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XBox (Games) The Almighty Buck

The 360's Towering Pricetag Explored 224

Posted by Zonk from the that-is-a-lot-of-gil dept.
Last week Gamasutra had up a call for commentary on the revelations about the Xbox 360's pricing structure. This week, comments are available on the groaning pricetags gamers will have to endure if they want to jump on the next-gen bandwagon. This commentary is especially well seen, given that Gamestop has just come out with a 360 Bundle that clocks in at a whopping $1,199.83. From the article: "I don't think the prices for the $300 or the $400 bundles are unreasonable, but anyone who buys the $300 bundle is going to end up paying more on expensive accessories. $99 for a 20 gig hard disk? You can get a 250 gig hard disk for less than that! If you don't want to get the hard disk, you have to pay $39.99 to save your game."
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The 360's Towering Pricetag Explored More

The 360's Towering Pricetag Explored

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  • Small nitpick (Score:5, Insightful)

    by zbuffered ( 125292 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @02:25PM (#13399628)
    The 360's HDDs are 2.5", aka laptop drives. 250GB $100 laptop drives? Sign me up!

    • Re:Small nitpick (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Guspaz ( 556486 )
      $100 US gets you a 60GB 2.5" notebook drives at retail. While the "250GB" comment is just plain ignorance, the fact remains that Microsoft is overcharging for the hard drive, charging the price of a 60GB drive for a 20GB drive.
      • The drive is preloaded with some software from what I understand. As well it uses a proprietary removable connection system. So you know, as with other propriatary stuff. You get what you pay for. I do wonder though if you can take the case off the harddrive put a new larger PC 2.5 drive in.. Will it work?
      • Can you buy a 20 GB portable USB2 or Firewire HD for $100? Because that's basically what Microsoft's selling, and I'm pretty sure you can't get that product anywhere else or, if you can, it costs more than $100.
        • Can you buy a 20 GB portable USB2 or Firewire HD for $100?

          You can buy a 60GB 2.5" drive for $90 and then buy a USB2.0 enclosure for $10, thereby netting you not a 20GB portable drive for $100, but a 60GB portable drive for $100.

          This stuff is not expensive. It doesn't help when people use unnecessary hyperbole and fail to recognize the difference between 2.5" and 3.5" drives, but the fact remains that MS is overcharging. I mean let's face it, they want to make a profit this time. But clearly, if others

      • Re:Small nitpick (Score:2, Insightful)

        by Mitsoid ( 837831 )
        I think ill just wait for someone to find a way around the 'microsoft xbox hard drive only' requirement and let me pop in my seagate 80gb i have sitting on the shelf...

        and yeah, im not too excited about the x360... no hard drive in the base system means games will use the feature a lot less... as the article said...

        I'm afraid if i do end up paying for it, i'll just end up turning it into a linux box...

      • Re:Small nitpick (Score:2, Informative)

        by PeelBoy ( 34769 )
        newegg has an 80 gig notebook drive for 90-something dollars.

        http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82 E16822149016 [newegg.com]

    • Re:Small nitpick (Score:3, Insightful)

      by NanoGator ( 522640 )
      "The 360's HDDs are 2.5", aka laptop drives. 250GB $100 laptop drives? Sign me up!"

      They're not just 2.5", they come with the equivalent of a firewire casing. The idea behind them is you can yank them out, take them to your friend's house, and plug it in there. No 'cracking the case...' going on here.

      I'm amazed at the volume of ignorance the XBOX 360 has brought to light.
    • Not only that, but it's probably a hot-swapable drive (or, at the least, won't self destruct if you remove it while powered on)... that takes effort and hardware to get right.
    • Nobody forced Microsoft to use 2.5" drives... Indeed, a 3.5" drive would work just as well. There's no need to artificially limit yourself on an irrelevant factor when doing a value comparison.
      • Irrelevant? The 360 uses 2.5" drives, not 3.5". Case closed. Feel free to argue they should have used larger, less expensive drives, but don't compare them and say "this laptop drive is expensive!"
        • When comparing value the 1" difference in physical size is indeed irrelevant. If presented with the option of having an 80GB drive for $70 and a 20GB drive for $100, and knowing that you were probably going to leave it under your TV until the end of time, which would you consider the better value?

          That's even before you consider that $100 for a 20GB drive is a rip-off at any form factor. Here's a 2.5" 20GB external USB 2.0 drive for $47 ($54 shipped!) [pcpartsohio.com].

          So, in summary... $100 for a 20GB external drive that doe
          • When comparing value the 1" difference in physical size is indeed irrelevant.

            And when comparing sales, the 1" difference in physical size is relevant. So the question comes down to: should MS make the best value-providing product and not sell any units, or should they provide a not-as-good value product and sell some units?

            As a previous owner of a Japanese XBox, I can partly field that question: if a console doesn't sell, hardly anyone makes any games for it...making it pretty valueless. A $400 console th

  • OMG! (Score:4, Funny)

    by AcheronHades ( 837485 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @02:27PM (#13399646)
    Breaking news, this just in, the XBox 360 is gonna be expensive.

  • Considering 50 bucks a game... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Datamonstar ( 845886 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @02:30PM (#13399680)
    ...there's over 500 dollars worth of games there.
    • It's actually $59.99 per game, so with 11 games included in that crazy bundle, you are getting $660 "worth" of games.

      Add that to the $400 MS XBOX bundle that includes wireless controller, headset, and HDD, and you are up to $1060.

      What I want to know is how they get from $1060 to $1199.
      • "What I want to know is how they get from $1060 to $1199."

        I don't think they're looking for customers that can do math...this is Gamestop, after all.
        • No, unfortunately, they're looking for gamers who "MUST HAVE NEW SYSTEM NOW!!11!!"

          What they haven't told you is that each store will only get 2 $300 systems, 2 $400 systems, and 100 $1200 bundles on day one. If you aren't one of the lucky first 4 people, then you have to buy the big bundle or you go home empty-handed.

          The reason they can get away with this is the limited initial supply. There are some people who absolutly must have it one day one, and they are willing to PAY to get it. The game stores did

  • Oh noes! $1,200! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by defkkon ( 712076 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @02:30PM (#13399685)
    ...a 360 Bundle that clocks in at a whopping $1,199.83

    This is just moronic. Are we trying to make things sound worse, by citing some ridiculous package put together by some retailer? Please.

    The $399.99 bundle that Microsoft announced is expensive. We freakin' get it, already. Considering what you get, many of us feel that its not that bad. Mentioning that $1,200 package is just flamebait.

    That bundle includes every possible launch title for the Xbox 360, including those that haven't even been confirmed! Bethedsa has never confirmed that Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion will launch. The closest we get is "Holidays, 2005".

    You know what's even worse? When Sony comes out with the pricing for the PS3, this is going to start all over again. Ken Kutagari has already warned us that its going to be ridiculously expensive. *sigh*

    • Re:Oh noes! $1,200! (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Otter ( 3800 )
      Yup, this sounds like one of those PC World reviews of new Macs, where they moan about how it's so much more expensive than a comparable Dell once you add in a 30 inch aluminum Cinema Display and a 60 gig iPod...
    • Ken Kutagari has already warned us that its going to be ridiculously expensive.

      There it is though. He's forewarned us that it may be more expensive then we expect. So when it does come out and it's pricey we can't turn around and scream bloody murder.

      The 360's major problem is that the lower priced model is an insult. It essentially comes with *nothing* in the box, seemingly just so they can say they offer a lower pricepoint. The cost of accessories is unjustified. The memory cards hold, what, 64MB? And the
      • It essentially comes with *nothing* in the box, seemingly just so they can say they offer a lower pricepoint. The cost of accessories is unjustified. The memory cards hold, what, 64MB? And they cost $40?! I found a 512MB USB thumbdrive on Froogle for that price. Christ, how about just slapping on a USB port and letting us use any generic thumbdrive?

        The bare console (particularly early in the life span) tend to be a break even, or loose money proposistion for the manufacturer (MS, Nintendo, Sony). They rely

  • $40? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by jclast ( 888957 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @02:34PM (#13399721) Homepage
    $40 for a memory card? That's ridiculous. I know most XBox 360 buyers will be interested in the HD, but what happened to the reasoning people bought consoles in the first place?

    They used to work straight out of the box. Need to hook it to your TV? There's a cord in the box. Need a controller? There's one in the box. Need to save? Either it came with a memory card or the games saved to the cart.

    I'll be waiting to buy any new console until I can buy it the way I bought my GameCube (I got the cube, a controller, a game (choice of 5 I think), and a memory card) at a reasonable price.
    • First off, I completely agree with you. It should come with a memory card, no questions asked. In the case of the package that includes the hard drive, we obviously don't need a memory card. To not include a way to save your games out of the box is annoying as hell.

      In their defense, however, I purchased my PS2, XBox, Gamecube, and N64 without memory cards. Console manufacturers never put them in their default packages. Sometimes retailers will add them in for a bit of extra money, but what Microsoft

      • Add in the original Playstation and Dreamcast as well, as systems that required a memory card to save that didn't come with one.
    • I paid $35 for a memory card when I bought my PS2 because it didn't come with one. Shame on Microsoft and Sony.
    • On ebgames.com right now, a 2-pack of 8MB PS2 memory cards is $40. I don't know how big the xbox card is, but I'm willing to bet it's bigger.

      With the PS2, though, you have all kinds of third party memory cards which are dirt cheap. I would say that a short while after launch, you'd be able to pick up a MadCatz Xbox360 SuperMegaMemoryStick in a variety of flourecent colors for half that.

      I *would* say that, except rumor has it [geek.com] that the 360 will only work with "approved peripherals", so MadCatz will have to
    • The Gamecube wasn't originally sold with a memory card, either. It was added as a bundle later on. You're making it sound as if Microsoft is doing something worse than every other console maker...

      Nintendo 64 required that you buy a memory card.

      Playstation did too.

      Dreamcast did.

      Playstation 2 did.

      GameCube did.

      It's an industry standard. If anything, Microsoft bucked the trend by including the HD standard in the original Xbox. (Although memory cards are still available for it, they aren't required.)
      • Small correction - the N64 didn't use memory cards. I agree that it seems to be an industry standard, though. Is it a good standard? I think you could make a pretty good argument for at least a minimally sized memory card being included with consoles.

        • N64 had memory cards. They plugged into the controller and retailed for around $20.

          • All I really remember those cards doing was saving "ghost data" in mario kart. Other than small things, games saved to the cart itself. The only stuff they put on the memory cards was optional stuff.

            • Re:$40? (Score:3, Informative)

              by Gothic_Walrus ( 692125 )
              The N64 did use memory cards, and they were required...for some games.

              For games that were released early on in the system's life, memory cards were the only way to save. Madden 64 springs to mind; in fact, it seemed that a lot of the sports titles used it as the sole mean of saving data.

              I also know that the memory card lasted until the end of the system's lifespan. The Spider-Man port required it, and Perfect Dark had an option of saving your data to the card instead of the cartridge.

              It really depen

    • $40 for a memory card? That's ridiculous.
      Agreed. I think that $15-$20 is the right price range for memory cards and I have a feeling that MS is over-pricing them to encourage hard drive sales. If the vast majority of users buy the hard drive, developers are more likely to support it.

      I know most XBox 360 buyers will be interested in the HD
      In the US at least, I doubt that. Most homes still don't have an HD-capable TV and fewer still understand how to get the most out of the television. I think that a lot

  • A fool and his money... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by rAiNsT0rm ( 877553 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @02:50PM (#13399895) Homepage
    Soon part.

    I have been saying this all along, way before the official numbers were released and I was met with countless flames.

    The simple fact is that the Xbox 360 and PS3 are going to be very large busts. Sure the dedicated fanboy will spring for a $1000+ system but the average person is not. The Revolution's position keeps looking better all the time.

    On top of these massive costs, the games are going to be more expensive and long gone are the days of $20 older popular titles. The other MAJOR problem will be the number of titles released over the consoles lifespan. With astonishingly high production costs and timetables almost double that of other consoles, developers are simply not going to be pumping out many titles... and those that do get made will be the "safe" titles and licensed games. So except for FPS, Sports, and safe RPG's/MMO's and crap movie/TV/whatever licensed games there will be little else. I don't even believe many puzzle games or niche titles will be seen.

    It is going to be very frustrating for gamers, look how the comparatively cheap (while still way expensive) to produce for PSP is doing... If the Revolution can come in at $199-$249 and have some solid titles on top of classics/GC backwards compat. and a simplified innovative controller, there truly will be a revolution in gaming.
    • I agree. You know, as much as a fan as I am for the PS2, the insane price tags of these new consoles will not have me chomping at the bit when launch day comes. And it's not just the XBox360 either. There's no way in hell I'm buying either of these consoles at the prices they're touting. So what if I end up a late adopter, at least I'll be able to make my house and car payments.
    • Speaking of a fool, you *do* realize that the suggested retail price of the Xbox 360 is $300 for the "lite" version and $400 for the "full" version, right? Because you just posted as if you think that Microsoft somehow sets the pricing of the Xbox 360 bundles instead of the retailers...
      • ...Sticks with MSRP when it comes to console pricing. If they could push $99 consoles and still make a profit, believe me, they would. The revolution, by design, is going to have more games more often, for less. My problem with the GC was the complete lack of 3rd party titles. But if I *have* to participate in this generation, my dollar is on nintendo.
    • So don't buy the $1200 bundle. The basic console and one game costs about $460.
    • Ok...where to start with this. You are going to get modded up here, but your post is far from insightful. Maybe one of the two non-Nintendo consoles will be bust, but I guarantee you both of them won't. Those are consoles that appeal to the mainstream gamer. Slashdot is not mainstream, the Nintendo is much more appealing because most of us are old gamers. Gaming is not the niche activity it used to be. The market is huge for Sports games, FPSs, and RPGs. These (currently) aren't games that Nintendo o
    • I'll try not to be too hard in my post.

      The simple fact is that the Xbox 360 and PS3 are going to be very large busts. Sure the dedicated fanboy will spring for a $1000+ system but the average person is not.

      The PS2 and Xbox both launched in the 300-400 dollar range, and came down in price relatively quickly. Neither of them were large busts. The Game Cube launched cheaper, and the 3DO launched much higher. Having the PS3 and Xbox 360 launch in the 300-400 dollar range is about the safest bet they could ha
  • I'm still waiting for a $99 USD XBox to come out.

  • Supply and Demand -- Economics 101 (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Cinematique ( 167333 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @03:16PM (#13400192)
    I don't get why people are upset about these bundles... price point be damned.

    Back when the Playstation2 came out, many who were actually able to get one turned around and sold it on eBay for 2x-3x as much as Sony's $300 MSRP. So this time around, the retailers are trying to cash in on the people with wads of money to spend and a burning desire to be the first one on the block to get the new XBox.

    Can you blame 'em?

    Again, people were buying new PS2s on eBay for $900... without extra accessories! At least the retailers are driving up prices by bundling a bunch of extras and not just inflating the price "base" system.

    Supply and demand, here, people.

    Too few units at launch coupled with people willing to pay for expensive bundles... hell, I'll be shocked if the retailers complain "nobody's buying!" I strongly doubt that'll be the case.

  • Staging A Nintendo Win? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by blueZhift ( 652272 ) on Thursday August 25, 2005 @03:44PM (#13400490) Homepage Journal
    I'm no Nintendo fanboy, but I cannot help but wonder if Xbox 360 and PS3 are going to price themselves right out of the market and give Nintendo a big win in the next console round. It's not just the cost of the console and the games themselves. As others have mentioned, the next gen offerings from MS and Sony are going to be relatively difficult and expensive to develop for. This could leave the door wide open for Nintendo to become the console of choice for the great middle swath of developers that don't have the resources to develop on the other machines, whose high prices may result in smaller market penetration.

    If Nintendo plays the price game right, wooing consumers with a capable low cost and easy to understand (no multiple models here) console, and wooing developers with an easy and cheaper to develop for console, they could win the round.

    I know that the new generation of consoles usually have more expensive launch prices, but it seems that something is different about this launch. It's taking place against the backdrop of a relatively sluggish economy in the major console markets, high energy prices, and each major console manufacturer facing financial difficulties or at least reduced profits. That makes me believe that we won't see a fast drop off in prices after launch as has been the case in the past. And some major publishers have invested a lot of money in either securing exclusive sports licenses and/or buying out the competition. In short, no one will be in a hurry to lower prices.

    If Nintendo plays this right, they could win. And I can think of no company more desperate to get back to the top of the gaming heap than the big N.
     
  • And you still only get one controller! For $1000+ I would expect atleast 2 controllers.
  • Retailers are trying to sell as much as they can! Someone stop the world from spinning!
  • You can walk into any EB Store and reserve your Xbox 360 for $50.00. You apparently can't reserve your 360 through their site without buying a $600 or so package.

    I'll be going for the $400 package and probably order one or two games (Elder Scrolls and one other shooting/blow-em-up Live enabled game).

  • I keep saying it, and I keep getting shot down, but if the revolution that nintendo is talking about is one of pricing, they could have something big on their hands. Imagine a $150 revolution with a huge launch library available over the net and a dozen or so high quality games. I truly hope that MS and Sony get bit in the butt for overthinking this generation of consoles.

  • limit (Score:3, Funny)

    by minus_273 ( 174041 ) <aaaaa@SPAM.yahoo. c o m> on Thursday August 25, 2005 @07:12PM (#13402475) Journal
    "Limit 1 Xbox 360 bundle per household. "

    somehow i dont hink with a 1.2k price tag, that is going to be a big problem.

  • $1199 is nothing! (Score:2, Informative)

    by ZESTA ( 18433 )
    They are now listing a bundle for $1999 that has 20 games.

    -Randy

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