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Games Entertainment

A Look At The PSX2 More on The Recall 83

Posted by Hemos from the rescinding-comments dept.
cicatrix1 writes "According to this story at Daily Radar, the online stories about the Playstation 2 Memory Recall are false. Sony admitted to not being able to manufacture enough cards, but said that they all, in fact, work properly. " So, that means our recent story was true, as updated. As well, the folks at Core Magazine have got a look inside the machine.
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A Look At The PSX2 More on The Recall More

A Look At The PSX2 More on The Recall

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  • Anybody else notice that..... (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    "So, that means our recent story was not in fact true"

    became

    "So, that means our recent story was true, as updated"

    after about 20 minutes or so?

    Guys, if you're going to change your header like that, at least tell us that you changed it, else those who posted in those first 20 minutes are going to look a bit daft, especially as the whole tone changes with the removal of the word 'not'.

  • _your_ recent story?? I don't think so (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Emphasis added:

    "So, that means
    our recent story was not in fact true."

    Uh, get a clue, Slashdot. It was not _your_ story. Posting a link to another site does not make it yours.

  • Can someone post a URL for this bug-reproduction on this thread? Thanks...

    Regards,
    Denny

    # Using Linux in the UK? Check out Linux UK [linuxuk.co.uk]

  • Mind translating that for us dumb Americans?
  • I know I shouldn't even waste my time with this...

    There is no recall by sony, however owners of the PSX2 are still reporting the problem.
  • Actually I read two weeks ago at MSNBC that the playstation accounts for 40% of sony's total revenue.
  • Just because you don't care doesn't mean that the rest of US don't. I for one want to see how Sony handles the situation and I would like to see where the actual cause of this memory card / DVD driver problem is because unlike you I may actually consider getting a PSX2 when they are released.
  • Before you start criticising Slashdot, note that the Slashdot story cited its (only) source, and provided a link to it.

    My problem was with the way the information is presented. Instead of saying that the original story was incorrect but the update to the original was correct, Hemos said the same thing but in a way that leads the reader to think that the original was correct. Given that the headline of that story was about Sony recalling some the memory cards, most people are probably going to remember that.

    An analogous example are those sweepstakes that seem to suggest that you need to buy something in order to enter but at the very end say that no purchase is necessary. I just think its sleazy when someone makes a mistake, and then frames the apology/correction in such a way as to suggest that the original mistake was not a mistake after all.

  • Upgradeability for high-end (ie gaming) PCs is
    little to non-existant.

    Change your CPU, oh no, new slot, change the motherboard. Change the motherboard, change the RAM. Change the motherboard, end up with a no-ISA board for the features you want, throw out all your "legacy" (== "more than six months old" modem, sound, network cards). Buy a new graphics card every six months and be unable to sell the old one for anything more than a pittance. PCs now seem to be desinged for six-month obsolescence.

    I've given up with the whole PC upgrade rat-race. My boxen are a P75, P133 and K5-100 (Win95, Linux, NetBSD), and I'm only adding hardware when something I want to do needs it (the P133 is looking for a second CPU, but only because I want to play around with an SMP box. Nothing I'm doing needs the speed.) I gave in and bought a Playstation - it's *so* much easier, all the games run on it, I don't have to keep checking the box thinking 'do I meet the specs? Do I have enough disk space to install?'

    Admittedly I probably picked a bad time to do it, with the PS2 due in the UK late this year, but in general with consoles you can look at three to five years of playing games on the same machine without any upgrades. I've no intention of being on the PS2 bleeding edge, so I should get another year at least out of my PS1.

    Regards,
    Tim.
  • My thoughts exactly. :)

    --GnrcMan--
  • I guess that wasn't the best wording, I didn't mean to say that nobody from Japan reads slashdot, but I would assume that most people who do are in North America. Though this may also be wrong seeing as I have nothing to base that on. That being said what I really mean is in the next few months to a year Sony will have (hopefully) cleared up these problems. Too bad they didn't fix them first but that seems to be the way everybody releases software/hardware today. At this time, is when most people be they in Japan, the US or elsewhere is probably when they will buy these systems so why do we give the initial problems so much attention. As for a PC I made another incorrect assumption, that anyone reading slashdot had a PC that was probably capable of playing these games. Obviously this was a bad assumption to make since not everybody can afford to buy a new computer ever year or so. Personally though I would rather spend the money to upgrade my PC then buy a console gaming station. On the other hand if all you have is a mainframe (poor you NOT! :)) then a console game just may be the way to go......

    Cheers
  • for the fact that an overwhelming percentage of product is defective. In light of the PSX2 being the most eagerly awaited console in years, and in light of Sony making a grab to enter the financial industry; it certainly doesn't take a genius to realize that the last thing Sony can afford right now is for the PSX2 to publicly have issues so severe that only a full recall is sufficient to fix the problem. How would those market analysts react to Sony attempting to be part of the financial community when they (Sony) can't even get a video-game right?
  • Funny you mention it...

    IBM introduced the VGA port on its PS2 way back in 1987.

    Somehow I doubt one of those fine 386's could handle Kessen, though.

  • Us? (Score:1)

    by kalor ( 103136 )
    Who is 'us'??
    There are no ./ readers in Japan?

  • Nintendo had problems with the Famicom (NES) when it was first released in Japan. Those issues caused Nintendo to miss out on the entire Christmas season because the issues were serious enough that a full recall was needed.

    Sony missed the Christmas '99 season (probably because of software development issues) but even with their delayed launch date, they can't keep up. Geesh!
  • At which point did I say that I was from Japan?
    I also live in Europe but the difference between a console and a games-pc is large enough to stop me from ever buying an up-to-date PC.
    Most of my non-gaming computer activities are either at work on a high-end machine that I can't play games on, or on a 486 at home which runs an up-and-coming OS. I have no need of a high-end machine at home, therefore - even in Europe - news like this matters (even more so if it turns out to be true).
  • Have you seen the *IDOITIC* system requirements for PC games nowdays? Buying 1 $300-400 PlayStation 2 beats buying a $1000-2000 computer every 6 months kiddo....

    People need to realize that the resolution on console systems are no where near what that of a computer is. Sure, we could all get a Voodoo3 and a low-end Pentium and play most games fine on at 320x200. When you start to increase resolution, thats when bad things happen. TVs are horrible when it comes to gaming, assuming you don't have a wide-screen digital one.

    If you have a problem with that much for a much more usable and upgradeable piece of hardware, just build a low-end CPU and run at 320x200. Thats all the consoles really are: cheap computers that don't expand as much as a real computer.

    -Bill

  • Caught this on http://dailynews.netscape.com/ [netscape.com]. Basically Sony hasn't admitted there is a bug (yet?), but admitted that the complaints were real and they are investigating.

    The stats are staggering, they have sold 900K units in a few days. A recall/repair would be quite a mess, even if it was limited to Japan.

  • I think alot of sites ran the story whilst waiting for some sort of reaction from Sony - which is understandable

    From one of the reports I've seen, the problem is with a particular game, and might still be a fault with the memory cards

  • at the bottom of that daily radar article it says:
    Daily Radar has experienced Ridge Racer V saved game files wiping out the PS2's DVD drivers. We were able to replace the old drivers using the Utilities disc, but the memory card bug is still a significant flaw that Sony has not yet addressed.
    All is not well in PSX2 land apparently. Are the DVD drivers stored on the memory card? I would have thought they would be in flashable rom or something.
  • What?! /. make a mistake, surely not!

    Either way, the PSX2 is bound to have some teething problems, just as the PSX did - It's been too short to see if one can run for a week and not overheat yet :-) I'd say that'll be tested soon, for sure!

  • I was thinking that very same thought actually, seems odd none of the articles I've read has brought that up. I wouldn't hold Dell responsible if a PC game I bought destroyed data on my system.
  • PC's just aren't that expensive anymore. I have a p3/550 that I built last summer for under $1000. I can play the latest and greatest bleeding-edge games, and will be able to for at least another year.
  • Hell, even ps2.ign.com had posted that false story. How could something like that get going? Matters not, I want it and I want it now.
  • Well, it's either that or it's a bug in how Ridge Racer writes to the memory card. But you're right, it's not such a big deal, especially to one who hardly ever rents movies like me. But now my curiousity is piqued, I want to see if there is anything to this.

    I wonder if PS2 games can save their data on PSX memory cards? I know it can read from them just fine though.

    And is the PSX memory card really 1MB? I never bothered to find that out. Anyway, I ask because if you look at files on one with the PS2, it lists each "block" as being 8KB...

  • Thanks for the link! Seems like everyone here has been citing the Dailyradar article when mentioning the DVD playback bug. This gives the bug rumors more credibility...

    BUT, I still want to see this for myself; in other words does this affect each and every PS2, or just a certain number of them? Is there anyone out there that has tried this out themselves??

    I plan to try it out probably tonight...go rent a DVD and see if the DVD player has been corrupted.
    Seems like if this is a universal problem, scores of people would have found and been talking about it already over here. Still, even over here, I don't know too many who own one that could have tested this yet. But most BBSs only seem to have "normal" discussions of games, etc, (so far....)

  • Well, the DVD player is pretty much a software DVD player. It's completely (as far as I can tell) stored on the memory card.

    FYI, the memory card also contains a file called "System Drivers", which may or may not have anything to do with the DVD playback functionality.

    FYI#2, the memory card browser is kinda cool, the information on stuff saved on the card is given to you in real KB, not mysterious "blocks". The DVD player is 634 KB, the system drivers file is 42 KB. Neither can be copied directly from the memory card, I guess you have to do this from the Utility disk.

  • I think the point is that the Memory card technology is supposed to let you lock the data on the card so that other processes (that do not have the key) can not affect it. This is I believe to prevent copying and alteration of the stored information.

    The fact that Ridge Racer V can affect this data suggests that the implementation of the protection on the card to prevent this is open to bypassing.

    It may be in the future that these early memory cards become prized posessions as they allow people to bypass the Magic protection. Which may be useful for people GameSharking hacking the DVD playback software, etc.
  • You said it here yourself.
    almost every decent game
    The key word is almost. Some of us like to be able to play everything.
  • yes, that may be true but dell dose not charge mega bucks to allow you to make games for their computers nore dose it recive a cash for ever game sold for a dell system. This type of arangment in my opion shifts some blamb onto the console company for ensuring that all games made for there console work proply
  • >I am glad that the problem doesn't exist, but do we really care? The
    >product is not available to us yet and by the time it is all of these
    >issues will surely be fixed, that being said almost every decent game
    >they release will also be released for the PC. Therefor why would you
    >want to pay for the device when you could just pay for the game on
    >your computer?

    Have you seen the *IDOITIC* system requirements for PC games nowdays? Buying 1 $300-400 PlayStation 2 beats buying a $1000-2000 computer every 6 months kiddo....
  • And the accuracy record of professional journalists is...? Considering the biased, shallow, error-ridden, and uninformed drek I see on T.V. and read in the newspapers every day, I value the "here's the source, now let's all comment" mentality of Slashdot a helluva lot more.

    (Did I just feed an energy creature?)



  • Thought it might be interesting to check out the article in the norwegian newspaper Nettavisen [nettavisen.no].
    It seems Playstation 2 will be on sale in Norway within a few days at Smartshopper [smartshopper.no] for 750$. They found a totally legal way of avoiding Japanese export regulations.

    Feel free to moderate me down for being off topic and spoiling your tomorows news.

  • And this is the same problem as the DC -- manifested in a different way. On the DC bad discs froze the system, on the PS2 bad code overwrote its bounds.
    This doesn't cover the overheat/freeze problems however. I suspect they need to further cool these puppies. DVD playback is still an issue.
  • All I see on the core site is screenshots from a game. I want to see what's inside the box.
  • ...to protect their stock price. They had a full new product news (free advertising) blitz this last weekend, I haven't seen the bug report stories yet...

    Playstation (mostly the games) accounts for 20% of Sony's overall revenue and 33% of their profits (according to those same news stories) The PS2 is a *big* deal for them and damage control is a very serious occupation around there right about now.

    --
  • Daily Radar's take [dailyradar.com]. They don't give too many details, but few details is likely to satisfy a rumor-hungry horde where no details has failed.
  • For those keeping score at home, there's at least one: rmager@vgkk.co.jp [slashdot.org]. I fail to see what you're responding to, however -- the summary didn't contain the word "us".

  • Though this may seem like a biased report [ign.com] seeing as how it's a Nintendo related site, it's also IGN and they usually report accurate legit stuff. It would seem that if you look past the fill-rate capabilities of the PSX2, you run into some hardware limitations of a different kind.

    Since that topic is sorta Dolphin related, some of you may want to check this other link as well [ign.com]...it would appear that a Dolphin release later this year isn't that far fetched after all.

  • Don't be so arrogant as to assume that nobody from Japan reads Slashdot.
    Some of us even care about things we will never own (mainframes, big unix boxen etc)- never mind only having to wait a few months.
    Some of us can't afford to buy a PC that will run the latest games, wheras a console is a much more economical option.

    That's actually very strange considering that I hardly see any homeless Japanese people (hell even in Europe for that matter) and that Japan has one of the highest per capita incomes in the world. Technically you can order a nice new state of the art computer (PIII and all that) for less than $900 from pricewatch I would also hazard a guess that they have similar deals in Japan. Plus a PC can do so much more than a console can.
  • They seem to have moved them to a 'members only' Hardware Guide section (the slashdot effect?) - not being that desperate to hand my details to all & sundry just to see what I saw for free when the first /. story linked there, I declined their offer of membership.

    Can anyone tell me what exactly the region coding system on Japanese PSX2s is? Can they be set to to other regions a limited number of times, or are they fixed permantly for region 2?

    Does anyone with a TOOL and who knows where the AC button is want to fill me in? Could this 'reload from utilities' feature provide for 'pirate' region free DVD drivers to be substituted?

    - Andy R.

    (oh, well done to all slashdotters! 58 comments so far in this thread, and no-one's used the 'L' word! Your fixation may yet be curable!)
  • Has anyone even thought for a second that the memory cards may not be defective? The only game the screws with the cards is Ridge Racer V - Therefore, the problem is that Ridge Racer was badly programmed, and overwrites or corrupts the DVD playback software, case closed. If the memory cards don't screw up at any other time, then the cause of the problem is not the memory cards, but with Ridge Racer V!
  • Daily Radar sucks. But regardless, if you want import game news from a source that actually has reasons to take it seriously, check the what's new section on NCSX.com. They've confirmed the problems, they're considering halting sales of the console.
  • Which journalists?

    /. merely provided a link. Slashdot say "this site says this thing", and link to the site.

    As I recall, the site in question said "there are rumours circling the Internet that...", which was true.

    So... no bad journalism there, just people who can't read, or who can't make value judgements about fact, opinion, conjecture.
    --

  • And by false, I mean true... (Score:3)

    by Mickey Jameson ( 3209 ) on Thursday March 09, 2000 @06:59AM (#1215150)
    The recall may have been bogus, but the cards still have bugs. The Daily Radar reported that Sony denies the recall, but that the DR has replicated the bug that Sony vehemently denies exists.
    So yesterday's story may have been not 100% accurate, but there still is a problem.

  • Re:Does it Mater? (Score:3)

    by slashdot-terminal ( 83882 ) on Thursday March 09, 2000 @07:32AM (#1215151) Homepage
    Have you seen the *IDOITIC* system requirements for PC games nowdays? Buying 1 $300-400 PlayStation 2 beats buying a $1000-2000 computer every 6 months kiddo....

    Well I have stated similar concerns but people sweep them under the rug as rantings from a wacko and I get massarced. They are rediculous and could use some trimming down.

    I however disagree with the price tag. Theoretically with new PCs upgradeability is something that can be more easily achieved without too much hassle.

  • Memory Card Problems (Score:3)

    by mayesje ( 88625 ) on Thursday March 09, 2000 @07:02AM (#1215152)
    There may not have been a recall but the reports of problems w/ the cards seem to be legitimate. See Ike Sato's impressions of the PS2 @ videogames.com [gamespot.com] for a first hand account of some of the problems.

  • Still problems (Score:3)

    by BoneFlower ( 107640 ) <anniethebruce@ g m a i l . c om> on Thursday March 09, 2000 @07:09AM (#1215153) Journal
    Daily Radar has experienced Ridge Racer V saved game files wiping out the PS2's DVD drivers. We were able to replace the old drivers using the Utilities disc, but the memory card bug is still a significant flaw that Sony has not yet addressed.

    Apparently Sony is denying the problems. What I think is they shipped the cards, found the bug, managed to quickly fix the problem. However they are now having supply problems putting out enough of the fixed cards to meet demand. The delay in sales is simply to give them time to make enough of the new cards to be marketable.
    The idea that they are simply short on cards is just BS, they just don't want to admit to making a mistake. If they were producing good cards to begin with, why would they stop selling? If I was them I'd keep selling, I don't see the point in halting shipping.
  • Before you start criticising Slashdot, note that the Slashdot story cited its (only) source, and provided a link to it.

    It's up to us to decide how well we value that source.
    --

  • Yes it does (Score:4)

    by MonkeyMagic ( 118319 ) on Thursday March 09, 2000 @07:31AM (#1215155) Homepage
    Don't be so arrogant as to assume that nobody from Japan reads Slashdot.
    Some of us even care about things we will never own (mainframes, big unix boxen etc)- never mind only having to wait a few months.
    Some of us can't afford to buy a PC that will run the latest games, wheras a console is a much more economical option.

  • SCEA?! I thought this was in Japan! (Score:5)

    by TuRRIcaNEd ( 115141 ) on Thursday March 09, 2000 @07:16AM (#1215156)
    Online reports of a recall of PlayStation2 memory cards are false, Sony Computer Entertainment America told Daily Radar today ... but the memory card bug is still a significant flaw that Sony has not yet addressed.

    But wasn't it a problem with the Japanese machines? SCEA shouldn't be bothered with this, as the console won't ship over there for months yet, hence the 'we're rectifying this' spiel. As far as I can tell, the problem of corruption with savegame files (RR5) is still a problem, and I think that that is far more damaging PR than a recall. Strictly speaking, if the component parts of Sony have some degree of independence from each other, who says that the Japanese arm has to tell the US arm that they're recalling?

    This sounds like marketroid-speak for 'The first release machines are crocked in Japan, but don't worry about the US/Europe release'.

    If you take the leading and final statement from the article (catenated above), then it seems that this press release contradicts itself more than it does the previous story, with marketing bumpf inbetween. Sounds more like face-saving and future-protection than a denial to me.

  • You can help. Pass this on to ten friends (Score:5)

    by 348 ( 124012 ) on Thursday March 09, 2000 @07:05AM (#1215157) Homepage
    WASHINGTON, D.C.-The Institute for the Investigation of irregular Internet Phenomena announced today that many Slashdot posters are becoming infected by a new virus that causes them to believe without question every groundless story, legend, and dire warning that shows up on the site. The Gullibility Virus, as it is called, apparently makes people believe and forward copies of silly hoaxes relating to E-Mail Sony Playstation releases, Slashdot, viruses, get-rich-quick schemes, and conspiracy theories. These are not just readers of tabloids or people who buy lottery tickets based on fortune cookie numbers, & quotes; a spokesman said. Most are otherwise normal people, who would laugh at the same stories if told to them by a stranger on a street corner; However, once these same people become infected with the Gullibility Virus, they believe anything they read on the Internet.My immunity to tall tales and bizarre claims is all gone, reported one weeping victim,.I believe every warning message and sick child story my friends forward to me, even though most of the messages are anonymous. Internet users are urged to examine themselves for symptoms of the virus, which include the following

    * the willingness to believe improbable stories without thinking
    * the willingness to post meaningless comments on the hoax at Slashdot
    * the urge to forward multiple copies of such stories to others
    * a lack of desire to take three minutes to check to see if a story is true.

    A. C. is an example of someone recently infected. He told one reporter,I read on the Net that the major ingredient in almost all shampoos makes your hair fall out, so I've stopped using shampoo.; When told about the Gullibility Virus,A . C. said he would stop reading e-mail, so that he would not become infected. President Clinton has been advised by the National Health Council. He has had an emergency session with former presidents Bush, Reagan, Carter, Ford, and Lincoln. All agreed he should not quarantine the country. This is not being reported in the major news media to avoid panic. Anyone with symptoms is urged to seek help immediately. Experts recommend that at the first feelings of gullibility, Internet users rush to their favorite search engine and look up the item tempting them to thoughtless credence. Most hoaxes, legends, and tall tales have been widely discussed and exposed by the Internet community. Many companies have internal support groups to help employees minimize the impact of this terrible virus

    Forward this message to all your friends right away! Don't think about it! This is not a chain letter post! This story is true! Don't check it out! This story is so timely, there is no date on it! This story is so important, we're using lots of exclamation points!!! For every message you forward to some unsuspecting person, the Home for the Hopelessly Gullible will donate ten cents to itself.

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