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Games Entertainment

Bully To Blacken Rockstar's Other Eye? 113

Posted by Zonk from the beatdown dept.
Tom writes "As if Hot Coffee wasn't enough for the reeling publisher, Gamespot has an article regarding the uproar starting over Rockstar's next game, Bully. Seems like the assault is coming from both sides of the pond, with anti-bullying advocates from England worried about the game causing kids to act out in classroom what they saw on the screen and with America's very own Jack Thompson calling upon Take-Two president Paul Eibeler to stop the release of the game. How will Rockstar handle the additional pressure being put upon it?"
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Bully To Blacken Rockstar's Other Eye? More

Bully To Blacken Rockstar's Other Eye?

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  • How I hope Rockstar Responds (Score:3, Funny)

    by DarkHelmet ( 120004 ) * <{ten.elcychtneves} {ta} {kram}> on Tuesday August 02, 2005 @06:39PM (#13226729) Homepage
    How will Rockstar handle the additional pressure being put upon it?

    To: Jack Thompson ESQ.
    From: Rockstar Games
    Subject: Bully Boycott.

    Dear Jack:

    Enclosed is a diagram that details whether or not we will stop development of our new game, Bully. Please feel free to peruse this diagram [seventhcycle.net] at your earliest convenience.

    Sincerely
    Rockstar Games

    • Dear Rockstar:

      I understand your recent trouble with GTA: San Andreas, and the hot coffee scandal. There are many on the religious right, and so called democratic left that disliked your consentual sex scenes within the game.

      I understand you're working on a new game called Bully. From what I understand so far, you can be a Bully within the game. This sounds quite interesting, but any sort of consentual sexuality that might creep into the game might once again offend the censors.

      In response, I sugges

    • Wow... It's been a really long time since I've seen anything that F*ing funny....

      Thanks. I needed that!
  • why are these idiots making a big deal of this game, if nobody said anything i doubt the game would end up popular, now it's the game 'they are trying to ban' so everyone wants to play it now.
    • Or are they working for Rockstar's PR department .
      What i find most amusing is that a large group of Anti-bullying advocates are joining together and putting pressure on Rockstar to not release a game with threats of "Think of the children" and legal action .
      Ah beautiful irony , unless i misunderstood what bullying is .
    • why are these idiots making a big deal of this game, if nobody said anything i doubt the game would end up popular, now it's the game 'they are trying to ban' so everyone wants to play it now.

      Yeah, because it's not as if Rockstar makes popular games or anything, controversy or no controversy.

      Why do people keep saying stuff like this? Do you realize you're just regurgitating the same arguments people have been making for 50 years, regardless of whether or not the argument actually applies?

      Here's a news fla
    • That is why Rockstar loves Thompson. They know they can always count on him for advertising. As it is I'm sure that Rockstar left the Hot Coffee code in for just this reason. I wouldn't be surprised if he was on Rockstars payroll and some of his lawsuits and his public denouncments are just staged.
  • Right now the game is only worth some moms complain, and Hilary Clinton's time. If Dubya Bush himself put the war on Iraq aside and hold a conference on this game, then you know it's damn good. I'll get my wallet ready right after that.

    For those who have really read the reviews of "Bully". I think at most it would do is match the sales of "RedDead Revolver" or "Manhunt" without enough media attention.

  • So it's OK to jack cars, attack and kill people to steal their money, drive a cab so fast that pedestrians have no hope of getting out of the way, take work as a hitman, blow police helicopters out of the sky, etc., etc. But having sex is very very bad, and bullying is beyond the pale.
    • Why does this keep getting posted? Are you seriously telling us that you aren't aware of the insane amount of criticism the violence in the GTA games has received these last few years from grandstanding politicians and self-appointed cultural guardians? You and I probably agree that the government should stop wasting its time legislating taste, but you can't call them hypocrites. They openly want to control what you see and hear, and that includes violence as well as sex. These are the same people who h
      • They openly want to control what you see and hear, and that includes violence as well as sex.

        No, it doesn't attempt to control those things openly. As just explained, GTA:SA already portrayed extreme levels of violence and criminality. To call the protagonist a "drug-peddling serial-killer" is putting it lightly. Yet all of that deserves a lower rating than a single scene of softcore, consensual heterosexual intercourse.

        When the game was only ludicrously ultra-violent, it was allowed in stores. But wh
        • You won't get any argument from me that the ratings system, and American values in general, aren't broken. However, it's disengenuous to suggest that until the Hot Coffee scandal Jack Thompson and all the politicians weighing in recently were "OK" with the level of violence. They weren't, and furthermore, I don't see anyone here saying thank God for Jack Thompson standing up against ludicrous ultra-violence in video games. Instead, there's a bunch of accusations of hypocracy, and all I'm saying is that t
        • To call the protagonist a "drug-peddling serial-killer" is putting it wrongly.
          GTA:SA (at least its hero) is definitely anti drugs, especially crack cocaine.
      • Oops, you're completely correct. Like everyone else here, my short-term memory is impaired...
    • Even though I'm feeding a troll, I'd just like to mention that most of the behavior shown in GTA:SA is unlikely to be duplicated by most of the players, because nearly all kids have the good sense not to kill people. The ones who do get involved in those crimes IRL have problems in their lives going far beyond a video game.

      On the other hand, many kids already show a propensity for bullying others, and while a game like Bully won't necessarily cause kids to bully others, it does convey the message that bull
      • Why are you so sure you're feeding a troll? My previous comments were honest opinions, even if they were poorly informed -- as I've already admitted. And I happen to agree with everything you just said.

        People are too quick to yell "troll!" Doing so means you don't give people a chance to correct their mistakes. Worse, it means you don't give a fair hearing to opinions you don't already share.

        Of course, if you err the other way, every once in a while you're going to gratify a real troll. Bad for the ego.


        • People are too quick to yell "troll!" Doing so means you don't give people a chance to correct their mistakes. Worse, it means you don't give a fair hearing to opinions you don't already share....
          --
          Since ACs tend to be trolls, I tend to ignore them. If you really have something serious to say to me, please log in.

          I don't really think anything serious of it, but the juxtaposition of this comment and your sig is somewhat comical...
    • So it's OK to jack cars, attack and kill people to steal their moneytake work as a hitman, blow police, etc., etc. But having sex is very very bad, and bullying is beyond the pale

      The gangster games appeal to a young male demographic and to no one else.

  • How will Rockstar handle the additional pressure being put upon it?

    Start making games that don't appeal only to what is worst in humanity?

    • Re:silly idea (Score:3, Insightful)

      by QuantumG ( 50515 )
      Lemonade? Please. I made it just for you. You are my best friend. Mm, this really hits the spot. Doesn't it, though. You make really good lemonade, Scratchy.
      Oh, thank you, Itchy.

    • Which disturbs you more? That Rockstar makes the games, or that people buy them?

      Humanities dark side is more intriguing to me and many other people. Sales show it. And when is the last time you saw a study on the behavior of people with the characteristics of a monk or saint as opposed to the severly depressed or psychotic?
      • Which disturbs you more? That Rockstar makes the games, or that people buy them?

        Neither disturbs me especially, I was simply remarking that's something that Rockstar can do to avoid criticism.

        Humanities dark side is more intriguing to me and many other people. Sales show it. And when is the last time you saw a study on the behavior of people with the characteristics of a monk or saint as opposed to the severly depressed or psychotic?

        The best games are the ones that have some sort of ethical or phi
        • Sorry about that. I took your post to be of a lot of the self-ritious crap I hear and read everyday and responded in kind, and from your reply I see that not to be the case. Also, when I said psychotic, I was refering more to individuals who are moraly and ethically squewed in comparison to the general populace, but are more or less sane in their general thinking and logic (very general). I, personally, find that interesting.

    • Start making games that don't appeal only to what is worst in humanity?

      I sure hope that they don't do this. I like games with an ethical or philosophical component too, but they certainly exist. There is also a place in the markey for dark and immersive games. Perhaps part of the issue is that Rockstar does such a great job of filling their niche (gameplay, production, storyline), which really adds to their widespread popularity. IMO, games like Postal don't hold a candle to the GTA series' gamepla

    • Eh, I'd rather see people beating the shit outta ho's in a game instead of real life...
      • I'd rather just not see someone beating the shit out of a prostitute at all... and if I *was* subjected to seeing it, I'd rather be the one beating the shit out of the criminal that just beat the shit out of a prostitute, and then helping the prostitute with getting medical attention or even a way out of her lifestyle (maybe she's trapped via blackmail and abuse to be a prostitute against her will).

        I simply don't buy the argument that people play games to do the bad things they can't do in real life, beca

        • I'd rather be the one beating the shit out of the criminal that just beat the shit out of a prostitute, and then helping the prostitute with getting medical attention or even a way out of her lifestyle (maybe she's trapped via blackmail and abuse to be a prostitute against her will).

          Yes, I'm sure that GTA: Social Worker as you have described above will be a multi-platinum success. Perhaps it can also have exciting mini-games where you provide the prostitute with restaurant vocational training, or where

    • Start making games that don't appeal only to what is worst in humanity?

      Obviously, they don't make games that appeal to the worst in humanity - they don't seem to be appealing to the politicians and lawyers.
  • "A check of Internet web sites today reveals that Wal-Mart, GameStop, ToysRUs, and Amazon.com are all presently pre-selling the game with no questions asked as to age of the buyers," Thompson said in a statement.

    Yeah. Cause we all know that most twelve-year-olds have credit cards.

  • I get to play a pissed off kid who gets to go ape at his school? Man this sounds better than my 36 hours of Punisher. (See Journal)

  • This is actually quite interesting, as bullying probably won't be rated anything more than PG.

    Will we see ratings for racism, sexism, political and other similar behaviors? These are non-sexual and non-violent, yet they can have great, if not greater, impact on people's life.
    • Will we see ratings for racism, sexism, political and other similar behaviors?

      What is this, 1986? Have you looked at a game box since we all learned who Tipper Gore was? Did you not realize those letters meant things?
  • Taking a look at their website, it's a little unclear whether they are there to help the victims of bullying, or to help kids become bullies and to help the parents help their kids become bullies.

    I mean, what do you think when you read "Practical help and advice for parents who are tackling school bullying."

  • How will Rockstar handle the pressure? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by dave-tx ( 684169 ) * <`moc.liamg' `ta' `todhsals+80891fd'> on Tuesday August 02, 2005 @06:57PM (#13226863)
    How will Rockstar handle the additional pressure being put upon it?

    Probably by watching their profits rise to an all-time high. Nothing beats free advertising.

    • Damnit...if I had mod points I'd mod you down like it was nobody's business...have you seen Take-Two's stock price lately? That's all from the "free advertising" that the hot coffee mod generated. I think their investors have had just about all the "free advertising" they care to handle...and if you don't think those losses will trickle down to the development house that caused them (one way or another), then you should be running for president...
      • have you seen Take-Two's stock price lately?

        Uh, the current stock price has nothing to do with sales. I don't know where "official" sales numbers are, but GTA is currently Amazon's 2nd highest selling title. Do you really beleive that all of the current hype has no effect on sales figures?

        ..and if you don't think those losses will trickle down to the development house that caused them (one way or another), then you should be running for president..

        Oh, I get it - this was just an excuse to make a silly

        • Uh, the current stock price has nothing to do with sales. I don't know where "official" sales numbers are, but GTA is currently Amazon's 2nd highest selling title.

          And it was #1 before the controversy.

          It was also in the top 5 at EB and Best Buy. It's no longer even on the list at those stores.

          You're still going to tell us controversy always helps sales?
          • You're still going to tell us controversy always helps sales?

            Don't be stupid, I'm not saying always. So it was #1, and now is #2, behind something that's listed as pre-order only. The controversy didn't knock it out of the top spot, a new release did.

  • If they do, it's not on the news like this.

    They should make a 'Passion of the Christ' video game. You can be Jesus or his sacrificers.
    • Speaking of which, I just have to plug this review [tucsonweekly.com]. I don't know how they managed it, but our little free weekly rag has one of the best reviewers I've ever read.
    • I still say they need to stop pussyfooting around with this medium-evil crap and go whole hog.

      Sim Auschwitz.

    • Is....*drum roll*

      In a movie, you're watching actors play the parts. In a game, you are playing the part. So Catholics and Christians could potentially say "This game is evil because you're allowed to beat on Jesus", especially if you get points or some sort of reward for beating on Jesus. And honestly, I could see their point for the game not being appropriate (i.e. it'd be just like a game where you're a nazi and you get to execute jewish people).

      However, regardless of the innappropriate nature, I per

      • This game is evil because you're allowed to beat on Jesus", especially if you get points or some sort of reward for beating on Jesus. And honestly, I could see their point for the game not being appropriate (i.e. it'd be just like a game where you're a nazi and you get to execute jewish people).

        I want to play both of these games, where do I get them?
  • Make games which piss people off but play well. They've done that the entire GTA series and it works for them.

    Bitch and whine all you like but GTA is a damn fine game and that's why it sells. If you don't like it make a better game with none of the violence and outshine GTA every time they release a new one.
    • Bitch and whine all you like but GTA is a damn fine game and that's why it sells. If you don't like it make a better game with none of the violence and outshine GTA every time they release a new one.

      Y'know, now that you mention it, here's something I forgot to bring up in all of the other GTA posts. I just got SA about.. a month ago, now that's not a very quick response time. I never got into GTA3 at all, didn't even bother, but Vice City quickly became one of my vices (Heh, couldn't resist) ..In any case
      • Huh. I just don't get it. Maybe I didn't play it long enough, but the controls in VC drove me nuts. I played it for a few hours and then gave it up - if I remember correctly it was hard to look around and you couldn't aim. WTF? Maybe it's because the only other Rockstar game that I've played is Red Dead Revolver (which has excellent controls, IMO) and I went into GTA expecting the controls to be the same. I'll admit that the driving was fun, but every time I got involved in a shootout it pissed me off
        • you use lock on to aim. It makes things simple.

          Controls are all really "this works, that's all you're getting". You also use the second contorl stick to look around :)

          Tis all simple really. Some like it, some don't. Tis how it goes.
      • Funny you say that. I said EXACTLY the same.

        "Great it sold out to the YO YO YO NIGGAH! bullshit rap is infested with". I got it for christmas, didn't like it much and went "nah, it can wait till ToS is finished". I finished Tales of symphonia and went back to it, after the first hour or so I adored it as much as I used to vice city. It starts out way too "wannabe black" (best way to put it) but once you relise CJ is the anti "wannabe black" it makes more sense. Then the map starts to open up and you relise
  • From the articles I've read, you're not the bully, you stand up to them. Yes, you can kick the crud out of mean teachers.. but the game seems to be about a badass kid who goes to school, people pick on him, and then EVERYONE finds out they've messed with the wrong kid. He beats the shit out of bullies and gets justice on evil teachers. And yes, I Would imagine politicians would still be up in arms about this - afterall, like prisons, in school you're punished when you defend yourself.
  • They'll probably give up their lunch money and run away crying!
  • Who cares? It will sell, and that is all that matters for them most likely.
  • Is anyone else here heartily sick of Rockstar's "Sell Games by Moral Panic" strategy yet?

    All the more so since, judging from Manhunt at least, it really doesn't seem to have much of an effect on sales; a good Rockstar game sells well, a bad one sells poorly, and the furor raised over all of them doesn't make much of a difference at the cash register. What it _does_ do is create a horrible reputation for the game industry as a whole. Just once, I'd like to see them do something _not_ designed to give Hillary
  • In the UK there's currently a really stupid and nasty "craze" called happy slapping [wikipedia.org] which started as a form of bullying in schools but progressed onto the high-street. Many people think that happy slapping was inspired by a TV program called Trigger Happy TV [channel4.com] and I can imagine a lot of people in the UK getting upset that a game like this might encourage more of the same.

    For some reason I find myself reminded of A Clockwork Orange...
  • This reminds me of all the protesters who kept saying the Kevin Smith's movie Dogma was was disgusting and a slap in the face to the Catholic church. When protesters were asked if they'd seen it, they said "No".

    This game hasn't even been released yet. Why we wait to see what the game is actually about first.
  • "How will Rockstar handle the additional pressure being put upon it?" Probably by gut laughing all the way to the bank...
  • These events are just a backhanded attempt to censor Rockstar. Of course, given the current march of freedom in this country, it's probably only a matter of time before they get shut down.
  • Rockstar doesn't make fun games. It makes crappy un original games and then also makes games just to be controversial. Rockstar reminds me of the hicks at school acting like they're rebels. They have a burst of success at times, then they get shut down either violently or quietly.
  • Jack Thompson must've had a rough time in grade school or something.
  • Maybe I'm completly wrong. I don't know. My memory is kinda vague on this....but...well. Here's Gamespy's capsule of the game.

    "You're not going to take it anymore. From edgy publisher Rockstar's Vancouver development team comes this dark comedy set in the most vile and sadistic setting yet in a Rockstar videogame: the schoolyard. As a troublesome schoolboy, you'll laugh and cringe as you stand up to bullies, get picked on by teachers, play pranks on malicious kids, win or lose the girl, and ultimately learn
    • There you go again, using facts. Why do you have to insist on using the facts? Can't we just express moral outrage anyway? No-one ever got a fucking shitload of votes from morons by stating the boring facts.

      My only complaint about the game so far is that it sounds like a complete ripoff of the Spectrum classic 'Skool Daze'.
  • Is it not the case that the nerds who actually play computer games are usually the ones being bullied, rather than those who bully?

  • According to Thompson, two busloads of Washington, DC schoolchildren will protest the game's release, though it was not clear what organization was promoting or funding the demonstration.

    This is just outrageous. They drag in a bunch of kids to demonstrate for their cause. Children are easy targets, easy to influence. How about they brought adults, the kind that actualy knows what it's talking about, not just the kind that wants to prove they're more moralistic than their neighbours. But ofcourse those ar

  • Bullying is not a suitable topic for a computer game. In term time this charity is contacted by up to four suicidal pupils a day. Between 16-20 children a year kill themselves in the UK due to school bullying. Amusing subject for a game isn't it?

    What a bunch of self-righteous wankers. A huge fraction of films/books/games deal with horrible subjects. Should we ban *every* film/book/game that doesn't involve everyone just being nice to each other?

    They'll be protesting against Itchy and Scratchy and Michel

  • If Rockstar wants to continue making games that cause controversy they should look at Valve.

    No need for ratings if you distribute the game yourself...

    I would think Rockstar, with some minimal advertising, could pull this off. They have enough brand recognition to pull it off...although I suppose this would make them just a PC game maker...which wouldn't be very good for their profit margin.

    Does the ps2 have a "seal of approval" or whatever for their games? Or can anyone release something? Or is it more a
    • Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo make their profits on consoles from game sales, and as such charge 3rd party developers a fee should they wish to run software on the console. It is one of several reasons why the current-generation consoles contain copyright/DRM chips.
  • This game sounds somewhat like it was inpsired by the old ZX Spectrum titles "Skooldaze" and the sequel "Bak to skool" both of which were very innovative and excellent fun. Very popular (in the UK at least) and pretty regularly in people's Top 10 and Top 5 picks of retrogames. Not surprised these ideas are being revisisted, whatever else happens in families and work, school is the universal experience after all.
  • Oh noes! 5,000 years of civilization and video games are bringing about this thing called "bullying". I mean children have not been tormenting each other for all this time without the aid of electronic magic boxes? Also, this crime and sex thing you speak of... I'm quite positive it never existed either until video games and rock and roll existed. Humanity was quite perfect and free from sin until the 1980's! If we banned everything that transmits electronic media I'm sure everything would be just fine and
  • You've got to remember that everyday people, those who don't play video games, those that are 35-40 and up in age still view video games as entertainment for kids. They say GTA, Bully, etc. is marketed to kids. Why? Because game stores will have posters up for them? Or video mags run ads for them? Well, I hate to tell ya, but not JUST kids read those mags or visit those stores! As a video games publisher, where would I correctly advertise my game other than the market it was created for?! BTW, I've never se

    • ...those that are 35-40 and up in age still view video games as entertainment for kids...

      Excuse me? I think you're confused about video game history. I'm well past 40 and have been playing video games since I was about twelve years old. Myself, and plenty of people I know in our age group play and enjoy video games all the time.

      40 neq 60, just FYI.

  • In related news...

    Rockstar responded to bullying.co.uk's demands by stealing thier backpack, throwing it in a trash can, and dumping a coke on it.

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