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GameCube (Games) Portables (Games) Entertainment Games

Metroid II, Prime Get New Speed Run Records 66

Posted by simoniker from the go-faster-already dept.
PrinceBrightstar writes "Both the Metroid Prime pure speed run and the Metroid II 100% completion speed record have been shattered by Zoidi and Brightstar (myself) respectively. The Metroid Prime (GameCube) pure speed record is now 1hr 17mins, and the Metroid II (GameBoy) 100% is now set at 1hr 12mins, with further decreases planned - these records were recorded into video form and no emulators were used." We've previously covered Metroid Prime 'speed runs', which are an extension of classic Quake speed runs.
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Metroid II, Prime Get New Speed Run Records More

Metroid II, Prime Get New Speed Run Records

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  • Silly Question (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Guppy06 ( 410832 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:13PM (#8424737)
    "the Metroid II (NES) 100% is now set at 1hr 12mins,"

    Aside from "Medroid II is a GB game," how do you know you have 100%? Super Metroid was the first game to bother keeping track of your completion rate and I have yet to find complete maps of the game anywhere (even the ones published in Nintendo Power left stuff out). You can't even go by the number of e-tanks you have since there are more in the game than you can use.

    Also, while on the subject, am I the only person who has trouble believing people who claim to get a 100% completion rate in Super Metroid in less than 1:30?

    • Re:Silly Question (Score:5, Informative)

      by Radix37 ( 670836 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:35PM (#8424855) Homepage
      how do you know you have 100%? Super Metroid was the first game to bother keeping track of your completion rate and I have yet to find complete maps of the game anywhere

      100% is just getting every item... pretty simple :-) Since the weapons respawn and are in different places, we just decided that you have to get each one once.

      As for a complete map, check GameFAQs, I just submitted once recently.

    • http://planetquake.com/sda/other/supermetroid.html 100% at one hour exactly. watch and weep.

    • Re:Silly Question (Score:5, Informative)

      by MMaestro ( 585010 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:31PM (#8425115)
      am I the only person who has trouble believing people who claim to get a 100% completion rate in Super Metroid in less than 1:30?

      Considering I personally have beaten Super Metroid in less than 1 hour with roughly 60% completion, its not hard to imagine some hardcore gamer out there getting 100%, with an extra half hour. (Unless you do a bare minimum run through, you will get at LEAST 30% completion rate. As it stands the lowest is 15% so 30% isn't that much more.)

      Not only that, there are reports and entire FAQs dedicated to bare MINIMUM runs (theres even a report for a 1% run through in Metroid Fusion!) Naturally this were made on the emulator so they wouldn't count, but the fact that they CAN BE DONE remains.

      • Re:Silly Question (Score:4, Interesting)

        by metroid composite ( 710698 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @09:34PM (#8425975) Homepage Journal
        100% with 1:30 is a bit of a joke I seem to remember. I may be wrong, but I believe getting below an hour with any percentage is more difficult (and I got 0:43 a couple years ago before newer tricks were found; though yes, getting below 1:00 seems impossible for a while).

        And Metroid Fusion 1% run is doable and really not that bad compared to Super Metroid 15%. The reason: all the normal upgrades (Varia, Gravity, etc) do NOT count towards your percentage. You'd be able to do 0% except one missile pod is sitting in your way and you have to roll through it.

        By converse, Metroid Prime low percentage runs realistically get padded by 12 items or so (because you have to collect the Chozo Artifacts which really shouldn't add to your percentage).

        Oh, and just for the fun of it, you can get to the very last save in Metroid II picking up only the bombs (so 1%...well you start with 30 missiles and the morph ball, thus 5 might be a more accurate description). I haven't managed to bomb jump up through the goo into the next room yet, but in theory I think it can be done. You'll need the Ice Beam to kill the metroids in the next section, of course (2%). Now, for the Queen, the trick is to bomb her stomach, but you lose energy when you do that, and you only have the 30 starting missiles. It's possible that you literally don't have the resources to kill her; I don't know her HP I'm afraid.

      • I don't doubt it either, as I have a save on my cart under two hours, 98% (that I remember--it's been awhile) without beating Kraid. This means, of course, that I could not fight Mother Brain and finish, but it's still fun to show people that he's alive with all that stuff =)

    • Re:Silly Question (Score:3, Informative)

      by fredrikj ( 629833 )
      Well, the record for 100% in Super Metroid in 0:58. Straight speed is 0:38. Check my post history, I recently posted links.
      • Which seems more realistic? A rom where you can savestate back to a previous point, or the real game where if you want to go back you have to go ALL the way back. Also, how fast is that computer? If its slow enough, slowdown can occur, thus rendering the run ineligible because it wasn't running at the same speed the real game would be and would allow for more accurate jumps and such. Besides, the legality of the who thing over roms and emulators is also in question, and Nintendo probably wouldn't allow such

        • Re:Silly Question (Score:5, Informative)

          by fredrikj ( 629833 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @09:59PM (#8426074) Homepage
          Why would a video recording be more reliable as evidence? Really, what would prevent a cheater from recording on an emulator and then creating a video from that (through his TV or whatever)?

          Your chances of catching a cheater are in fact greater when dealing with emulator input recordings, since you can analyze the exact input and, judging from reaction times and various oddities, to some degree determine the likelihood of slowmotion being used. Then there's visual analysis, of course. A skilled player can often tell when there's something superhuman going on. I know that a few cheaters on the Doom speedrunning scene have been caught this way.

          In the end, the safest way is knowing the person. And trust me, there's no reason the guy who set these records would have cheated. He's made tons of recordings, each containing mistakes and occasionally improving his time slightly. I doubt a cheater would go through that.

          On the other hand, if I saw a flawless run...
    • Here's the formula used to calculate what % you have at the end of the game. (Total number of missile pickups (22) + Total number of energy tanks (6) + Each weapon picked up ONLY ONCE as any more would break 100% (4) + All the suit upgrades (7)) / 39
      • "Total number of energy tanks (6)"

        Except that I've collected 8. As with the first game, any e-tanks after 6 don't count. But if you don't get them, then they are obviously items in the game you didn't get.

        "Each weapon picked up ONLY ONCE as any more would break 100%"

        Depends on how you count. There's a school of thought that not getting each beam weapon twice gives you less than 100%, since they are items you did not pick up.

        And again back to the first game, should you have to get the Ice Beam in b
    • Back in my cheating days I used Game Genie and beat it with 150%, although eventually I both lost the codes and learned about that thing called gameplay.

  • Question? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 29, 2004 @05:31PM (#8424840)
    It seems that the run was broken into segments which were based on save points.

    Did the person actually run through the game in the time he said he did? Or did he just repeat each segment for the best time possible and then add all the shortest segments up for the time stated?

    -J

    • Re:Question? (Score:5, Informative)

      by metroid composite ( 710698 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @09:37PM (#8425984) Homepage Journal
      Repeat each segment of course. This is how it works in-game too. There's a constant raging debate over which save points to visit, and which to skip. The more you visit the more you break up the run into more perfectable pieces. However visiting a save point takes time as well, so you really shouldn't do it too often.
    • I watched through the videos the other day, its broken up into different files for each save segment, so at least he isn't trying to hide it. But there ARE clear fuckups in his runs in multiple segments. In one instance he missed a jump to a platform three times in a row. That seems like something he'd want to retry for, but was clearly left in. Take that as you may.

  • Minimum percentage runs (Score:4, Interesting)

    by MMaestro ( 585010 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:34PM (#8425134)
    Will there ever be a speed run record for people who play through getting the bare minimum items? At least in the Metroid games, you don't need to get all the items especially considering with 100% you'd end up with over 100 missles and 1000 energy..

    • Re:Minimum percentage runs (Score:5, Informative)

      by fredrikj ( 629833 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @06:45PM (#8425196) Homepage
      Super Metroid has been done with 14% items [geocities.com].

      • 14%? Alright; spill the beans (Score:5, Interesting)

        by metroid composite ( 710698 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @10:10PM (#8426127) Homepage Journal
        I know that either 3Missiles/2Supers or 2Missiles/3Supers are needed to beat the Mother Brain and the zebetites, then let's look at the rest:

        6% -- Morph Ball (can't get out of the area without it)
        7% -- Bombs (needed to leave Crateria) that area of Brinstar)
        8% -- Power Bombs (needed to enter the Wrecked Ship, and to beat Metroids without the Ice Beam)
        9% -- Gravity Suit (needed to activate the Speed Booster underwater)
        10% -- Speed Booster (needed to access Draygon)
        11% -- Charge Beam (needed to kill Ridley/Mother Brain unless you stock up on more missiles/Supers)
        14% -- Three Energy Tanks (needed to survive Mother Brain's ultimate attack)
        15% -- Varia Suit (cuts Mother Brain's ultimate attack in half while Gravity does nothing, unlike all other damage in the game. This is easy to fake in a video mind you, since Gravity and Varia/Gravity look identical)

        This is the knowledge of 2001. Has anything changed? If there was a way to bypass the zebetite columns presumably this would cut down the percentage by more than 1%. If you could survive Mother Brain's ultimate attack by crystal flashing maybe...? That'd take out the Varia and three energy tanks, but add in two Power Bombs and at least two Super Missiles. I can't honestly see leaving out the Charge Beam, and all other items lock you completely out of an area before you can progress.

        So...spill the beans. What new crack in the game has been found and exploited?

        • Re:14%? Alright; spill the beans (Score:4, Informative)

          by fredrikj ( 629833 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @11:04PM (#8426314) Homepage
          The removed item is the Speed Booster, which you in fact don't need to access Draygon. By freezing a Mochtroid and jumping on it in the right moment, it is possible to pass through the block above it. Another glitch in the collision detection has been found that makes it possible to skip the Zebetites (but it doesn't change the amount of missiles needed, since you could always reload, and the amount required to beat Mother Brain is the same).

          This is easy to fake in a video mind you, since Gravity and Varia/Gravity look identical)

          Well, you'd record picking it up, wouldn't you?
    • From GameFAQs [gamefaqs.com]:

      Board: Super Metroid Topic: Sortest time ever for a 15% game? From: smokeYxMCpot Posted: 2/20/2004 8:42:36 PM the best is 1:36 set by me, AFAIK. I really don't think 14/15% runs are done for speed anyways.

      Personally I did 1:45 IIRC (though it may have been 1:56; I should look that up in my log book). However, I double bomb jumped into Lower Norfair as this was before the Gravity Suit trick, and that took me a couple months so I would just try it repeatedly. So given how much time I wast

    • Will there ever be a speed run record for people who play through getting the bare minimum items? At least in the Metroid games, you don't need to get all the items especially considering with 100% you'd end up with over 100 missles and 1000 energy..

      Just as a quick side note, the new Metroid game, Metroid: Zero Mission for the GBA, has special endings for players that beat the game with 15% or less on Normal or Hard mode. So at the very least, the games' developers are taking notice of the players that tr
  • Were the SMB3 speed runs proven fake?

  • What's the non-100% record? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by metroid composite ( 710698 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @10:27PM (#8426185) Homepage Journal
    Personally, I found 100% runs to be kind of pointless, especially on Metroid 2 where they don't even tell you the percentage, and glitches allow you to get more items that theoretically weren't supposed to be in the game. Even in Super Metroid, though, you basically avoid getting items for most of the game, then sweep back through at the very end when you can reach all the spots and subsequently crush the Mother Brain like a bug. Why do the final sweep at the end? It just serves to make the last few bosses pathetic and thus boring, and merely reduces your choices of route (since you have to go this direction anyway to get the missile, the other shortcut is useless).

    So...I'm wondering what the non-100% run for Metroid 2 is. Have they gotten it below an hour yet? I don't remember hearing about it, but I wouldn't be surprised....

    • I have 1:05... I started to record it a few weeks ago and then BrightStar comes out of the blue to do a 100%. I wasn't expecting competition heh. I'll finish mine soon though and it'll be on the same page. Maybe I'll get 1:04 or even 1:03 but I don't see how under an hour would be possible.

  • Quake came out before Metroid? (Score:4, Troll)

    by dancingmad ( 128588 ) on Sunday February 29, 2004 @11:34PM (#8426418)
    which are an extension of classic Quake speed runs.

    Uh...no, Quake came out in 1996, Super Metroid in 1994 and the original Metroid long before that - and people were doing speed runs back then (I know my friends did). The internet has made it easier to show off good runs, but it started long before Quake, so they're not an extension.

    I don't see why everything has to be tied back to crappy PC games (especially cool console stuff).
    • He means that it's an extension of SDA... used to be all about Quake but now it's expanding. Of course Quake wasn't the first speed run game ... even on the internet, I think that would have to be Doom.
    • Nintendo Power Arena anyone? Much better known than this site, though granted you only have a month to do the challenge at best, which is certainly less time than I spent doing my serious SM speed run, and I spent a long time getting a feel for the game first.

      Though, speed runs didn't used to be as popular. I know I didn't get interested in them at all until (believe it or not) 1998 and Warioland 2 [amazon.com]. Can anybody beat 2:45? Does anybody have a clue what I'm talking about? *sigh*

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