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PlayStation (Games)

HD-Less PS3? 69

Posted by Zonk from the because-no-hd-really-failed-them-last-time dept.
GamesIndustry.biz has the story that, for the time being, Sony is planning on releasing their next generation console without a hard drive bundled into the package. From the article: "However the company has never said that a hard disk would be bundled with the unit at launch, and Chatani's comments this month seem to suggest it's erring toward not including one - and perhaps offering the peripheral optionally in the same way it currently sells Memory Card units separately from PlayStation 2."
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HD-Less PS3? More

HD-Less PS3?

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  • If the memory is big enough (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Enrico Pulatzo ( 536675 ) on Thursday June 02, 2005 @02:59PM (#12707526)
    It shouldn't be too much of a concern, with a requisite "if".

    If the memory cards are treated like a hard drive, there will be no problem, I can later swap in a HDD to store more data/access it quicker. If, however, the situation is similar to the one with the Playstation 2 (a hard drive evenutally came out and found little use since developers couldn't really count on one being there) then the PS3 will suffer for it and when a hdd is released, it won't see too much use.
    • By not including a harddrive built in, this is the problem they put themselves in. The industry has proven time and time again that if it's a peripheral and not built in or at least bundled it's not going to get used very much in actual games. This was the reasoning behind the dreamcast coming with a built in modem and the xbox coming with a built in ethernet and harddrive. MS seems to be screwing up in this dept too with the option of buying a system w/o a drive. I could see selling a "basic model" with a
      • I think the reason Nintendo is including 512MB of flash ROM is for downloading NES/SNES/N64 games. Granted if you download a lot of those game (especially N64), you'll run out pretty quickly. I am kind of suprised that they won't be including a hard drive for such a purpose. Maybe it's a supply issue. I've heard of Microsoft procuring the right size hard drives for the XBox.
        • What? Are you serious? I'm not a scholar on this topic by any means, but I'm pretty sure that Nintendo has been one of the toughest campaigners against emulation of any kind. I'm sure there will be all sorts of methods built into the new Nintendo system to prevent "misuse" of the flash memory, and I have no doubt that ROMs are one of the bigger possible "misuses".

          • What? Are you serious?

            Yes, he is serious. One of the main selling points of the Nintendo Revolution will be its ability to download and play games from many older Nintendo consoles.
            I think this is a clever move, as this might make the console more interesting for an older / more hard core audience (i.e.: people like many slashdotters).
          • Nintendo is all about emulation. They just don't want third parties doing it :)

            Look at the Zelda promo disc for the Gamecube. Totally emulated NES there. Also for the GBA. It's highly likely those old games didn't get recoded or ported. Then there's the game Animal Crossing, where you could unlock old games.

            The Big N is all about emulation: it's a cheap way to add a library of games to new hardware.
        • My old roommate collected NES games like nobody's business, and I only have 70 megs worth of his stuff on my hard drive now. I also have 80 megs of SNES game and a decent variety to choose from there. I don't know about much about N64 games, but I still think the average gamer will be able to fit what they need into a half a gig. As long as there's some sort of upgrade option available, just in case, I got no beef.
        • Without N64 games, it's not likely to fill up at all. My NES roms total at 100MB, my SNES roms at 750MB. That's for pretty much every game that exists in English, plus some that don't. And, of course, while there are lots of gems in there, most of those games are pretty bad.

          N64 games are smaller than people think, as well. You DO have some big games, like Conker's Bad Fur Day and Resident Evil 2, at 64 MB. But the majority is much smaller, about 10MB each.

          So, you can fit, well, let's say at least 30 games
      • When did they announce they'd be selling a system without a drive? From all I've heard, there will be a 20 GB hard drive standard.
        • Which sys you talking about? Sony's "looking unlikely" (ie..rumor) and MS has already said long ago they were gonna have three tier system for the 360 (one w/o hd) and Nintendo announced the 512MB thing...just to clear things up :)
    • If the situation is similar to the PS2, then the HD will store about 500mb and cost $300 - making it the most expensive per mb HD in the world.

      The format and file system on the HD will be proprietary. Years after release the EXACT SAME HD will be avaialble for sale at about the same price as when it was first released - and it will still be the most expensive (and now slowest) HD on the market.

      I find it amusing that some people on this site are anti-Xbox because of "M$" the big nasty corporate, and trumpe
    • [sic]... perhaps offering the peripheral optionally in the same way it currently sells Memory Card units separately from PlayStation 2.

      Oh, like the same way the current PlayStation2's harddrive is sold seperately, and no one is using it other than for one, below-average online RPG? Sounds like a plan.
      • actually there is a pretty large mod community that use the harddrive to backup their legal games onto the harddrive. this reducing load times and strain on their aging ps2 dvd lasers.

        google: hdadvance and hdloader

  • That's fine. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by HaloZero ( 610207 ) <[protodeka] [at] [gmail.com]> on Thursday June 02, 2005 @02:59PM (#12707530) Homepage
    But I want the ability to put my OWN hard drive in there, of my choosing, without having to buy additional equipment (except for said hard drive, of course). Sony's trying chance to sell a 40GB hard disk for the PS2 at a price of 199$ is and was ridiculous. I mean, FFS, I have hard disks just kicking around my room.

    Also, will I be able to put savegames on the hard drive? Will I be able to near-seamlessly move them onto a Memory Card?
    • I have hard disks just kicking around my room.

      You shouldn't kick hard disks around your room. It's not good for the platters or the heads for that matter.

      public service announcement brought to you by the ASFPOCTHD's
    • The PS2 HDD was only $99. Actually, it was more like $50, because it came with FFXI, which would have easily gone for $50 otherwise. (Actually, given it came with the first expansion pack by default, it'd be more like $39.99+$39.99.) In any case, it wasn't that much, and you can get them now for like $60 at Frys. Still with FFXI. (Which includes a free month of play, which is more than enough time to get addicted.)

      Yes, you can easily transfer saved games to the HDD; both PS1 and PS2 games, in fact.

    • Re:That's fine. (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      The other posters missed your point about the memory card, I think. Yes, you can use the HD to store gamesaves, but in 99.9% of the cases, you can't just save to the HDD directly. You have to use the memory card, and then later come back and swap the saves over (which also means you can't load from the HD either). There are a few HDD-aware titles in Japan that will cache to the HD and/or recognize it as a place to save/load memory card files, but not nearly as many as there should have been.
      • Yeah but eh. It's not really that big a deal. Saving direct would be nice---and there should have been a unified storage API so that any game can use any unit---but it's still really not that big a deal. One card easily holds enough for probably 20 games with two exceptions: Drakengard, which had ridiculously large saves (1.4MB) and FFX, where you could use about 4MB and 75 save spots if you wanted to have a collection of every spot in the game.

        Not that I'm hoping they overlook it in the PS3. If/when

  • This is frustrating. The whole benefit of bundling something with the console is that game developers can count on it being there. They can therefore program extra functionality and know that it will be supported. If Sony isn't including a hard drive, this will cause many developers to scale back this extra functionality.

  • Price control? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Snowspinner ( 627098 ) * <philsand@3.14ufl.edu minus pi> on Thursday June 02, 2005 @03:06PM (#12707599) Homepage
    Hm. This seems a bit of an odd move, unless they're dropping it to try to get back below the $400 price point, in which case it makes total sense.
    • If they're so close that the bulk price of hard-drives makes the difference on the cost, all it'll take is a hiccup in some PCB or chip fab house to push 'em over the edge. I hope cost isn't the factor, I'd rather believe it's a marketing thing to create their own upsell opportunity.

      • I hope cost isn't the factor, I'd rather believe it's a marketing thing to create their own upsell opportunity.

        And that would be a huge mistake. Expensive add-ons for consoles just aren't successful. There are many examples of this and very few (if any, depending on how you count it) counter-examples. If they do this, can they at least please make the various versions compatable with each other? (PS2 Linux hard drive not usable for games, games hard drive not usable for Linux.)

    • "Hm. This seems a bit of an odd move, unless they're dropping it to try to get back below the $400 price point, in which case it makes total sense."

      Makes you wonder if they're overloading it a bit in the graphics department.

      Me personally: I'd rather they lowered the clock speed (thus lowering the price of the CPUs) and put the savings into more RAM. That'd be a cute way to kick the XBOX 360 in the ass.

  • In other words... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by calikahuna ( 826232 )
    Holy hell, this thing is gonna cost a lot to make! Cut costs! The downside is the same as for the PS2, if its not standard equipment, developers will assume that the majority don't have it and won't use the features. Tough decision for Sony, but in the long run at least the marketing folks can still say that it has hard drive capability to compete with MS, even if most games will ignore it.
  • It really means one thing. Sony isn't nearly as serious about their online plan as they should be, and bye-bye to content download as a standard option on the PS3. Sure, there are other uses like custom sountracks, media capabilities, game saves, and caching for faster or seamless loading, but that's really the main issue, as the others can be worked around.

    • It really means one thing. Sony isn't nearly as serious about their online plan as they should be, and bye-bye to content download as a standard option on the PS3.

      And I say good riddance! The only reason publishers are pushing for content downloads is so they can stick you with "micropayments" later. example: "Want that uber weapon you just got killed by? Buy it for only 50 cents!"

      Many marketing people see this as the holy grail in business models. It plays off the addictive nature of gamers to

  • Something fishy... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by kaptron ( 850747 )
    I seem to remember hearing that the PS3 is not really a gaming console [slashdot.org]. They've stripped the HD, the controller is already wireless, like a remote control... Hey, this is looking like a fancy blu-ray DVD player! Well, at least it stands on its side. Killer.
  • Oh well, I guess Sony is still playing chicken with Microsoft wrt standard hd for the ps3. Right now it looks like Xbox 360 will ship with a hd, in fact I would guess that's a definite if Sony announces definitively no hd for ps3. We all remember what happened with the hd for ps2 and all of those broken support promises (Square Enix remembers too!). I think that this time Sony has to ship with the hard drive or else they really will open the door a little wider for MS to gain market share. Why? Because I th
  • So... will this end up like the PS2? The PS2's harddrive was released LATE in it's life (at least, here in America), and was never support properly. The Japanese had a few games that used the harddrive, as did we, but they had more.. They had software specifically for the harddrive. Software that would allow them to buy stuff, e-mail, browse the web, download things, listen to music, etc. etc. Said software was never released here in America... Sony left the harddrive to die, on both continents. The

  • HD/HDD (Score:2, Insightful)

    by goodenoughnickname ( 874664 )
    Can we stick to the acronym "HDD" for Hard Disk Drive? I thought this was an article about a non-High Definition PS3 being made. Which, really, is a stupid idea, but so is not bundling an HDD.

    Thank you.
    • Can we stick to the acronym "HDD" for Hard Disk Drive?

      I couldn't agree more. I also saw it as High Definition at first.
  • What would be nice if the console makers clued into allowing us to load the media onto the hard drive like what is done with hacks. I have kids, so I like to store the original media away from sticky fingers and and stomping feet. Even if it required keys and online authentication, I'd be happy if they used a hard drive for something more than storing game saves and small map updates.
  • what i would like to see is for sony to provide memory online,like google does. then you don't have to worry about carrying your own memory card with you, if you can connect online, you can access your profiles and saves anywhere. you can even keep your mp3's and video files for your psp too. hmmm, on second thought, probably not.

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