Command and Conquer Generals Released 385
A reader writes:"Febuary 11th marks the day that the future of the Command and Conquer universe will be determined. Electronic Arts has taken over the franchise and has even shut down Westwood Studios. Many of us will remember Westwood for such games as Dune II. They basically invented the RTS market which makes this a sad time. Electronic Arts today launches what they are hoping will be the WarCraft 3 killa. This game along with SimCity 4 is what EA is counting on. Here is an amazing 430 screenshot pictorial of the Generals single player missions. "
Eye of the beholders (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Eye of the beholders (Score:2, Interesting)
~Jon~
Re:Eye of the beholders (Score:2, Informative)
Command & Conquer again, and again, and ag... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Command & Conquer again, and again, and ag. (Score:5, Insightful)
Isn't that the POINT of a sequel game? Keep the basic game play, which people like, intacted but also add as many new features as you can. Each game had new units with differant special abilities changing the game play just enough to keep it fun and fresh. Yet they kept most of the basic units in some form or another so the learning curve would be small for an old vet.
Game sequels are the game programers remaking the same game to push the latest hardware and add new things that at the time of the orignal game where not possible.
Don't dog on a C&C game for being a C&C game.
C&C Red Dune Generals Alert 2 (Score:2)
Actually, typical game sequels are the publishers/developer shops trying to make some "easy" money. A lot of the work is already done: name recognition, game design, internal toolsets. Some of the actual game code might be "reusable" as well, with some tweaking (or none, depending on the game).
I've worked in the game industry in the past, and this has been my experience... YMMV.
Re:Command & Conquer again, and again, and ag. (Score:2)
I want something that changes my strategies from the original game. Now, I haven't played the newest C&C game, but I'm guessing you're going to be tank rushing a lot.
--trb
Re:Command & Conquer again, and again, and ag. (Score:3, Insightful)
No! No! I disagree and I hate when they do that!
I would agree is that the basic game play should be the same, but the thing should be SIMPLIFIED!
Make the user interface CLEANER! (Example: I am so glad that in Civ III I no longer have to move the fucking camels around)
Emphasize the things that people LIKED about the game, and remove the fiddly bits that people did NOT like. (Example: allowing you to let an AI "advisor" do things that you don't want to control manually)
Simplified doesn't mean "not improved" though. Things that are good can be HEIGHTENED and enriched, without just "lookit all the new features. To use Civ III again as an example, they didn't just add more "features" to diplomacy as much as enriched it. Yes, it is more complex from one point of view, but I would say it is simpler in that the types of things you can do seem more natural. An "alliance" feels more like what I would expect an alliance to be like, for example.
And... of course... I think part of the point of a sequel is to make the AI SMARTER.
(and yes, I like it when the whole thing is purtier too)
Re:Command & Conquer again, and again, and ag. (Score:2)
Complete waste of time releasing subsequent versions that are so similar.
Re:Command & Conquer again, and again, and ag. (Score:2)
Most of the generals beta-testers I know won't be buying the game. They've done a poor job integrating user suggestions and nobody is expecting them to fix much after release.
I know they need to focus on the successful products, but they can only burn their fans so many times. Maybe will bring some changes, but I doubt it.
Re:Command & Conquer again, and again, and ag. (Score:2)
I'd say they did the same bloody thing _over_ and _over_ and _over_ again in Dune:Emperor. Missions were not unique, rehashing the same maps got old, and it was real flacky on my laptop until one of the later patches fixed the graphics issues. Anything 'new' with units retreating was lost on me... What a waste of time/money.
Buying and shutting down... (Score:5, Informative)
Well, EA has made some good games but for me it's more and more a game-studio killer, buying other game makers and shutting them down (more or less)...
The interview with Lord British [gamespy.com] that was posted recently on /. gives some insight into EA's thinking: make money fast, even at the cost of quality, it seems.
Very sad...
Re:Buying and shutting down... (Score:4, Insightful)
This includes:
Bullfrog and their Magic Carpet Series
Origin and their Ultima and Wing Commander series
Janes and their entire line of simulators
Westwood and their C&C and Dune series
Notice, those four companies (amongst others) have released some of the most important and critically acclaimed titles in the history of Computing. Their all dead now, and you have Electronic Arts to thank.
The only good thing about all this is EA are morons and let most of the key talent leave to start new game companies. The good people are still out there making games, it's just sad that they no longer have access to the properties that made them successfull (and us quite happy gamers).
the rest of their history has been a joke... (Score:3, Insightful)
Some of us still remember MULE, Mail Order Monsters, Marble Madness, Seven Cities of Gold, Arctic Fox, Skate or Die, Racing Destruction Set, Archon, etc.
I hate sports games too - but EA was once something, man.
Sure hope this runs under WineX... (Score:2)
I always enjoyed Red Alert. From the previews I've seen, Generals looks like it might be even more fun. We'll see.
430 screenshots! (Score:5, Funny)
Movies Too (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Movies Too (Score:2, Informative)
and as a sidenote (Score:4, Informative)
10 hours playtime for all 3 campaigns
uncounted number of bugs
AI is.. Not So Good(tm)
there are no movies furthering the storyline
then again there is no real storyline
its built on chinas/arab terroristi stereotypes, us are great peeps though
worst c&c ever.
so im off playing dune2.. the dos one you know
Re:and as a sidenote (Score:2, Funny)
Good, nothing more annoying than loosing in single player mode.
NOW I see EA's strategy... (Score:3, Funny)
I thought they intended to reduce the entire game market to Sims and Sports. But I forgot that there is one other category just as boring as Sims and Sports -- the C&C Clone category!
This increases the diversity of EA's offerings by 50%!
Been playing it already for 3 days... (Score:5, Interesting)
My initial comments, based on playing Skirmish mode:
- Effects are okay (nice explosions) but I think some of the animations esp. for the personnel suck. I think the 3D engine is solid, but not really ground breaking. Not sure if the terrain is deformable (haven't played around with the superweapons as much), but I don't it's a big loss that it isn't. Most, if not all structures are certainly destroy-able.
- Tech tree isn't that deep, although the Experience Points system is something different. I've been able to beat opponents using the plain old tank rush, but it's not as bad (or good, depending on how you look at it) as in previous versions.
- Lack of previous version's cut scenes (no more Kari Wuhrer --- damn!!!)
Re:Been playing it already for 3 days... (Score:4, Funny)
Wait, No Tanya in tight army fatuges, or at the end of the game in a thin, small dress waiting to get on a helicopter with YOU to goto the biggest party the world has yet to see?
I think we all need to bow our heads and have a moment of silence please.
don't forget (Score:2)
I'm gonna have to say that this one looks like it was released half-baked.
Re:don't forget (Score:2)
Retarded Or Something? (Score:4, Funny)
they are hoping will be the WarCraft 3 killa.
Yeah, ok...Word up, homey.
Sheesh.
*sniff* (Score:4, Informative)
Oh Battletech, The Crescent Hawk's Inception (and Revenge) were my first ever Westwood games, and in fact my first ever PC games back in 1988 on a CGA monitor and an XT i believe! The Crescent Hawk's Inception was one of the best RPGs i've played, but of course playing it now only takes a few hours to win. I'd love to see a huge, modern version of that game instead of today's run-around-and-kill-stuff-in-a-huge-robot Battletech games. Here's to more science fiction RPGs!
Don't forget Westwood also did a whole bunch of the early AD&D games (whether that's a good thing or not is perhaps debateable). They did California Games - those wacky surfer dudes with their hacky sacks :-) Kyrandia, Eye of the Beholder II, Lands of Lore (featuring our beloved Jean-Luc Picard).
I have a feeling Westwood were even around in the 8-bit days, though going under a different name, perhaps. Were they Ocean? Does anyone remember?
Re:*sniff* (Score:2)
Here's the boxart [csd.uwo.ca]. Notice it says "Westwood Associates" on it, not "Westwood Studios". They may not have even been the same company.
you will probably lile sea dogs II (Score:2)
sea dogs 2 should be released soon.
http://seadogs2.bethsoft.com/
Re:*sniff* (Score:2)
In the first Battletech you're a guy with no mech. You have some money in the bank, but you can't buy a mech because you're a student and not a soldier. You walk around and train at the mech training place, where you start with missions like picking up some rubble, shooting a "dead" mech, shooting some robots, etc. You can't train 24/7 so you also walk around the rest of the city and train in other areas like rifles, pistols, vibroblades etc. You can also learn how to fix mechs. You can buy hand weapons, talk to random people in various buildings, check your bank account for interest...
Eventually in the middle of a training mission you are attacked by an invading force and the city is destroyed. If you run like hell you can escape inside a mech, but if you die you eject and have to walk around. Then it's a matter of going anywhere. You can visit any of the other cities on the map and talk to people there, heal up at a hospital, train further in various skills, buy new weapons, talk to more people. Depending on who you talk to and when you talk to them they might join your party or give you some information about what you're supposed to be doing next. Basically it's about the freedom to run around talking to whoever doing whatever. If your mech is destroyed, that's it bub, you're walkin', you know? It's actually very similar to those early SSI AD&D games, but with a skills-based system instead of str/dex/con/cha/etc.
Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2, Interesting)
1) Destroy a nuclear warhead storage facility in China ("The dragon awakes...")
2) Destroy a damn in Shymkent, Kazakhstan.
3) Destroy all enemy forces in Iraq ("Operation: Final Justice")
Can't they just use make-believe places and situations? I find this kind of stuff offensive.
If a company in China or Russian or wherever released a game about invading and destroying things in the USA, I'm sure many people in the USA - and especially elements of the press - would be outraged. Imagine if an Arabic country released a game like this - many people would see it as inciting hatred towards the USA.
Plea to game makers - please make the baddies aliens and dragons or robots.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
CNC Axis of Evil addition may have been a better name, still I'm sute the US is a big enough market that TROTW doesn't matter too much.
(see earlier post about Lord British and EA's marketing stratergy)
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2, Funny)
10. Gorgeous female british agent saves the day
9. Female agent is Russian but defects
8. Lone US Marine saves the world
7. Arabs are evil
6. Arabs are stupid and evil
5. Aliens have Eastern European Accents
4. Aliens have German accents
3. Bad guys are from wherever the US hates right now
2. Bad guys are British
1. Bad guys are German
I think there could be a trend but I can't see it right now.
However my half-British, half-German, Communist Palestinian (who happens to own a Chinese weapons factory) leader says we will board our spaceships and attack at dawn.
Troc
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:5, Insightful)
This is political correctness gone too far. You've started down a path I don't think you intended to take. If we turn it to face another way, being half-German I know that many Germans, most Germans in fact are ashamed that their history includes Nazism and Hitler. And they certainly don't like being reminded that the whole affair happened, but you're not campaigning for Medal of Honor and Castle Wolfenstein to change their games? Why not? If aliens landed tomorrow and started complaining that they're being maligned by our entertainment industry would you suddenly want to remove them from the list of acceptable villans? No, you probably wouldn't.
If a company in China or Russian or wherever released a game about invading and destroying things in the USA, I'm sure many people in the USA - and especially elements of the press - would be outraged.
And I agree with you, people in the states would be outraged, but that's not my metric for why I should or shouldn't do something. While I may not agree with the missions, or what they portray (though I think they accurately reflect active military plans the US already has drawn up), I have enough wherewithall to distinguish between a game and reality. The path you're taking leads to the same place 'concerned parents' and activists are taking us by wanting to ban violent video games altogether because of what they portray, and how they will affect us. If a game offends me, I don't buy it. You should do the same, and vote with your dollars, instead of trying to take choices from me.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:5, Interesting)
Imagine how supprised I was to find that this arcade contained not only the cutting edge of both American and Japanese gameing companies, but also the old classics as well.
I kept a croud of 15 kids enraptured with my exploits on "Battle of Midway" (or whatever it's called) for about 20 mins before I realized that the plane I was -=flying=- was a Zero and the planes I was shooting down were Mustangs and B29s.
Yeoch.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2, Insightful)
I didn't realize that it's offensive to say these nations are our military competitors. Are you going to say all those warplane simulators are offensive? And it's not like they've been confined to just American craft, they've simulated Soviet aircraft too.
You're saying I shouldn't buy "SU-27 Flanker 2.0" because it's offensive to Americans. Yeah. Whatever.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:5, Funny)
You realize in ALL the Command and Conquer games, you can play the badguys? Which means, ~gasp~ you're invading and destroying things in the US and its allies (esp in RA2)
You're offended? Where do you want hte missions to be, in canada and chile?
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:3, Funny)
Missions we would like to see (Score:2)
b) Maori Revenge: The secret Maori army, developed for centuries disguised as a rugby team, has taken New Zealand and now are on the way to Australia. As the Maori leader your mission is to free Australia from all white people.
c) Antarctica: The war for clean water reachs its finnal stage: The joint Israeli-Saudi Arabia army face the South American forces for the last untapped water resources.
d) The Fourth World War, Einstein version: armed with sticks and stones, Americans, Chinese and Russians fight for World domination.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:3, Interesting)
Goddamnit... (Score:2)
Why do you think Return to Castle Wolfenstein is so popular? Yeah, the engine and the gameplay are good; but honestly, it's just so morally and emotionally satisfying to shoot Nazis in the brain. Killing a computer representation of Saddam Hussein or Osama bin Laden or that wacko Kim Jong Il would be just as fulfilling, I'd imagine.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:4, Insightful)
No kidding. Imagine the hell that would be raised if someone came out with a mod pack that lets you run squads of Israeli stormtroopers to squash Palestinian uprisings, conversely if you could play small squads of Palestinians to take out key Israeli civilian targets, or if you could deploy Arab sappers/bombers/engineers to take out key city buildings.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
O'well back to BF1942 and protecting the beaches of normandy from UK and US invaders.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
China vs Terrorists -- Chinese destroyed facility to avoid terrorists gaining control of it.
China vs Terrorists -- Chinese destroy dam to destroy terrorists.
Probably USA vs Terrorists. Not got that far yet
Um, you realise, of course, in this game, the USA and China are portrayed as co-operating in the fight against the GLA (terrorists).
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
I bet they felt bad about that one after 9/11/2001.
The point is, these games are based on an alternative history in which Albert Enistien invents a time machine and assassinates Hitler while he was still a child. It shouldn't be seen as happening today.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:5, Insightful)
Would you feel the same way if the object of the game was to crash a plane into a US city?
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:4, Insightful)
To be honest, playing the original Microsoft Flight Simulator at age 6, I thought the purpose -was- to crash a plane into the Sears Tower.
BUILDING CRASH
As to this-- look, there's tons of North Korean and Iraqi movies about the downfall of America in various ways. Every side spins things the way they will, and I like playing games with conflicts/weapons I can relate to. And killing a lot of Russians in Operation Flashpoint doesn't mean I hate Russians.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
Really? "Tons"? Can you give me more details?
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
The difference there is that you have an alien race and a mutated lizard destroying cities, not people from differing countries. Something quite different.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:2)
Doesn't sound so much fun after September 11th, does it? I'm sure no USA games company would attempt to release a game like that now.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:5, Insightful)
Do you know how terrible, how absolutely hellish WWII was? Neither do I, even though I've got a tiny window into it from reading many books and soldiers' accounts and seeing many pictures of it. It makes the whole WTC incident, including the footage of people jumping to their deaths, seem like a birthday party.
But that doesn't stop us from playing any of the WWII-themed games out there. And by 'us' I mean of course the people who can tell the difference between a game and real life.
Re:Can't they stick to aliens? (Score:3, Insightful)
In the name of Eris, stop bitching about Sept 11 already. We're talking about a GAME here which thousands of people, including me, have enjoyed. Not because of the fact it involved blowing up US stuff, but because the game simply was quite fun to play. Yes, I enjoyed flattening entire US cities for fun, but I also enjoyed playing on the German side when playing Operation Market Garden in Battlefield 1942 and I also enjoyed nuking Amsterdam when playing Superpower [dreamcatchergames.com], both involving my own country. Besides, flattening US cities or taking on an US armour platoon in a GAME doesn't have much political "power" anyways.
Warcraft 3 Killa? (Score:3, Interesting)
Electronic Arts today launches what they are hoping will be the WarCraft 3 killa.
;).
Umm.. I thought Warcraft 3 already killed itself. Maybe I'm just getting too old now, but EVERYONE played the original it seems, but everyone I've talked to that I know hated 3. That's the nice thing about piracy. Everyone I knew back in the day pirated Warcraft, then went out and bought it because it rocked, but if people pirate a game they don't like they won't buy it.
Now, if they wanted to try and kill something I would suggest going after MOO, but then again this is EA(Electronic Assoles) we are talking about, so it may be good that they set their expectations low
Re:Warcraft 3 Killa? (Score:4, Interesting)
I really think more and more games are getting too clever for their own good. Warcraft 3 being a perfect example. Certainly hardcore gamers will go in there and memorize 25 different hotkeys and be able to follow games running at turbo speeds... but when we look back at Dune II and Warcraft I they played fairly slowly, you only had about 4 hotkeys (Move, Attack, Guard and Harvest/Mine/etc is all i remember)... you didn't have to remember a whole bunch of stuff before you could even play a game. The same thing is happening in first-person-shooters.
I was talking to a friend the other day who said he thinks things started getting out of hand when Street Fighter 2 and Mortal Kombat came out because there were all these combos of up-down-left-right-high-punch-low-punch-jump-back. .. I think he's probably right. Certainly i've memorized my share of secret moves and fatalities, and i even played TIE Fighter and various flight sims... but games like real-time strategy and first-person-shooters i always considered the Space Invaders of today... games where you can just kick back and click around and shoot and that's it. Who knows? Maybe we'll see a back-to-basics movement in the future when they start simplifying all this stuff again. Either that or a more intuitive input system (like thought-controlled-movement :-)
Re:Warcraft 3 Killa? (Score:2)
EA is counting on? (Score:3, Informative)
Also in the article, they talk a bit about sports games, saying it's the perfect franchise because fans will repurchase essentially the same game year after year to get updated player rosters. Is this actually true? I can understand buying the same game every couple years, as they add new features, and you migrate from one generation of consoles to the next. But are there really people who buy Madden 2000, Madden 2001, Madden 2002 and so forth all for the same system?
Re:EA is counting on? (Score:2, Informative)
What's worse than that, however, is that many of these people will also buy several different brands of the same game. At EB we have folks come in who have been playing Madden 2003 for months and are bored with it...so they grab Sega NFL 2k3 or NFL Fever for a little variety!
yrs,
Ephemeriis
Upgrade time... (Score:4, Funny)
I've got an *early* view of this game (Score:2, Interesting)
With my p4 1.5 and radeon 8500, the game ran VERY choppy at the minimum of 800x600 with low detail (although I didn't see any difference in detail between high and low).
Secondly, theres basically no story line behind the game, and seemingly, no single player campaigns at all. Sure you can play the single player stuffs, but don't expect to get blown away by great sounds and storyline like in starcraft or warcraft. Nope, here you get all generic characters, and wouldn't you know - when you play the chinese people you get all the racial slurs in there ("Toys "L" Us" anyone?)
I would seriously recommend waiting for the demo on this one, as there are bound to be people who perfer C&C over blizzard's unbeatable line of games, BUT there are probably some aspects of the game I've missed.
There is carpet bombing, saturation bombing, and all this other stuff, but its just sooooo freakin cutsy putsy... i'm not sure how else to put it.
Strange (Score:3, Insightful)
I know using GDI, NOD does not have the same jingoistic appeal for many as deploying battalions of Rangers, Raptors and Stealth bombers to sort out the bad guys. However for the sake of argument suppose someone wrote a game where you play a terrorist cell and have to attack civilian targets in a realistic process gaining experience and improved intelligence, more committed terrorists and the ability to commit greater atrocities as you 'advance'. I don't think people would find that an acceptable outlet for their kid's energies.
I know its only a game, but in the current climate I think a little more sensitivity could have been used.
Re:Strange (Score:2)
Several reasons come to mind: lack of imagination, laziness, or the fact that we are currently not on good terms with these particular countries? Ever hear the phrase "art imitates life"? We are currently in a tense situation with both of these countries, and the game reflects that.
However for the sake of argument suppose someone wrote a game where you play a terrorist cell and have to attack civilian targets in a realistic process gaining experience and improved intelligence, more committed terrorists and the ability to commit greater atrocities as you 'advance'.
A game that is not another standard cookie-cutter FPS/RPG/RTS/MMORPG would kick ass. I think that would be a great idea and I would buy it in an instant. Want to know why? Because it's a GAME! It doesn't indicate that I will eventually snap and gun down people in the streets, it indicates I have a twisted sense of fun. Besides, after games like GTA III and Vice City, we haven't exactly seen an upsurge of carjackings and joykillings, have we?
I know its only a game, but in the current climate I think a little more sensitivity could have been used.
Why? So bleeding heart liberals like you can feel all warm and fuzzy and pretend that all is right with the world? Wake up. Besides, who are we being sensitive to? Ourselves? Screw that. The nations depicted in the game? Again, screw that. If they were to make a game where the US were attacked and major cities were nuked, and civilian lives lost, I really wouldn't care because....wait for it....IT'S A GAME! It's meant to be fun! Heck, I wouldn't mind playing a game where I could take a couple pot shots at the good ol' USA, given the way it's being run now...
Re:Strange (Score:2, Interesting)
I know its just a game, and I certainly had fun blowing up recognizeable US landmarks in RA2, but it just seems like bad timing. A year or two ago I wouldn't have even blinked at this...but today, with all the noise about war with Iraq, it just seems to strike a little too close to home.
Call me stupid if you will, or a bleeding-heart, or whatever else.... I just wonder how this game will actually fare. I thought Collateral Damage [imdb.com] was actually an entertaining movie....but coming out so close to 9/11 just killed it in the theatres.
yrs,
Ephemeriis
personal summary (Score:5, Informative)
Well, first of all a PIII 800 with a GeForce2 MX 440 and 640MB RAM doesn't cut the cheese. And yes, I'm not a professional gamer, and it sucks to upgrade your box to be able to play an RTS.
Next thing is, I believe that 3D doesn't add value to an RTS game. Isometric is perfectly fine for strategy games, and doesn't look so cluttered. But thats personal preferences I guess...
What I liked about it:
* the Chinese Flame Tank
* nuke animations
What imho sucks:
* hardware requirements
* the absolute *braindead* idea that you see your buildjobs only when the building is active. man...
* the rather shallow tech tree
* unimaginative units (at least compared to Yuris Revenge)
* the missing storyline and videos
* the background story. like china is likely to just blow up one of their major dams to catch a few terrorists. jeez.
* the gameplay is _slow_, no real action (compared to red alert...)
Oh, and I've just seen the first 5 or so missions of the Chinese, and sincerely hope it's getting better. America was always the most fun to play with Westwood games.
My review of multiplayer mode (Score:5, Informative)
I really, really, like the bomb trucks. You get to load them up with anthrax and explosives, and send them charging at the enemy troop formations. The bomb trucks can disguise themselves as enemy vehicles, and the other player has to compel his units to shoot at them.
Another nice touch is the rebel ambushes. You can make your rebels appear behind enemy lines near a power station or something else that needs to be defended by the enemy, wait for the enemy to send a whole bunch of troops to kill them, and now that you know where a whole bunch of the enemy is you can dust the rebels and the enemy both with anthrax. Fun.;-)
The GLA scuds, chinese nukes, and american particle cannons are too powerful, and should perhaps be removed from the game I think. Maybe I am wrong....
The static defenses are too strong, or maybe I need more practice in taking them out using longer ranged weapons, I don't know yet. It seems that the scuds, nukes, and particle cannons are what you need to break through the static defenses.
It is a really good idea to keep a few bomb trucks
in reserve so that if a mass of enemy units rampages through your defenses, you can smash them a bit.
The car bombs are cute, but the timescale does not really allow you to spend time loading terrorists into cars and then getting just a small explosion out of the use of all that time. This is a pity.
I should probably try multiplayer at a reduced speed.
No more EA games for me, thanks (Score:2, Insightful)
They seem to be done entirely with an eye to maximizing profit, and have little to do with The Joy Of Gaming.
Case in point: SimCity 4.
I eagerly rushed into the shop as soon as I heard that SC4 is now available (been playing that game ever since the original SimCity).
Turns out that - despite the lowish recommended specs - my AMD 2100 with 512MB RAM and the GeForce 4 4600i is not powerful to fluidly run a city of more than about 8000 people.
A lot of functionality from previous versions is missing, and even the gorgeous graphics do not make up for this.
The handbook was the worst I ever saw in any game, and that certainly includes the tape covers back in the early 80s. It did not even explain the most basic concepts of the game, forcing you to buy the strategy guide (which, of course, I didn't).
Oh, and the price was about $50 (+$20 for the strategy guide, of course).
My bet is that C&CG is going to be much like this. No thanks, not interested. I am also not interested in the use of 3D in my strategy games, but that's personal preference, I guess.
Another poster complained about using real-life story lines (e.g. "Kill every civilian in Iraq"), which also bothers me slightly. I am certainly far from Politically Correct, and much prefere shooting humans to shooting robots and aliens, but the environment could at least take place in some fictional Evil State.
Bah. In the last couple of years, EA has only disappointed me. I'm taking my money elsewhere.
For example, to Uplink. Fun game, interesting idea, cheap, runs on both Eeevil Windoze and Good Linux. Have a look at http://www.introversion.co.uk.
(Just a happy player, no relation to Introversion).
Ciao,
Klaus
Re:No more EA games for me, thanks (Score:3, Interesting)
I's great that nobody gave a shit when great games Like "Mutant Storm" come from guys that have a passion for making games, and make them *multi-platform*. Still, they can't make a buck because everyone is proccupied with Final Fantasy and Command and Conquer news.
Or how about news about the latest LGP titles that are popping up. Disciples 2 is on the way. LGP just picked up two games from a company called GRIN. Maybe nobody cared that Icculus is porting MOH:AA to Linux along with Serious Sam and a few other games (Yes. I know that this did kinda make it to Slashdot a month ago.)
Re:No more EA games for me, thanks (Score:3, Interesting)
Athlon 2200+ XP (1.8GHz)
1 gig of PC2100 RAM
GeForce Ti500
I can run the game at 1024x768 with absolutely zero slow downs or stutters. I even tried 1600x1200 and it did pretty decent as well.
Maybe try upgrading your RAM? I dunno. SimCity4 appears to be quite a RAM hog.
But it's still an RTS! (Score:2)
Anyways if I might make a humble request to the
Re:But it's still an RTS! (Score:2)
heehee
"Warcraft 3 Killa" (Score:2)
It won't have to be much better than the C&C:Red Alert to be the WC3 Killer. WC3 was one of the biggest gaming disappointments I've ever had (although Diablo II was pretty close).
It's not very good (Score:3, Interesting)
This most interesting thing (Score:2)
This most interesting thing on their website was the status bar text. The metatag keywords are a bit OTT too - all 128 of them.
Some web developers have too much time on their hands. :)
The status bar text: :(
The Generals Multiplayer Test Preview Is The Ownage......
But I've Been Clicking On Pop Ups For 18 Hours....
And still haven't found the download link!
Sigh...
Shoutouts to the Webprincess who can be reached at sweetlil@renegadegenerals.com
She doesn't really like the webmaster playing games....
But she tolerates me... and she is damn sexy
In fact she is actually a princess
I wanna play Generals now damn it
I've pre-ordered and I better get the China box
If I get the dumb USA box I'll be upset
I'll take my Ranger crew and combat drop in to Amer's office
Do you think the military would authorize action against EAP?
Somehow I'm doubting it....
And what about the map editor.....
My girlfriend thought I was bad at being late.....
At least I show up within the same week
We've asked you nicely, now give it to us
Or we'll have to nicely ask again
I bet Amer is enjoying our e-mails and not returning them
More likely Harvard's dog is enjoying them
You think he prints every one off to feed the dog?
Maybe we should offer a prize for anyone who can tell us Amer's location
Perhaps all the n00bs scared him off
Yep, thats it. damn n00bs
Invent? (Score:2)
game ok but need to zoom out more and BIGGER maps! (Score:2, Informative)
I wish EA had never bought Origin and Bullfrog (Score:2)
I really miss Origin...Lucas Arts has me placated for a while with the X-wing and Tie games, but they seem to have abandoned the space shooter...I am just itching for a good space Shooter like wing commander again, but alas....
Re:I wish EA had never bought Origin and Bullfrog (Score:2)
Generals Reviews (Score:3, Informative)
The game disappoints... (Score:2, Insightful)
I saw it while peering over the shoulder of somebody I don't know but they say he's a warez guy.
It plays sort of like the original, true - but it has numerous faults.
System requirements are insane, and it does not look it. I mean, do you really need 2x the horsepower to reproduce Warcraft 3 & AoM's visuals?
The "story" (or since there's no story to speak of, the "setting") looks like a certain Texan's wet dream.
Units and sides are stereotypical and completely lack imagination. I mean, the arabs have a suicide bomber unit! Wow, who came up with THAT idea? Give him a medal.
Is it supposed to be fun to drive my shiny US tanks into a desert town after having the game take out all their defenses automatically with a number of combat helicopters and send the civilians flee in terror (oops there's that word in a weird context) while taking no casualties - not even shot at?
If this dud makes or breaks the C&C franchise, well, I have bad news.
After playing from experience... (Score:5, Informative)
So, here are my thoughts:
* I love the idea that cutscenes are gone.
They are cheesy, and it would take Spielberg to make them even resemble TV Mini-Series status. I mean, did anyone actually care about those overracted scenes and goofy costumes? Tiberian Sun wasn't the worst (Red Alert 1 + 2 takes that honor), but they certainly make the game more serious, and the beautiful engine makes the most of showing what's going on and what you need to do.
* I'm so glad they broke the formula but didn't break the game.
This refers to the fact that they took the command bar from the right to the bottom of the screen, and now you have the ability to minimize it (why isn't this in Warcraft 3?). Also, they quit that "Primary" crap that haunted old C&C's forever, and now you can have 5 different barracks on seperate hotkeys. This was not previously available in past versions of C&C.
* The game is SO BALANCED. It is unbelievably balanced. I was so impressed how the rocket launchers now have much more effect on tanks, yet the infantry can take out rocket launcher units in no time flat. Defenses and offensive units strike an excellent balance, and this is probably because the game was delayed, and the online beta test was a rousing success. This just goes to show you that if you keep the game in beta long enough to try it out on many different systems, and people find the weaknesses and strenghts of all the different factions, you'll strike a perfect balance that never upsets the gameplay or the fun. This is huge, and what might make C&C Generals a classic (I can't wait for the Expansion Pack/Sequel).
* The engine is glorious.
It's not Jaw Dropping, it's no Doom 3, but its damn good and better than Warcraft 3's in my opinion. Again, thanks to in-game cutscenes utilizing what they've already got, you cut down on the cheese and can really showcase what's truly great about the game. The environmental effects are truly staggering. I just cannot explain how cool it is to be attacking a garrisoned tower, blowing it up, and then watching it fall on the rest of the enemy forces, crushing them instantly. Geek greatness is found here!
Anyway, to sum up, the more I play it the more I like it. They've finally put some of the most balanced gameplay into an RTS (even War3 can't touch this one), and the engine is a delight. Truly a notable game, and I'm so glad they delayed it to add functionality, gameplay and a graphics polish that the difference between the God Awful Beta Test (if you've played it, rest assured the final game is Much Much Better) and the Final Game is truly Night and Day.
Requirements (Score:2, Informative)
I've been playing this game for over 2 months..... (Score:3, Interesting)
First of all, I've only played the multiplayer game, and I would not be surprised if it far outpaced any parts of the single player campaign. There's a ton of people complaining about the lack of story, but I really see no need for one. It's not as if the games of Tic-Tac-Toe or Chess needed them. The focus is square on strategy, not extras.
As far as using "real" countries and events, this game succeeds in using a Holywood style of presentation. Yes, the Chinese talk with an accrent and the GLA (Terrorists) have carbombers that say "I love a crowd", but the USA are far more gung-ho than their real counterparts. It's blatantly over-the-top... Heck, to make money after normal supplies are depleted or destroyed, the Chinese rely on hackers to steal a little bit of money from the internet. The GLA salvage destroyed bits of enemy units to upgrade their own.
It is a great multiplayer game... The various factions seem to me to be much more distinct than other RTS games, yet still balanced. Playing locally with friends (at a gaming center with 5 copies), we've had tons of fun with this thing, especially on the unique team-game dynamic. When USA and GLA team up, you've got the biggest anthrax-spreading superweapon on one side, and radar on the other side. Hard to beat, but I send my Chineese overlord tanks anyway while occupying the city with a ton of tank hunter troops and hackers.
Anyway, I love this game, and I'm seeing far more negative criticism of this game than it deserves, and there's no clear reason why, at least from where I sit. This is one of the few games lately that's been worth my money..... even if it is going to EA
First RTS? - Herzog Zwei (Score:2)
The horse is dead!! (Score:2, Insightful)
While I loved playing the first few games in this franchise, I personally think it's time for the madness to stop. Buying this game will only encourage EA to come out with more $50 retooled clones of old games.
__
The orginal C&C is still king. (Score:3, Insightful)
C&C was different. I used to make people insane when they'd have some 12 missle tower base entrance and I'd land a chinook in their base and start c4'ing everything. With good players, the general rule was "if they make your base, you're done". That's why in the original C&C EVERYONE played the Tiberium Gardens map, you could make choke points into your base.
All RTS's suck these days, and I wonder if I'll ever see another C&C caliber game. RTS's now are about how fast you can click the build unit button.
Re: tweaking (Score:3, Interesting)
Tweaking also meant we could change the game just enough so that the normal strategies (light tank storm etc in later incarnations) didn't work so well, and we'd all have to invent new ones.
The map designer in redalert was also great! it added so much value to the game in multiplayer mode.
Re:the nuke explosions (Score:2)
The thing was, once a harvester launched it's rockets once, it would forget how to harvest.
While they kicked butt as offensive weapons, if one unit made it within range of all of your harvesters, and they shot at it, your money supply was gone...
Re:hrm... (Score:2, Informative)
yrs,
Ephemeriis
Re:hrm... (Score:5, Informative)
Informative? Put down the pipes, moderators. The original Dune was in fact an RPG. You played Paul Atreides and walked around talking to Leto, Stilgar, etc. There weren't really any traditional puzzles to solve or battles to fight, you just met with Fremen, spoke to them, found out a little more about what was going on, then set them to work mining spice or training for war. Toward the end of the game you told all your Fremen to attack the Harkonnen palace, and that was that. It wasn't the most interesting game in the world, but it was undeniably one of the most immersive. The graphics and music were absolutely stunning at the time, and remain breathtaking even today. We're talking 320x240x256 VGA, but the color palettes were perfectly chosen, and the attention to detail when flying the ornithopter over sand and rock formations was second-to-none. I highly recommend downloading it from an abandonware site near you. If you get the CD-ROM version it has full speech throughout the whole game, with perfect pronunciation and acting on a par with a LucasArts adventure game. One of the best "art" games ever, in my opinion.
Dune 2, however, was a total different kettle of fish. That truely was the first real-time strategy where you build units, move them around, click back and forth real fast to avoid getting eaten by a sandworm, etc. There were other real-time strategies before that - the one that sticks in my mind is an old (80s era) CGA game called Sun Tzu's Art of War or something, but nothing broke through like Dune 2 did. Everyone liked Dune 2. The difficulty was very well-balanced, the interface was simple (unlike today's 25-hotkey RTS games) and the music and sound effects worked very cleverly with the game - subtlely changing with action on the screen. I think this was one of the first truly successful (read subtle) implementations of interactive music.
All in all, Dune has had a great time of it on home computers. That said, i haven't played Dune 2000 or the new C&C Dune. Anyone got reports?
Re:hrm... (Score:3, Interesting)
I remember playing Dune 2 on the Amiga 500 & 2000 ages ago. I imported it from the UK for about 25 USD and it came on 4 (or so) floppies because CD-ROM drives were rarer then diamonds back then. It was a great game on the Amiga though, with music, in game sound and even different voices as you ordered your units around a bit. That is where my addiction to RTS games began, the moment I ordered my first Harkonen (sp?) trooperer to engage some Atreides infantry attacking my precious big red lump of pixels which was my harvester. All I remember after that is making HUGE bases that are completely walled with rocket turrets at every corner and the fact I never really finished the game because the two vs one end levels were too hard for me back then :(
Great game and pretty original back then as well. Receives a well deserved place amoung my personal RTF "Hall of Fame" which also includes "Total Annihilation" (despite the cheap name) and "Homeworld"
Re:hrm... (Score:3, Informative)
A lot of people panned Emperor: Battle For Dune. Personally, I thought it was excellent. The storylines were well-told (Michael Dorn plays the head of Atreides), and I like the involvement that the lesser houses play both in the story and in the game (Ix, Tlielaxu, Fremen, Sardukar, and the Spacing Guild).
Sun Tzu's Art of War (Score:2, Interesting)
Sun Tzu's Art of War is also the first that I can remember. Played that day after day. You had swordmen and archers. Maybe Pikemen too. Top down 2D view. 4 colours only. As you moved your men around the map, the different terrain affected speed and offense/defense hiderances. You simply had to kill all opposing units.
It was followed up a year or maybe two years later by Art Of War At Sea. Independently maneuver your sailing vessels and fire their cannons (left or right barrage only). Classic elemntery naval tactics. 4 or maybe even 8 colours.
A little too sophisticated for most people at the time.
Re:hrm... (Score:2)
Re:hrm... (Score:2)
I'm not sure what you mean by Dune II was made with Virgin... It was developed by Westwood and Virgin published it (much like EA is publishing Westwood games now). Dune I, on the other hand, was developed by Cryo though also published by Virgin. It seems Virgin had the Dune license, because at the end of Dune I there's a "teaser" saying something like "Coming soon... DUNE II!" I would guess that due to poor reviews of the Cryo game, Virgin kicked the franchise over to Westwood.
Re:Syndicate (Score:5, Insightful)
Syndicate was AWESOME. Syndicate is one of the top PC games of all time in my books. The intro was nothing short of orgasmic, and the cutscenes were gorgeous. The gameplay was sweet and it had some cool interactive music too, though unfortunately it only had two "themes", where Dune II had five or six at least. And the sound of that mini-gun! One of the most amazing sounds ever to come out of a computer game. How come no other game mini-guns just tore shit out like that? It sounds like it's blasting several hundred bullets a minute.
I'm not sure if i'd call Syndicate a real-time strategy on the level of Dune II, though, mainly because a lot of the strategy happened between missions when you taxed your countries and outfitted your team. It reminds me of another old game called Steel Empires (Cyber Empires in America) where you built up resources and outfitted your giant robots before switching to the real-time part where you had a top-down view and ran around blasting the other guy. Great fun in two-player mode :-)
Re:Syndicate (Score:2)
Yes. A thousand times yes.
The gameplay was sweet and it had some cool interactive music too, though unfortunately it only had two "themes", where Dune II had five or six at least.
Yup. And they had zero quality to work with. Sounded like 8 bit, 11 kHz sound or so, and it has one of the best "feels" of any game I've played.
And the sound of that mini-gun! One of the most amazing sounds ever to come out of a computer game. How come no other game mini-guns just tore shit out like that? It sounds like it's blasting several hundred bullets a minute
Yup. It evokes the phrase "tearing through things" wonderfully well.
Also, Syndicate *Wars* kind of sucked. I'd *love* to see a new Syndicate-style game (Syndicate seemed to be a pretty much one-game-genre, although there are vaguely similar games. Nothing quite mixes the strategic and tactical components with the incredibly gritty cyberpunk feel), and I'd buy it in a second.
The Syndicate engine, unfortunately, was not timer-based, so it stayed pretty jerky through the years, and never got ported to new machines.
A Syndicate-style game would make a pretty cool OSS project, because it takes a relatively small amount of art, and can be played with few system requirements.
Re:Bad Link... (Score:2)