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Sony Confirms It's Making a 'High-End PlayStation 4' With 4K and Richer Graphics (ft.com) 142

Posted by msmash from the new-console dept.
Sony has confirmed it is working on an upgraded version of its PlayStation 4 gaming console (could be paywalled; alternate source). The company says that the upcoming console dubbed Neo is intended to sit alongside and complement the standard PS4. Touted as the "high-end PS4", the gaming console will support ultra-high definition 4K resolution and richer graphics, and will certainly cost more than PlayStation 4's $350 retail price.

The move might upset many PlayStation 4 owners, especially the ones who have purchased the console in the recent months. One of the perks of purchasing a gaming console from Sony and Microsoft is knowing that neither company will launch an upgraded version of their respective console for around six to seven years. Sony realizes that it is playing with fire here, so it assured that all forthcoming games -- including the VR ones -- must support the older version of the console as well. The company says that the new PS4 console won't be unveiled at E3 tradeshow next week, however.
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Sony Confirms It's Making a 'High-End PlayStation 4' With 4K and Richer Graphics More

Sony Confirms It's Making a 'High-End PlayStation 4' With 4K and Richer Graphics

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  • Downward compatibility (Score:3)

    by freeze128 ( 544774 ) on Friday June 10, 2016 @12:03PM (#52289097)
    If all games released from this point on will support both the Neo and Original PS4, then what is the point of buying the Neo if you already have an Original?

    • Re:Downward compatibility (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10, 2016 @12:07PM (#52289133)

      Just because it supports the old one, doesn't mean it will support it properly. Inevitably many games will come out with only the new one in mind, and half assed measures to meat whatever minimum requirements sony has set out for support of old model will be made

      • nevitably many games will come out with only the new one in mind

        Yep. Get ready to get fucked if you're an existing PS4 owner. Because the developers will start focusing on the Neo and optimizing for that instead of the regular PS4 (and all the demo videos will be shown on the Neo too). So regular PS4 owners can look forward to shitty frame rates and crappier, half-assed graphics as their machine tries to run games that were designed with the Neo in mind.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Rob MacDonald ( 3394145 )
          Agreed, my ps4 gathers dust as it is, but now it's already last gen? A big old fuck you to sony and crew.

        • Only if they sell a lot of them.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          It really depends on how many they sell. Developers will target the most popular machine, which almost certainly be the standard PS4 for some time, because it's more profitable. The developers I have spoken to say they are targeting the PS4 and planning to simply add some better textures and a few extra shader effects, then bump the resolution to 4k for the Neo. Most people don't even have a 4k TV yet.

          • Re: (Score:1)

            by donaldm ( 919619 )

            It really depends on how many they sell. Developers will target the most popular machine, which almost certainly be the standard PS4 for some time, because it's more profitable. The developers I have spoken to say they are targeting the PS4 and planning to simply add some better textures and a few extra shader effects, then bump the resolution to 4k for the Neo. Most people don't even have a 4k TV yet.

            Why buy a low-resolution 4k display when you can purchase an 8k display? Admiddltly 8k displays are not exactly cheap but they will come down in price and if 4k is anything to go this will happen fairly quickly. :-)

    • Are you stunned? Seriously? The neo is more powerful. The backwards compatibility literally means they have to continue to produce low quality ports of those games for my Ps4. how did those ps4 games that got ported to ps3 look? This will be worse And you know what? Good. This is officially the last gaming console I will ever purchase because it's not worth the hassle and they are now officially on a faster upgrade path than a desktop gaming pc. Game over sony, you've earned the last penny you will

      • Are you stunned? Seriously? The neo is more powerful. The backwards compatibility literally means they have to continue to produce low quality ports of those games for my Ps4. how did those ps4 games that got ported to ps3 look? This will be worse And you know what? Good. This is officially the last gaming console I will ever purchase because it's not worth the hassle and they are now officially on a faster upgrade path than a desktop gaming pc. Game over sony, you've earned the last penny you will ever see directly from me.

        It shouldn't be tough to do at all. On the PC I can switch between 1080p, 2k and 4k with the click of a button. It should be the same for the console's. I'm more upset that there's still no mention of uncapping FPS at 30. It's ridiculous that in today's market you are still capped at an old TV's frame rate.

      • These aren't two radically different pieces of hardware like the PS3 and PS4, it mostly looks like a bump in graphics capabilities. It seems fairly plausible that games will run well on the PS4 in HD and on the new machine at 4K. I have a PS 4 and am not particularly worried about this. Maybe if the VR is better with this on or if I decide to get a 4KTV at some point it might be worth the upgrade. Otherwise I expect to be happy with my PS4 and expect a lot of people will still continue to buy the cheaper
    • If some of the disasters from the previous console generation are anything to go by(did they ever get Skyrim actually working properly on the PS3?), there is a real risk that the original will be 'supported' rather than actually supported by at least some games; at least if it becomes popular enough to be the favored target platform.

      It wouldn't be a huge surprise if it doesn't gain that much traction(attempts to update consoles between 'generations' have historically gone pretty poorly); in which case it

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by donaldm ( 919619 )

        did they ever get Skyrim actually working properly on the PS3

        If you are referring to the 6MB bug/annoyance then no, but you could work around the issue by turning off all auto-saves and stick with manual saves. The problem with manual saves is if you forget then you may loose hours of playtime if your character died. Still if you are used to the Souls games and even Bloodborne this is not a big deal.

        As for the rest of your comment about the Neo, I fully agree.

    • Re: Downward compatibility (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Better graphics and performance.

    • I'd compare it to a Game Boy Color (GBC), whose games fell into two categories:

      Dual-mode games
      These run on pre-GBC systems (the original Game Boy, Super Game Boy, and Game Boy Pocket) but have additional features on GBC. The cartridge has the original mold shape with an "innie" grip, and most are black (as opposed to gray for original Game Boy games). All dual-mode games have severe motion blur on the original Game Boy (but not on SGB, Pocket, or GBC). Some dual-mode games had slowdown on pre-GBC systems for any of three reasons: a slower processor (4.2 MHz vs. 8.4 MHz for GBC), lack of VRAM DMA, and intentionally reduced frame rate to accommodate the original Game Boy's severe motion blur. Early on, most GBC games were dual mode because of the massive installed base of pre-GBC systems.
      Exclusive games
      These run only on GBC. They display an error message if used with pre-GBC systems. The cartridge has a new mold with an "outie" grip, and most are transparent. Starting a couple years after the GBC's release, most games were exclusive.

      Likewise, dual-mode games for Neo may slow down or have reduced graphical complexity when run on an original PlayStation 4. And starting a couple years after the Neo's release, SCE may end up reversing its stance and allowing Neo-only games.

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by Anonymous Coward

        Honestly, this has been a PR shitshow.

        They should have simply said "we've started working on Playstation 5, it's still a ways out there so we won't be showing it at E3 this year, but we're going to promise you right now that it will be backwards compatible with all PS4 games."

        Sure, having a short PS4 life cycle will be a shitshow of its own, but at least it'll be a shitshow with an end in sight and the promise of compatibility should prevent a revolt from developers with games in the pipeline. Having PS4 a

      • Interesting bit of Gameboy history - thanks!

        Yesterday I picked up my kids' old GBA and rummaged through their stockpile of games, which inludes original GB stuff. I never noticed the innie vs. outie grips until you pointed them out. Another big differentiator is that the GBA (GBC?) carts are half-length, relative to the "big" GB carts.

    • With Old School Gaming.

      The IBM CGA Display that was plugged into the TV over composite vs. RGB often offered better gaming experience making a 16 color pallet from 4 color display, As it allowed for more colors to be shown at the expense of Crispness.
      Also Later on when Playing an EGA game on a VGA monitor the pixels were more blocky on the VGA screen, vs, the Lower DPI on the EGA display, making the 16 Color EGA graphics look more realistic (cartoon like) as the pixels were more rounded.
      Even when you switch

    • Other point: If all games released from this point on will have to support multiple platforms and aren't able to be optimised for the experience of a single unit, what is the point of having a console?

    • Err, seriously? It's right there in the title. It literally could not be any clearer.

      4K and Richer Graphics

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by donaldm ( 919619 )

      If all games released from this point on will support both the Neo and Original PS4, then what is the point of buying the Neo if you already have an Original?

      The current PS4's can output 4k content although it can't play the new three layer BluRays of which the specifications were only ratified on a year ago. However, the PS4 will not support 4k gaming which requires a powerful graphics card with additional power supply requirements and possibly an increase in CPU power as well. To do this will require a case change since the new machine will require enhanced cooling compared to the original.

      At the moment, we still don't have any idea what the specifications

  • ...and if they're better in 4K, I'll buy it. Otherwise, it's still lipstick on a pig.

    • Its not gaming in 4k. Only video and menu output. Games are still going to be 1080p.

  • Yeah, right (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    So which advertised features will be the first to get disabled in a few months? So sorry, Sony. "Fooled me once, can't get fooled again."

    • Unless you bought a launch ps3 that actually listed that feature on the box (Like I did) just go ahead and shut the fuck up about "install other os" what the fuck were you going to use yellowdog for?

      • OtherOS was NOT mentioned on the box. I don't know why people think it was. If you have a CECHA/CECHB/CECHE model, it will list PS2 games, but the box itself doesn't mention OtherOS.

        Go on, check, and take pictures. I'll wait.

  • So they said it will complement the original; is this an add-on like the 32X or the SegaCD was for the Genesis? If so, that's not so bad for current owners.

    • It's marketing doublespeak meant to placate the current PS4 owners.

      It means the PS4 Neo will be $499 or more and the original PS4 will be $299 until production contracts and stock run out. At this point, owners of the original PS4 will be at the mercy of the install base of the PS4 Neo. As more people buy the Neo, Sony will relax restrictions on developers, allowing them to shit out games that run like ass, don't have all the features enabled, or simply don't work at all on the PS4.

      The PS4 is dead, long l

  • So first we get a report of an XBox One Two, and now a Playstation Four Two. I predict that the next go around, people won't even bother buying the first release with the expectation of a more powerful half-way release of the same system.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Daetrin ( 576516 )
      A popular(?) theory is that now that Sony and Microsoft have fairly standardized hardware they are switching to a more iPhone type release schedule, where they will be releasing updated versions at a more regular interval but maintaining support and continuing releases for the previous (mini) generation.

      By which theory in another two or three years they'll come out with XBOne.Three and PS4.3 and the original XBOne and PS4 will be retired from active development but the XBOne.Two and PS4.2 will still be su

  • If incrimental upgrades are going to be the norm (Score:5, Insightful)

    by NotDrWho ( 3543773 ) on Friday June 10, 2016 @12:14PM (#52289177)

    I had may as well go back to PC gaming. I went to consoles expecting the simplicity and ease of the traditional 5-year life cycle and standard hardware.

    • If you were aching for 4k gaming you probably would have already done this.
      • Its not 4k gaming, though. Think about what that requires for PC... There is no way they could get a console at a reasonable price that could do that.

        • Its not 4k gaming, though. Think about what that requires for PC... There is no way they could get a console at a reasonable price that could do that.

          No, but you could double the price of a PS4 easily make it work. They said it would be more expensive so don't expect it to only be a $100 or $200 price hike.

          • It would be closer to $1000. If not more. For 30 FPS 4k gaming, you need a 980 TI (or possibly a 1070 depending on how it actually benchmarks). Add in a better CPU to be able to handle a GPU that is that powerful, and you already hit double the price without factoring in any other parts. Then you would have to consider how much heat a box like that is generating. So no, its not 4k gaming at even double the PS4 price.

          • Re: (Score:1)

            by donaldm ( 919619 )

            Its not 4k gaming, though. Think about what that requires for PC... There is no way they could get a console at a reasonable price that could do that.

            No, but you could double the price of a PS4 easily make it work. They said it would be more expensive so don't expect it to only be a $100 or $200 price hike.

            Say just for argument sake that the Neo will be able to play 4k games at 60 fps and the machine costs $1000. There definitely would be people who would buy such a machine, however, they would be in the minority because most PS4 owners would not see the value of paying two to four times the price of the PS4 which is good enough for their HDTV.

            Maybe if the console owner had a 4k TV they may be tempted but for most people who already have an HDTV why should they replace it when it already works and most TV

        • I think that is the whole point here. Suppose Sony sells a 4k for 600$ and continues to sell and support the HD version... the impact on game developers is really small and not a bad deal for the HD users who more likely than not don't have a 4k TV.
          • From what I read, its really only 4k for video and the menu systems anyways. The console is supposed to hit 1080p/60FPS on demanding games which is a monstrous improvement over the current gen consoles. Its really not a bad buy, but the 4k claim is very misrepresented.

    • Is it really that bad is a new version comes out every three years, but each model still supports all of the older games and gets new games going forward for 6-8 years?

      You could skip every other release and still play everything. This will also help PC games, as newer hardware will drive developers to actually support new graphic capabilities. Unlike in the PS3/360 generation which went on way to long and held the PC back.

      • Is it really that bad is a new version comes out every three years, but each model still supports all of the older games and gets new games going forward for 6-8 years?

        You must have forgotten what site you were one. Sony or Microsoft could give away bars of gold and someone on /. would complain that they were too heavy and strained their back.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Mashiki ( 184564 )

        I'm glad to hear it. You'll find playing games that don't discriminate against minorities and avoid uses of offensive and discriminatory language much more appealing when you switch to Politically Correct gaming.

        That's either the worst joke, or the biggest troll I've seen today. I'm betting on the latter. Especially considering the politically correct and their pro-male killing, pro-sexism, pro-racism, statements that continually pop out of their mouths. Then again, not sure what's worse. That I can't tell the difference between a politically correct person and a bigot/racist/sexist from the 1950's, or that they think they're actual champions of inclusivity while they push for anti-egalitarian ideals.

        Up in next

    • PC gaming is cheaper. Online multiplayer is without monthly fees. There are truly free games with no subscription fees on Steam, GOG and Origin, maybe others. Build your own PC for the same price as a console with more power and greater functionality. Replace your own parts... yada yada yada . . .

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by tepples ( 727027 )

        PC gaming is cheaper. Online multiplayer is without monthly fees.

        Which platform is cheaper for offline multiplayer? Especially if you have kids, it may be a choice of one console, a few controllers, and one copy of each game, or two to four gaming PCs and copies of each game.

      • Build your own PC for the same price as a console with more power and greater functionality.

        More power and greater functionality is easy enough, but for the same price as a $350 PS4?
        It is difficult for individuals to compete with Sony's volume purchasing power. Even a low-end $100 PC motherboard is certainly more than Sony spends on their motherboard.

    • I had may as well go back to PC gaming. I went to consoles expecting the simplicity and ease of the traditional 5-year life cycle and standard hardware.

      That's quite a bad reason to go to console gaming. A gaming rig that's just a little more expensive than the Xbox or Playstation will last ten years or more (i.e. you can play games 10 years later at near-max settings without much problem). Plus you get an awesome desktop for when you're not gaming.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Mashiki ( 184564 )

      Considering consoles have been holding back PC's for the better part of a decade, you'll easily find that your 5 year old PC is still good enough to play today's titles without too much of a problem. My dad got my old PC to game on, it's a Phenom I X4-945BE w/560Ti in it and it does everything he wants. My sister built a similar PC, it ran her around $110 for all the parts and still does a just fine job.

      Consoles haven't offered anything over a PC in nearly 15 years, and have handily made themselves less c

    • See, I kind of think of it in the opposite way. What I want most from consoles is just the fact that I don't have to wonder "will it run?" It would make sense to me if Sony released a new Playstation model every year with better capabilities, but maintaining compatibility. Sort of like what smartphone vendors do-- Apple releases a new iPhone every year, but I don't have to buy all new apps every time I get a new iPhone. With every new iPhone, I get something a little faster and with new features, but ap

    • Simplicity and easy with consoles? That's a thing of the past.

      Yeah, I'm old, I remember the times when you stuffed a cartridge into that console, turned it on, picked up the controller, played 'til your brain turned to mush, then turned it off and went to bed.

      Today it's more like... turning on the console, trying to find the menu for "I wanna play a game" between the thousands of blinking icons that want you to "socialize", navigating there with the motion-sensitive (read: wave like an idiot) input system d

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Shados ( 741919 )

        Yup. The irony is now I use a Steam link connected to my PC as "my console" and its easier to use with less bullshit than my PS4.

        Push the button on the controller, pick "resume playing", done. PS4's collecting dust (though there are a few...very few, but a few, exclusives I want to play)

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Yvan256 ( 722131 )

      PC gaming = requires to maintain Windows, anti-virus crap, security updates otherwise your computer gets owned by hackers and starts sending spam or become part of a botnet, etc.

  • What do you mean, "sit alongside"? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by wonkey_monkey ( 2592601 ) on Friday June 10, 2016 @12:17PM (#52289199) Homepage

    The company says that the upcoming console dubbed Neo is intended to sit alongside and complement the standard PS4.

    Is that supposed to a metaphor, or a literal truth? Is it designed to be put next to/connected to a PS4? And then say nice things about it?

  • One of the perks of purchasing a gaming console from Sony and Microsoft is knowing that neither company will launch an upgraded version of their respective console for around six to seven years.

    Launching a 32GB WiiU Delux alongside the 8GB WiiU was a bold move for Nintendo; previously, they'd only released handhelds in multiple colors or with smaller or larger form factors. The Wii got a mini-version that nobody bought; the Gameboy got the Gameboy Pocket, while the Gameboy Advance got the Gameboy Advance SP and Gameboy Advance Micro. Even the DS only got the DSXL (bigger screen), while the 3DS got the 3DSXL and the 2DS (runs 3DS software without 3D display). These are all budget options or lar

  • mainly for blu ray 4k / streeming 4k?

    • Sure as hell not going to be for 4K gaming at any price point the average console player is going to spend. I'll be shocked if they can get decent 4K running for less than $800.
      • Keep in mind they have the luxury of subsidizing the extra hardware cost because hardware prices drop. They may eat the cost and not profit on the hardware for a year or two.
        • Indeed, and that's been their strategy for a while now (selling consoles at a loss to start), but given that many computers still have difficulty doing 4K at a stable rate this would be one HELL of a cost to eat. I'm very curious as to what the technical load out ends up being when all is said and done.

  • What's really going to upset people... (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Is when this is required for PlayStation VR. Hell, my GTX970 has trouble keeping up with games like Elite: Dangerous in VR; I have no idea how the current run of consoles are expecting to pull that off.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Yvan256 ( 722131 )

      Which resolution and graphics settings are you using? You're probably way over what the VR titles on the PS4/PS4Neo will require.

      • Which resolution and graphics settings are you using? You're probably way over what the VR titles on the PS4/PS4Neo will require.

        Exactly. Currently PS4 is capped at 30 FPS. I'm sure he's pushing for at least 60FPS or much higher on the PC.

  • Don't know why everyone is so surprised... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by johannesg ( 664142 ) on Friday June 10, 2016 @12:48PM (#52289475)

    In the past we had long console life cycles because Sony et al. had to recoup their investment in developing that hardware in the first place. Nowadays it is AMD doing all the development, so a quick platform upgrade is as simple as calling AMD and asking for the latest chips. And why wouldn't they? Especially since the competition is going to be doing the exact same thing... So in order to avoid falling behind, there is only one choice: upgrade.

    Long life cycles were never an intended goal of consoles to begin with. They were an _accident_, and since everyone has now standardized on PC hardware they are no longer necessary or even desirable.

  • Despite their godawful handling of my beloved Playstation Vita, I had been eyeing a PS4 so that I could play Final Fantasy XV this fall. I'm starting to think I shouldn't bother with a PS4 at all if they're trying to pull this cell phone upgrade every year or two bullshit.

    I already have a WiiU, and with the rumors flying around that Microsoft is also thinking about these shenanigans, the WiiU might be the only console I get this generation.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Guyle ( 79593 )

      Word is flying everywhere that FFXV will likely come to PC, and likely be bigger and better as well. I was also considering buying a PS4 for the same reason, but I'm definitely going to wait for the PC version. Even if it takes awhile it'll be worth it.

    • If the Neo releases this Fall, that's a full 3 years after the original. Hardly on par with cell phones. And it likely will cost less than a new high-end cell phone.

      The recent node shrink and AMD's new architectures are likely the impetus behind this revision. We've been waiting for anode shrink for a long time, and it's bringing massive benefits. I wouldn't expect this to become a pattern, but if Sony/MS try to force it, future revisions won't be anywhere as significant as this one looks to be.

  • If you haven't done your research prior to making the purchase, you only have yourself to blame. This news has been in the rumor mill for a while now. I've decided that I'll buy the PS4 once GT7 releases, PS4K notwithstanding.

    Moreover, if you always sit and wait to buy the next big thing, you'll be waiting forever and never buy anything.

  • This is just AMD (Score:3)

    by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Friday June 10, 2016 @01:50PM (#52289977)
    Giving Sony better chips that can be over clocked. It makes perfect sense for Sony to sell these at a premium. I'd be mad, but given that most modern games couldn't give a toss about frame rates above 24fps I don't see the problem. Plus if you're one of those folks who don't care you're about to see an abundance of cheap used PS4s.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Overclocking means running a chip at a speed faster than the manufacturer-listed default speed.

      These arent the same chips with improved cooling and voltage adjustments to make em run faster than AMD's advertised speed.

      Theyre new chips, based on a significantly smaller manufacturing process, and a new architecture, that perform all the same functions of the original PS4, but much faster.

      In order to not fragment the userbase and ensure compatibility across both the PS4 and PS4k, developers will develop the ga

  • In the end, same shitty game play, same 2-3 hours of a game 'til you're done with it and most games simply counting up a number in their name without changing anything but sticking another gimmick in it.

    Seriously, what's the point? I've had more fun with indie games in the past year than with AAA titles.

  • He's already had to send his PS4 back for warrenty work. Now when you turn it on there's a good
    chance the fan will spin up and the PS4 shut down (cold system).

    I've never had a problem with any of the previous PS controllers they last forever. I bought a PS4
    controller to play with on his system, when I'm not there his son use(s/d) it. Not one month later
    the right joystick stuck to the left -if controlling a person you will just start spinning to the
    left.

    I'm not impressed at all with the PS4, going to stick w

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