Simulator X, but that's eternities ago
There is an open source flight simulator called "FlightGear", but I never got the hang of it.
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According to Wikipedia, the team was just laid off. But it's coming back as Microsoft Flight.
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According to Wikipedia, the team was just laid off. But it's coming back as Microsoft Flight.
I might be wrong, but IIRC I heard somewhere that Flight is a different product and isn't necessarily compatible with the add-ons that Flight Simulator eventually accumulated a large number of(?)
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Yeah, from what I saw on Wikipedia and the Microsoft Flight web page (linked from Wikipedia), it looks like a complete rewrite.
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Heh. I remember interviews with Alex St. John, where he outlined the history of DirectX, gradually rewriting all of DOS hardware access into the API. It was like virtualization, before virtualization.
What "architecture"?
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Originally, sure - but $billions in the hole with only a (very) slim hope of eventual ROI isn't much the way to do it. Then again, to be fair, maybe they think (hope/project/predict?) that their next console version will be the one that rakes in enough profit to pay all that off?
TFA does have it right though - we're already seeing XBoxes that do movies, music, online social bits, and the like.
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For money.
Next!
Definitely, but you need to say it in the "Mr. Krabs" voice.
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Not for them it ain't. They only make quarterly profits, Xbox is not paid for, 360 might pay that debt back but it is pretty doubtful.
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And don't forget that the Xbox has helped to cripple PC gaming, which is one of the main reasons for people to upgrade their PC and buy a new version of Windows.
All in all the Xbox has been a disaster; I'm amused to see Microsoft tying their loss-making search engine to their loss-maknig console and hoping it will suddenly make money.
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Microsoft got into the console market because they wanted to maintain and increase the number of developers hooked on DirectX.
End of story. Everything else was a "So, where do we go now" afterthought.
Oh please. Do you expect me to believe that it was originally envisioned as the DriectXBox? Or that they didn't really have any other plan beyond buying off the shelf components and slapping them together in an ugly case? That the billions in losses that even today still haven't been made up weren't part of some grand scheme?
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Which is why Microsoft is so hung up about vendor lock-in and crushing Linux
With a market share of less than 1%, and a trend line as flat as the Kansas prairies, what is there left to crush?