Trying Your Hand at Level Design? 382
Utawoutau asks: "As a student nearing graduation with high interest yet no game industry experience I have been taking a serious look at the position of Level Designer. In order to apply for such a position of course, I would need an impressive portfolio. I am aware that a number of games, Neverwinter Nights for example, come packaged with level development tools and that a number of other games have tools (official or not) that are readily available on the Internet. I am interested in hearing opinions from others that have experimented with the level design tools for a number of games as to what they found the easiest, the most fun, the most in depth, and the most impressive to work with. In particular, I am interested in a game whose tools strike a good balance between all four of the above criteria."
Valve Hammer Editor (Score:5, Informative)
However, being an excellent architect is never easy:)
Few reccomendations (Score:5, Informative)
as to what they found the easiest (Score:5, Informative)
The Cube Engine [cubeengine.com] allows you to edit maps right in the game on the fly. There is also a cooperative edit mode, try and beat that
Depends on your tastes (Score:2, Informative)
Re:as to what they found the easiest (Score:5, Informative)
Unreal Tournament (Score:3, Informative)
Personality and dreams (Score:2, Informative)
You should be looking something suitable for you not other people. Everyone likes how things work differently. Also go take a look at Gamasutra [gamasutra.com] for some good reading.
Personally, try out Valve Hammer Editor [valve-erc.com] and QuArK. [planetquake.com] They are standards that can be used for many games.
Re: UED... 50% match (Score:4, Informative)
In depth? Extremely.
Impressive? Well, maybe Intimidating is a more appropriate word, but sure.
Fun? Depends on how much of a sadist you are. It can be fun, but it can also be a lot of friggin work.
Easy? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAAAaaaaaaaahhhh... good one!
Ok seriously now though. UED is a pretty damned fine level editor if I may say so. Powerful as all hell, but its not exactly idiot proof. Its not impossible either. I managed to learn the ins and outs of UED (and to a lesser extent, the Unreal engine) just by reading tutorials, dissecting other peoples maps, and screwwing around... but it took a while. Months really. Even after three years of occasionally booting up UED, i'm still learning new things. Though to be fair, a lot of it is stuff that changed from UT99 to UT03 (haven't had the urge to map as much for the new game
But hey, if people really want to learn, there isn't much stopping them. Most people just dive right in. You'll probably be frustrated and attempt to quit (repeatedly
Re:Valve Hammer Editor (Score:4, Informative)
To enlighten you further, Valve Hammer Editor a.k.a. Worldcraft is very versatile, and like plams said its backed up a thousand times over, with places like the Valve-ERC Collective [valve-erc.com]. It's a very excellent Valve mapping/editing resource.
The latest version of the Valve Hammer Editor is 3.4 and can be found here [valve-erc.com].
You should read one of Chris Crawford's books (Score:5, Informative)
You should also take a look at some of his old game design articles in Next Gen magazine. He had one article on level design in Doom that was quite unique.
Secondly, from a tricks/tools perspective, gamedev.net or xgames3d.com are your best bet.
Quake engine (Score:2, Informative)
Im eagerly awaiting the HL2 level design tool, with the SDK, in whatever form it takes when it's released. I have to make a ton of levels for our mod (Junkyard Corps, see sig) when it comes out.
Some people say the Unreal engine is better for level making. Rather than build a level inside empty space and have to close everything off (ie, checking for leaks, etc) the unreal world is a block, and you carve stuff OUT of it. This seems a harder way of doing things to me, but according to other people, its the most natural way of doing it. As for non FPS games, I have no idea. I suspect it's horses for courses. Liking a particular genre more will make you want to take more steps to learn out to get good at designing for your chosen game.
Chris Crawford - useful links (Score:5, Informative)
and "The Art of Computer Game Design" here [wsu.edu]
and the related Game Design Wiki [ludism.org]
Good luck! -Joel
Level Editors... (Score:5, Informative)
Well, I guess the easiest, most obvious level editing suite out there (in the realm of FPS games anyway) is Valve's Hammer. It's quite scary just how easy it is to make levels with that util. Upon starting it I was able to figure out pretty much all of the basic features just by looking at the buttons. That's quite an accomplishment, if you ask me. The whole way the editor is layed out, and the process you use to design a level in the editor are both painless and relatively easy. If you're looking for a place to start, and games like TFC, CS, and NS are your forte, might as well start here. I think the only problems you may run into are in the setup options, and true to its oldschool roots, getting down and compiling a map, then tweaking that, can get pretty gritty.
The only other editor I've logged any sort of time on was the unrealed that shipped with UT2003. I missed the whole UT generation, so I can't vouch for the older unrealed, I'd assume it's basically the same. However, after coming from Hammer, learning unrealed is a real pain. The interface is kind of counter-intuitive and the whole logic behind building levels is completely the opposite. It's quite weird. Once you get into the unreal mindset though, creating a level isn't hard at all, it's just that initial hill that you need to climb over. Well that, and unrealed is insanely buggy. I cannot tell you how many times I've lost work due to unexpected quits or fatal errors that seem to make no sense. I guess as it is with every program, save early and save often. This is the editor I eventually found most technically impressive. After learning something new about the editor, or pouring after technical docs and taking a stab at it myself, I am still wowed when I get a new effect (be it graphical or gameplay) working.
Now note I have not logged any significant hours with these editors (read: I have not produced any well known or well thought of maps) as to know the individual quirks and the nuances of each editor. However I can offer the complete newbie's look into it, which I guess is better than nothing. If anything, I say that the Half-Life community has more tutorials and help geared toward my audience than the unreal community, as finding good and easily digestible information is hard. Epic seems to be trying to remedy this with their opening of Unreal Uni, or whatever it is they are doing, which offers video tutorials and forums for developers. (A good thing, but I'm fearing the mod potential is going to waste in these days counting closer to HL2, with potential developers looking for the next big thing rather than weighing the assets of what's out there- which is hard to do for something not quite released)
As for most things tech, I guess slogging through it and exploring is probably the best way to learn either of these.
I guess on the RTS front, nothing is easier than Blizzard's warcraft 3 map editor. The thing is incredibly simple to use, though not quite as intuitive to the newbie's eye as hammer. I was able to get up and building levels (after finding I was unable to figure the tools out myself I went to the documentation) in about 10 minutes after reading the rather friendly documentation that comes with the toolset. I guess the thing is that the tools take 10 seconds to learn, but to master them and build a balanced and fun map, will probably take you a life time. (not to mention a keen understanding of the game.) The tools are fun to use, and going from the editor to a game to a multiplayer match you're testing with friends is quite easy and gratifying.
Neverwinter Nights, I found, was rather easy. Scripting seemed to get kind of nightmarish quick, but I quickly lost interest with building with those grossly simplified tools. I guess the real challenge was figuring out a way to make and import your own tilesets, but in the beginning when I had just spent 50 and tax on the game, it was a disappointment for it to have such poor mod support right off the bat.
I have heard good th
Check Out Jedi Knight (Score:2, Informative)
Game Editors (Score:3, Informative)
Back around Feb 2003 I started an online module called Mandrake that went well over 90+ areas when I decided to move on. I had a good base of players too, not near as much as some places but a good base. Since then I've worked on about 4 other module designs of my own including an arena one for the PVP section.
I'd say the scripting language and the flexability to created hundreds of possible paths for a module are it's greatest power over all the other editors out there. It's also relativly easy to use, the only thing is you don't get a nice print bound manual for the scripting though the script editor in there has a nice help reference side bar. It's also really nice to be able to script in counter measures for cheaters.
I'm not sure I'd ever want to do this professionally though. Seems it would make a better hobby then a job but thats my opinion.
Re:as to what they found the easiest (Score:4, Informative)
If you haven't already tried far cry (single player demo), I suggest you read Boomtown's review [boomtown.net], and download it [boomtown.net] - no time to waste! Hurry!
You have ti check this out! (Score:3, Informative)
well.... (Score:5, Informative)
Speaking as a player, I'd encourage you to seek out any competitive communities built around the game(s) you're interested in designing for. While Neverwinter Nights is a cool enough game, I'd also reccomend you check out getting some experience with the "Quake-related" FPS games.
One of the tools that's used to create maps for several game is Radiant [qeradiant.com] (supported on both Linux and Windows) and supports a bunch of games. Mappers familiar with Quake3 were able to transfer that knowledge to RtCW when it came out, and in turn that was transferrable to ET. Plugins for other games (Half Life, Soldier of Fortune, and some others I'm blanking on) is also available.
Couple that with experience working with 3DSmax (or gmax [discreet.com] if you're on a budget) creating models, and you should be good to go.
If you're also looking for ideas on what to make maps of, I'd suggest trolling around and seeing if you can find a competitive community for the games you're interested in designing for. Stuff like Half-Life and its mods (most notably Counter Strike), Quake3/RtCW/ET, and the MOHAA/CoD stuff are going to be hot ticket items right now. Organizations like The Team Warfare League [teamwarfare.com] or the Cyber Athlete League [caleague.com] might be worth a look to get an idea of how people are using the games and what kind of maps and what features they'd benefit from.
Looking to the future, everyone's pointing at stuff like Doom3 and Half-Life2 (obviously). But it might be worth taking a look at games like Far Cry and Painkiller as possible sleeper hits coming up on the horizon.
Good luck in your efforts. :)
Don't Do It! (Score:1, Informative)
Game Design Books (Score:3, Informative)
Re:I'm not a game programmer (Score:1, Informative)
Good news - it's using Hammer [valve-erc.com]. Okay, so it's been hugely upgraded, but it's still the program we know and love.
Apparently the Half-Life 2 SDK will come with a version of Softimage XSI for modelling purposes, so no more dodgy cracked copies of 3D Studio Max are needed.
I woudln't be getting my hopes up for a job (Score:3, Informative)
Another issue is job security, you have to make your own, but then again pretty much in every job today you have some degree of doing that. However, even if you have made your job security there is nothing that can protect you from being laid off when you finish the game your working on(ie Ritual employees after Elite Force 2). Those people were quickly hired by others but I don't know if you want to be moving around so much.
So to wrap things up, you better be good at what you do, you better have a contact in the industry, or hope someone recognizes you. Lastly, your going to always run the risk of being let go and have to move somewhere else.
Re: UED... 50% match (Score:4, Informative)
On a somewhat related note, if you pre-order the special edition of UT2K4 you'll get the VTMs on a DVD.
Re:well.... (Score:1, Informative)
When we go to higher level designers, experience helps, but the most important thing is the portfolio. Most importantly, you should be building maps in the genre of the company you are applying. If you are making an FPS, you submit Unreal or Quake maps, preferably using the respective tool that we use. The reason is that a NWN map is built very differently from a Max Payne map. Even deathmatch maps use different skills than single player maps.
Despite what has been said on this forum, level design is not architecting. We don't build houses that fit well on a property that are structurally sound. We want to see levels that show good creativity; good flow, aligned textures, good use of the existing widgets.
Can you pump out a good level fast? Can you build levels that look better than they actually are while staying in the memory budget and aren't framerate whores?
We also like to see level designers have some artistic skill and skill with a modelling tool. 3DSMax is good. Maya is better.
Most importantly, you need to show that you can create cool stuff within the toolset that we use, in the genre of games that we are building. So pick a genre and use that tool. Many times the tool might not be good or easy to use, but it might be what we have to work with daily.
Re:I'm not a game programmer (Score:2, Informative)
Of course, that's what they keep saying, but every developer out there that can do the math realizes that the subscription fees alone are the equivalent of selling 3-4 games per year to every subscriber, which is why the MMO games that make good money make most of their money from users that spend more than 6 months as subscribers.
With good management and a solid team, you make your initial costs back right away, and the more bandwidth you buy, the less it costs per user, so of course the more users you have, the more you make per user. The only time they lose money on an MMO game is when they have significant launch problems and/or low sales (don't recoup cost of initial development), and they have to maintain the servers for a certain amount of time regardless of whether or not they have enough people playing to justify it.
The cost of maintaining the servers, supporting the users, and developing new content is significantly less than the cost of developing 3 or 4 more games, yet they bring in that $10-15 per month per user, or $120-180 per year per user. If you can afford to secure the bandwidth for several thousand users at the start, you'll find that it costs significantly less than $5/user for that portion of the costs. Support costs go down over time, not only because bugs are fixed, but also because bugs are found, categorized, and added to the support scripts. To add content, you don't need a team the size of the original development team, you simply need artists and coders that understand whatever system your game has for adding that content and are familiar with the world you're trying to create.
Beyond all of that, if an MMO game were made with a smaller number of players in mind, and managed properly to meet the budget that would require, it could be quite profitable, as long as it didn't have an explosion in player numbers (at that point it might fall on it's face if the developers are unprepared to expand capacity, and it's much more expensive to expand capacity than to build for it from the start).
Re:I'm curious... (Score:1, Informative)
I had no experience developing or playing games before my later college years. But I was enthusiastic about programming game engines, and I pursued a game-development specialty MS, went to trade events, and (sure enough) landed a job. It's difficult work, but rewarding if you enjoy the small-company atmosphere and can handle the stress.
Re:I'm not a game programmer (Score:3, Informative)
You're right to a degree, but even CAD work can have elements of design to it that aren't just about measuring the space. Games tend to deal in units equivalent to the height of the standard player character (or half the height in the cases I've experienced), so instead of working in feet or inches you're working mostly in ~3' units. Still, if your door is only 3' tall, your players are going to have to duck to get through it, and you'd better hope that you planned for that in the dynamics of the level.
Yes, there are more considerations in level design, such as game balance, the level of detail and number of polygons in an area (you can use more detail and polygons in a single-player level than in multiplayer, for instance, because you can better control how much is on the screen at one time in single player), the pace that people go through an area, and so on.
In CAD your considerations are function first, implementing a design that satisfies your customer. These things can move over to level design perfectly well, and if you can use AutoCAD, for instance, you can probably find your way through almost any level design software. You won't necessarily be a good level designer just because you can design a warehouse or office space in a CAD program, but it doesn't hurt if you can design a level in AutoCAD and use the available converters to port it into most available games (I just double-checked because it's been quite a while before I messed with a level editor, but there are tools available for Quake, Half-Life, and Unreal (multiple versions of Quake and Unreal) to convert AutoCAD drawings into formats native to their respective map editing tools). Still, any developer looking for level designers is going to be looking for people with at least some familiarity with their tools, so the bulk of the work you show them should be in their tools. The rest just doesn't hurt if your designs are good.