Sam Lake on Video Game Storytelling 314
loladeutsch writes "What makes for a great story in a video game? Sometimes, with all the innovative development and cool graphics the actual story a game has to tell can get lost in the shuffle, or at least can seem to be an afterthought. When a game arrives on the shelves that presents one of the more engrossing stories we've seen in awhile, it's worth noting. Max Payne 2: The Fall of Max Payne has been recognized by many people with their heads screwed on straight as a benchmark in video-game storytelling. "
Context (Score:5, Insightful)
I play plenty of games with good stories (Score:5, Insightful)
Integrating the narrative (Score:2, Insightful)
Agreed, story telling is important.. (Score:5, Insightful)
One has to compliment the other, and I think most of us would prefer the games that are better to *play*, rather than those we feel a part of because of an excellent storyline.
I still play Quake 1
Excessive story can kill a game, too. (Score:4, Insightful)
Now, I haven't played the game, but if that means it's an eight-hour movie with a little "Okay, move from point A to point B now" thrown in.. no thanks.
I feel that way about some of the Final Fantasy games. I remember thinking "Wow... 90 minutes in... wonder when I'll, you know, fight a battle."
That stuff was great when I was 14 and on summer vacation. At 25, I want something I can *play* in 2 hours.. not "get all set up to start playing."
Even better (Score:5, Insightful)
No, the best storyline I've ever seen in a game is the Marathon series from Bungie. They've been out for over 9 years, and people are still discovering [bungie.org] new depths to the story after all this time.
Re:Excessive story can kill a game, too. (Score:2, Insightful)
Lost in Gameplay (Score:2, Insightful)
With Max Payne, I'm not sure that's a bad thing. Only game where the story justified the gameplay was Half-Life, and I really can't think of any other videog that reaches its level.
Storyline != Good Gameplay (Score:4, Insightful)
On the other hand you have games like Morrowind. Great sense of freedom and that contributed to the quality of it's gameplay. As a side-effect, the storyline was easily mangled, and you could break the main quests by doing things out of order, going to where you shouldn't be too early, etc...
Until we reach a point where the hardware is powerful enough that programmers can create an adaptive enough AI, Storyline will just be a euphemism for 'railroading'.
Problem (Score:3, Insightful)
That said, there are a number of ways a good writer could dramatically improve the quality of numerous video games, and help improve various genres. Most publishers now take great delight in emphasizing the total lack of literature in their products.
If video games are to truly become meaningful, then they must convey meaning.
The Curse of Monkey Island, Sam & Max Hit the (Score:4, Insightful)
Should it be so suprising that pure action games generally have relatively weak story lines(with the exception of a few), whereas the more thought provoking ones(in terms of gameplay) tend to have a better plot?
No correlation to movies is there?
Gameplay at the moment tends to be driven by arcade desires, I sort of feel we are still in the transition from the stand up arcade machine instant gratification level of gaming to a more time consuming home leisure pursuit.
Hence I feel the storylines will slowly get better as developers learn more about what is possible for a succesful game for the home, giving alternatives to the wham, bam , thank you kind lady style of today, in favour of a slower pace, yet ultimately more rewarding experience. Which of course are far greater suited for plot and story telling.
It depends on the type of game (Score:2, Insightful)
Over time, we've seen genres of games which, if it weren't for the pretty graphics, there'd be no real reason to play them. Thankfully, it's a genre that has matured and can be enjoyable. I'm referring to games like Silent Hill 2 and 3, where the actual interaction on its own is pretty clumsy, but the story is very interesting (well, in SH2 it was... in SH3 it was too convoluted and hokey).
I personally don't like the original Max Payne way of story telling too much. I don't like being narrated to. I want to be part of the experience.
I tell you what doesn't.... (Score:3, Insightful)
If anything they should be going the other way!
Re:Excessive story can kill a game, too. (Score:4, Insightful)
This is off on a tangent but I also think ALL games should allow you to save at ANY time. Maybe they should allow you to save and only restore that save game once, but it really sucks when I am playing some game and have to go somewhere only to not be able to find a save point. Final Fantasy is one of the most irritating games in that regard.
Re:Context (Score:4, Insightful)
Best storyline I've ever played goes to... (Score:5, Insightful)
Spoilers. It even started out boring. You're just an agent. The only hint of a unique focus on backstory is the conversation with the NSF leader in the statue, who rattles on with historical taxation statistics.
But once you finish the statue mission and enter UNATCO HQ, you start meeting the characters, start getting hints of something greater. By the time you're out of New York and Paul has turned to the side of the NSF, you've tapped into these greater realities woven into the game, and eventually you're flying to Hong Kong, infiltrating VersaLife, destroying a nanotech constructor, and so forth.
The game starts out as a standard "agent" game with some interesting takes on aiming and skill systems, and ends up as a vast conspiracy game with Illuminati, Knights Templar churches, and weird alien laboratories. Not to mention Area 51.
One of those games that "feels" completely different by the time you reach the end, like it's a whole new game instead of what it was when you bought it. I really enjoy games like that.
Re:I play plenty of games with good stories (Score:5, Insightful)
Besides, what other games allow your character to completely forget his main quest and become a drug-addicted sex-fiend extortionist?
How about designing a game instead of a story (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:No. (Score:2, Insightful)
Many books have been written then adapted to screen without the author giving thought to the limitations of the movie effects at the time. It's up to the director to figure out how to best represent the story using the story as a guide.
In a game if it is too difficult to do real time you make it a cut scene. The REAL problem is game-developers and lead designers not figuring out creative ways to incorporate the player more and rely less on cut scenes.
Re:Even better (Score:2, Insightful)
It's a shame Bungie has come to PC's, as it was really the ONLY thing Mac gaming had. Pathways, Marathon, ONI, Myth.... All GREAT games.
And IMHO Halo is a worthy successor to the Marathon lineage. (Hell, if some of the possible connections are fleshed out, it could qualify as a sequel!)
I dunno how many times I ran out of ammo fighting Flood in Halo, and I really don't see the difference between that and beating Kefka on 4hp. The great thing about FFIV was the plot and character development. If the final battle with Kefka was completely scripted (like the duel between Cloud and Sepheroth) and the outcome pre-ordained, it would still have just as much emotional impact. Thats how strong the story was. Heck, some of the stuff Square does in battles is flat out rediculous! Like Sephiroth's Nova spell. He destroys the friggin sun! But the fights aren't whats important. It's the reason you're fighting.
Re:Noir atmosphere (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Even better (Score:3, Insightful)
Sadly, a Half-Life movie would probably have a much thinner, dumber story than the video game does. And at least one guy outrunning an explosion while yelling "It's gonna blow!"
I remember the naive days of my youth, when I used to wish they'd make movies out of my favorite video games and comics, instead of wishing they wouldn't.
Charlie Sheen would make a great Gordon Freeman though.
Re:Trolls (Score:3, Insightful)
I gave that an honest try, believe me. Even though it seemed little more than an attempt to suck unspecting web-surfers into 80+ minutes of oral wandering, I listened to most of it. And I think I've gleaned some good pointers on how to withhold information, while claiming to be providing it:
How to obfuscate the fact you have almost nothing to say:
I actually have great respect for the people [michaelmoore.com] who do projects [imdb.com] along these lines (I admire Powerkill for example)- I simply have no belief that you are actually doing one! You post about DFC in the present tense, which is premature at best. This seems to be an attempt to give your public opinions more credibility, by creating the illusion of some firsthand experience.
Ideas are a "dime a dozen". Many, many people have had oddball game ideas that'll never come to anything. But much of them have the decency not to pretend do have accomplished something until they actually do . Id software has a philosophy: "When its done"- think about it sometime.
I've been in the mod-scene too... and I've seen many over-ambitious projects that had such grand ideas that they obviously were never going to get off the ground. DFC ranks up there with the very least plausible of them.
I'll leave with a few quotes from the audio file, as an aid to anyone else who might read this and wonder what's in the "seminar":
The goth class, maybe I can give them special powers for all the tattoos they get.... mystics and sorcerors are going to use real magic behind the scenes to make things happen.
Lets face it- the consequences to Columbine were not available before Columbine... there were no videogames about it... and I think if people had the opportunity to learn what these kids go through, cuz we're gonna show it, we're gonna show this
The premise in Doom For Columbine is the idea that demons or some evil force are preying on our students in... these demons communicating back and forth on how they're gonna corrupt souls, and that figures a lot into this game