Design Educations Under Criticism 48
Via GameSetWatch, a story at CollegeNews.org about the crass reasons higher learning institutions have for offering game design courses. From the article: "Video game design as a college major? It's yet another sign of the coming of the apocalypse. Schools of higher learning are simply cashing in on a fad that is destructive to society. Electronic Arts, the nation's largest game maker, has led the way in encouraging ivy-stained institutions to teach the design of such games as Grand Theft Auto, World of Warcraft, Doom, Wolfenstein 3D, and Mortal Kombat. Last year, the company contributed millions of dollars to establish a three-year master of fine arts program in 'interactive entertainment' at USC." More on GamePolitics.
new medium (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:new medium (Score:1)
Re:new medium (Score:2)
That's one terrible picture. (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:That's one terrible picture. (Score:2)
"The National Coalition on Television Violence (NCTV) has developed a ratings system to evaluate the violent content of video games, ranging from XUnfit, XV, and RV (highly violent) to PG and G."
Uh, is this a joke article or something? In what nation is this coalition, who forms it and who do they represent. And then, why the hell I have never heard of these guys.
Likewise the study of psychologists:
"Our study reveals that young me
Re:That's one terrible picture. (Score:1)
Does this really make sense? (Score:3, Insightful)
It just doesn't seem real logical to say that game design courses must be bad because games today promote violence. That'd be kind of like saying that we shouldn't teach film courses because movies and television are too violent.
Wouldn't it be a good thing to offer game design courses, because that'd provide chances to teach potential designers responsibility and ethics?
Re:Does this really make sense? (Score:2)
Re:Does this really make sense? (Score:2)
(I'd like to put the Baron Munchausen [64.233.167.104] reference in here too:
Horatio Jackson: Ah, the officer who risked his
Re:Does this really make sense? (Score:2)
This article makes no sense. (Score:2)
Schools of higher learning are simply cashing in on a fad that is destructive to society.
Paragraph four:
Video games are big business--rivaling the movie industry. In 2004, video game sales totaled $9.9 billion. Electronic Arts alone employs 4,300 video game makers.
Make up your mind! Passing fad, or major industry. You can't have both.
He goes on to present some random evidence that seems to purport that some games aree viol
Re:This article makes no sense. (Score:2)
And by the "violence as a theme" statement, he probably includes such games as Mario (stomping on Goombas is probably considered violence) and Metroid (blasting space aliens must be a no-no).
This is another example of an article that just takes a headline, then runs it into the ground against the same old diatribe.
Re:This article makes no sense. (Score:1)
hey! that bastard mario smushed my goomba brother! i will have my revenge! oh no, here he comes! *boop* *poof*
Highly Subjective (Score:1)
The amount of low quality games cashing in on franchises is at an all-time high. I blame us, the consumer, because we keep buying the garbage games.
Noone wants "designers" (Score:3, Insightful)
Plus, a degree isn't worth much in the games industry anyway, your skill and especially past experience (often a required number of shipped titles for major companies!) are what's important. Many graduates are worse than the self-taught people. Most jobs with degrees require stuff selftaughts don't even know the name of (how many selftaught coders can do code verification?) so the degree makes sense but the processes involved in games is nothing your average selftaught doesn't know about (or, in case of complex coding, a computer science degree won't teach you).
In the no-degree-required positions it's even recommended to have a degree that's not game related so you can take another high-paying job if you get burned out (or pissed off) by the games industry. If you only have a games degree the rest of your life would involve asking customers whether they'd like fries with that.
*=Yes, I know all of these jobs require thinking. I mean they don't think up the game, just its implementation.
Re:Noone wants "designers" (Score:2, Insightful)
however a number of ppl who obtain a degree in one area, don't necessairly stay true to that area. Think of the number of fine art ppl that graduate each year, and how many of them actually get a job doing art? Isn't it better that they get a degree in an art that has relevance rather than just some general arts program?
Re:Noone wants "designers" (Score:1)
Re:Noone wants "designers" (Score:2)
Unfortuanately, the industry doesn't need 10,000,000 people with 'really cool' ideas who want to sit there drawing pictures of robots and alien castles all day masturbating about how great the game will be, what it needs is coders and artists who can actually code and
And Why Not? (Score:1)
Re:And Why Not? (Score:1)
1. The market is going to flood with available game designers.
2. It'll become even more difficult to become a game designer.
3. The graduates will try to find jobs in other software fields.
And that's where they'll fail because they lack a theoretical education. From experience, the most experienced and insightful people I've met had a theoretical education (B.S. / M.S. / Ph. D) and figured things out by applying t
Re:And Why Not? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:And Why Not? (Score:1)
Re:And Why Not? (Score:2)
How Cute.. (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:How Cute.. (Score:2)
You said what now? (Score:2, Insightful)
Wha'? There was nothing here even hinting at "reasons". The article was a (somewhat disjointed) opinion rant: "1.) Video games are violent. 2.) Video games are popular. 3.) Schools are starting video game design courses (and should not)" (although not specifically in that order).
This article makes weak connections at best between violent video games and the detriment a game design program would have. The title of the article
Article +troll (Score:2)
What a crappy article. None of studies he mentions have links or refernces to the actual data. He makes unsupportable acusations. His picture makes you want to smack it. He mentions that the game industry rivals the film industry. But hasn't gaming outearned films for the past couple of years? "Rival" does not strike me as the best word choice. All in all, just a troll, and a poor one at that.
Smirking tool (Score:1)
Consider the Source (Score:3, Interesting)
Ted Rueter, the author of the article, is an Assistant Professor of Political Science at DePauw University. I don't remember many friends or acquaintances in college that majored in PolySci, unless they were A) planning on going to grad school, or B) not planning on getting job (seriously!). I think we have a case of bona-fide "marketable skills envy" here! Remember--this is coming from a man who has no apparent expertise in the realm of child psychology. In other words, he doesn't know what he's talking about. He mentions studies that supposedly prove that violent games make kids more aggressive, but doesn't reference them. I did find it humorous that Rueter derides the fact that "Many games are based upon a scenario in which a woman is kidnapped or has to be rescued". Is he trying to say that chivalry and heroism are ruining our society?
Game Design in College (Score:3, Insightful)
This is a complex problem. First off, funding for institutions of higher learning comes from a multitude of sources. Colleges need to attract funding and in order to do that they need to attract students. In order to attract students, they need to create programs that are attractive to students. In Canada, colleges and universities are publicly funded and their funding is largely based on the number of students. This competition for students is unfortunate because students who are 19 years old tend to be relatively short-sighted about what constitutes a good education.
Secondly, I believe almost any course of study can become excellent education depending on the teachers/instructors/professors. My father [berteigart.com] is probably the best professor one could ever have: his background as a professional fine artist combined with experience in education and volunteer activities, plus his interest in philosophy and science makes him singularly capable of delivering an excellent course regardless of the subject matter. He is constantly creating new and better methods of instruction for his courses that he teaches at Keyano College [keyano.ca]. Incidentally, he has been investigating the creation of a game design program at the college... because it is cutting edge in terms of the arts!
I personally strongly feel that if I had focused on a purely technical or vocational path in my education I would not be nearly as far along in my career as I am. I studied sociology, philosophy, anthropology, linguistics, French, Russian, marketing and accounting in addition to my core computer science and mathematics classes. The benefits of these classes have become clear 15 years later as I am doing management consulting [berteigconsulting.com] for Agile methods [agileadvice.com]. If a program is going to be about game design, make sure that it includes a diversity of relevent subject matter such as gender studies, theatre, story-writing, linguistics, adult educational theory, etc. in addition to the technical stuff.
I tried making video games... (Score:3, Funny)
After creating a game engine very similar to Valves Source, I went on to make a few really beautiful and compelling titles: Getting ready for Work, Chores!, Making Dinner and Making Dinner 2: Grocery Store. All of these titles could hook into each other anad make for a wider game. Multiplayer online options were available - whats more exciting that doing your chores with a friend!?! Nothing, i tell you!
For some reason none of them really sold at all. Focus groups kept trying to take the coffee pot with them on the way to work the smash their boss with it. In another test, the kids kept trying to order pizza and steal the guy's car. In no tests did the subjects try to actually try to meat their actual goals of living a mundane everyday life.
I blame the universities.
Re:I tried making video games... (Score:2)
Nice namedropping there. (Score:2)
Wait... 69% of Nintendo's games are highly violent, to a degree unfit for kids? By what standards? Do those people consider the Road Runner cartoon a bloodbath or what? Mario jumping on goombas is hardly "extreme violence".
A different survey found that 40 of the 47 top-rated Nintendo video games had violence as a theme.
Now it's a theme? Um, hellooooo? Wh
Re:Nice namedropping there. (Score:2, Interesting)
"In Nintendo games, women are often depicted as victims. The covers of Nintendo games show males striking a dominant pose."
For example... this game depicting males as the "breadwinner" of the household. [ebgames.com] Sick.
Or perhaps this one. [ebgames.com] Another classic example of a "dominant male pose". Will somebody think of the children?
Or what about these [ebgames.com] three [ebgames.com] games, [ebgames.com] which blantantly reinforce the negative stereotype that males possess superior athletic ability to females?
And this horrid game. [ebgames.com] Another
Re:Nice namedropping there. (Score:2)
Is It All A Clever Plot To Destroy Video Games? (Score:2)
Once teachers start deconstructing the underlying motifs to first-person shooters, will kids flee the stultifying horror of academic respectibility?
"Okay, students, who can tell me the five elements of situational puzzle resolution?
"Anyone?"
"Anyone?"
"Buehler?"
Just exchange the $$ for a Game Industry Job. (Score:2)
USC is not cheap. It is currently $981/credit. Assuming that a MS consists of 16-20 credits per year, this new Game Design curriculum is going to set back each candidate by on average 3x18=$52k. Thats in USD. Granted the
Game design is evil? Do away with its fruits! (Score:1)
And who's the most guilty? V-Tech [vtechkids.com] and Leap Frog [leapfrog.com]! Those companies need to have criminal charges filed against them, because they're marketing video games designed to brainwash little children!
</sarcasm>
So What? (Score:1)
Should be game development. (Score:1)
Seriously though, putting down degrees that are based on video games is wrong and usually completely biased. Most colleges that are offering "game design"
i was all riled up... (Score:2)
odds of this guy understanding enough to even begin to appreciate the process involved in creating a game: about 40 billion to 1 against.
odds of this guy understanding his ignorance: about 40 billion to 1 against
odds of this guy understanding that there is more to the game market than gta, halo, etc.: again, about 40 billion to 1 against
given this, what are the odds he should be taken seriously?
The basic gist of the article... (Score:2)
1. Video games are evil.
2. Evil video game companies (which is reduntant as creating video games is the equivalent of selling poisoned milk to school children according to the article) are spending money to encourage colleges to create courses teaching people how to add poison to milk for schoolchildren.
3. All video
Consider the source (Score:1)
by Ted Rueter, Assistant Professor of Political Science at DePauw University, Greencastle, Indiana
Now clearly, here's a fella with his finger firmly on the pulse of the gaming medium, and, for that matter, fully qualified to discuss its relevance in terms of higher ed.
If I teach programming, can I spout off about the high cost of drug prices and get a front-page href at webmd.com?
Can we get the opinions of some staff members at the Culinary Ins
Libby McLiberal (Score:1)
God forbid we let business trends and the interests of young people influence the cirricula on college campuses.
Also, and perhaps this is the elitist in me, but it is my experience that a trained baboon can obtain a poly sci degree.
How is this any different? (Score:1)
How is this any different from, for example, an oil company sponsoring university programs in petrochemical technology?
Well, I suppose that oil companies HAVE been sponsoring petrochem programs for many, many years longer. And, yes, I suppose that it is a generally established fact that consumption of petrochemicals has a detrimental effect on the environment, as opposed to half-baked "studies" about their effects.
Exxon Mobil had over $100 billion in revenues in this quarter alone! And they donate abo
Hmm.. Funky pic (Score:1)