Neverwinter Nights Update 169
nyquil superstar writes "Just thought everyone might like to know, there are a whole bunch of updates at Bioware's NWN Linux Client Page. Includes goodies like the timing of future releases and betas, how to install the Linux client and future(!) expansions, and updates on the movies and sound issues. The quick version: sound is in and they will release a Linux client before they integrate a movie player. Oh, and you'll need to download the game's resource data or use a Windows install, the CD is only good for the reg. key and Windows install. Good news though, because it sounds like it's getting close."
Finally (Score:2, Interesting)
Hopefully more companies will follow bioware's example. Give the distributors the windows games, give the community the linux patch
Re:Gamers.. (Score:1, Interesting)
I dont see why he's been modded up apart from some Linux zealot being biased. Its quite right that Windows is better for games and its hardly something that can be discussed.
Closer, but still vaporware *sigh* (Score:5, Interesting)
This game is the one that will actually get Linux Gaming off the ground. It removes the need for an emulator or middle-run to get it working, and is one of the biggest games in recent memory. If we saw some of the other big guns, like Blizzard and EA doing this, there would be a lot more solid development on the gaming front.
Since Bioware already will have the linux base installed, and the NWN engine is the core of their future RPG games, this looks well for the Linux community. Now if only they would start releasing the stuff out of box like this...
Re:Gamers.. (Score:2, Interesting)
They use Windows because they don't have much choice, not necissarily because of a better driver base. Most Windows drivers are updated more frequently, but that's because of the distribution of the market.
What is true is that DirectX is the API of choice for game makers, but for a reason. The development of higher level graphics processes and Shader development for the OpenGL 2.0 specification has been rather slow, and no where near the specification and performance of DX. But that is changing slowly.
Linux is just easier to use on the graphics front, with display properties tweaking and things like NView and the ATi Control Panel, but given time, you'll see similar functions appear in Linux (if they're not already there).
And the reason is for making conversions? Money. Linux is also a desktop OS, for most of the people that read here, for example. Those people like to play games too (or so I'd assume), and would purchase games they can play. More people playing the game on different OS's, especially for a user-content driven game like Neverwinter Nights is a good thing.
And the speed thing is debateable. The actual Graphics Driver speed that is gained by running Windows can be offset by the efficient memory utilization and processing streamlining of Linux. I'd be willing to bet that the low-end specs for NWN would be a lot more friendly on a Linux Box than a Windows box, if for nothing else other than the ability to strip what's running in the background.
No movies isn't a loss (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Gamers.. (Score:2, Interesting)
NWN no good for me because I lack self-control... (Score:4, Interesting)
A battle.net hosted d2 world (even with the occasional cheating bugs, which I don't persue at least), is far more challenging. Running a hardcore character that you have had for months and gone through hell with (puns intended) just has far more of a rush and satisfaction (for me at least). If my character dies, it's permanent, and I've suffered a real loss. Death has meaning, and death sucks. It's great!
That must be it, because why else do I waste so much time on an aging game, running the same quests and acts over and over and over again... I don't get it personally, and I guess neither did those two Asians that dropped dead after playing D2 non-stop for more than a day.
(At least I understand my condition well enough to stay away from worlds where I have to pay to play, like Evercrack. If battle.net charged, that would finally cure me....)
a message to bioware... (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Closer, but still vaporware *sigh* (Score:3, Interesting)
I think this game would have been a boon for linux gaming if they'd stuck to their plans to do simultaneous release. I'm not so sure now. Still, I like native linux gaming, and it does raise the bar for developers a bit. But in all seriousness, if you're a big fan, you could not wait until now to get it for linux. Thankfully they don't sell a "linux version" in box, so there won't be bogus weird sales figures.
On a final note, there won't be any linux toolset, because of the environment they built theirs in.
Re:Bolt-On Programming (Score:3, Interesting)
What makes you think the engine is good to go?
Eventhough bioware used OpenGL to render their graphics, they also used DirectSound, DirectInput and DirectPlay. All which would need ported to linux alternatives. Also, they wrote some opengl extensions for various effects like their (kinda cool btw) shadowing system. Who are to say if they are completely multiplatform.
The movies should be re-encoded into another format that plays natively in Windows and Linux. The interface should use wrappers..
A. I have a feeling that its not the encoding of fileformats thats holding back port.
B. Im a little confused about what you mean when you say "interfaces. If you mean the in-game interfaces, then they are most likely rendered by the engine(probertly by OpenGL, since they use a directx version without directdraw). If its the in-game interfaces youre talking about, they wont be a problem when the engine is ported.
Hell, even the wankers using WineX have been running NWN for a while.
I fail to see your point here, i've seen varoius of PC games under wine. Most of which arent being ported at all.
What does the fact that people can run the windows binaries under emulation have to do with the development of the linux binaries?
This should be a lesson for future projects. Don't try and bolt on functionality that was never intended. Either do it right (cross platform) from the start, or not at all.
How should this truely crossplatform development work then? DirectSound, DirectInput and DirectPlay are standard compontents in most games today, which crossplatform APIs should replace them? SDL is nice, but is just as its name implies a "Simple DirectMedia Layer". And is simply not as feature rich as its DirectX counterpart(especially in the sound area).
I think its important for us linux users to realise that currently, windows OWNS the PC gaming sector. They deliver what the gamecompaies want, a simple method of defining requirements for their game. The companies use DirectX and simply write on their box that you need a direct3d compatible gfx card, a directsound compatible soundcard etc etc. Also the windows/directx platform offers WAAAAAY more potential customers AND the option of porting very easily to the xbox.
I think we should be glad that some companies do ports, since linux has pretty much nothing to offer to gamedeveloping companies execpt alot problems for a very little marked (in gaming terms).
Re: DIrectPlay (Score:3, Interesting)
At that time, all the features promised by DirectPlay, such as master host failover, reliable datagrams, etc. simply were missing or did not work in catastrophic ways (like crashing Windows 98 hard, for example.) At the end of the day, one ended up writing all the code one would for a sockets implementation, but with the added feature of not being able to communicate with any non-Windows machine.
DirectPlay then was a broken 'solution' in search of a problem. Sadly many developers (including ourselves at the time!) were suckered in, and used it regardless.
Given that NWN was supposed to be cross-platform, I can only presume that they did not use DirectPlay for their networking. Even if it were not meant to be cross-platform, it probably would have been a good idea to steer clear of DirectPlay.
Re:Let me dispel a couple things... (Score:3, Interesting)
While it's pretty obvious a good solid core of NWN was cross platform, you can't really say the entire game was. For instance you guys were re-writting the audio engine until you found out there was a Linux version of Miles.
Also the movie format you're using still isn't portable.
From an outside perspective seeing BioWare release NWN Linux looks very much like you're going through a learning experience, figuring out what works and what doesn't. Dispite the odd gripes you'll hear, most of us Linux geeks are extremely pleased BioWare is making the effort and our biggest hope is that you take what you've learned in porting NWN and apply it to future BioWare titles so Linux support isn't such a drain on your programmers.
Chicken... Egg... (Score:3, Interesting)
Generally speaking people who have Linux also have a windows computer around. The deeper a person is into gaming the greater the chance that they'll have Windows as at least a dual-boot option. I know very few people who run Linux exclusively and none of them are heavy gamers.
I've begun to think that the only thing that has the potential to bring the Linux platform into a better gaming position is a community effort to produce something truly unique for Linux. Independent developers, as you point out, cannot afford such a plan. Big developers aren't willing to take the risk. So in the end it may just need to be a collective of interested geeks hacking away. Of course that's how Linux came to be what it is, so I suppose that'd be an appropriate way for it to become a gaming platform.
Re:Bolt-On Programming (Score:3, Interesting)
i've been following the linux client since that page was put up, and i think that bioware has done a fantastic job of updating the community on what's going on with development. most companies just say it's done when it's done, stop bothering us. go back and read the page. there are updates almost every week.
if you knew anything about linux development, you would know that there are a LOT more configurations you have to cater to compared to windows where worst case you have a rouge driver that needs updating. also, they didn't know there was a linux version of the sound engine they used which admittedly sounds like a huge fuck up. i'm not quite sure where the blame for that lies.
bioware is setting a great example for other large development houses. they listen to their community, ignore the whining, tell us what's going on, and get shit done. we should all be thankful.
good job bioware